My school has gone too far

Iron Warrior

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The other day, San Jose State University decided it would be great if they had a showing of Farenheit 9-11 for the students to see. So, is it even legal for a state university to engage in this kind of **** ? I'm don't consider myself a republican or democrat, but I do have a problem with forcing your ideas on others
 
ManBeast

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As long as they don't force it upon the students to watch it (other than maybe in a poli sci class). They can show whatever they want. My school has shown a bunch of different politically-oriented movies in the 4 years I've been here, but they've never forced any attendence (as a university, professors can make things requirements for classes) of anything like that.

ManBeast
 
kwyckemynd00

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The other day, San Jose State University decided it would be great if they had a showing of Farenheit 9-11 for the students to see. So, is it even legal for a state university to engage in this kind of **** ? I'm don't consider myself a republican or democrat, but I do have a problem with forcing your ideas on others
I believe that if they show that, maybe they should show something like FarenHype 9/11 or Celsius 41.11, etc...but, we're in california and this is academia :frustrate
 
Iron Warrior

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As long as they don't force it upon the students to watch it (other than maybe in a poli sci class). They can show whatever they want. My school has shown a bunch of different politically-oriented movies in the 4 years I've been here, but they've never forced any attendence (as a university, professors can make things requirements for classes) of anything like that.

ManBeast
They also advertised it on the school paper and had people (didn't look like students) handing out flyers about it on the streets around campus too. Just seemed to me like they forced it.
 

size

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If you are overly distraught, then write an editorial in the university paper.
 
kwyckemynd00

kwyckemynd00

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If you are overly distraught, then write an editorial in the university paper.
The board will use it as toilet paper. I've given up on our educational system being fair a long time ago. If I knew any better, I would have given up back when my teacher practically endorsed communism to my class...
 
DAdams91982

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I hate Michael Moore period... Bowling For columbine was completely trashing my country, and I refuse to watch feirenheit 911.. because i know that is even worse. I hate it when I am fighting for something, and people are trashing it, or taking certain freedoms for granted.

SrA Adams
 

jweave23

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Just because you are uncomfortable with it does not mean they are in the wrong. Political movies of any variety can be shown on campuses. Academia is of course primarily liberal (and yes I work at a law school, I see it all the time), but I would hardly call a showing "forcing" anything. :rolleyes:
 
Iron Warrior

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Just because you are uncomfortable with it does not mean they are in the wrong. Political movies of any variety can be shown on campuses. Academia is of course primarily liberal (and yes I work at a law school, I see it all the time), but I would hardly call a showing "forcing" anything. :rolleyes:
You're right, I just had a bad day yesterday at school with one guy who put that flier on my hand. I threw the flier away and he said people like me are bad for this country, that heated me up real good :twisted:

My intention wasn't to bash anyone.
 
ManBeast

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Being the non-confrontational person that I am, I tend just to pocket any and all fliers that I get, and throw them out later. No sense in gettin riled up over things like that IMHO.

ManBeast
 

Brodus

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One thing I don't understand is that is if a University is truly "liberal," and believes they are correct in their philosophy, why wouldn't they show both sides, i.e. also screen movies from the "other side." If they are so sure that their philosophies will ring true, regardless, why don't they put that ball in play and be the pinnacles of fairness they claim to be?

What disappoints me is that if you don't give students all sides, they are ill-equipped to understand an issue in its totality, and they aren't prepared to interact with the rest of the world. When you leave that University bubble and enter the "real world" it can't be a real shock, and it can piss you off! (It pissed me off!)
 
kwyckemynd00

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Just because you are uncomfortable with it does not mean they are in the wrong. Political movies of any variety can be shown on campuses. Academia is of course primarily liberal (and yes I work at a law school, I see it all the time), but I would hardly call a showing "forcing" anything. :rolleyes:
It's definately not forcing anything on anyone. However, it's a blatant attempt at brainwashing easily influenced college students into eating up the liberal propaganda and IMHO an attempt to do whatever they can do effect the election in John Kerry's favor. It's wrong any way you look at it coming from an institution of education. How educated are students who are only given one point of view and are only taught one way of thought? LOL. Kinda bass-ackwards to me.
 

Matthew D

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Well I have noticed that there have been more than a few attempts to only persent one side of everything by a few people on here.
 
CDB

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Being the non-confrontational person that I am, I tend just to pocket any and all fliers that I get, and throw them out later. No sense in gettin riled up over things like that IMHO.

ManBeast
I save the ones I don't like for target practice.
 
kwyckemynd00

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Well I have noticed that there have been more than a few attempts to only persent one side of everything by a few people on here.
Well, none of us ever claimed to be non-partisan; nor did we ever claim to be an (or part of an) "educational" institute! (which happens to be practically brainwashing people! Seriously, my teachers had me scared shitless 1.5 years ago telling me "I would be drafted if Bush is re-elected" and hwo they have "sources" in the government, etc. I'm not freggin' kidding I had multiple teachers telling me this crap. It's complete BS.)
 
CEDeoudes59

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Farenheit 9/11 isnt changing anyones mind right now...
But typical liberal education
 

Matthew D

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I am really sorry you have had teachers that are that bad, but that is not the state of the whole profession and to paint it with such a wide brush does a GREAT disservice to all that teach that attempt to show both sides of anything.
 
kwyckemynd00

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Teachers are awesome as long as they "teach the material". When an "institution" is pushing it's political agenda, that's ridiculous. I've had good teacher and I've had bad teachers. I'll tell you what, I've never had teachers coming from the other side doing the same. That's why it's such a big deal to me. I've got schools all around my area (Universities) who are using some public funds to hire Michael Moore to give speaks, and are showing farenheit 9/11 to kids. It's reallly, really, really, lame. Every idiot I ever talk to who "hates" bush without any good reason (some peole have "legit" reasons) has asked me if I ever saw farenheit 9/11...lol. It's really sad that educational institutes are showing fictions movies calling them documentaries and using the situation to further their political agenda.

But, I'm going to take your advice and learn not to sweat the petty things and defiinately not to pet the sweaty things ;)
 

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It's fucked up cause stupid people think Fareinheit 9/11 is facts cause it's a "documentary". You tell em it's bullshit and they say "no it's a documentary, it's real". :frustrate
 

Brodus

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It's a parody of a documentary...that's why I hate it...but I hate more that people take his word as truth. I got myself in a lot of trouble at work after I repeated some of his "truth" in a meeting about airline pilot salaries...turns out he was terribly full of **** on that (from the book "Stupid White Men")
 

size

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Read this article if you want to learn about problems at Columbia University:
http://www.nysun.com/article/3452


Here is a small portion:

Columbia Abuzz Over Underground Film
BY JACOB GERSHMAN - Staff Reporter of the Sun
October 20, 2004

At a history class, a professor mockingly tells a female Jewish student she cannot possibly have ancestral ties to Israel because her eyes are green.
During a lecture, a professor of Arab politics refuses to answer a question from an Israeli student and military veteran but instead asks the student, "How many Palestinians have you killed?"
At a student meeting on the topic of divestment from Israel, a Jewish student is singled out as responsible for death of Palestinian Arabs.
Those scenes are described by current and former students interviewed for an underground documentary that is causing a frisson of concern to ripple through the Morningside Heights campus of Columbia University, where the incidents took place.
The film, about anti-Israel sentiment at the school, has not yet been released to the public, but it has been screened for a number of top officials of Columbia, and talk of its impact is spreading rapidly on a campus where some students have complained of anti-Israel bias among faculty members.
 
kwyckemynd00

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Now ^ THAT ^ is just fucked up...But, I can believe it happened; that's for damn sure. Freggin' "open-minded" liberals, right? :rant: "So how many palestenians have you killed?" Grrr.... :rant:
 

g4ud1n

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Now ^ THAT ^ is just fucked up...But, I can believe it happened; that's for damn sure. Freggin' "open-minded" liberals, right? :rant: "So how many palestenians have you killed?" Grrr.... :rant:
Where does it say the teacher is a "liberal"
 
Iron Warrior

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I'll give my school credit for being a little more balanced, they will show farenhype 9-11 after much pressure from the student body
 

VanillaGorilla

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I know Moore was scheduled to speak at a university and they showed hype 9-11 a few days before and he cancelled his appearance.
When you leave that University bubble and enter the "real world" it can't be a real shock, and it can piss you off! (It pissed me off!)
Especially when the student gets into the real world and has half their pay check taken away each week.
 

VanillaGorilla

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Well I have noticed that there have been more than a few attempts to only persent one side of everything by a few people on here.
They are two totally different things. A message board is a place to debate. If you feel that someone is missing a point or presenting a issue in a one sided way, you can post your point of view. A college is a place to get an education not indoctrinated. I had a teacher say that Clinton put her kids threw college. I took a environmental science class and found their was little science and allot of socialist buzzwords like a fairer distribution of land and wealth. When I called the teacher on it in a paper I wouldn't get as good grade if I just told him what he wanted to hear. In a sociology class students were taught that capitalism and "rugged individualism" is bad. The class identified Lennon as a sociologist but left out what else he was known for. Those are a few examples. The fact is unless you are taking hard science classes the majority of colleges are to the far left and basically trying to brainwash students.
 
kwyckemynd00

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I'll give my school credit for being a little more balanced, they will show farenhype 9-11 after much pressure from the student body
Awesome...My pessimism level is going down; conversely, my optimism level is rising :D <to put it in simple, dorky terms>
 
kwyckemynd00

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Where does it say the teacher is a "liberal"
It doesn't say that, but you're never going to find a conservative (well, maybe if you look hard enough) bashing a jew for now being a palestinian. I take it you don't know middle eastern politics too well? :D

For the most part, the liberals are demonizing the jews constantly (you'll see this a lot in the United Nations) for retaliating against arab attacks. For all of you who don't know, the Jews didn't start it...that's just a historical fact, unless you consider the fact that Jews are "there" them starting it. Conservatives tend to support Israel in a more fierce manner and don't think they're barbarians for bombing Palestinian "terrorist" leaders.

I would personally bet money on the fact that the university teacher in question is, in fact, an extreme liberal.
 

INFOHAZARD

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Again, a college campus is not a monolithic indocrtination machine. I would guess that the organization responsible for showing F-911 has nothing to do with the tenured profs, which has nothing to do with the campus Christian organizations going around trying to harvest young impressionable souls for Christ. I would be shocked if there wasn't some organization like the Young Republicans on campus that will "set the record straight."

Michael Moore is a fine polemicist, whose goal is to be inflammaory. He is causing debate like we see here which is a good thing, even if some portion of his facts are a bit bent out of shape. The difference between Moore and folks like Limbaugh and Coulter is that as a film-maker, he is like dynamite, causing a rather dramatic effect, which is over fairly quickly. Limbaugh and Coulter are like running water that wears slowly away at stone to produce their effect. I suspect Limbaugh and Coulter are much more effective at changing the political landscape because they do not cause the same degree of inflammation and debate.

I would not, however think of Moore as anything but a good Left-Wing polemicist.

Also, I don't have a problem with liberal professors. Academia often tends towards liberalism for a reason (assuming it takes the spectrum to have a healthy society). On the other hand, where it passes into the dogma of the classic "Political Correctness" of the early '90's academia is where I get upset. When an English course becomes a diatribe on the "white male hegemony" that one must parrot back to the prof to get a good grade, something is horribly amiss....

What also bugs me is that the neoconservative reaction to "Political Correctness" simply coopted their techniques of intolerance to make the opposing point. David Brock, a former Right-Wing polemicist illustrated this in his autobiography "Blinded By the Right."

Whenever things move to the extremes, expect division and chaos. It doesn't matter whether it's the right or the left. It's my understanding that Kennedy ran on a platform of tax-cuts, and that Nixon was a bit to the left of where Kerry's platform is today (Nixon introduced price freezes, the 55 MPH speed limit and he had a plan to get the US out of Viet Nam. The welfare state flourished under him). We have swung HARD Right. It will swing back unless somebody decides to consolidate power in an unconstitutional way.
 

VanillaGorilla

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Infohaz........ The problem with colleges is that both sides are not equally represented in the classroom or on campus. Much like in journalism you will find that 90% of all professors are liberal and the ones that aren't are ostracized. Obviously more young people are liberal than not. I think the saying if your young and not liberal you have no heart and if you are old and still liberal you have no head applies
What also bugs me is that the neoconservative reaction to "Political Correctness" simply coopted their techniques of intolerance to make the opposing point. David Brock, a former Right-Wing polemicist illustrated this in his autobiography "Blinded By the Right."
It's actually quite the opposite. It is the PC people who are intolerant of a diversity of opinion. They have a name to call anyone who opposes them. If you are against affirmative action your are a racist. If you are against the gay agenda you are a hetrocentric homophobic ect.
 
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snakebyte05

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Anyone who has not seen farenHYPE 9/11 do so. I bought it last week, great movie. You guys don't like how people around you take moore for fact, well my girlfriend idolizes him. She honestly believes everything he says is true, and that hes protecting america. When she saw HYPE 9/11 she didn't like, since it was "not as interesting". Goes to show what america has come to. People who refuse to look at the facts. Moore is one topic that I will get the most heated on, because I just can't believe how some people will refuse to look at the facts, and they believe all his stuff is true, since he has "sources" to back it up. If I asked a friend if he thought moore was an ass, I could then make a movie about moore saying he is an ass, I mean I have a source. Point is, anyone can be a source, problem is his sources are not reputible, or if they are, he takes what was said and done completely out of context.
 
CDB

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The problem, Info, is that neoconservatives are not representative of the whole right wing of American politics. And that's in the same way that Kerry's position on the war is not reflective of a significant part of his party's ideology, though I don't know what I'd call them label-wise.

All the debate in this forum comes down to one point: everyone in politics is full of more **** than a fertilizer plant. Some are just more tolerable to us for this or that reason.
 

VanillaGorilla

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The welfare state flourished under him).
That's not exactly true. The welfare state flourished because the democrats controlled the senate for decades. They refused to cut spending. That is similar augment blaming Regan for the deficits when in reality he couldn't force the dems to cut spending.
I would not, however think of Moore as anything but a good Left-Wing polemicist.
I would agree with that but I would change polemicist to propagandist. I think he shot him self in the foot with his last two movies. As time goes on he will have less and less credibility.
 

INFOHAZARD

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Infohaz........ The problem with colleges is that both sized are not equally represented in the classroom or on campus. Much like in journalism you will find that 90% of all professors are liberal and the ones that aren't are ostracized. Obviously more young people are liberal than not. I think the saying if your young and not liberal you have no hart and if you are old and still liberal you have no head applies

Have you considered Bob Jones University? A person can find what they are looking for in this country (well, except for PH's soon)



It's actually quite the opposite. It is the PC people who are intolerant of a diversity of opinion. They have a name to call anyone who opposes them. If you are against affirmative action your are a racist. If you are against the gay agenda you are a hetrocentric homophobic ect.
Yeah, right. Let me give some examples of prominent spokespeople for the contemporary Right:

Ann Coulter told Time, "The Democratic Party has got to go away. It's got to just hang up its stirrups." http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/942957/posts

Can you think of 3 instances in the 20th Century when 1/2 of the political spectrum 'just went away?' How about Lennin, Hitler and Pol Pot? Just what is it she is advocating?

She also tried to ressurect the reputation of Joe McCarthy (whom even the most conservative people I know who were adults during that period despise).

Further, in referring to Muslims, she noted we should, “Invade their countries, kill their leaders, and convert them to Christianity.�


Then there's Bill O'Rielly who will tell people to "shut-up" and cut the mike off on people who disagree with him, then lie about how often he does it.
http://cdn.moveon.org/data/ShutUp_Final_BbandLo.mov


Then there's the President who excludes half the population of the nation from his campaign speeches. These speeches are in no small part Taxpayer funded because of the use of AF 1 to get there (it's amazing how much 'official business' Bush has in swing-states these days).

There's members of his administration who give speeches but only allows TV media, but not print Media to attend. Why on earth would they do that?

You clearly have not read the David Brock book I mentioned, "Blinded by the Right." Even if you don't agree with it, it will make you far more knowledgable when you make your points.
 

INFOHAZARD

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The problem, Info, is that neoconservatives are not representative of the whole right wing of American politics. And that's in the same way that Kerry's position on the war is not reflective of a significant part of his party's ideology, though I don't know what I'd call them label-wise.

All the debate in this forum comes down to one point: everyone in politics is full of more **** than a fertilizer plant. Some are just more tolerable to us for this or that reason.

Can't argue with that nuanced point.
 

Funny Monkey

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Have you considered Bob Jones University? .
What does that school have to do with this? They are actually bi-partisan as best I can tell.
Now if they have strong traditional fundametalist beleifs that indirectly lead them to one side or the other well then ok but no names of canadites come up saying vote this way or that.

I saw on my schols website today that the college dems are showing mopores film in the multi disc room next week and I go to school in TN. Try all they want Kerry will not win this state
 
CDB

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She also tried to ressurect the reputation of Joe McCarthy (whom even the most conservative people I know who were adults during that period despise).
I read her book Treason where she did this. Problem with McCarthy seems to be that while his methods were off and extreme, he was essentially right. The commies were infiltrating our government.

Further, in referring to Muslims, she noted we should, “Invade their countries, kill their leaders, and convert them to Christianity.�
True, but she did say this very shortly after 9/11, and I don't think we should necessarily hold anyone's angry outbursts from that time against them. However, I find it an interesting point that you do find very few suicide bombers in the Judeo Christian, westernized world. I think what she was saying was an extreme way of putting the point out that some how, some way, someone has to take a metaphorical 2x4 and bat the middle east into the 21st century, or problems within that part of the world will continue.
 

INFOHAZARD

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What does that school have to do with this? They are actually bi-partisan as best I can tell.
Now if they have strong traditional fundametalist beleifs that indirectly lead them to one side or the other well then ok but no names of canadites come up saying vote this way or that.

I saw on my schols website today that the college dems are showing mopores film in the multi disc room next week and I go to school in TN. Try all they want Kerry will not win this state
So when is a campus group showing F-911 on the BJU grounds? They are also not an accredited university. The point I made is you can find what you are looking for if you don't like what you got.
 

INFOHAZARD

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I read her book Treason where she did this. Problem with McCarthy seems to be that while his methods were off and extreme, he was essentially right. The commies were infiltrating our government.
Yes there were a few spies. Unfortunately, McCarthy did immense damage to our culture, society and freedom without finding a single bona fide spy. Kind of like invading Iraq after being attacked by a bunch of Saudis.


True, but she did say this very shortly after 9/11, and I don't think we should necessarily hold anyone's angry outbursts from that time against them. However, I find it an interesting point that you do find very few suicide bombers in the Judeo Christian, westernized world. I think what she was saying was an extreme way of putting the point out that some how, some way, someone has to take a metaphorical 2x4 and bat the middle east into the 21st century, or problems within that part of the world will continue.

Hate speech is hate speech and is especially heinous when uttered by a prominent spokesperson during a time of crisis.

I don't think for a moment that that's not EXACTLY what she meant, and she found the opportunity to say it when it had the most impact. If it weren't for the fact that the people of concience can still speak out she'd be leading the mobs.

You are very forgiving of such things when spoken by someone whose politics you sympathise with. What if someone on the Left had uttered something that intolerant? And what about her statement about the Dems just needing to go away?

She's a facist. There are a lot of them out there.
 
CDB

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Hate speech is hate speech and is especially heinous when uttered by a prominent spokesperson during a time of crisis.
In all honesty I have no problem with hate speech. I feel if you hate someone, be honest about it.

I don't think for a moment that that's not EXACTLY what she meant, and she found the opportunity to say it when it had the most impact. If it weren't for the fact that the people of concience can still speak out she'd be leading the mobs.

You are very forgiving of such things when spoken by someone whose politics you sympathise with. What if someone on the Left had uttered something that intolerant? And what about her statement about the Dems just needing to go away?

She's a facist. There are a lot of them out there.
Yes, she's bordering on a good looking Hitler these days. As for hate speech from the left, there's been plenty of it. How about the constant plastering of Pat Buchannan as an anti-semite because he is critical of US support for Israel, most notably by Abe Rosenthal? How about the near interminable hate speech against men that floods almost nonstop from most feminist groups, many of who are undeniably left leaning in the extreme? The All Sex Is Rape, Dead White Male lines are the ones I'm talking about.

I think the basic disagreement you and I would have here is on the issue of tolerance. I really don't see the merits of it. I see the merits of general politeness and cordiallity. And once more, in my personal experience with actual liberals in daily life, they are far more intolerant than any conservatives I know. I hear far more invective and see more insults hurled by liberals every day than from conservatives. Racist, anti-semite, fascist, biggot, etc. Once more, in my personal experience which I related in another thread a long time ago, as I started to change my ideology while I was still in college the first thing I noticed, and which outright amazed me, was the unbelievable amount of venom on left, much of it from people who I thought were friends as I tried to explain a point of view they didn't agree with. The casualness with which they labeled and insulted me was stunning. The substitution of name calling for debate was frustrating. In fact ironically enough the first taste of this came from feminists, because I disagreed with many of their judgements on this or that issue. I was called "a rape enabler" because I didn't think some guy was guilty of rape. The situation presented to us was two people, guy and girl, both drunk out of their minds have sex. She wakes up the next morning, charges rape. What I said was that it was basically an instance of two people making a stupid decision, one or both may regret it, but it isn't rape. The **** flew when I said that, to say the least.

I'm sorry for the lengthy response, but it seems to me to be on topic for this thread. Do I agree with Coulter? Like I said it's amazing how few suicide bomber we produce in westernized culture. I don't see Bush sawing anyone's head off while praising God. I see little to no repudiation of terrorists by supposedly true Muslims, the ones that say Islam is a religion of peace. In the end I don't agree with her because I don't think I know enough to make a good judgement at this point. But after seeing some 200 plus people I have some connection with deal with or actually die in the twin towers on 9/11, I sure as hell don't blame her for suggesting it might be time to solve the problem of the middle east with a few nukes and a shitload of Bibles. Would it be humane? No. Would it be effective? Probably.
 
kwyckemynd00

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I read her book Treason where she did this. Problem with McCarthy seems to be that while his methods were off and extreme, he was essentially right. The commies were infiltrating our government.
Were? I'd go as far as to say are in the form of radical socialists.

Remember good 'ol Lord Acton? "Power tends to corrupt, absolute power corrupts absolutely." I feel that applies to socialism and big government. The more social programs we less decisions we make , the less decisions we make, the more decisions they can make, and as you can see, I'm demostrating the domino effect. But I do believe that if we keep giving them power, eventually they can just give themselves power more easily and things will get really nasty.
True, but she did say this very shortly after 9/11, and I don't think we should necessarily hold anyone's angry outbursts from that time against them. However, I find it an interesting point that you do find very few suicide bombers in the Judeo Christian, westernized world. I think what she was saying was an extreme way of putting the point out that some how, some way, someone has to take a metaphorical 2x4 and bat the middle east into the 21st century, or problems within that part of the world will continue.
Agreed.
 

Funny Monkey

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So when is a campus group showing F-911 on the BJU grounds? They are also not an accredited university. The point I made is you can find what you are looking for if you don't like what you got.
No and they sure wont be showing stolen honor either. What exactely does being accredited have to do with this?
 

Funny Monkey

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So when is a campus group showing F-911 on the BJU grounds? They are also not an accredited university. The point I made is you can find what you are looking for if you don't like what you got.
Did you go to BJU?

Bju is so out of touch with the real world it is rediculous. I am all for having morals and be a fundmentalist. I say if you belive in somehting **** whoever disagrees with you. The thing about that school is that they try and instill things into a person without having any Biblical proof of why they do it that way. I agree with all there doctrinal standpoints.

I understand your point but BJU is not a good example. The things that go on at that school are so different I dont think that anyone woudl truly get a good perspective of it unless they went there.
 

INFOHAZARD

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In all honesty I have no problem with hate speech. I feel if you hate someone, be honest about it.


Yes, she's bordering on a good looking Hitler these days. As for hate speech from the left, there's been plenty of it. How about the constant plastering of Pat Buchannan as an anti-semite because he is critical of US support for Israel, most notably by Abe Rosenthal? How about the near interminable hate speech against men that floods almost nonstop from most feminist groups, many of who are undeniably left leaning in the extreme? The All Sex Is Rape, Dead White Male lines are the ones I'm talking about.

I think the basic disagreement you and I would have here is on the issue of tolerance. I really don't see the merits of it. I see the merits of general politeness and cordiallity. And once more, in my personal experience with actual liberals in daily life, they are far more intolerant than any conservatives I know. I hear far more invective and see more insults hurled by liberals every day than from conservatives. Racist, anti-semite, fascist, biggot, etc. Once more, in my personal experience which I related in another thread a long time ago, as I started to change my ideology while I was still in college the first thing I noticed, and which outright amazed me, was the unbelievable amount of venom on left, much of it from people who I thought were friends as I tried to explain a point of view they didn't agree with. The casualness with which they labeled and insulted me was stunning. The substitution of name calling for debate was frustrating. In fact ironically enough the first taste of this came from feminists, because I disagreed with many of their judgements on this or that issue. I was called "a rape enabler" because I didn't think some guy was guilty of rape. The situation presented to us was two people, guy and girl, both drunk out of their minds have sex. She wakes up the next morning, charges rape. What I said was that it was basically an instance of two people making a stupid decision, one or both may regret it, but it isn't rape. The **** flew when I said that, to say the least.

I'm sorry for the lengthy response, but it seems to me to be on topic for this thread. Do I agree with Coulter? Like I said it's amazing how few suicide bomber we produce in westernized culture. I don't see Bush sawing anyone's head off while praising God. I see little to no repudiation of terrorists by supposedly true Muslims, the ones that say Islam is a religion of peace. In the end I don't agree with her because I don't think I know enough to make a good judgement at this point. But after seeing some 200 plus people I have some connection with deal with or actually die in the twin towers on 9/11, I sure as hell don't blame her for suggesting it might be time to solve the problem of the middle east with a few nukes and a shitload of Bibles. Would it be humane? No. Would it be effective? Probably.

If you loook at an earlier post on this thread, I also noted the intolerance of PC liberals and I also have a big problem with it. I have seen this intolerance and invectve institutionalized on both sides of the debate, both in the media and in my social life. It's sad to see.

But I also have a huge problem with becoming the evil we claim to be fighting against. I will not stand for it.

Before the invasion, I imagined a strategy much like we used to prevent nuclear Holocaust with the Soviets:

Declare peace with the Islamic Extremists, but warn them that if they do commit one more act of terrorism, Mecca, Medina, the Dome of the Rock and the madrassas would be blown off the face of the earth.

I'm sorry you haven't run into moderate thoughtful Muslims. I spent 3 years in Turkey, and I assure you, there are plenty of them out there, but they don't get much exposure in our media. I wonder why not.

As for your comment about Israel, for what it's worth, I have a relative who has worked around Mossad guys. His impression was they they were among the more evil people he has run into. I had never heard him say anything like that from him before he worked with them. I think Israel should be as much a subject of criticism of their national polices and actions as any other country without raising the spectre of "Anti-Semitism."
 

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Were? I'd go as far as to say are in the form of radical socialists.

Remember good 'ol Lord Acton? "Power tends to corrupt, absolute power corrupts absolutely." I feel that applies to socialism and big government. The more social programs we less decisions we make , the less decisions we make, the more decisions they can make, and as you can see, I'm demostrating the domino effect. But I do believe that if we keep giving them power, eventually they can just give themselves power more easily and things will get really nasty.

Agreed.
All things in balance. It's my impression that this administration wants to dismantle the Government all right. The trouble is that they want to hand it over to really big corporations and churches. The corporate lobbyists are now writing most of the important legislation.

I for one do not care to become a corporate serf; a slave to my credit score. I have a very large problem with this. I'll worry about socialism later when they are the threat.

"Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power."
-Benito Mussolini
 

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Did you go to BJU?

Bju is so out of touch with the real world it is rediculous. I am all for having morals and be a fundmentalist. I say if you belive in somehting **** whoever disagrees with you. The thing about that school is that they try and instill things into a person without having any Biblical proof of why they do it that way. I agree with all there doctrinal standpoints.

I understand your point but BJU is not a good example. The things that go on at that school are so different I dont think that anyone woudl truly get a good perspective of it unless they went there.

Bush gave a campaign speech there.
 
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All things in balance. It's my impression that this administration wants to dismantle the Government all right. The trouble is that they want to hand it over to really big corporations and churches. The corporate lobbyists are now writing most of the important legislation.
This is the same baseless BS that every liberal spews when they don't have anything more original to say. "uhh....big business....uhh.....global warming....ehhh, black voter disenfranchisment....umm.....old people won't get their social security....ummm....ummmm.....we're going ot be a religious theocracy because he said 'god' and there's supposed to be a separation between church and state.....umm...well....MICHAEL MOORE! Take that!" Come one, you have to be able to do better than big business and religion.
I for one do not care to become a corporate serf; a slave to my credit score. I have a very large problem with this. I'll worry about socialism later when they are the threat.
"Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power."
-Benito Mussolini
Exactly!!!! WTF do you not understand about this quote!? The government takes control of private affairs and therefore the citizen is left without any real control over thier own lives! This does not mean that an administration give, god forbid, "corporate tax breaks!" Oh, no!!! I can't believe a business was given a 'tax break'"...

Nice definition of fascism here:
" centralized authority regimenting commerce and people; citizens are allowed to hold a piece of paper (land title, business license, central bank note, birth certificate) fooling them into thinking they have property ownership, then the "owners" are heavily regulated and taxed. "

" A political system that emphasizes nationalism, militarism, and anti- communist and totalitarian rule. Individuals are allowed to retain ownership of capital goods but are subject to centralized control. "

Any definition that says "right-winged" in it, is only correct when referring to "right winged facists". You can be a left-winged facist.
 

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