Election of 2012....Who ya got?

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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14 View Post
    Its amazing that you guys think Paul would be any different. These folks are all bought and paid for
    Well..for one thing, Ron Paul is the only anti-war candidate, the rest have no anti-war tone to them.

    Also, Ron Paul is the one addressing the real issues wrong with the economy, which is the endless wars/empire/military-industral-complex and the federal reserve. The rest only speak of band aids and meaningless solutions.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessep76 View Post
    Woh woh ...woh. haha even if you include Clinton, W, and O that would make the next person 5?


    Or Paul would just get filibustered
    Reagan, Jimmy Carter, Ford, Lyndon Johnson, Bush Sr. are all corrupt evil nwo corporate devils. Dont let Jimmy fool you, he is a Bilderberg.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessep76
    Or Paul would just get filibustered
    By his own party
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    By his own party
    absolutely. Not from the Democrats they're too spinelss to speak up period. He needs to go indie. Maybe get Bernie as his VP

    Actually maybe not Bernie, he's for SS
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    Paul will never get the vote from the repubs. His best option is to be a 3rd party and attempt to screw it up for someone else.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14 View Post
    Paul will never get the vote from the repubs. His best option is to be a 3rd party and attempt to screw it up for someone else.
    I agree...he needs to use the republican party to his advantage so he can keep getting national and mainstream exposure on the debates then leave when he is not nominated (even if he won, the republicrats wont nominate him.)

    As much as I want to vote for him, I honestly have mixed feelings about voting him if he has a Republican title attached to himself. I may actually skip out if he doesnt leave the party...not sure.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ax1

    I agree...he needs to use the republican party to his advantage so he can keep getting national and mainstream exposure on the debates then leave when he is not nominated (even if he won, the republicrats wont nominate him.)

    As much as I want to vote for him, I honestly have mixed feelings about voting him if he has a Republican title attached to himself. I may actually skip out if he doesnt leave the party...not sure.
    I understand where you are coming from. It's almost as if you sell out voting for him with that party affiliation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    I agree...he needs to use the republican party to his advantage so he can keep getting national and mainstream exposure on the debates then leave when he is not nominated (even if he won, the republicrats wont nominate him.)

    As much as I want to vote for him, I honestly have mixed feelings about voting him if he has a Republican title attached to himself. I may actually skip out if he doesnt leave the party...not sure.
    His popularity has skyrocketed since he first came on the scene as far as a possible nominee. If he went under a third party he'd not only keep his fan base but wouldn't have competition within that party and people would have a chance to vote for him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14 View Post
    Its amazing that you guys think Paul would be any different. These folks are all bought and paid for
    ur probably right. But I like to dream that one day a straight and narrow non-politician will run for office. Somebody similar to Washington - Someone that doesn't desire money and power more than the well-being of this country. Paul isn't this type of person, but if he just did what he says he'd do I think that would be a good start. Personally, I'm on the Cain train more than anything. We dont need politicians anymore. We need someone with a little sense.

    Plus, if Cain were somehow magically elected into office and somehow passed his taxing deal then we'd have to repeal the 17th amendment which would be a HUGE step back from centralized government power and a big step forward to the original natural rights movement.

    In fact, I think the taxing deal is Cain's plan to open up the door to giving power back to the states which would be just awesome! After all, not all states r equal. Some states have their crap together while others dont and I believe it'll allow us to choose to live in the area that embraces our personal philosophy instead of centralizing everything to make EVERYONE suffer crappy regulations and government mandates.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fueledpassion View Post
    ur probably right. But I like to dream that one day a straight and narrow non-politician will run for office. Somebody similar to Washington - Someone that doesn't desire money and power more than the well-being of this country. Paul isn't this type of person, but if he just did what he says he'd do I think that would be a good start. Personally, I'm on the Cain train more than anything. We dont need politicians anymore. We need someone with a little sense.

    Plus, if Cain were somehow magically elected into office and somehow passed his taxing deal then we'd have to repeal the 17th amendment which would be a HUGE step back from centralized government power and a big step forward to the original natural rights movement.

    In fact, I think the taxing deal is Cain's plan to open up the door to giving power back to the states which would be just awesome! After all, not all states r equal. Some states have their crap together while others dont and I believe it'll allow us to choose to live in the area that embraces our personal philosophy instead of centralizing everything to make EVERYONE suffer crappy regulations and government mandates.
    the trouble with 9-9-9 is that most economists agree, we lose money the first few years. Which would kill any chance that he has of pushing forward any agenda. I think there have been some Presidents that did truly have the greater good in mind, but it seems that most now have only 1 thing in mind and thats money.

    Very sad indeed
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    I'm going to stick with Obama. It looks like it will be either Romney or Perry. Cain will be another "Flavor of the Month" and then be forgotten. Perry is just Perry and Romney has flip-flopped way too many times since running. The same party that criticized Kerry for doing do should have the cojones to realize that and call him out, but Romney is their best chance in beating Obama, so why would they?
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    kinda funny
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessep76 View Post


    kinda funny
    I found it amusing.I cannot figure out why the GOP hitched their wagon to these teaparty idiots,thereby validating the teabaggers movement,whatever the hell it is.I don`t even understand what their fundamental ideology is.What exactly do they stand for?Isn`t this the group that initially formed in protest of the supposed death squads?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conagher View Post
    I found it amusing.I cannot figure out why the GOP hitched their wagon to these teaparty idiots,thereby validating the teabaggers movement,whatever the hell it is.I don`t even understand what their fundamental ideology is.What exactly do they stand for?Isn`t this the group that initially formed in protest of the supposed death squads?
    Depends...there is the tea party, and then there is the tea party that Palin, Backmann, Glenn Beck and the mainstream infiltrated.

    Really...now we have the new Wall Street movement which will be infiltrated by Obama and his zombie followers and distort that too.

    Best way to squash a genuine movement is to become it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14
    the trouble with 9-9-9 is that most economists agree, we lose money the first few years. Which would kill any chance that he has of pushing forward any agenda.
    Umm wait, we aren't losing money now anyway?
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Umm wait, we aren't losing money now anyway?
    Clearly we need to make cuts. The idea that the wars will be anywhere near done with in the next coming years is nuts. We're still going to be in Iraq and Afghanistan until at least 2018, as much as I opposed us being there in the first place. Same time, reform is another word for cuts when it comes to Medicare and SS. So why do the people that rely on those programs have to be punished because BOTH parties can't properly spend our money where we aren't spending more than we are pulling in? I support the millionaire tax or whatever they want to call it, I'm not falling for their bluffs and the whole "job creators" nonsense. What really needs to happen now is setting up Washington so this country never has to deal with this again, even with the political BS we deal with every year.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumpy View Post
    Clearly we need to make cuts. The idea that the wars will be anywhere near done with in the next coming years is nuts. We're still going to be in Iraq and Afghanistan until at least 2018, as much as I opposed us being there in the first place. Same time, reform is another word for cuts when it comes to Medicare and SS. So why do the people that rely on those programs have to be punished because BOTH parties can't properly spend our money where we aren't spending more than we are pulling in? I support the millionaire tax or whatever they want to call it, I'm not falling for their bluffs and the whole "job creators" nonsense. What really needs to happen now is setting up Washington so this country never has to deal with this again, even with the political BS we deal with every year.
    We build a Embassy in the heart of Baghdad the size of the vatican...we are not leaving 2018, neither are we leaving in Afgan in 2018. We will be there way beyond that.

    We still havent bought our troops home from WWII.
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    And that's the problem, we don't need the numerous bases we have all around the world. With the communication technology, planes, and missiles, the need of these bases barely exists. Have one for every continent at least, but no more.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grumpy View Post
    And that's the problem, we don't need the numerous bases we have all around the world. With the communication technology, planes, and missiles, the need of these bases barely exists. Have one for every continent at least, but no more.
    Wether we need it or not is one thing. I usually express my personal feelings over, but if Im right or wrong doesnt matter as the fact is we cant afford it this country is broke and in debt. We can continue borrowing money from the Chinese. I know the corporations making billions and trillions of dollars in War profits would love to sustain everything as long as possible.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL

    Umm wait, we aren't losing money now anyway?
    Of course we are. But 9,9,9 will hurt us more than help on the first 3-5 years.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ax1 View Post
    Depends...there is the tea party, and then there is the tea party that Palin, Backmann, Glenn Beck and the mainstream infiltrated.

    Really...now we have the new Wall Street movement which will be infiltrated by Obama and his zombie followers and distort that too.

    Best way to squash a genuine movement is to become it.
    Yeah,these people are clowns,too.Cannot figure out what the deal with all the props and costumes is.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conagher View Post
    Yeah,these people are clowns,too.Cannot figure out what the deal with all the props and costumes is.
    Halloween is around the corner, just a coincidence w/ timing. They will be wearing Santa hats before you know it, maybe throw a parade with Disney balloons.
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    Looks like the new hot candidate is putting himself in hot water. Herman Cain has come out and stated (paraphrasing here) "if you do not have a good job, or are not rich, dont blame the rich or the government, blame yourself."

    Wonder how this will effect his numbers
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14 View Post
    Looks like the new hot candidate is putting himself in hot water. Herman Cain has come out and stated (paraphrasing here) "if you do not have a good job, or are not rich, dont blame the rich or the government, blame yourself."

    Wonder how this will effect his numbers
    Definitely not an intelligent thing to say in today`s economic climate.So much for any chance that Cain had for winning the Presidency.The
    more I watch him,the more he reminds me of a used car salesman.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14
    Looks like the new hot candidate is putting himself in hot water. Herman Cain has come out and stated (paraphrasing here) "if you do not have a good job, or are not rich, dont blame the rich or the government, blame yourself."

    Wonder how this will effect his numbers
    At the same time, he's right
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    At the same time, he's right
    In some ways...but America is turning into a caste system and the government has every intention of not only keeping it that way, but building on that.

    Also, I think the illusion that if you work hard, go to school, etc..that you will be that top 5% rich is an un-reasonable false expectation. In this country people are generally taught to dream big, and when they dont get there as expected they carry themselves as miserable and start getting addicted to lottery tickets as their key to happiness.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    At the same time, he's right
    Generalize much?

    You know that it is not entirely true
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14

    Generalize much?

    You know that it is not entirely true
    Is the government or corporations stopping people from educating themselves or spending more time on their children's education? No, and the value of unskilled uneducated labor drops each year by supply vs demand.

    Again look at unemployment by education level.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ax1

    In some ways...but America is turning into a caste system and the government has every intention of not only keeping it that way, but building on that.

    Also, I think the illusion that if you work hard, go to school, etc..that you will be that top 5% rich is an un-reasonable false expectation. In this country people are generally taught to dream big, and when they dont get there as expected they carry themselves as miserable and start getting addicted to lottery tickets as their key to happiness.
    Some do sure, but anyone can make it to the 100k a year level and live well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Some do sure, but anyone can make it to the 100k a year level and live well.
    Yes...anyone may have a chance, and I also agree you can make far less than that and live well.

    That chance though is only limited and there are only a small % of jobs available that even make 100k. According to the 2009 census 9.7% of Americans make 100k and up. I know there are far more than that that qualify for the same type's of jobs but are in a impossible situation of limited work.

    I feel that if everybody gets a master education, and is equally as competitive, hard working and smart..still only 9.7% will make 100k.

    This is what they told people in China that if they get an high education they will do good. With the increase and overabundance of college graduates in China many and more in the future are being left out with no real job opportunities because you can only supply a certain amount of jobs.

    In any monetary system most have to be poor and there is no choice. The only solution to this is to ban the monetary system and to move on to a resource based economy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Some do sure, but anyone can make it to the 100k a year level and live well.
    this is just not true. not everyone has the same opportunities as others. Not all circumstances are the same.

    Additionally, the value of degrees has changed. Currently, a bachelors degree is the equivalent to a HS degree of 20 years ago.

    Your oversimplification does not address the realities that are being faced.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14

    this is just not true. not everyone has the same opportunities as others. Not all circumstances are the same.

    Additionally, the value of degrees has changed. Currently, a bachelors degree is the equivalent to a HS degree of 20 years ago.

    Your oversimplification does not address the realities that are being faced.
    And attempting to hold the government and corporations responsible for a population that makes more effort to watch tv than improve skills its no different
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    And attempting to hold the government and corporations responsible for a population that makes more effort to watch tv than improve skills its no different
    These are obvious issues I agree with you on completely, but its just a part of a complex equation that there are no single answers too. The answers are found on more of a individual bases than the country as a whole.
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    And attempting to hold the government and corporations responsible for a population that makes more effort to watch tv than improve skills its no different
    again....an enormous generalization. Are there those who fall into your assumption? Of course, but by and large that does not seem to be an accurate depiction at all

    I dont know what is going on today E, typically I am pretty much with you on these issues, but we are having a rough generalization day today
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    I'm extra grumpy because I'm traveling for work. The things you have to do to make that $
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14 View Post
    Looks like the new hot candidate is putting himself in hot water. Herman Cain has come out and stated (paraphrasing here) "if you do not have a good job, or are not rich, dont blame the rich or the government, blame yourself."

    Wonder how this will effect his numbers
    Didn't he say that to the occupiers? Don't be made at wall street, be mad at yourself for not being rich (sounded like)
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    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Is the government or corporations stopping people from educating themselves or spending more time on their children's education? No, and the value of unskilled uneducated labor drops each year by supply vs demand.

    Again look at unemployment by education level.
    Stopping them no, certainly not. I got all my college education from grants, but that was 10 years ago. Tuition keeps getting more expensive and last I checked they were talking about cutting grants if they haven't already. Community colleges were the way to go when I was in school to save on fee's for your first 2 years and then only have to go into half the debt for the State or University college. Community colleges are twice what they cost from 10 years ago. Unemployment on the other hand is higher also. So its safe to say its not easy to get an education for some.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessep76 View Post
    Didn't he say that to the occupiers? Don't be made at wall street, be mad at yourself for not being rich (sounded like)
    Cain was Chairman of the Federal Reserve branch in Kansas (but they market him a pizza guy.) He will say whatever propaganda it takes to cool off and invalidate any enemies of his corporate/banking interests.
    나는 2000년 10월 매들린 올브라이트 전 미 국무장관 매들린 사랑, 그 중 한 뜨거운 젠장!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessep76 View Post
    Stopping them no, certainly not. I got all my college education from grants, but that was 10 years ago. Tuition keeps getting more expensive and last I checked they were talking about cutting grants if they haven't already. Community colleges were the way to go when I was in school to save on fee's for your first 2 years and then only have to go into half the debt for the State or University college. Community colleges are twice what they cost from 10 years ago. Unemployment on the other hand is higher also. So its safe to say its not easy to get an education for some.
    exactly, its not easier now by any stretch. Add in the value of a bachelors in todays job world (which is minimal) and you realize how difficult it is.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AE14 View Post
    Looks like the new hot candidate is putting himself in hot water. Herman Cain has come out and stated (paraphrasing here) "if you do not have a good job, or are not rich, dont blame the rich or the government, blame yourself."

    Wonder how this will effect his numbers
    With the folks he is trying to attract to nominate him, that might get more cheers than the execution of 200+ people.
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