Muliculturism has Failed

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  1. OK tough guys-- It's easy to say "kick em all out and lock down the border." But considering there are 5-10 million of them already here (and without them, major sectors of our economy would collapse), my challenge to you is this: come up with a creative and fair way to allow them to stay. Take your time; impress me...
    mw2012


  2. Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    No, because alcohol is a product you consume, not a person who will breed more children, raise the population, while the majority of them are in low end uneducated careers and relying more on government assistance than they pay in taxes. You are comparing apples and oranges.
    E, you know as well as I do, that a crackdown per se will not work because it is half-a$$ed. Additionally because many of those in power get more votes and retain their power the more that are here. There is money to be made by allowing this...and it will continue to do so.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by ImJ2x View Post
    OK tough guys-- It's easy to say "kick em all out and lock down the border." But considering there are 5-10 million of them already here (and without them, major sectors of our economy would collapse), my challenge to you is this: come up with a creative and fair way to allow them to stay. Take your time; impress me...
    There are more than 14 million people on unemployment right now who are actual US citizens with a right to be here. If all the illegals disappeared it would likely lower unemployment.

    There isn't a fair way to allow them to stay, as its unfair to nice educated useful people from all the other countries on the planet that want to immigrate here.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by AE14 View Post
    E, you know as well as I do, that a crackdown per se will not work because it is half-a$$ed. Additionally because many of those in power get more votes and retain their power the more that are here. There is money to be made by allowing this...and it will continue to do so.
    Well, its just as you say, a half assed crackdown won't work. Establish a simple system - once deported if you are ever found illegally in the US again its an instant death sentence by border patrol. Then build a real wall, have it set up with automated machine guns to shoot whoever tries to cross.

    Yes they have a right to live, they also have a right to stay in their own country. Our government is empowered to do 2 things by the constitution, regulate interstate commerce and protect our borders. Its amazing how much additional crap they try to do, when they can't get protect the borders right.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    There are more than 14 million people on unemployment right now who are actual US citizens with a right to be here. If all the illegals disappeared it would likely lower unemployment.

    There isn't a fair way to allow them to stay, as its unfair to nice educated useful people from all the other countries on the planet that want to immigrate here.
    OK Eric. If you refuse to let them stay; if you're convinced that people are willing to come off unemployment to pick our strawberries and clean our toilets for minimum wage... how do you propose to implement this master plan of yours? Exactly how do you intend to round up 5-10 million Mexicans, and ship them back across the border?
    And why this hatred towards Mexicans? Did a brown person run over your dog when you were a wee lad? Do you feel the same disdain towards blacks? Gays? Women? Jews? I'm just asking...
    My parents are "nice, educated, useful" and super-white people, but they made 6 babies. Does this qualify as a "pile" of children? Maybe it's not too late to send them back to Ireland...
    mw2012
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by ImJ2x View Post
    I work in the hospitality industry in Southern California. We could not run our hotel without the absolutely wonderful Mexican people (legal, illegal-- who knows?) who do the jobs that "real Americans" are unwilling to do. The most impressive people I've met since I moved to Orange County are Mexican. Period. I want these fine, brave people to have a legal and reasonably streamlined path to citizenship. They are not flaunting our laws in any way. In fact, they are willing to put themselves in legal jeopardy to secure a better way of life for their children. (Who will, btw, learn English, within one generation, even if their parents don't.)
    Your industry is a huge part of the problem. The notion that they do jobs Americans "aren't willing to do" is just plain false the truth is industries like yours take full advantage of the opprotunity to pay illegals a substandard wage that a citizen would not accept thus increasing their own profit margins. Try telling all this to people who work in the healthcare industry whose facilities struggle to stay economically viable because illegals use the hiospital ER as their own personal doctors office for themselves and their children. They know that they cannot be turned away and take advantage of this knowing full well they will never pay one cent of what they owe. I do not call that "wonderful" or "impressive".
    They are "flaunting?" our laws immediately upon entering the country illegally. My wife is Mexican and the first generation of her family born here and she is even opposed to the current immigration situation, probably because her parents came here on work visas and natuarlized the right way instead of running across the border in the middle of the night in clear violation of American law.

    Quote Originally Posted by omni View Post
    We are Americans for a reason. Some of us weren't born here but have assimilated into OUR culture, learned OUR language and will die for the freedoms OUR culture provides. Our dead soldiers didn't die for illegal immigration. They fought for America.
    This is an extremely important point as far as I'm concerned. When our forefathers came here they not only did so the right way, they assimilated themselves into American culture because they wanted to be Americans. Immigrants no longer care to assimilate, they want to take advantage of the land of opprotunity but maintain a seperate cultural identity. I say assimilate or get the hell out.

    Quote Originally Posted by ImJ2x View Post
    my challenge to you is this: come up with a creative and fair way to allow them to stay. Take your time; impress me...
    This post is just silly! Why should anyone undertake this challenge? They are called "illegal" immigrants for a reason they are criminals who entered the country in defiance of our laws.

    Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Well, its just as you say, a half assed crackdown won't work. Establish a simple system - once deported if you are ever found illegally in the US again its an instant death sentence by border patrol. Then build a real wall, have it set up with automated machine guns to shoot whoever tries to cross.
    Strong union! I'm not sure I would go that far but it sure would make you think twice about running across the border illegally.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by BUCKNUTS View Post
    Your industry is a huge part of the problem. The notion that they do jobs Americans "aren't willing to do" is just plain false the truth is industries like yours take full advantage of the opprotunity to pay illegals a substandard wage that a citizen would not accept thus increasing their own profit margins.
    Just recently a young man threw up in our lobby bathroom. It was awful; literally everywhere, on the floor and every wall. And the smell was quickly filling the lobby. Before I even had to ask, our Mexican houseman was in there cleaning it up. God bless him. What wage would we have to pay you to clean that mess? Is there such a wage? Or would you just quit? Not all our housemen are Mexicans, but it's only the Mexicans who actually clean the restrooms. The others just plain won't.
    And how many non-hispanic applicants do we get for our housekeeper positions? Zero.
    You can stick your head in the sand and pretend we don't need that portion of the labor force to run America, but we absolutely do. We need them as much as they need us.
    mw2012

  8. Quote Originally Posted by ImJ2x View Post
    OK Eric. If you refuse to let them stay; if you're convinced that people are willing to come off unemployment to pick our strawberries and clean our toilets for minimum wage... how do you propose to implement this master plan of yours? Exactly how do you intend to round up 5-10 million Mexicans, and ship them back across the border?
    And why this hatred towards Mexicans? Did a brown person run over your dog when you were a wee lad? Do you feel the same disdain towards blacks? Gays? Women? Jews? I'm just asking...
    My parents are "nice, educated, useful" and super-white people, but they made 6 babies. Does this qualify as a "pile" of children? Maybe it's not too late to send them back to Ireland...
    You implement the master plan by actually doing it. Not by talking about it, not by making half ass raids, not by placing them in detention centers for time while you work out what to do with them. But by throwing them on buses and trains, and taking them back over the border and leaving them there. And by making the penalty for returning a death sentence. If you want to say a death sentence isn't a deterrent, thats fine, but they won't be crossing the border a third time.

    Your parents came here legally, so the number of kids they had is irrelevant. I have no hatred towards mexicans at all.

    I have disgust for people who think that because they illegally cross a border they have a right to the benefits of being a US citizen. There is and always has been a legal way to come into the US and become a naturalized citizen, and I have a great respect for anyone of any group who does that. I see no reason why 11+ million mexican citizen who committed a crime to be here should be given a preference over the also deserving immigrants around the globe who are making the effort to legally cross the border.

  9. Throwing millions of people on buses and trains (assuming you can find them) is ludicrous. How much money are you willing to spend to eradicate a large and productive portion of our labor force?
    mw2012

  10. And you're honestly willing to kill anyone attempting to cross the border? Would you agree to non-lethal means of enforcement?
    mw2012

  11. Quote Originally Posted by ImJ2x View Post
    Throwing millions of people on buses and trains (assuming you can find them) is ludicrous. How much money are you willing to spend to eradicate a large and productive portion of our labor force?
    Allowing criminals to remain in our country just because they've been here a while is ludicrous. I'd spend as much as it takes to remove the criminals from our country, and follow our country's laws. If cost was relevant to dealing with a crime, then no murder or robbery would ever get convicted as the court costs and investigative costs are ridiculous.

    "In 1996, it cost Washington state, on average, $23,279 to prosecute a felony and $593 to prosecute a misdemeanor."

    So should washington have stopped prosecuting people who stole a car (grand theft auto, a felony) where the car was recovered because it was ludicrous to spend more than the value of the car new to prosecute it? thats not including any jail time for the convictee. Using your logic, it would be ludicrous to prosecute it. It surely won't cost $25k per illegal immigrant to send them home to the country where they are a citizen and have the right to be.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by ImJ2x View Post
    And you're honestly willing to kill anyone attempting to cross the border? Would you agree to non-lethal means of enforcement?
    I am willing to kill them, its the ultimate deterrent. if we could find a non-lethal deterrent that would work thats fine, but short of building a 30 foot electric fence topped with barbed wire, I doubt we can. And we'd need more nukes to power the electric fence

  13. Your wall would cost a fortune. Enough buses and trains to move that many people would cost even more. It would absolutely dwarf whatever money we spend prosecuting car thieves. Would we raise taxes (alot) to pay for it? And then, like I said, we're sabotaging our own economy. I can't imagine an America without the contributions these hard-working people make to our society. Would the produce section at the grocery store be empty? Or would the unemployed be willing to give up free money to go pick lettuce in the fields? And at what wage? Are you ready to pay $15 for a head of lettuce?
    mw2012

  14. See thats the amazing thing, supply vs demand really works. Would it cripple our economy? No, of course not. Things would adjust, as they always do and in the end it would work just fine.

    I can certainly easily imagine an america without the contributions of people who are here illegally. And thats of any race or color, there are areas where there are pretty huge amounts of asian illegals, and people who have overstayed student or work visa, etc. We issue those visas, we track them, we track addresses of the people on them, yet when they expire does INS normally even go talk to them? Nope, we just hope they go back on their own.

  15. We're gonna have to agree to disagree on this one. I see them as an asset to our country; you see them as a liability. But I've been awake all night (working on something awesome), and I need to get some sleep. Peace...
    mw2012

  16. I would rather have our teens taking the jobs of the illegals and cancel unemployment benefits forcing all citizens to work instead of having open borders. It is the governments responsibility to defend our borders. It should be a military zone. Its not just Mexicans crossing .

    http://www.thehotjoints.com/2010/05/...er-in-arizona/

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...4d11f4fe3a.421

  17. Quote Originally Posted by omni View Post
    I would rather have our teens taking the jobs of the illegals and cancel unemployment benefits forcing all citizens to work instead of having open borders. It is the governments responsibility to defend our borders. It should be a military zone. Its not just Mexicans crossing .

    http://www.thehotjoints.com/2010/05/...er-in-arizona/

    http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...4d11f4fe3a.421
    Good points omni. LOL....I can't rep you again yet.

    Just a few clarifications that I believe need to be shared.

    "Immigrant" does not automatically mean a bad person.

    "Illegal immigrant" is a bad person by the very definition of the term. If they come to the US illegally to work, they are committing multiple felonies to do so. If a US citizen is convicted of an equivalent crime, they lose the right to vote, own firearms and who knows what the hell else. And yeah, I know that fruit will go up, dishes won't get washed, houses won't get framed etc etc. But, there has got to be a better and safer way to allow these people to work here and pay income taxes.

    Being a conservative does not mean you are a racist or that you are culturally insensitive.

  18. This is a long article but worth reading. Illegal Aliens - America's
    21st Century Slave Class
    http://www.rense.com/general72/21st.htm

    While I was reading this, I was wondering if the legal immigrants were working side by side in the same jobs as the illegal immigrants. If they are, then I see a solution to the "who's going to pick our vegetables" argument.
    Another thing I was thinking about is...Why doesn't the Mexican government take care of their own people? They have cheap labor. Why can't they design a car, tv , cell phone or appliances? They can open schools to educate the kids and then colleges. The Mexican government change things.
    Maybe instead of guarding our boarders, we should expand our borders all the way through South America. The first new buildings could be large prisons for the gangs and drug cartels. Imagine all the roads, buildings, farming, new industry and vacation spots we could have all with cheap labor. All the cheap labor would be taxed and America would thrive again. Most Democrats and Liberals are OK with cheap labor from illegal immigrats anyway so why not expand and make everyone happy. All the Mexican people would be happy to have America come to them. It would be years before they realized we only wanted them for cheap labor...kind of like slaves.(tongue in cheek)

  19. Multiculturalism never worked.

  20. From the United Kingdom to France to Spain to Germany, leaders or former leaders have decried multiculturalism as a poisonous experiment for their nations.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...e-melting-pot/

  21. I'm not as sold on the dangers of multiculturalism... but it does appear that Europe walks on egg-shells around Islam..maybe residual fear from the Ottoman days


    YouTube - Family Guy-Ottoman Empire

  22. Multiculturalism is quite obviously a failure anywhere you go. You can't have multiple groups who think and act differently and expect them to live peacefully among each other. The very definition of multiculturalism can be summed up as "cluster-fck of beliefs."

    Read the US Constitution. If you agree with it, stay in the States. If you don't, you shouldn't be here. - The United States Culture is the United States Constitution; the Supreme Law of the Land. It is NOT a living document. It is NOT flexible.

    So many ignorant citizens believe the Constitution to be this massive rule book for their lives when in fact it's a small, almost pamphlet size article that says what the government cannot do.

    Case Law has completely fcked up our constitution and has made it completely unrecognizable. It's almost as if they've copied a cassette tape, and made a copy of the copy, and then a copy of that copy, and so on to where the instruments and lyrics can't even be made out anymore.

  23. Multiculteralism does seem to throw a wrench in things. Its one thing to stick in groups and people who speak your natural language when your a first generation immigrant. From what i understand (and have heard directly from my grandma) the immigrants that came here through ellis island wanted to be american. Initially they only knew there culture and language, but the urge to become american is something most of todays immigrants lack. I know hispanics born in america that can barely speak english. In contrast my grandma's mother would only speak english to her children, she refused to let them learn her native language because they were americans now. Todays immigrants run around waving their native coutries flag, talking down the country they are living in, the one that provides them and most likely their entire extended family back home a means of survival. Wtf?

  24. So yes, i'd rather pay 15$ for a head of lettuce than get a cheap one pick by someone who hates my country. i'm sure all our food prices would go up, but atleast the money would stay in the US instead of being western unioned to south america.
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