Mavi Marama raid...the real IDF footage
- 06-11-2010, 04:32 AM
This is a joke right?
Terrorism is a tactic my friend. Guerilla warfare is a tactic as well, and entirely different. Here, look at this site, which is the first one on google:
American revolutionists were not terrorists. They were freedom fighters, or Guerillas, fighting a military force much larger and better than their own. Terorists target civilians for political/religious/psychological agendas.
This is coming from someone who has experience with such things...myself.
You have no idea how intelligent our enemies truly are. I'm not at liberty to talk about why, but lets just say they are about 10,000 times smarter than you think. They have outlasted 150,000 soldiers for 8 years now.
America has the best armed and trained fighting force in the world...no other country in the world could maintain forces in over 80 countries...America will stand against EVERY enemy, and if you don't think so...I don't have much respect for you. I am one of the most patriotic people you will ever know, and I don't take kindly to people making even slight references against our troops.
On to muslims...I'm in Iraq mate. I think that qualifies me slightly more to comment on the character of muslims. I've met and worked with many more than 75, and I am in their country.
20-30% of the WORLD is muslim. You are going to pass judgement on 2 billion people based off of your opinion of 75? I'm glad I don't go to your church....
It's also one of the oldest and largest cultures in the world. 1000 years ago the Muslims were so much more advanced than the rest of the world it was a joke.
I bet you I know a lot more about the religious side of it than you, being a cultural expert is part of my job, extensive studies are included in that, above and beyond the basic courses in islam and culture EVERY SINGLE U.S. SOLDIER IS REQUIRED TO ATTEND.
I've known WAY more than 75 Americans who were total **** bags, do you think I hate Americans?
This is the most ignorant post I have ever seen in my life....even the non extremists are dumb enough to follow? Why the **** do you think we have been in Iraq and Afghanistan for 8 years now? If they were all ****bags we would have finished up 10 days after we got here. less than 1% of the population here are terrorists. They are normal people man.
Who exactly is the horse you speak of? The Grand Ayatollah? Random Imams? Muhammed? Do you even know anything about Islam?
Your last sentence doesn't make any sense at all...you aren't stereotyping, you are condeming an entire religion based on a few bad experiences you have, which I would bet money were bad because you are a radical yourself. I have never met a men who touts his religion around so much as you and was so demeaning and ignorant of other people.
- 06-11-2010, 09:15 AM
06-13-2010, 04:28 AM
Every religion will have the rapists, weirdos, freaks, label bearers,etc.
But not every religion accepts such things as beating your wife cuz your sammich was made wrong, and say its ok -.-
I dont count most christians as christians anyways, I was actually shocked to find out a few things about some christian leaders in my church, and another church, and their current youth leaders. Just made me go WTF is wrong with you people?
Money plays too big of a damn role anymore...
and as for passing judgement on 2 billion...well maybe they should ship some of their better ones here for me to meet and learn from. A man can only go by what he sees in person. To me, its not what you see, its what I see. To you, its not what I see, its what you see.
Thats like referring to prison...what % is black?
You want your people to have a certain image, represent it...White people get the redneck bit, black people get the jail bit, french get the "pussies" bit, muslims get the...hell muslim bit. I make jokes about strapping C4 to a pigeon and sending them off to blow someone up, but they would actually friggin do it.
As for them being smarter...dude, we are still discovering new fish in rivers we have been searching for the last 200 years...
In a country full of mountains and terrain, and where everyone wears layers of covering clothing, its not hard to vanish and hide.
As for their country, why cant their people fight their people? if only 1% are the bad guys, then you telling me that 99% of muslims are incompetent pussies who cant stand up for themselves?
And on the plain and simple viewpoint, I see muslims as misguided. Their entire heaven is based off of the Cardinal sin of "lust"....thats enough for me to disqualify a religion of having any merit.
72 virgins? wtf how many insecure men really have to turn to a religion for contentment. Honestly, you think that a grand creator of the heavens and the earth would place the reward for being a good man, to be to "wordly" take 72 virgins just made for that man?
Budhism is about spiritual peace and tranquility, christianity is about faith and healing and peace, catholicism is pretty much the same...but weird, many of them focus on being "non-wordly"....that when we die, we transcend...not degrade into horny bastards for all of eternity...and to subjugate 72 other souls to be under then for eternity, instead of an equality for eternity...
So up front, I am biased. And aside from my friend Maleke, who sadly returned to Africa because of the death of his brother(if thats even the truth, muslims here use lies such as trips like that to go to another job and "test" it out and then come back if its not better..common practice here) I have seen no good.
hell every Haji shop I have went to have been dealing drugs out the back door as well...
Honestly, they simply have had bad representation here then. Not saying good ones dont exist, but I am saying they cant be #rd in the higher end of the %s at this rate.
The only reason they have eluded us is political "red tape". And like I said, I am very biased. But not just because of my religion, but because in comparison to any religion...they are tweaked the wrong way...Plus they have a weird feeling around them, I would never trust one.
06-13-2010, 07:02 PM
^ Biased and very misinformed my friend. I think you should do some research on your own instead of judging people so.
There is not one bit of fact in your statements. What % of prisons are black? I guarantee you a higher % are white.
Yeah, I am sure there would be a gap in how many christians beat their wives vs muslims, because islam is the largest religion in the world. If you took the % however I would bet money they would be a lot closer than you think.
I have yet to see a Jerry Springer type show in a muslim country.
Oh, and a muslim I work with just warned me about a snake that is out near where our car is parked. He doesn't even speak English.
The 72 virgin thing is just a stupid oral tradition that has been passed down. It isn't mentioned anywhere in the Q'uran, in fact the holy book of Islam actually says you will be with your wife in heaven. The 72 virgin thing was an interpretation, and it is akin to the christian wings and harp. ie, most people know its just a stupid story someone made up. Just by you thinking their "entire religion" is based on lust makes you look like a fool, and the fact that every fact I state in my remarks to you I verified before typing. Seriously...think before you talk?
Your views are misguided my friend. You call yourself christian, but I do not see any christian values in you at all. In fact it bothers me very much that you tout around the fact that you don't have sex, you post it anywhere it will make sense, yet you are clearly racist, have a low tolerance for other religions, and don't bother to know about things you talk about.
As far as muslims being stupid: http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/...ons/index.html
06-13-2010, 08:54 PM
I have a high tolerance of jewish, catholic,morman(sp?), hindu, buddhist, and so on and find them interesting in their own rights. Again, actually very tolerant to anyone who actually knows me. In fact a good friend is morman, and I know some really nice jewish people. I even treat Jehovas Witness peeps nicely lol.
But muslims...I have seen them bring nothing to America but issues, conflict, and many problems. Them and atheists are one of the leading groups causing issues for Christian foundations and rights here in the states. Many elementary schools now forbid bibles from being carried, crosses from being worn, and any shirt showing Jesus. Yet the little towel heads can wear their headwraps because its their cultural right? I have never seen one of them be a good worker here, then again every one I have seen is in one form or another mooching off the government.
You may be right about the 72 virgins bit. But no one actually expects wings and a harp, and there is no lust in that....72 virgins is a lust-lure for attracting new believers IMO.
And as for citing 10 things they invented, hell Nazi's had some technological advancement too! So lets say they are swell people, k?
And I havent seen any Christian extremists sawing off anyones heads lately. Or buddhist extremists....etc,etc,etc
Hopefully the Israel will soon reach its point where it can deal with them.
Which Muslim countries are current world powers capable of taking on anyone and everyone else? They were always smashed when they tried long ago, by the Catholic crusades.
And as for muslims being the most populace religion in the world, I believe it. It is near the end times, and it was stated the darkness and false prophets would spread and take over.
My friend, the reason America is falling to its doom is because it has been far far too tolerant...
Now dont get me wrong. If I see a muslim broke down, I would help them. If I see them not have anything for lunch, I will generally offer something of mine that is spare. Their culture, religion, is all false. But I still treat the individual with respect. I see no purpose for their false religion, save it is another challenge from satan. I would give one the shirt off my back, doesnt mean I like them any more. Its doing whats right even to that which you disagree with.
That being said, YOU CANNOT have someone be a christian, and say being muslim is ok....doesnt make sense. They cancel out as calling the other false, they dont accept christians not by a long shot, hell over there we can be killed. Yet for stating I find their false doctrines(which in order to be a Christian your very teaching is that the false doctrines of the world or just that, false) disgusting is my right to have as an opinion.
oh and about prison
Census 2000 shows that predominantly White Franklin County New York more than doubled its Black population since 1990. That would be news to both the residents of the county and the prisoners, neither of whom consider the prisoners to be residents of Franklin County. Ninety-one percent of Franklin County’s Black population is incarcerated in the county’s 5 state prisons.
In 2003 4,834 out of every 100,000 black males were sentenced to prison compared to 681 per every 100,000 white males and 1,778 per 100,000 Hispanic males
Read more: Race and Ethnicity - Incarceration And Minorities http://law.jrank.org/pages/12131/Rac...#ixzz0qmWx2PIl
I am really not racist, there is a line between racism and statistics...
you know in lower crime areas, I am sure it evens out. But where the big money is at, its far from even...
I dont know where the hell your hometown is man, but I want to go there it must be a damn peachy place for you to only know of the happy tree muslims and to see no racial divide and its all equal...
I know your serving, and I respect that, but your also going to be getting the "pretty press" guys in your field, the ones who have the sole job of making their culture look friendly, nice,etc.
And finally, you get on me for being intolerant....you do realize that the Christian God will be sending all muslims to eternal damnation per the belief of anyone who is christian? That is the general understanding of the faith, that false doctrines that are a blasphemy against God will not be given entry into heaven? And yet you conflict with me for having issues with them? Like I said I would do what I could to help a man in need(unless he was a satanist maybe...or big pharma CEO, or BP executive, or obama) and would also risk my life if it was a child or younger person or someone who I knew was a good man or woman, even if they are of the faith. But I will never see it as any more than an affliction.
I understand where you are coming from, but you should understand where I am coming from as well. I see our entire life as a spiritual war with the single purpose that you do your best to save a few souls from hell before you die and go onto glory...thats it, muslims are seeking to take people to hell...so to me, they are just as deadly and of a risk(spiritually and eternally) as Nazis....take a minute out to understand the spiritual warfare aspect. And forgive me for my own tight views.They are dragging peoples souls into eternal damnation, kinda makes them not easy to be fond of as well...
Now as for the jerry springer aspect, AMERICA IS NO LONGER A CHRISTIAN NATION... that stopped when the damn liberals(i know not just them) really started turning it into a disgusting homo-filled wasteland of filth,porn, and special rights groups. Australia as far as I know is the only remaining nation that claims national Christian faith. If I am not mistaken.
As for America, I am beginning to believe it is the great whore lol.
I would prefer to drop the subject though.
06-14-2010, 02:11 AM
How about the KKK? Oh wait, those are good christians right?
How about the Crusades? Oh wait, that was in the past so it doesn't count.
How about The Lord's Resistance Army, who has been accused of many crimes against humanity? Oh right, it's not in America so it doesn't count.
You know that the Nazi's were radical christians right? Oh right...past again.
Crusade 2: 1147 - Christians attempt to take damascus, failed
Crusade 3: 1187 - Saladin conquers Jerusalem, FYI he is muslim. Civilians are not harmed and churches remain standing
Crusade 4: 1202 - Christians sack constantinople, a christian city. This is the split between roman catholic and greek orthodox churches.
Crusade 5: 1217 - Christians attempt to take jerusalem through Egypt. They get defeated at Cairo, and a muslim counter-attack ends with the christians surrender.
Crusade 6: 1228 - Christians took control of Jerusalem through diplomacy
Crusade 7: 1248 - Christians storm Jerusalem. They are defeated by the muslims within 48 hours in gaza.
Crusade 8: 1270 - Nothing happened, Louis IX died 2 months into it.
Crusade 9: 1271 - Edward I led a failed expidition. Crusades are done.
I cliff-noted it for you since you are unable to do your own research. Out of all the crusades, most failed. Christians took Jerusalem once by force, and once by diplomacy. Muslims took everything back. Also notice how the christians started the crusades. Muslims did not invade anything, the pope in rome just decided that the world should be christian, and started the crusades. This is fact, but I am sure you will have some stupid ass retort.
End rant. I refuse to respond to you until you start using some sense and facts in your argument. You did use the prison census, and I commend you for that, but every single other thing you have said has just been pure prejudice and bigotry. I'll be the big boy and let this die...
Argentina, Costa Rica, Liechenstein, Malta, Monaco, The Vatican, Greece, Finland, Denmark, Iceland, Norway, England, Scotland.
You are mistaken, and a 2 second google search could have saved face for you.
And I have no idea how you are so religous as to hate all other religions but misquote the bible...
06-14-2010, 06:22 AM
getting back to the footage:
Looking at the footage I must agree. Those activist shouldn't have attacked soldiers with metal poles. If I was one of them I'd probably shoot as well..
06-14-2010, 06:32 PM
For reference, next time you are pulled over for any reason, please attack the police officer with a metal pole, and see if your outcome differs from the Marmara.
06-14-2010, 06:40 PM
And btw, Reuters was caught editing photos from the deck of the marmara: in both photos, you see different idf soldiers laying bloody on the ground, and peoples legs and feet appear in the pictures. In one, you see someones hand with a large bloody knife in it, standing over the soldier, and in the other, a hand on the railing of the ship with a different bloody knife.
For those who believe they were justified in attacking the soldiers: 1) the idf was legally within its rights to board, 2) the marmara was breaking the law by approaching the barricade, 3) the marmara was warned of the consequences of trying to cross the blockade before they ever left turkey, on the way, and multiple times during that night before they boarded.
They are allowed to try to cross the blockade, just as you or I can make the choice to drive 90mph on the freeway. But we all know the consequences of our actions. They should've used passive resistance on board the marmara, not terrorist tactics (and actual terrorists with ties to global jihad/al qaeda. That totally erodes any point they were trying to make.
06-14-2010, 07:50 PM
You make very good points Votum! But so does Zero, and both of you are right.. Kind of. I am part Jordanian and in the military. I am not racist by any mean, but I am justified at being prejudice based on ATTITUDE, not color or religion. The majority of Arabs/Muslims that I know, and trust me, I know a lot, especially since half of my family is Arab, are not decent people; they indecent, rude, violent, loud, abusive and selfish.. I cant stand that half of my family!!! And I think the majority of Non Jew Arabs in general are anti Jew, from what I have seen and im talking about Christian Arabs and Muslim Arabs! Again, you cant call me racist or biased.. BECAUSE I am an Arab!
06-14-2010, 10:06 PM
Votum,in talking about the crusades please remember the primary reason for them was the violent incursions by Muslims into Christian territories.Also your statement that Christianity and Judaism evolved from Zoroastrianism is false for many reasons.One of which is that Zoroaster or more rightly Zarathustra is mostly beleived (including by the people who live in the area of Iran he was from) to have lived between 600-500 A.D.,while Moses is believed to have lived between 1300-1500 B.C.If anything Zoroastrianism probably evolved from Judaism.
You also said there is only one false prophet while Jesus Himself (Matt.24:24 and Mark 13:22) speaks of false Christs and false prophets.What you speak of in Rev.13 is the false prophet who along with the anti-Christ Satan will use during the tribulation (which is after the rapture in most thought)to form a kind of un-holy trinity.
I am not really sure where you got that nazis were Christians.Some may have claimed to be but must were either atheist or follwed the Norse relegion of Odin.While Hitler in His public speaches spoke of God , in private letters and other writings he often disparaged the idea of a god and of his hatred for Christianity.Now if I wanted to know what a polititian thought I would probably pay more attention to what he said in private than when he was trying to sway the people.
I am only replying to the specefic statements you made about Christianity.I just see to many untrue things said like they are true and never go corrected.Like when atheist talk about how many deaths religion is responsible but do not even think about the hundreds of millions of people in this century alone atheists have been responsible for (Stalin , Mao, Pol Pot just to name a few.
06-14-2010, 11:35 PM
I think it is probably arguable how they started, notice the article does state christians were being mistreated, but the Pope talked about "great attrocities" being commited. Big difference there, and there are a bunch of other reasons in the article that aren't "in response to muslim encroachment" However there is no doubt that muslims were attacking once christian lands...but then again you could say they were re-taking arab lands since the Romans had conquered the land 800ish years before.
BBC states that Zoroastrianism was founded 12-1500 BC, based on archaeological evidence.
This article explains a lot of the similarities between the two. It should be noted also, that it is arguable which came first, some people think Judaism was first, and some people think zoroastrianism was first.
I actually searched a bit and couldn't find anything saying Zoroastrianism evolved from Judaism, if you have any sources I would like to see them
You are right about Jesus talking about false prophets, but I understand those verses to be about the world going to crap before the end of days. There will be only 1 false prophet during the end of days though, if I misunderstood, my bad
Just one article. I think it is probably arguable about the Nazis being christian, but I think the idea has enough merit to validate my point. They viewed Protestantism as the true German religion, and many Nazi rites and ceremonies were modeled after christian variants. They thought Jesus was an Aryan o.O
Heres another more reputable source with many other sources within it:
It's really very interesting stuff. I consider myself fairly non biased when it comes to religions, because there are so many that are so similiar it just seems odd that only one is the right one. In fact, point 24 of the National Socialist Program endorsed "Positive Christianity"
Odin is the King of the Norse Pantheon, there was a term "Odinism" but it wasn't a wide spread religion. The SS had some occult stuff going on as well, but I don't think you can really back up that statement about most Nazis being Atheist or Pagan. I'd like to see some articles or something though, history is one of my favorite subjects
I agree with you for the most part. Most of what I say has research behind it. I posted all the sources for each one of my counterpoints above, I'm not trying to prove you wrong or anything, just asking for you to post your sources as well so I can better myself. I love history from all aspects and of all times, so if I am misunderstanding anything or telling flat out lies I'd like to see the proof so I can better myself!
06-15-2010, 12:51 AM
I am glad you admit that my points were at least arguable.I just so many times see statements made (usually negative) about Christianity as irrefutable fact that I feel are wrong or at the least arguable and it seems it gets repeated over and over without anyone ever even trying to figure out if it is true or not.
Ok, I guess I do not have enough posts to post web links.So on just Hitler alone if you search Hitler atheism you will find an article called Adolph Hitler- Christian,Atheist,or Neither.I think it is very fair.After reading it and other things I am not sure what he was but I am sure he was not a Christian. Goebbels said that as Christianity came from Judaism they would both be destroyed.
06-15-2010, 01:47 AM
I agree with you on Hitler, I don't think he was a christian, but I do think the majority of the Nazi army was. Hitler spun it in such a way that they thought they were doing the right thing, like saying Jesus was an Aryan.
For the record, I will argue either side of any argument lol. I remember once I had to debate against using grey water on lawns. I actually think it would be an ok idea, but I did a bunch of research to prepare, killed the debate, and ended it with something like, "don't use grey water on your lawn if you don't want to kill your kids!" Rest of the class voted, I think one voted for grey water lol. College biology class a few years ago. Meh.
I could argue with a wall
06-15-2010, 08:12 AM
In the end, all of the world's religions were created by the powerful elite to help give them another tool to control the unwashed masses.
06-15-2010, 08:16 AM
06-15-2010, 02:53 PM
Most German soldiers who were captured, enjoyed the hell out of POW camps. Many German soldiers did not want the war, hated the war, but were either going to get shot by their own guys, or the enemy. At least in fighting the enemy they would be able to survive a bit longer, and if they won, survive indefinitely Over there in Germany and Russia in WW II the Christians faced alot of troubles, dont think Hitler or Stalin left them alone by any means or followed the faith.
Your average Krout was just doing his job, being forced into a position to protect the ones he loved. Read up on alot of the German soldiers post WW II opinions. Many were duped in the beginning, but by the end seen Hitler for what he was. An evil mad man, likely guided by(opinion here) the spirit of the anti-christ to do such things as he was doing.
I hate the federal government, but lets say if China invaded I would consider it time to ignore that personal hate, and protect this nation as a whole from an outside source. Which would mean working alongside federal troops. ( I would never join up with them, but in the many Militias that would pop up to stop the invading force, I am certain we would end up side by side with many marines and army, airforce and navy. Probably get supplied somewhat as well).
Its kind of like brotherly conflict, you can piss with each other, but no one else is allowed
Genesis chapter 3
Humanity has been duped by such things many times, it was properly taken care of until probably the last 100 years when Christianity started facing....well....lets keep this civil shall we
06-15-2010, 03:19 PM
Stories like the OT or one likes this: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/...rticle1605082/ sometimes makes me wonder if the human race is salvageable. Maybe it's just time to tune it all out.
06-15-2010, 03:35 PM
06-15-2010, 03:48 PM
06-15-2010, 06:18 PM
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