So my live-in girlfriend's older sister came home for Christmas...

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    So my live-in girlfriend's older sister came home for Christmas...


    It was the first time meeting her because shes currently a music teacher in Indonesia. I meet her for the first time at dinner and a discussion comes on about the health care bill. I state something along the lines of "I hope they pay close attention prior to the final passage". She says it sounds like I listen to Fox and goes on how everyone deserves free health care. i said it isn't free AND at the moment the numbers used as 'uninsured" are a bit misleading. For one, it includes people not legally here and two; it makes it sound as if they can't be treated without health care"

    Wow...

    Okay. Round two, FIGHT!

    Then starts by saying we have the worst healthcare in the world... So I ask why we so many people from other parts of the world coming here to learn and even practice medicine. She answers "because we're using them"

    I drink some more wine and decide if this is a smart idea but the wine takes over.

    Round three, FI (hiccup) GHT!

    I ask why would someone specialize and further their education in advanced fields of medicine without certain gains being there to do so. She says, what money? I say, of course! I said, a neurosurgeon isn't going to be too happy making roughly the same as a general practitioner but having to devote so much more of their life. She told me they don't and they pretty much have the same training...

    "What the ****" came out of my mouth at this time while I briefly sobered up enough to back off.


    I added in a quick "how can government blame the mass foreclosures on people as a result of confusing loan and mortgage contracts that they couldn't be expected to understand" admitting that most people are reckless and irresponsible in their decision making process but will rush a healthcare bill through faster than I can buy a house and use the people's knowledge as a backing force on why it should be passed"

    She said that Congress are educated and know how to do it and all of the major screw ups in the world are because of Republicans (Im Independent lol). I asked where in the Constitution there is a requirement for education and knowledge to be a member of Congress...

    Due to a stare from my future mom in law I decided to call it quits but I am patient!


    Christmas Eve...

    I'm talking with moms in law (her and her hubby are very conservative republicans) and global warming came up and knowing the crazy woman was in the next room I stated my opinion as neutral as I thought I could to avoid being stabbed in the throat with a trombone. I said, "I'm not quite sure where I stand on this or level of impact but just like many other areas of science, sometimes it changes since it wasn't too long ago they thought the earth was cooling" She comes darting from the next room yelling that every scientist in the world knows there's global warming and we're causing it and I don't know what i'm talking about... I said "man, we're really never going to like each other"


    In a different conversation I asked how her pay was handled working in IND as an American and..............

    She says she pays almost no tax and the IND government provides housing, maid, healthcare, food and she spends a lot of money flying from country to country buying stuff and is flying back this weekend to go to Bali for New Year's.

    So as a final nail I had to say "Typical of liberal hypocrites who want everyone else to suffer and pay for the exact thing they refuse to follow. It must be nice to know the best for everyone else and championing global warming while flying all over the world to buy a pair of pants in a cute boutique but i should of realized that as soon as i was told you were a music teacher living in IND"

    Merry Christmas

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    Some people just love to argue, not debate. They will never see the other side of the coin, as something to take in to account, or even coincideration, until affected by it and left to figure it out. Another thing why is it that the wingnuts watch and listen to FOX for political news? seems a lil more like spoon fed propaganda to distract people from what is actually going on. FOX is like a magic show, plenty of slide of hand and wayward embelishments to control the viewers point of view. dont get me wrong i love the Simpsons, but their news should just stick to the car chases, and other fantasticly comical crap. Im just glad to see that the impeech Obama didnt come up over dinner, lol. Well, at least now you know what to get that gurl for future gifts lol, socks and sum birkenstocks. AHAHAHA. Another thing you know you can always look forward to a lil excitement at he holiday table.

    Debate is great, just keep the facts straight.
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    The thing is i'm fine listeing to a point of view and adding to the picture because sometimes it does change but when she told me some of these things as fact i figured there was no point.
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    Thinking about this a lil more, and i figure her to be about the 24-32 age range am i right? reason I ask this is because of the way she came from another room for some agruing, like she was needing to be the center of attention, as well as I bet you are older than your gurlfriend, and the older sis might been taken back by how much she found you attractive(not being gay), so arguing might have been a way to be heated around ya?
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    Ugh, been there before. I consider myself to be a liberal, but I put personal accountability higher than anything. If she's so adamant about something, then she should get off her ass and do something to better the situation. How much charity work has she been doing since she's obviously in a much better position than 99% of the people in the world?
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    So what did she say to your retort? I'm dying to know. lol sounds like my sister in law. Hahahahha
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    She said something while walking off but i'm not too sure what it was. if you watch Family guy, Brian's girlfriend played by Drew Barrymore explains here voice (sounds like she's asking a question when making a statement)

    She's 30 and i'm 34 and my gf is 29. I even tried to compliment her on her piano work (it was excellent, even on a old out of tune piano) but apparently showed my lack of culture when I didn't recognize the piece by Bach (it's common EVERYbody knows it)

    I give lol
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    You mean this? Where the accent's on the last word?
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    OMFG!!!!

    Yes lol
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    nobody's asked the more important question - is your gf's sister hot?
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    I suppose she could be, yeah. All three are attractive but I would rate her third. However, she effectively taken any hotness away in my eyes with that personality.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawkk View Post
    I suppose she could be, yeah. All three are attractive but I would rate her third. However, she effectively taken any hotness away in my eyes with that personality.
    Yeah..... thats a shame..... I don't know where I was going with that. I'm just on a lot of test right now so libido is ridiculous. I was thinking some sort of sister-sister threesome but..... that has nothing to do with your post.
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    LOL, yeah that would of crossed my mind too at one point but that fantasy went out the window the day I was "family' according to their parents.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawkk View Post
    LOL, yeah that would of crossed my mind too at one point but that fantasy went out the window the day I was "family' according to their parents.
    it might make the holidays a little weird.... or alot of fun? in a semi-creepy way.
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    Like the Uncle that wants you to sit on his lap, creepy?


    Okay, putting that one back in the closet and only letting it back out during my next session. :P
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    Quote Originally Posted by iron fists View Post
    Some people just love to argue, not debate. They will never see the other side of the coin, as something to take in to account, or even coincideration, until affected by it and left to figure it out. Another thing why is it that the wingnuts watch and listen to FOX for political news? seems a lil more like spoon fed propaganda to distract people from what is actually going on. FOX is like a magic show, plenty of slide of hand and wayward embelishments to control the viewers point of view. dont get me wrong i love the Simpsons, but their news should just stick to the car chases, and other fantasticly comical crap. Im just glad to see that the impeech Obama didnt come up over dinner, lol. Well, at least now you know what to get that gurl for future gifts lol, socks and sum birkenstocks. AHAHAHA. Another thing you know you can always look forward to a lil excitement at he holiday table.

    Debate is great, just keep the facts straight.




    LOL...i love how everyone loves to try to denounce fox news credibility as a reliable news source....but yet no one has been able to stand up and factually prove them wrong ona public platform...but hey i bet they just wish they could be like the liberal news network msnbc...did any catch chris mathis on him calling out anyone with footage and proof that obama wanted a public option and was going after the insurance companies making so much profit????????? thats a real news source because there ended up being tons of media showing and stating that obama wanted those things and is now saying the opposite ( which is typical obama talk) so i think we are all discrediting the wrong news sources here...fox is actually good, its just most americans dont wana hear the truth, especially when it goes against their implanted ideals....but also with another great media event that the liberal news source msnbc did was when it had a text in poll in how many people liked or disliked how obama was handleing this healthcare....91% aid they were in dislike but msnb only showed the results right before there time was up....what a coincidence.
    Yes, we live in a world where the news media has NOTHING to gain by spinning a dry piece of chicken into a juicy steak. I mean, hey, we all know that the media makes money by reporting the "facts" ...

    I understand that people makes mistakes but the last time i talked to a news anchor, he told me that when the story is best then that is what they report regardless if they have something else that sounds more factual yet not as "juicy"...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawkk View Post
    It was the first time meeting her because shes currently a music teacher in Indonesia. I meet her for the first time at dinner and a discussion comes on about the health care bill. I state something along the lines of "I hope they pay close attention prior to the final passage". She says it sounds like I listen to Fox and goes on how everyone deserves free health care. i said it isn't free AND at the moment the numbers used as 'uninsured" are a bit misleading. For one, it includes people not legally here and two; it makes it sound as if they can't be treated without health care"

    Wow...

    Okay. Round two, FIGHT!

    Then starts by saying we have the worst healthcare in the world... So I ask why we so many people from other parts of the world coming here to learn and even practice medicine. She answers "because we're using them"

    I drink some more wine and decide if this is a smart idea but the wine takes over.

    Round three, FI (hiccup) GHT!

    I ask why would someone specialize and further their education in advanced fields of medicine without certain gains being there to do so. She says, what money? I say, of course! I said, a neurosurgeon isn't going to be too happy making roughly the same as a general practitioner but having to devote so much more of their life. She told me they don't and they pretty much have the same training...

    "What the ****" came out of my mouth at this time while I briefly sobered up enough to back off.


    I added in a quick "how can government blame the mass foreclosures on people as a result of confusing loan and mortgage contracts that they couldn't be expected to understand" admitting that most people are reckless and irresponsible in their decision making process but will rush a healthcare bill through faster than I can buy a house and use the people's knowledge as a backing force on why it should be passed"

    She said that Congress are educated and know how to do it and all of the major screw ups in the world are because of Republicans (Im Independent lol). I asked where in the Constitution there is a requirement for education and knowledge to be a member of Congress...

    Due to a stare from my future mom in law I decided to call it quits but I am patient!


    Christmas Eve...

    I'm talking with moms in law (her and her hubby are very conservative republicans) and global warming came up and knowing the crazy woman was in the next room I stated my opinion as neutral as I thought I could to avoid being stabbed in the throat with a trombone. I said, "I'm not quite sure where I stand on this or level of impact but just like many other areas of science, sometimes it changes since it wasn't too long ago they thought the earth was cooling" She comes darting from the next room yelling that every scientist in the world knows there's global warming and we're causing it and I don't know what i'm talking about... I said "man, we're really never going to like each other"


    In a different conversation I asked how her pay was handled working in IND as an American and..............

    She says she pays almost no tax and the IND government provides housing, maid, healthcare, food and she spends a lot of money flying from country to country buying stuff and is flying back this weekend to go to Bali for New Year's.

    So as a final nail I had to say "Typical of liberal hypocrites who want everyone else to suffer and pay for the exact thing they refuse to follow. It must be nice to know the best for everyone else and championing global warming while flying all over the world to buy a pair of pants in a cute boutique but i should of realized that as soon as i was told you were a music teacher living in IND"

    Merry Christmas
    Sounds like you two will have a wonderful friendship.
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    On the last few posts, John Stewart showed a few clips of Fox's report on a Sarah Palin support rally where Fox used old footage to make the rally seem more well-attended than actuality. Both right-wing and left-wing networks make false representations to placate their base.

    ANY report is going to be presented with a slanted basis. Whether it is an 'unbiased' documentary, like Michael Moore's stuff (jk), or a Fox's news report, the personnel collecting and presenting the facts will have a personal perspective and that will bleed into the report. I'm no expert but, as a video-graphic hobbyist, I took a few college courses on the subject and had two different profs who said there is NO such thing as an unbiased presentation.
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    Aww doesn't family make life worth living especially when it is family u acquire in the middle of ur life.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyChemist View Post
    nobody's asked the more important question - is your gf's sister hot?
    Exactly,.. I figured,.. "politics" section,... Gf's older sister came by,.. I at LEAST expected a scandal of some sorts
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    Great first impression.

    She was right about the healthcare thing though. It is terrible in the States compared to elsewhere. It should always be free.
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    Here's to your health care bill!
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    Hey Jayhawkk any chance u listen to Colin Cowherd?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawkk View Post
    The thing is i'm fine listeing to a point of view and adding to the picture because sometimes it does change but when she told me some of these things as fact i figured there was no point.
    For some people on either side politics is religion. They will not give a **** one way or the other about facts, all that matters is dogma. This type of secular religious freak is a bit more common on the lefty side in my experience simply because of their general bias against The Bible and/or other holy books. As such they quote Hillary Clinton, Al Gore, and Ralph Nader as gospel with little to no critical thought/fact checking and think that makes them superior to those who quote from the book of genesis.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyChemist View Post
    On the last few posts, John Stewart showed a few clips of Fox's report on a Sarah Palin support rally where Fox used old footage to make the rally seem more well-attended than actuality. Both right-wing and left-wing networks make false representations to placate their base.

    ANY report is going to be presented with a slanted basis. Whether it is an 'unbiased' documentary, like Michael Moore's stuff (jk), or a Fox's news report, the personnel collecting and presenting the facts will have a personal perspective and that will bleed into the report. I'm no expert but, as a video-graphic hobbyist, I took a few college courses on the subject and had two different profs who said there is NO such thing as an unbiased presentation.
    Those profs would be right. The real question though is why people like this soon to be sister-in-law have such a hardon for Fox. I mean liberals have what, 90% of print and broadcast media and conservatives have Fox and !gasp! AM radio? And talking to some liberals you'd think that was one of the signs of the apocalypse. I mean there are people who literally do nothing but watch people like Hannity and O'Reilly, both commentators, and flood the internet with every possible misstatement as if it's proof they're trying to take over the world.

    No, I suspect the problem, in the eyes of such people, is two-fold. One, the liberal news media have lost their gate keeper status as deliverers of fact. Two, conservatives used to have to rely on citations to obscure think tanks to get their message out, now Fox has put itself into the mix as a legitimate news source that gets that message out as much as the major networks used to get the message out for groups like NOW without letting on that NOW was slightly to the left of Stalin in its politics. In the eighties this woman Jay is dealing with would have considered well informed and educated. Now there's more legitimacy in questioning her and her ilk, and the bottom line is they don't like that and are now more strident than ever. The funny part is if the MSM up until Fox hadn't pissed off so many conservatives and kept their reporting honest and on point and somewhat objective, Fox never would have happened. They created the Fox audience.

    Good luck, Jay. I've avoided relationships due to such people being in the mix before. There is a strategy for dealing with such people though if you must; get as educated as possible on a topic you know she's full of **** on and, if it comes up, ask her a highly specific/technical question. It's worked for me on climate change. Any time some dip**** starts speaking The Truth about the subject I ask them for the average CRN ratings of temperature stations, pacific decadal occilation, or something like that. They may go blank, they may get even more strident and revert back to basic talking points for whatever party they're a part of, but bottom line is they and you, and everyone else who sees their response, knows they're full of **** at that point. And they're usually not all gung ho to argue with you next time you see them. So if you must, do the above, and whatever points you lose familywise will likely be balanced out by the fact that she won't be running from room to room to engage you in 'debates' anymore. It's a form of the peace through superior fire power method.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Australian made View Post
    Great first impression.

    She was right about the healthcare thing though. It is terrible in the States compared to elsewhere. It should always be free.
    What makes it terrible? Because it isn't socialized? Healthcare isn't free in one place in this world. Just because your ass isn't paying for it, doesn't mean someone else isn't.

    Also please recheck your facts about quality of care and quit pulling your data from the socialized biased WHO.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DAdams91982 View Post
    What makes it terrible? Because it isn't socialized? Healthcare isn't free in one place in this world. Just because your ass isn't paying for it, doesn't mean someone else isn't.

    Also please recheck your facts about quality of care and quit pulling your data from the socialized biased WHO.
    If you dig into that last WHO report, the US actually has more or less the best survival rates for most diseases and the most 'responsive' healthcare system. There are just a couple sections where the authors do idiotic things like use life expectancy and infant mortality to grade the healthcare system, and also rate single payer systems higher by default when comparing payment schemes, which then contributes to the overall 'winning' grade for socialist healthcare systems even though people tend to die sooner of diseases there.

    The US has a lower life expectancy because we have a greater tendency to do stupid ****, like bunji jump or drive exceedingly fast, things which have no relevance to the quality of healthcare. We also bring a hell of a lot more problematic pregnancies to term because of our aversion to abortion and because our healthcare system allows for the birth of kids who would otherwise be still born or miscarraiges elsewhere, which contributes to a higher infant mortality in the US because of better healthcare. And we've managed to do all that in spite of a largely socialized single payer/third party corporate sponsored payment system.
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    Ah, the lovely warm holiday get togethers. Gotta love it
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    This just reminds me why I never bring up politics! Nice mid-thread aside CrazyChemist btw.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steveoph View Post
    This just reminds me why I never bring up politics! Nice mid-thread aside CrazyChemist btw.
    I always do. They say it's a relationship killer and I guess that's true, but I'd rather get it out in the open and know whether or not I can tolerate the views of the person I'm with, and they can tolerate mine. Otherwise what's the point of being with them, if just to get blindsided by some rant/action sometime in the future?
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    I had a small thing like this with a legal alein at my work. He told me he didnt like McCain because all McCain wanted to help is rich people. I asked him who payed the vast majority of taxes in this country. He said everyone. I explained the rich pay practically all the taxes and then I asked what have the poor done to deserve help? He said, but the rich dont need it and should pay more! I asked him if the place we worked should let the poor people pay less since they have less money. If we should give the poor people that walk in 20% off just for being poor. He didnt know what to say and I walked off. The only reason poor people get anything is their vote is equal to a rich persons.

    That said, Ive talked to girls before and had them add me on some social networking site and see my views as conservative and some pages like Vote GOP Texas etc and stop talking to me all together. Tolerance at its finest.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDB View Post
    I always do. They say it's a relationship killer and I guess that's true, but I'd rather get it out in the open and know whether or not I can tolerate the views of the person I'm with, and they can tolerate mine. Otherwise what's the point of being with them, if just to get blindsided by some rant/action sometime in the future?
    Fair point. I don't bring it up, but if they're very opinionated I'm sure they will bring it forward. I have a rough handle on international politics and events, and know when I stand on major issues like abortion, CP and euthanasia but am pretty open. I don't know if it's a Canadian thing, but politics rarely comes up, and if it does we talk about Obama
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    I think I need to take a trip up north lol. The things I couldnt stand about Canada would be the cold, crazy prices on supps limitations, and health care.
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    I actually plan to gain enough weight that I qualify as my own nation. Any who want can then colonize me, and as a God out of the machine I will enforce a strict hands off, libertarian ideal. I can't wait to see who homesteads my ass.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DAdams91982 View Post
    What makes it terrible? Because it isn't socialized? Healthcare isn't free in one place in this world. Just because your ass isn't paying for it, doesn't mean someone else isn't.

    Also please recheck your facts about quality of care and quit pulling your data from the socialized biased WHO.
    If i dont pay for it, it is free.

    I have no idea what a WHO is....
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    Quote Originally Posted by Australian made View Post
    If i dont pay for it, it is free.

    I have no idea what a WHO is....
    Exactly the problem with the entitled thinking of this world generation, as long as it isn't coming out of your pocket book right?
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    yes mam
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    Quote Originally Posted by Australian made View Post
    yes mam
    witty
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDB View Post
    I always do. They say it's a relationship killer and I guess that's true, but I'd rather get it out in the open and know whether or not I can tolerate the views of the person I'm with, and they can tolerate mine. Otherwise what's the point of being with them, if just to get blindsided by some rant/action sometime in the future?
    That's what I do now and tested my girlfriend prior to us dating. She really isn't in to politics or the debating aspect but she doesn't have any preconceived whacko ideas floating about and that's all I care about at this point :P
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyChemist View Post
    Yeah..... thats a shame..... I don't know where I was going with that. I'm just on a lot of test right now so libido is ridiculous. I was thinking some sort of sister-sister threesome but..... that has nothing to do with your post.
    I was sorta hoping it was a pornocchio when I saw the thread title.

    But yeah jay, its like most of the hyper-liberals, they have no clue because they've never really had to work, never really had to struggle and never have to live by their own rules. Sure Ted Kennedy fought for healthcare, but like he ever had to work a day in his life?

    It seems like the more liberal they are, the less they understand math, which is why they like universal health care. The health care bill limits the amount of premiums that can go towards administrative costs and guess what? Most of the major insurance companies already have their admin costs as low as half that. So that means they won't have to change policies, their profit won't go down, and what they charge won't go down either. Not exactly a win for the public, as now it allows them to actually charge more to get a higher profit, and still fall into government guidelines. Plus with the changes to the care they have to provide, it will raise premiums even more.

    If the government raised minimum wage to $25/hr, what would happen? Prices on the McDonalds menu would go up 50-100%, the price of gas and soda and haircuts and everything else would go up by by significant amounts, and after part of that new money goes to taxes the people who were making minimum wage wouldn't be significantly better off, but the people who used to make $29/hr would be screwed.
  

  
 

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