Policing Bias - AnabolicMinds.com

Policing Bias

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    Policing Bias


    Scientists are making groundbreaking discoveries into the roots of racial bias--and their research is fueling a wave of collaborations between researchers and law enforcement.

    Greater Good Magazine | Policing Bias

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    A very interesting read. A few blurbs stood out to me:

    Similar to Correll's earlier study, the researchers found both police and community members were quicker to shoot blacks with guns than they were whites with guns, regardless of the participant's own race.

    ...

    "Unless one is socially isolated, it is not possible to avoid acquiring evaluations of social groups," Phelps has written. "Yet such evaluations can affect behavior in subtle and often unintentional ways."

    ...

    But when it came to their final decisions—that is, whether or not they actually pulled the trigger—police officers didn't appear to be influenced by race: They did not shoot unarmed blacks by mistake as often as ordinary people did, nor did they shoot them any more than they shot unarmed whites.
    I really like that last part. It shows that the training police go through makes a difference in their decision making (pulling the tigger,) over civilian decision making. It's good to know they're being proactive with this research. Anything to help lessen the negative stigma police seem to get.
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    I think the law should be "Stop or I will shoot" and if they dont stop, regardless of armed/color. If you are running, you did something, if not, your stupid and at that point its simply protecting the genetics of the future....
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    I think the law should be "Stop or I will shoot" and if they dont stop, regardless of armed/color. If you are running, you did something, if not, your stupid and at that point its simply protecting the genetics of the future....
    Amen bro! It is Darwinism in action!
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    Quote Originally Posted by roids1 View Post
    Amen bro! It is Darwinism in action!
    LOL! You cavemen,I mean guys,crack me up with your in depth analysis.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    I think the law should be "Stop or I will shoot" and if they dont stop, regardless of armed/color. If you are running, you did something, if not, your stupid and at that point its simply protecting the genetics of the future....
    true story to follow.

    i worked with a guy (back in early 2000) who had apparently been pulled over with around half a pound of cocaine in his trunk. when they searched his trunk, he started running, and took two rounds to the back. he sued the police department for excessive force and won.

    this goes to show you, that the police office should have aimed just a bit higher and nailed him in the head - dead men tell no tales - just like with regards to home invasions.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    I think the law should be "Stop or I will shoot" and if they dont stop, regardless of armed/color. If you are running, you did something, if not, your stupid and at that point its simply protecting the genetics of the future....

    Ya bro, guilty until proven innocent
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    It's just wise, white cops making good decisions based off unique experiences... or something like that.
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    There's a difference between racial profiling and the law of probability.
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    Profiling behavior not color.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayhawkk View Post
    Profiling behavior not color.
    Yes,I'm sure color has absolutely nothing to do with profiling and it is all about the bad behavior of minorities,especially blacks and hispanics.
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    If a drive-by shooting takes place in an inner city area and the police make an assumption regarding the possible ethnicity of the perpetrators, is that really profiling or is that simple intuition based on probability? Stereotypes generally aren't created from thin air. They develop over time through one's experiences and repeated observations.
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    This reminded me of how much i hate gangs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by roids1 View Post
    If a drive-by shooting takes place in an inner city area and the police make an assumption regarding the possible ethnicity of the perpetrators, is that really profiling or is that simple intuition based on probability?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question

    Begging the question is a logical fallacy in which the proposition to be proved is assumed implicitly or explicitly in the premises. Begging the question is related to the fallacy known as circular argument, circulus in probando or circular reasoning.



    Stereotypes generally aren't created from thin air. They develop over time through one's experiences and repeated observations.
    Stereotypes develop when we are unable or unwilling to obtain all of the information needed to make fair judgments about people or situations. In the absence of the "total picture," stereotypes in many cases allow us to "fill in the blanks."

    Society often innocently creates and perpetuates stereotypes,however these stereotypes many times lead to unfair discrimination and persecution when the stereotype is not favorable.
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    Yeah yeah!. F'em Just. shoot first and ask questions later.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lutherblsstt View Post
    Begging the question is a logical fallacy in which the proposition to be proved is assumed implicitly or explicitly in the premises. Begging the question is related to the fallacy known as circular argument, circulus in probando or circular reasoning.
    He's not begging the question.

    Stereotypes develop when we are unable or unwilling to obtain all of the information needed to make fair judgments about people or situations.
    Incorrect. Stereotypes form as exagerations of behaviors people observe in other people of different cultures, races, etc., such behaviors they usually find distasteful and/or humorous. They can be self reinforcing, the result of ignorance and/or experience. You are begging the question by implicitly including 'ignorance' and nothing else in your definition of stereotype which precludes the possiblity that anyone anywhere could ever hold a stereotypical view based on experience.

    Society often innocently creates and perpetuates stereotypes,however these stereotypes many times lead to unfair discrimination and persecution when the stereotype is not favorable.
    'Society' is not the only place blame deserves to be placed. At the heart of all stereotypes is a kernel of truth, however distorted. And it is often a form of rebelion to adopt the derrogative words, labels, and stereotypes of an oppressive culture and celebrate them. A perfect example is the word "nigger". Blacks have effectively coopted it for their own use and through social pressure excluded whites from being able to use it in all but a few contexts.

    What you're missing from your analysis, as so often seems to be the case, is reality. Reality often times informs and supports stereotypes. Like it or not, it's not roaming bands of Scandanavias tossing meatballs and potatoes about that's making the inner cities unlivable.

    Another example would be the stereotype of the abusive cop. In reality most of us have met them, and my guess which I'm pretty sure is supported by facts is that they do end up harrassing blacks and hispanics more often than whites. The reason people stereotype cops as power abusers is because a certain number of them are power abusers. But, however wrong a cop is in detaining and harrassing someone just because they are black, it is equally wrong to suggest there is no statistically significant difference in crime rates between the races, with blacks and latinos committing a disproportionate amount. You could amend that to whites, latinos, and blacks if you look from an Asian perspective. And Asians, whites, latinos and blacks from a minority Jewish perspective.

    So what you have is a classical probability vs an actual probability problem, or frequency theory. Classical probability says if you toss a die the probability of getting a 2 is 1/6. That assumes a lot though: ignorance of the individual case being one thing; purity of the die being another. The classical case can only apply in hindsight to a randomly selected homogenous set of cases. Knowledge and circumstance informs each individual case though. How things workout in the aggregate is not an indicator of how to deal with each discrete case. Which means if a guy just rolled a 2 five times, either the die is loaded or he's likely not going to get another 2. Likewise, if there's a shooting in a neighborhood and out of the last thousand shooters arrested there the vast majority were black, a cop would be an idiot to assume the shooter was white.

    There is a very real disconnect between stats and stereotypes/profiling, and the reality of how each discrete incident is dealt with.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDB View Post
    He's not begging the question.
    Sure he is,he starts by assuming implicitly in his imaginary scenario the proposition to be proved.



    Incorrect. Stereotypes form as exagerations of behaviors people observe in other people of different cultures, races, etc., such behaviors they usually find distasteful and/or humorous. They can be self reinforcing, the result of ignorance and/or experience. You are begging the question by implicitly including 'ignorance' and nothing else in your definition of stereotype which precludes the possiblity that anyone anywhere could ever hold a stereotypical view based on experience.
    My definition is broader than that but is far from begging the question.I am aware that mental categorizing (or labelling) is necessary and inescapable.

    I agree with the following from wiki:

    "The effects of stereotyping can fluctuate, but for the most part they are negative, and not always apparent until long periods of time have passed. Over time, some victims of negative stereotypes display self-fulfilling prophecy behavior, in which they assume that the stereotype represents norms to emulate. Negative effects may include forming inaccurate opinions of people, scapegoating, erroneously judgmentalism, preventing emotional identification, distress, and impaired performance. Stereotyping painfully reminds those being judged of how society views them."

    These effects I bolded are what seem to happen as a result of the kind of stereotyping roids1 seems to condone.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lutherblsstt View Post
    Sure he is,he starts by assuming implicitly in his imaginary scenario the proposition to be proved.
    He assumed nothing because he comes to no conclusion, he asked a question. He merely asked whether it was reasonable for a cop to assume the race of a perpetrator based on past experience. Or in other words frequency theory vs classical probability. In the latter with pure ignorance of all discrete incidents the cop would be presumptuous to do anything but look at demographics and assume the chances of the shooters being of any particular race matched up with those numbers, with perhaps a nudge this way or that for some other factor(s) which might affect the outcome in the aggregate.

    In reality, that thing which is missing from your analysis, the cop knows the neighborhood, has answered calls there in the past, has dealt with shootings before as well as other incidents, has a general feel for the population, likely knows or will eventually know who the victim is, etc., etc., etc. Or in other words he is not ignorant about this and other discrete incidents he's been involved with. Therefore it is not unreasonable for him based on experience to make a judgement of the race of perpetrator. And that applies equally to whites and blacks.

    If you have a neighborhood were the population is almost homogenous and white, while it's a possiblity that a black or latino committed a certain crime and they are statistically a higher likelihood, that's likely drowned out by sheer numbers and the cop should be looking for a white male. Case in point, the Washington sniper shootings a while back where those two black guys turned out to be the guilty ones. Before they were caught the police rightly assumed it was one or more white males, because that was far more likely than one or more black males. They turned out to be wrong, but as far as playing the odds goes they didn't misstep. They biased the investigation towards white males, and while that didn't pay off that time it's more likely to in the end if applied consistently to such incidents. Using past experience to focus your investigation, based on any criteria only becomes foolish when you push that assumption over where evidence leads.

    My definition is broader than that but is far from begging the question.I am aware that mental categorizing (or labelling) is necessary and inescapable.
    Your definition is: "Stereotypes develop when we are unable or unwilling to obtain all of the information needed to make fair judgments about people or situations. In the absence of the "total picture," stereotypes in many cases allow us to "fill in the blanks."

    Which is incorrect. For one, the italicized portion shows you're trying to slip a normative judgement in. And whether or not someone has access to the "total picture," they still may make a judgement against the behavior in question. For example I am aware of the fact that certain religions require their followers to cover their heads out of respect to God for this or that reason. I find it stupid. I'm more or less aware of the reasons, and I don't give a **** about them, I still find it to be a moronic practice. There is nothing unifnormed about my decision, I just think most hats and other head dresses make people look like ****ing idiots.

    "The effects of stereotyping can fluctuate, but for the most part they are negative, and not always apparent until long periods of time have passed. Over time, some victims of negative stereotypes display self-fulfilling prophecy behavior, in which they assume that the stereotype represents norms to emulate. Negative effects may include forming inaccurate opinions of people, scapegoating, erroneously judgmentalism, preventing emotional identification, distress, and impaired performance. Stereotyping painfully reminds those being judged of how society views them."
    Which is a fancy way of avoiding the question. Paraphrased it merely says that there does end up being some truth to stereotypes, but there's complex reasons (excuses) for it. So what? End result is still that there is some truth there. That's like trying to explain to a guy who just had his arm ripped off in a shark attack that sharks don't generally eat people, it likely just thought he was a seal and gave him a test nibble. The shark's intentions and the nuances of him behavior within his ecological niche are nice to know, the reality is the guy is still missing an arm and bleeding to death.

    These effects I bolded are what seem to happen as a result of the kind of stereotyping roids1 seems to condone.
    And they leave out the opposite but equally true aspects of the issue. In order: stereotypes can be positive, hence I only let women and gay male friends choose my clothes so I look good because of their superior fashion senses; and as for innaccurate opinions, scapegoating and judgementalism, the type of stereotyping based on experience roids is speaking off also results in correct opinions, more effective investigations, and proper judgement and assignment of blame (see comment about Scandanavians).
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    Yes,I'm sure color has absolutely nothing to do with profiling and it is all about the bad behavior of minorities,especially blacks and hispanics.
    /shakes head
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