Barrack Hussein Obama's healthcare plan good enough for us but not him!

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    Quote Originally Posted by somewhatgifted View Post
    I made my points and the responded to the attacks i was under.
    and you my friend were only attacked because you attacked me first! if you cannot see that then you more lost than you think I am.

    Just remember guys, in this mans opinion if you get ill its all your fault no matter what happens to you, and you should quit complaining and expecting quality care because no doctor in the world will give it to you, on top of that to him none of our doctors care about any of us.

    pfff wow.

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    Well if you give a crap about your life at some point you realise that YOU are the only one responsible for YOUR life. Your options are to whine or get proactive and AVOID getting to the point of being in the doctors office, relying on the system and then complaining about the inadequecies of said system.

    Dont you realise this is how i look at my own life?

    Its comfortable to think the world is sunshine and rainbows but it isnt, people get sick so your options are to do something about it or just coast along complaining like all the other sick dying people.

    We cant justr wait until we get sick to think about health cause sometimes its too late.

    You think of any disease or ailment and guarantee someone has overcome it, with healthy mind, healthy eating and detoxifying their body.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JW32Hoops View Post
    At the time, I had health insurance through my previous employer, so it was OK. What if (for the sake of this argument) I did not have that insurance? (as I currently don't) Then, what would've/should've happened to me? I had a gash on my hand and was bleeding and in need of stitches. Without insurance, should they have turned me away because I was a "deadbeat"?
    Then that sucks to be you. You will owe the hospital money and it shouldnt be covered by the taxpayers. Its ridiculous that the middle class with say limited insurance has to pay and then the broke people with no money to pay for a good get off scott free.

    Quote Originally Posted by youngandfree View Post
    You mean they actually balance their budget without a state income tax? Gee, I don't see how that's possible since NY, MI, CA and others can't do it with stupid high income tax rates.
    Blue states...

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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasTitan View Post



    Blue states...

    That's creepy...almost down's syndrome-ish.
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    well it was either him or another rich white republican, either way Americans would complain....Mitt romney will soon get a chance, then everyone will complain about him.

    Tough job.
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    Quote Originally Posted by searl12 View Post
    I do take it inot my own hands, just took a week off to rest, and today im right back in the gym, and shortly I will be at the rivervalley running the stairs.

    Again when you dont me, and you tell me Im to blame for a small health problem it just isnt right ro appropriate...I cant understand how you do not see that?

    im just in awe that you cant...i pray, god I pray you have to eat your words one day.
    Man get over yourself not everyone making a post is centered in on attacking you.

    Im talking about body maintenance.. doing a seasonal cleanse, detox, taking organ support herbs, liver, kidney, gallbladder, heart, brain.... alongside the obvious diet and excercise. I mentioned spirit mind and body the three pieces to health. Its not about you running stairs... this just in man finds cure to cancer by running stairs...

    PREVENTATIVE medicine instead of reactionary chemical drugs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by searl12 View Post
    well it was either him or another rich white republican, either way Americans would complain....Mitt romney will soon get a chance, then everyone will complain about him.

    Tough job.
    Mitt Romney had his chance, did his damage, and bailed. look where Massachussetts is now with their universal healthcare. They are so underfunded, they recently DROPPED 30,000 LEGAL IMMIGRANTS that were put into the plan. They are cutting people loose after 3 years. B.O. wants to ensure that ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS will get coverage as well as state benefits, regardless if they are in the country as fugitives. Makes a lot of sense doesn't it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by searl12 View Post
    well it was either him or another rich white republican, either way Americans would complain....Mitt romney will soon get a chance, then everyone will complain about him.

    Tough job.
    Or its a guy who was a Senator for 2 years before being president and is the very definition of smooth talker. Actions talk, bull**** walks. He kissed everyones ass and promised the impossible, and now it starting to bite him in the ass. He is cunning, but if Congress swings back to the right, and I hope to God it does in the House, because I hate Nancy Pelosi with every fiber of my being, it will be even harder for him to fulfill his unrealistic campaign promises.

    Quote Originally Posted by somewhatgifted View Post
    Man get over yourself not everyone making a post is centered in on attacking you.

    Im talking about body maintenance.. doing a seasonal cleanse, detox, taking organ support herbs, liver, kidney, gallbladder, heart, brain.... alongside the obvious diet and excercise. I mentioned spirit mind and body the three pieces to health. Its not about you running stairs... this just in man finds cure to cancer by running stairs...

    PREVENTATIVE medicine instead of reactionary chemical drugs.
    My dad was an active individual and ran everyday, did all kind of stuff and at 32 was dead from cancer. I agree with you to an extent, but there just isnt much he could have done.

    Quote Originally Posted by youngandfree View Post
    Mitt Romney had his chance, did his damage, and bailed. look where Massachussetts is now with their universal healthcare. They are so underfunded, they recently DROPPED 30,000 LEGAL IMMIGRANTS that were put into the plan. They are cutting people loose after 3 years. B.O. wants to ensure that ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS will get coverage as well as state benefits, regardless if they are in the country as fugitives. Makes a lot of sense doesn't it.
    Obama also wants amnesty for Illegals. He gets a big **** you from me on that one. I would die and go to heaven to see INS given authority and manpower to remove all illegals while we create a comprehensive and strict guest worker program. And while Im ranting, English should be made the official language.
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    "Obama also wants amnesty for Illegals. He gets a big **** you from me on that one. I would die and go to heaven to see INS given authority and manpower to remove all illegals while we create a comprehensive and strict guest worker program. And while Im ranting, English should be made the official language."
    I like this, immigration needs to be slowed to a near halt as we are having enough problems these days with the people we already have. Why should we bring in more people to compete with what minimum wage jobs are left.
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    Quote Originally Posted by somewhatgifted View Post
    Well if you give a crap about your life at some point you realise that YOU are the only one responsible for YOUR life. Your options are to whine or get proactive and AVOID getting to the point of being in the doctors office, relying on the system and then complaining about the inadequecies of said system.

    Dont you realise this is how i look at my own life?

    Its comfortable to think the world is sunshine and rainbows but it isnt, people get sick so your options are to do something about it or just coast along complaining like all the other sick dying people.

    We cant justr wait until we get sick to think about health cause sometimes its too late.

    You think of any disease or ailment and guarantee someone has overcome it, with healthy mind, healthy eating and detoxifying their body.
    Great post!
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    Quote Originally Posted by searl12 View Post
    "Obama also wants amnesty for Illegals. He gets a big **** you from me on that one. I would die and go to heaven to see INS given authority and manpower to remove all illegals while we create a comprehensive and strict guest worker program. And while Im ranting, English should be made the official language."
    I like this, immigration needs to be slowed to a near halt as we are having enough problems these days with the people we already have. Why should we bring in more people to compete with what minimum wage jobs are left.
    Why not run for office so you can get some of your ideas actually implemented?
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    dude if you dont agree thats fine ok, you dont even live here, lots of people feel this way, my girl is an immigrant her parent are the hadrest working people ive ever met, I have no problem with them being immigrants and living here, its simply that the economy is in shambles, we should shore up what we are already working with instead of funneling in new citizens to compete with us.
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    Quote Originally Posted by searl12 View Post
    dude if you dont agree thats fine ok, you dont even live here,
    So what,I am from there and lived there for over 30 years.

    lots of people feel this way, my girl is an immigrant her parent are the hadrest working people ive ever met, I have no problem with them being immigrants and living here, its simply that the economy is in shambles, we should shore up what we are already working with instead of funneling in new citizens to compete with us.
    Even if you keep them out there is still outsourcing which does not need physical people entering the country to work.

    See: Outsourcing Greenville the story of what happened when the world's largest refrigerator plant outsourced to Mexico leaving 1/4th of Greenville, Michigan residents unemployed.

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...29805897242874
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    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EkGGDOp4uUg"]YouTube - Health Care Reform: 450,000 Doctors Can't Be Wrong[/ame]

    Thoughts?
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    Quote Originally Posted by somewhatgifted View Post
    450,000 doctors can indeed be wrong.
    There is a real need for health care reform but that's not what is being proposed. Instead what is being proposed is a new government insurance program. That won't necessarily increase access (look into how many doctors restrict who they see and how that relates to what insurance they have) and will definitely not do anything to decrease health care costs (according to the CBO).

    A big problem is that insurance is tied to employment, that needs to change. Instead of insurance ebing considered part of your compensation, you should be paid more and buy your own insurance.

    Also, while I support increasing coverage for children and older people, if you work you can get coverage and pay for it on your own (I was surprised at how much coverage actually is, often less than 100/month).
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    I think idea of universal health care is great, but haven't seen a good plan anywhere yet.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lutherblsstt View Post
    450,000 doctors can indeed be wrong.
    There is a real need for health care reform but that's not what is being proposed. Instead what is being proposed is a new government insurance program. That won't necessarily increase access (look into how many doctors restrict who they see and how that relates to what insurance they have) and will definitely not do anything to decrease health care costs (according to the CBO).

    A big problem is that insurance is tied to employment, that needs to change. Instead of insurance ebing considered part of your compensation, you should be paid more and buy your own insurance.

    Also, while I support increasing coverage for children and older people, if you work you can get coverage and pay for it on your own (I was surprised at how much coverage actually is, often less than 100/month).
    Holy Sh!t Luther! Maybe you need to get back on your meds. You started to make some sense there!!! Yes, maybe the answer isn't a new govt program filled with bureaucracy, govt red tape, and eventual rationing of services.

    There are other ways to insure people and their families besides group plans through employers or the federal govt. If there were a way to give individual policy holders a more competitive hand, then the insurance companies would have to be more competitive with one another for individual business. But, as it stands now, you have to take what your employer offers, through a group plan, with no bargaining power. Yet, the idea that private insurance companies can compete with the federal govt, an entity that can operate with net losses year after year, is ludicrous.

    The idea of a "public option" as an alternative is bull****. In the long run, it will reduce competition and drive the quality of everyone's healthcare into the ****ter. Keep in mind, you can sue your insurance company, but you can't sue the federal govt. Under a "public option," if you don't like what you get, you have no recourse. Thanks Barry!
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    Quote Originally Posted by roids1 View Post
    Holy Sh!t Luther! Maybe you need to get back on your meds. You started to make some sense there!!!
    I think you are the one who temporarily went off the meds and thus actually saw the merits of what I posted,for once.


    Yes, maybe the answer isn't a new govt program filled with bureaucracy, govt red tape, and eventual rationing of services.

    There are other ways to insure people and their families besides group plans through employers or the federal govt. If there were a way to give individual policy holders a more competitive hand, then the insurance companies would have to be more competitive with one another for individual business. But, as it stands now, you have to take what your employer offers, through a group plan, with no bargaining power. Yet, the idea that private insurance companies can compete with the federal govt, an entity that can operate with net losses year after year, is ludicrous.

    The idea of a "public option" as an alternative is bull****. In the long run, it will reduce competition and drive the quality of everyone's healthcare into the ****ter. Keep in mind, you can sue your insurance company, but you can't sue the federal govt. Under a "public option," if you don't like what you get, you have no recourse. Thanks Barry!
    Agreed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by roids1 View Post
    Holy Sh!t Luther! Maybe you need to get back on your meds. You started to make some sense there!!! Yes, maybe the answer isn't a new govt program filled with bureaucracy, govt red tape, and eventual rationing of services.

    There are other ways to insure people and their families besides group plans through employers or the federal govt. If there were a way to give individual policy holders a more competitive hand, then the insurance companies would have to be more competitive with one another for individual business. But, as it stands now, you have to take what your employer offers, through a group plan, with no bargaining power. Yet, the idea that private insurance companies can compete with the federal govt, an entity that can operate with net losses year after year, is ludicrous.

    The idea of a "public option" as an alternative is bull****. In the long run, it will reduce competition and drive the quality of everyone's healthcare into the ****ter. Keep in mind, you can sue your insurance company, but you can't sue the federal govt. Under a "public option," if you don't like what you get, you have no recourse. Thanks Barry!

    I'm with you, Luther has showed he does have some common sense. maybe everything else is just to see how much he can stir up things and isn't his true colors.
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    I figured Luther was a big fan of B. Hussein Obama. Maybe I guessed wrong.
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    my two cents.

    I agree with somewhatgifted in the sense that one's health should be one's own responsibility aside from accidents and things that a person cannot fix themselves.
    Many of us who are fitness oriented already take responsibility for our own health.
    Even people on the the harder things take steps to minimize the bodily harm.
    As well as having a clean diet and pushing our bodies hard with exercise.

    Cannot speak on Canada, but in the USA some have become excuse makers and blamers.
    We had a case in which someone won a couple of million because they spilled hot coffee from McD's on themselves. Not to mention people who sue tobacco companies because they smoke three packs a day and get health problems.
    Or trying to get snack machines banned in schools instead of teaching people to be responsible in their eating choices.

    And we have people who bust their tails doing something constructive. paying for the benefits of some who choose not to work.
    Or those who play crazy and have multiple kids by different people to draw assistance for health care and necessities.

    I have a suggestion for those of us who are independent minded.
    Let's terraform Antarctica, found our own nation where our hard work directly influences our reward and ban all those who want something without any effort.
    And before you can go to the apothecary and get pills, you have to prove your diet and lifestyle are on point first(that is unless you have a condition that does not depend on or respond to those).

    Just a thought.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lutherblsstt View Post
    So what,I am from there and lived there for over 30 years.



    Even if you keep them out there is still outsourcing which does not need physical people entering the country to work.

    See: Outsourcing Greenville the story of what happened when the world's largest refrigerator plant outsourced to Mexico leaving 1/4th of Greenville, Michigan residents unemployed.

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...29805897242874
    It is interesting that companies use outsourcing to cut their costs but the prices keep going up.
    Hmmmmm.....

    They want americans to buy their products but would rather hire way cheaper labor.
    Hmmm.........

    The wonders of the service oriented economy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuyverX View Post
    It is interesting that companies use outsourcing to cut their costs but the prices keep going up.
    Hmmmmm.....

    They want americans to buy their products but would rather hire way cheaper labor.
    Hmmm.........

    The wonders of the service oriented economy.
    Its almost like these companies with mission statements that talk about quality, commitment and respect are full of crap... Wait they are. Everything is about money nowa days people would bludgeon you to death if they were paid well enough, given enough biased information or taught to do things without question.. war anyone?
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuyverX View Post
    my two cents.

    I agree with somewhatgifted in the sense that one's health should be one's own responsibility aside from accidents and things that a person cannot fix themselves.
    Many of us who are fitness oriented already take responsibility for our own health.
    Even people on the the harder things take steps to minimize the bodily harm.
    As well as having a clean diet and pushing our bodies hard with exercise.

    Cannot speak on Canada, but in the USA some have become excuse makers and blamers.
    We had a case in which someone won a couple of million because they spilled hot coffee from McD's on themselves. Not to mention people who sue tobacco companies because they smoke three packs a day and get health problems.
    Or trying to get snack machines banned in schools instead of teaching people to be responsible in their eating choices.

    And we have people who bust their tails doing something constructive. paying for the benefits of some who choose not to work.
    Or those who play crazy and have multiple kids by different people to draw assistance for health care and necessities.

    I have a suggestion for those of us who are independent minded.
    Let's terraform Antarctica, found our own nation where our hard work directly influences our reward and ban all those who want something without any effort.
    And before you can go to the apothecary and get pills, you have to prove your diet and lifestyle are on point first(that is unless you have a condition that does not depend on or respond to those).

    Just a thought.
    Lets take a look at pharmaceuticals for one second.
    If a plant, herb or natural remedy works it can be harvested produced and mildly profitable!

    BUT one cannot patent a herb or plant.... you can only be incompetition with other harvester/distributers and when people get HEALTHY they stop taking it.

    ON THE OTHER HAND.. IF you isolate what compound or chemical causes the desired response then you can synthesize it and patent it!!!

    The problem being... when you take the isolated chemical out you get side effects!!! The whole herb is what is needed including the stabalising agents!!
    A synthesized, isolated chemical is nowhere as benefitial.

    So they get rich, you stay sick, you keep buying and when you get side effects you buy more drugs.

    The cause of all illness, disease and malcontent is lifestyle, diet and environment.

    If we try to fix our problems with drugs we deserve to be sick.

    Herbs FTW!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by somewhatgifted View Post
    Its almost like these companies with mission statements that talk about quality, commitment and respect are full of crap... Wait they are. Everything is about money nowa days people would bludgeon you to death if they were paid well enough, given enough biased information or taught to do things without question.. war anyone?
    We need to control our frustrations and make sure we don't expose ourselves to anti-capitalist arguments.

    There's a way through this....
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    Quote Originally Posted by dsade View Post
    We need to control our frustrations and make sure we don't expose ourselves to anti-capitalist arguments.

    There's a way through this....
    I agree. There are a TON of companies out there that stand by their product. Especially small business.
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    Quote Originally Posted by somewhatgifted View Post
    Lets take a look at pharmaceuticals for one second.
    If a plant, herb or natural remedy works it can be harvested produced and mildly profitable!

    BUT one cannot patent a herb or plant.... you can only be incompetition with other harvester/distributers and when people get HEALTHY they stop taking it.

    ON THE OTHER HAND.. IF you isolate what compound or chemical causes the desired response then you can synthesize it and patent it!!!

    The problem being... when you take the isolated chemical out you get side effects!!! The whole herb is what is needed including the stabalising agents!!
    A synthesized, isolated chemical is nowhere as benefitial.

    So they get rich, you stay sick, you keep buying and when you get side effects you buy more drugs.

    The cause of all illness, disease and malcontent is lifestyle, diet and environment.

    If we try to fix our problems with drugs we deserve to be sick.

    Herbs FTW!!!
    You will be singing a different tune when they have to shoot your ass up with a healthy dose of pharmaceutical epinephrine when you have an allergic reaction to your precious herbs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DAdams91982 View Post
    I agree. There are a TON of companies out there that stand by their product. Especially small business.
    Exactly.
    Too bad I have not had the good fortune to get a job somewhere like that.
    Or be able to start my own yet which focuses on quality, service, internal and external customers.

    Regulation is a funny animal though. Always a little extra in the legalese that may not benefit citizens or businesses.

    I guess in a perfect world we would have room for gainful employment/entreprenuership for everyone who wanted it and we would get paid well enough to pay out of pocket for certain things.
    That way the mass of taxpayers would not have to shoulder the burden for certain services that are not generalized.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuyverX View Post
    We had a case in which someone won a couple of million because they spilled hot coffee from McD's on themselves.
    In that lady's defense, you should not be able to use fresh coffee to smelt iron ore, and that's how hot the **** was. When your server needs asbestos gloves to hand over a cup of joe I think it's possible that the restaurant might want to turn the temp down on their hot plate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDB View Post
    In that lady's defense, you should not be able to use fresh coffee to smelt iron ore, and that's how hot the **** was. When your server needs asbestos gloves to hand over a cup of joe I think it's possible that the restaurant might want to turn the temp down on their hot plate.
    next time she should not complain that her first coffee was not hot enough.
    they were just trying to cater to her desire.
    not their fault that the coffee heating apparatus uses uranium ore as a power source.
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    Quote Originally Posted by GuyverX View Post
    Regulation is a funny animal though. Always a little extra in the legalese that may not benefit citizens or businesses.
    Regulation always benefits businesses. Select businesses. Otherwise it would never get passed.

    Follow me in a thought experiment if you would. Pretend with me that instead of being made up of upright citizens sworn to uphold the constitution and defend liberty, that the congress is made up of money grubbing whores who by and large would do anything to stay in office, stay in power, and make a buck.

    I know it's a stretch, but go with me on this.

    Now a piece of legislation comes before these whores. Do you honestly think if it hurt their campaign donors at all, or if it did at least also gave them something in return for that hurt, that there is any way this side of a snowball fight in hell it would get through the legislature?

    Now back to reality, which is basically one hair away from the above thought experiment, do you really think any legislation ever was really meant to help you, or me? Government is power. It is violence. It is brute force, and the only reason to employ it is to get through force what you couldn't get through voluntary action. Therefore when legislation pops up, ask who supports it. This holds for almost any piece of legislation that has been visited upon us.

    FDIC and Glass Steagle? FDIC socializes bankers losses. They no longer have to maintain safe balance sheets and when the **** up the tax payers pay their depositors off so the banker can stay flush.

    Anti Trust? Look who was lobbying for it and who uses it now: sour grapes competitors. Well over 80% of all anti trust suits are private complaints.

    Legislation is now and has always been the tool by which the market is manipulated in democracies. And in the progressive era especially a ton of it was passed, supposed public interest legislation, that really does nothing but empower certain businesses at the expense of other businesses and ultimately the consumer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDB View Post
    In that lady's defense, you should not be able to use fresh coffee to smelt iron ore, and that's how hot the **** was. When your server needs asbestos gloves to hand over a cup of joe I think it's possible that the restaurant might want to turn the temp down on their hot plate.
    It's those types of frivilous lawsuits that cost consumers millions every year.

    It's not just the cost of the actual lawsuit, the damages, the lawyer fees. It's printing up signs that should be common sense, documenting every nitnoid detail about darn near everything you do, all kinds of non-value added costs.

    When someone wins a lawsuit like this, WE all pay for it!!

    That's what most people don't understand. They aren't taking the money from the CEO, they're passing the costs on to consumers.

    Tort reform has got to be a key element of any healthcare proposal. Until you cut out the lawyers, you'll never solve anything.
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    Quote Originally Posted by enswalters View Post
    It's those types of frivilous lawsuits that cost consumers millions every year.
    I wouldn't call McDonald's knowingly serving magma to customers a frivilous claim. Yes, it's known coffee is hot. What isn't known, and what also isn't the subject of reasonable common sense, is that you could use it to heat steel and then hammer it into shape. I mean the woman got SCORCHED man. There's also an issue with assuming cases are frivilous when they really do have some merit.

    Tort reform has got to be a key element of any healthcare proposal. Until you cut out the lawyers, you'll never solve anything.
    I agree. But on the flip side is you don't want to make people immune to reasonable, justified actions taken against them. If some hack cuts you open and sews a dead cat inside of you, you should have a case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CDB View Post
    I wouldn't call McDonald's knowingly serving magma to customers a frivilous claim. Yes, it's known coffee is hot. What isn't known, and what also isn't the subject of reasonable common sense, is that you could use it to heat steel and then hammer it into shape.



    I agree. But on the flip side is you don't want to make people immune to reasonable, justified actions taken against them. If some hack cuts you open and sews a dead cat inside of you, you should have a case.
    Right, but the hospital not clipping my new borns nails for fear of a lawsuit is unjustified as well.
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