McCain's VP Pick - a GILF?

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    keep 1 thing in mind, if the dems are smart (yes a big friggin if, as we found out in 2004) there are countless experts that will tell you that all this new drilling will do nothing to the supply for at least 15 years, thus doing nothing to the price of oil. Also, a bit of focus on new energy sources would suit the dems well. However, we are working under the assumption they wont pull a 2004, when they could have run a steak against that dingbat Bush and won.
    The vast majority of US citizens want drilling now, whether or not it will make a huge difference remains to be seen. The Dems have been beating the "drilling won't effect price" drum for a while now, yet polls continue to show support for drilling to be in the 60-70% range. As prices rise I think we can expect to see the demand for drilling to rise as well.

    Intuitively it makes sense that drilling for oil will reduce the price short term, as speculation plays a huge role in the price of oil these days (look at how high oil prices have shot up just based on the chance that a hurricane will interrupt production/supply. This is speculation at work). Convincing the masses that this is not the case, and that we shouldn't try will be next to impossible.

    If I were a Dem strategist I would make drilling a top priority before this election, even if it risk alienating a few environmentalist. The masses are stupid enough to fall for a change of heart by the Dems in this instance.


  2. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    I dont think you as a die hard repub, can give an indication of how indy's will vote. Her stance on many core issues is very ultra conservative and plays well with the religious right, which indys will walk away from
    I can because I've watched the last two elections and it was the independents that gave Bush/Cheney the White House and nobody pandered more to the religious right than Bush/Cheney.

    McCain does well with independents because he actually goes against his party at times and Palin only emphaiszes that point as she has done the same.


    I think you might want to check the numbers again. Check the Pew research polls as well as the CBS polls. Not a big discrepancy like you might imagine
    You do understnad that 58% (quoted in Gallup and not the wiki Pew and CBS numbers you quoite) is considienr a solid majority?

    "There has been no appreciable change over the past two years in Americans' attitudes about legal recognition for same-sex marriage. As noted, about three in five (58%) still oppose it. Just 39% believe marriages between homosexuals should be recognized by the law as valid, with the same rights as traditional marriages."



    58%-39% in politics is basically a landslide.

    Even California, one of he most liberal state in the US polls against it.

    I dont think that will be the one issue, however, if shown how different she is from hillary, then the appointment of her wont help as much as the repubs think
    Its a non issue as I have already stated. If it becomes one, like it did in 2004 at times, the Dems will lose that one again.


    There is one huge difference between 2004 and 2008, Obama is a much more likeable candidate for dems to rally around than John Kerry.
    Thats a big difference? Polls don't show it.

    He also has an attack dog in Biden,

    Biden is an attack idiot. I can't wait for those semi intelligent rambling type attacks good ol Joe slings.

    . Additionally and quite sadly, Bush was more in line with what the traditional party wanted in 2004 than McCain is in 2008
    Not anymore.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by Dadof2 View Post
    The vast majority of US citizens want drilling now, whether or not it will make a huge difference remains to be seen. The Dems have been beating the "drilling won't effect price" drum for a while now, yet polls continue to show support for drilling to be in the 60-70% range. As prices rise I think we can expect to see the demand for drilling to rise as well.

    Intuitively it makes sense that drilling for oil will reduce the price short term, as speculation plays a huge role in the price of oil these days (look at how high oil prices have shot up just based on the chance that a hurricane will interrupt production/supply. This is speculation at work). Convincing the masses that this is not the case, and that we shouldn't try will be next to impossible.

    If I were a Dem strategist I would make drilling a top priority before this election, even if it risk alienating a few environmentalist. The masses are stupid enough to fall for a change of heart by the Dems in this instance.
    The people that say the price of oil won't be effected by drilling are idiots. As someone who has traded oil, as soon as the announcement would be made that the US has lifted the ban and will allow them to drill, everyone and their mother who has an ounce of a brain would pull their money out of the commodity and put it int refiner stocks and wildcat stocks.

    The people who state otherwise are morons.
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  4. Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    The people that say the price of oil won't be effected by drilling are idiots. As someone who has traded oil, as soon as the announcement would be made that the US has lifted the ban and will allow them to drill, everyone and their mother who has an ounce of a brain would pull their money out of the commodity and put it int refiner stocks and wildcat stocks.

    The people who state otherwise are morons.

    I agree.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    If man is made in God's image and we experiment, don't you think he or she experimented as well. Believe what you wish but there's no denying that there is millions of years of evidence that factually supports our evolution. Barack Obama is hardly owned
    I really tried hard, but I just can’t let this one by, so forgive me if this seems a little nit-picky. You made a couple erroneous assumptions.

    1) Because we are made in God’s image God is therefore like us. That essentially says God is made in our image which is a real dangerous assumption.
    2) Experiment means trial and error. Since God is perfect He is not capable of error. He gets it right the first time.
    3) Re: factually supports our evolution. Human evolution is theory NOT fact. The last I heard the link was still missing. So Palin has a good and reasonable basis for believing “God just snapped his fingers and Adam and Eve materialized.”
    4) Since we’re on this topic. It’s not “he or she” although technically gender neutral (for the most part) He always refers to Himself in the masculine.
    Last edited by DBinMD; 08-31-2008 at 06:42 AM.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by DBinMD View Post
    I really tried hard, but I just can’t let this one by, so forgive me if this seems a little nit-picky. You made a couple erroneous assumptions.

    1) Because we are made in God’s image God is therefore like us. That essentially says God is made in our image which is a real dangerous assumption.
    2) Experiment means trial and error. Since God is perfect He is not capable of error. He gets it right the first time.
    3) Re: factually supports our evolution. Human evolution is theory NOT fact. The last I heard the link was still missing. So Palin has a good and reasonable basis for believing “God just snapped his fingers and Adam and Eve materialized.”
    4) Since we’re on this topic. It’s not “he or she” although technically gender neutral (for the most part) He always refers to Himself in the masculine.
    1. If you take the bible at it's word, that could go either way.


    2. The assumption is that God Or what ever higher power is perfect, Define perfection as it relates to a superior being.

    3. The law of gravity is a theory, jump and see what happens.

    4. God is referred to as masculine because in the time the bible was written, there was no way that it would or could have been any other way. God could be anything, have you had a personal face to face discussion with "him" lately?


    :bruce3:


    When it comes to religion, I generally stay away form the argument because as I do believe in God, I also believe in possibility. NO 1 the possibility that the bible was altered by man to control the masses.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    1. If you take the bible at it's word, that could go either way.

    2. The assumption is that God Or what ever higher power is perfect, Define perfection as it relates to a superior being.
    I'm not sure what you mean by 1 and 2.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    3. The law of gravity is a theory, jump and see what happens.
    Gravity is one theory that's likely correct. There's tons of odd ball theories out there, too. Like the ones about global warming. The point is the story of Adam and Eve is no less plausible than the one about creation. Since the theory of Adam and Eve came first, it's up to the evolutionists to make their case.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    4. God is referred to as masculine because in the time the bible was written, there was no way that it would or could have been any other way. God could be anything, have you had a personal face to face discussion with "him" lately?
    What makes you believe there was no way that it would or could have been any other way. Pagans, for instance had no problem with deities of either sex.

    re:God could be anything, have you had a personal face to face discussion with "him" lately?
    Not specifically, but Christ is an historical fact (verified thru pagan sources, too) . But then you have to have a belief in the New Testament, too.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    When it comes to religion, I generally stay away form the argument because as I do believe in God, I also believe in possibility. NO 1 the possibility that the bible was altered by man to control the masses.
    re: I also believe in possibility. The trouble is if you believe in everything, you essentially believe in nothing.

    re: NO 1 the possibility that the bible was altered by man to control the masses.

    If you look close enough, thru a reaonably authoritative source, you'll see that the Bible is NOT about control, but the infinite love of the Creator. IOW, perfect love is incompatible with coersion.

  8. Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    I can because I've watched the last two elections and it was the independents that gave Bush/Cheney the White House and nobody pandered more to the religious right than Bush/Cheney.
    soyou think the indys are willing to make more errors in judgement? Most indys right now, if you look at the numbers are leaning to Obama, and Palin will not help that cause

    Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    McCain does well with independents because he actually goes against his party at times and Palin only emphaiszes that point as she has done the same.
    the issue with McCain is that he is a gambler, hence the pick. However, do you want a 72 year old, with bad health at best, who is a gambler in the white house? most will say no.

    Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    You do understnad that 58% (quoted in Gallup and not the wiki Pew and CBS numbers you quoite) is considienr a solid majority?

    "There has been no appreciable change over the past two years in Americans' attitudes about legal recognition for same-sex marriage. As noted, about three in five (58%) still oppose it. Just 39% believe marriages between homosexuals should be recognized by the law as valid, with the same rights as traditional marriages."

    58%-39% in politics is basically a landslide.

    Even California, one of he most liberal state in the US polls against it.
    we are not just talking about gay marriage, we are also talking civil unions, and hell Palin wants a constitutional ammendment. Wait, I thought the dems believed in big gov't.



    Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    Its a non issue as I have already stated. If it becomes one, like it did in 2004 at times, the Dems will lose that one again.
    again, the dems need to be smart, which might be difficult no doubt. They need to pander to a lot of women and show them the significant differences between Palin and Clinton.




    Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    Thats a big difference? Polls don't show it.
    are you serious? I mean listen, I know you are as biased as they come around here, but come on, look at the response to Obama in comparison to Kerry, it is light years apart. The dems believe they actually have someone they can build with, even though they were not sure from the start. Lets try to leave the bias at the door if possible

    Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    Biden is an attack idiot. I can't wait for those semi intelligent rambling type attacks good ol Joe slings.
    It is funny how most pundits who are not the traditional bias of fox news and msnbc consider him a huge asset to the ticket.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by Dadof2 View Post
    The vast majority of US citizens want drilling now, whether or not it will make a huge difference remains to be seen. The Dems have been beating the "drilling won't effect price" drum for a while now, yet polls continue to show support for drilling to be in the 60-70% range. As prices rise I think we can expect to see the demand for drilling to rise as well.

    Intuitively it makes sense that drilling for oil will reduce the price short term, as speculation plays a huge role in the price of oil these days (look at how high oil prices have shot up just based on the chance that a hurricane will interrupt production/supply. This is speculation at work). Convincing the masses that this is not the case, and that we shouldn't try will be next to impossible.

    If I were a Dem strategist I would make drilling a top priority before this election, even if it risk alienating a few environmentalist. The masses are stupid enough to fall for a change of heart by the Dems in this instance.
    I agree, especially if Gustav is as dangerous as they think. However, and this is the biggest issue facing dems, they will need to start to saddress this and if they dont do it properly it wiwll hurt them,. It is amazing, the average American could give two poops about any science that they actually have on this.

    Correct me if I am wrong, but I remember reading something based on Palin and McCain disagreeing on this issue? I could be wrong.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by DBinMD View Post
    I really tried hard, but I just can’t let this one by, so forgive me if this seems a little nit-picky. You made a couple erroneous assumptions.

    1) Because we are made in God’s image God is therefore like us. That essentially says God is made in our image which is a real dangerous assumption.
    2) Experiment means trial and error. Since God is perfect He is not capable of error. He gets it right the first time.
    3) Re: factually supports our evolution. Human evolution is theory NOT fact. The last I heard the link was still missing. So Palin has a good and reasonable basis for believing “God just snapped his fingers and Adam and Eve materialized.”
    4) Since we’re on this topic. It’s not “he or she” although technically gender neutral (for the most part) He always refers to Himself in the masculine.
    Um, I didn't post that. That statement was made by someone else, and was possibly quoted in one of my post, but that is not my statement. I am a Theist, a Christian to be specific.
  11. Never enough
    EasyEJL's Avatar

    Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    we are not just talking about gay marriage, we are also talking civil unions, and hell Palin wants a constitutional ammendment. Wait, I thought the dems believed in big gov't.
    Adding a couple of sentences to the constitution, which has to be ratified by congress plus a majority of the governors is big government? What do you call universal health care then? Supermegahyperenormous government?
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  12. Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Adding a couple of sentences to the constitution, which has to be ratified by congress plus a majority of the governors is big government? What do you call universal health care then? Supermegahyperenormous government?
    Oh I agree that Universal Health care is big government ( I am not in favor of it btw, except for children). However, with the big fuss Repubs make about big government, trying to get a constitutional ammendment to ban gay marriage most certainly is big government.

    Also, way to understate it with a few sentences. This is the most important document in this country. Man, I am starting to believe I am the only moderate around here.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    soyou think the indys are willing to make more errors in judgement? Most indys right now, if you look at the numbers are leaning to Obama, and Palin will not help that cause
    Its dead even and Obama actually was losing last week at one point.

    He's been dropping for the last 30 days.

    Palin will only help that cause once people hear her speak.


    the issue with McCain is that he is a gambler, hence the pick. However, do you want a 72 year old, with bad health at best, who is a gambler in the white house? most will say no.
    Last time I checked, he is in better health than Biden. Is this the way the Dems are gong to win now? The death card? And where do you get this bad health from? He released his records and he's fine. Are you really trying to reach that far to find a negative?

    Most will say no? Like they said no with Reagan? Oops....

    we are not just talking about gay marriage, we are also talking civil unions, and hell Palin wants a constitutional ammendment. Wait, I thought the dems believed in big gov't.
    Once again, a non issue. I think you and the audience of Ellen are the only ones who care.

    ..and the sarcastic remark was bad. Try harder next time.


    again, the dems need to be smart, which might be difficult no doubt.
    YOu have Howard Dean. Its not possible.

    They need to pander to a lot of women and show them the significant differences between Palin and Clinton.
    Yes, a black man and a 6th term Senator will do better than a woman.

    Hello? Anyone?

    are you serious? I mean listen, I know you are as biased as they come around here,
    Pot, kettle, REALLY black.

    When its come to Obama, you have your full blinders on.

    but come on, look at the response to Obama in comparison to Kerry, it is light years apart.
    Its the response of Dems to a flashy Dem candidate. If he was so popular he would break the 50% mark consistently. You're letting the hype and flash get in the way of your thinking but then again, thats typical of an Obama supporter

    Numbers don't lie. If he was so popular with everyone, he would be killing McCains in this environment. He's barely winning.

    The dems believe they actually have someone they can build with, even though they were not sure from the start. Lets try to leave the bias at the door if possible


    It is funny how most pundits who are not the traditional bias of fox news and msnbc consider him a huge asset to the ticket.
    Yes, the "traditional" media doesn't favor Obama at all. You're on a roll tonight!

    "Gallup Daily: No Bounce for Obama in Post-Biden Tracking
    McCain creeps ahead, 46% to 44%
    August 26, 2008"


    Looking at the new Gallup poll video, its basically a split down the middle with Ind women actually favoring McCains 42% to 41%. That will only go up now.

    His speech and the convention gave him a bump overall but the Biden pick did nothing and will continue to do so.


    That's not a bias, that's numbers.
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  14. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    Oh I agree that Universal Health care is big government ( I am not in favor of it btw, except for children). However, with the big fuss Repubs make about big government, trying to get a constitutional ammendment to ban gay marriage most certainly is big government.
    There is a difference between right wing conservative and Republicans just as there is a difference between liberals and Democrats. I guess you chose to ignore McCains opinion as well as many other Repubs.

    But nice generalization you had there...it shows how "moderate" you are.



    Man, I am starting to believe I am the only moderate around here.
    LMAO...right....feverishly defending Obama/Biden 3 months out and you're a "moderate".

    I've heard it all now.
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  15. Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL View Post
    Adding a couple of sentences to the constitution, which has to be ratified by congress plus a majority of the governors is big government?


    wow.....yeah, that's BIG government. Incredible.
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  16. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    we are not just talking about gay marriage, we are also talking civil unions, and hell Palin wants a constitutional ammendment. Wait, I thought the dems believed in big gov't.
    Why is that even an issue in anyones minds? Over 50% of congress is Dems and they need a 2/3rd majority for a constitutional amendment. Is there a chance in hell that would happen?

  17. Quote Originally Posted by RobInKuwait View Post
    Why is that even an issue in anyones minds? Over 50% of congress is Dems and they need a 2/3rd majority for a constitutional amendment. Is there a chance in hell that would happen?
    No because there are a lot of Republicans, including McCain, that do not favor an amendment like that.

    It will never happen and its basically a non issue.

    But people (the moderates!! LMAO) need something to attack Palin on...
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  18. Quote Originally Posted by Dadof2 View Post
    Um, I didn't post that. That statement was made by someone else, and was possibly quoted in one of my post, but that is not my statement. I am a Theist, a Christian to be specific.
    Sorry, Dadof2. I made a correction to the post.

  19. Wow JP, address the issues with sarcasm well done.

    It seems you havent read my posts, I have gone against hte McCain/Palin ticket as I disagreed with his choice. I have said over and over that I am not an Obama fan, but I personbally feel that ticket is better. However, I would expect captain neo-con to turn of the Foxnews long enough to understand. Ah well, not worth it, either way inb 3 m onths we will see

  20. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    Wow JP, address the issues with sarcasm well done.
    Funny you should say this since you are the one that started to state people were biased because they didn't hold the same view you did as well as being sarcastic.


    I suggest you read your own posts before you click "Submit" next time.

    It seems you havent read my posts, I have gone against hte McCain/Palin ticket as I disagreed with his choice. I have said over and over that I am not an Obama fan, but I personbally feel that ticket is better. However, I would expect captain neo-con to turn of the Foxnews long enough to understand. Ah well, not worth it, either way inb 3 m onths we will see
    Ah..the typical reaper response.


    "You didn't read posts my you (insert generalization here)." It was neo con this time which is downright hilarious. And you couldn't forget the Fox News reference as well! Well done!

    Yes, the multi quote response to each point suggest I haven't read your posts. I just randomly pick sentences to multi quote

    Please have another cup of coffee since it seems you are still asleep on this one.
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  21. Quote Originally Posted by J. Peterman View Post
    Funny you should say this since you are the one that started to state people were biased because they didn't hold the same view you did as well as being sarcastic.


    I suggest you read your own posts before you click "Submit" next time.



    Ah..the typical reaper response.


    "You didn't read posts my you (insert generalization here)." It was neo con this time which is downright hilarious. And you couldn't forget the Fox News reference as well! Well done!

    Yes, the multi quote response to each point suggest I haven't read your posts. I just randomly pick sentences to multi quote

    Please have another cup of coffee since it seems you are still asleep on this one.
    I, like your responses am too tired.

    So here is what I will do, I will come back again in November, and we shall see how correct you are. I wish you luck with your ticket. It is a shame however that you cannot be anything more than biased, but that is ok. See you in November

  22. At this point since all of the PC insults have been exhausted, we should just agree to disagree and move on to another topic.

    Anybody for Gustav vs the Republican convention. I say Gustav will have higher ratings, flame on. btw, J. check out the polls today especially on Fox

  23. Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    At this point since all of the PC insults have been exhausted, we should just agree to disagree and move on to another topic.

    Anybody for Gustav vs the Republican convention. I say Gustav will have higher ratings, flame on. btw, J. check out the polls today especially on Fox
    Barack Obama and John McCain are in a tight race for the White House, but at this stage many voters are still undecided. In the latest FOX News poll, Obama has a slim three-percentage point edge over McCain (42 percent-39 percent), while nearly one of five voters is undecided.

    These undecided voters will likely determine the presidential election outcome. So what do they feel in their guts about the two candidates? The FOX News poll tried to get at that question by asking: If you had to make the “toughest decision” of your life, who would you rather get advice from — Obama or McCain?Based on that question, there are signs that undecided voters may be more inclined to move to McCain than to Obama. The largest number of undecideds – 38 percent – would rather get advice from McCain – that’s nearly three times as many as the 13 percent that would go to Obama. The remaining say “neither” (27 percent) or are unsure (18 percent).

    Furthermore, independent voters pick McCain by a 15-point margin (41 percent – 26 percent).

    As one would expect, most Obama voters — 78 percent — say they would go to him for advice. Similarly, fully 83 percent of McCain voters would consider him their trusted guru on a tough life decision.While 68 percent of Democrats would go to Obama for advice, nearly one of five – 18 percent – would pick McCain. Most Republicans (74 percent) would go to McCain, with less than one in 10 saying they would pick Obama (7 percent).

    Overall, slightly more voters say they would turn to McCain in this situation (43 percent to 37 percent Obama).

    In such a tight race for the White House, where both candidates have positive favorable ratings and strong support from their party faithful, there are some troubling signs for Obama from undecided voters

    Opinion Dynamics Corp. conducted the national telephone poll of 900 registered voters for FOX News from Aug. 19 to Aug. 20. The poll has a 3-point error margin
    .
    I like those odds. Thanks for getting me to do a search on those polls.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by slow-mun View Post
    I like those odds. Thanks for getting me to do a search on those polls.
    You're welcome, the latest Gallup daily tracking poll has it Obama 49% McCain 41%, I like those odds. The fact is Polls are mostly crap, they're more effective in fueling discussions like we have here on this site than anything else, imo. Harry Truman learned to love the polls

  25. Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    You're welcome, the latest Gallup daily tracking poll has it Obama 49% McCain 41%, I like those odds. The fact is Polls are mostly crap, they're more effective in fueling discussions like we have here on this site than anything else, imo. Harry Truman learned to love the polls
    Very true.

  26. Quote Originally Posted by slow-mun View Post
    Very true.
    I agree. Polls are essentially meaningless

  27. Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    At this point since all of the PC insults have been exhausted, we should just agree to disagree and move on to another topic.

    Anybody for Gustav vs the Republican convention. I say Gustav will have higher ratings, flame on. btw, J. check out the polls today especially on Fox
    Gustav has more hype surrounding it than Prime. Category 3, decreasing in strength, and they are saying it's the worst storm this country has ever seen? Uhmm...what?

  28. In all seriousness, I hope Gustav turns out to be a big dud but, it doesn't look good right now.

    :bruce3:

  29. Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    I, like your responses am too tired.

    So here is what I will do, I will come back again in November, and we shall see how correct you are. I wish you luck with your ticket. It is a shame however that you cannot be anything more than biased, but that is ok. See you in November

    Nowhere did I state anywhere that McCain would win...once again you make false assumptions and show that your comprehensions skills need a tune up.

    I said Palin will help with independent women and she will. If you can't see that, then your Obama blinders are on so tight its restricting oxygen to your brain.
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  30. Quote Originally Posted by Fastone View Post
    Obama 49% McCain 41%,
    Convention bump.
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