AnaBeta Elite on CBL

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  1. Quote Originally Posted by ma70 View Post

    So it would be okay to take Anabeta fasted, pre workout?
    I don't see why not, I personally feel you can get a lot out of it with intra carbs tho.

    Use it's MOAs to your advantage


  2. Quote Originally Posted by ma70 View Post
    So it would be okay to take Anabeta fasted, pre workout?
    Yep. When I am fasted I do that with no problems.
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  3. Quote Originally Posted by EBF Inc View Post
    I'd cut my intra carbs to just 20-30 just to get your bodies enzymes working for optimal glucose absorption after doing low carb.

    With that said. Protein fats in the morning, either pre workout carbs at 25g or intra carbs at 25g, the. Post workout eat
    Thank you, but at the moment I'd rather go without intra-carbs, cause I should better keep an eye on my current body fat. But how does the following solution sound to you?
    Since the first carbs of the day I take are included in my PWO-shake (52g maltodextrin) I am considering taking it straight after training, then waiting 15 minutes and having the first 2 anabeta capsules, which could potentially "benefit" from the already circulating carbs. After another 15 minutes (GDA?) I would have my first carb-backload with solid food and then spread the other 2 pills on my two remaining meals. Does this theory make any sense to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    To clarify it increases glycogen retention and accelerates clearance of blood glucose in response to a meal. If you take it without food, it won't act as a GDA (as opposed to, say, Na-r-ala)
    by "food" do you mean any kind of nutrients, even a shake, or just solid foods?

  4. Quote Originally Posted by MaXopA View Post
    Thank you, but at the moment I'd rather go without intra-carbs, cause I should better keep an eye on my current body fat. But how does the following solution sound to you?
    Since the first carbs of the day I take are included in my PWO-shake (52g maltodextrin) I am considering taking it straight after training, then waiting 15 minutes and having the first 2 anabeta capsules, which could potentially "benefit" from the already circulating carbs. After another 15 minutes (GDA?) I would have my first carb-backload with solid food and then spread the other 2 pills on my two remaining meals. Does this theory make any sense to you?



    by "food" do you mean any kind of nutrients, even a shake, or just solid foods?
    I mean nutrients

  5. Quote Originally Posted by MaXopA View Post
    That's great news. How would you guys split ABE/EP/DAA doses considering the following plan? The first half of the day till I workout is ultra-low-carb with a maximum of 800 calories in order to enhance fat-burning. After training I pig out on high-glycemic carbs.

    10.00 PM to 8.00 AM: Fasting

    8.00 AM: Breakfast-Shake (6g MCT-Oil, 10g Whey Isolate, Coffee [about 300mg caffeine])

    9.00 AM: SNACK (16g fat - 16g protein - no carbs)

    1.00 PM: LUNCH (27g fat - 24g protein - no carbs)

    5:00 PM: PRE-WO-SHAKE (12g MCT-Oil, 20g Whey Isolate, Coffee (about 300mg caffeine)

    5:30 PM: Workout

    7:00 PM: PWO-SHAKE (52g Maltodextrin, 25g Whey Hydrolysate, 30g Whey Isolate, 15g Micellar Casein, 5g L-Leucine, 5g Creatine, 150mg Caffeine)

    7:30 PM: 1st PWO-meal (118g carbs - 55g protein - 18g fat)

    8:30 PM: 2nd PWO-meal (76g carbs - 40g protein - 3g fat)

    9:30 PM: 3rd PWO-meal (88g carbs - 47g protein - 36g fat)

    TOTALS: 3.492 Calories - 337g Carbs - 114g Fat - 271g Protein

    I've already read DAA has no particular directions, just take 3g at any time of the day, but I'd like to know your opinion about dosing/timing ABE & EP, since my nutritional protocol is a bit weird.

    I'm surprised that nobody has picked up on the amount of caffeine in this diet.

    Your posts indicate that you're current goals are both to gain lean mass and to cut back your body-fat and whilst caffeine is a very effective tool when cutting, I'm concerned that high dosages such as that described above could eventually lead to adrenal fatigue somewhere down the track (halting or even reversing your fat-loss), not to mention the myriad of other health issues that can potentially arise (kidneys etc).

    This is just my 2c and I'm only chiming in because I don't want you to cause undue harm to your health.

    Cheers mate.
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  6. Caffeine possesses no ability to cause adrenal insufficiency. Caffeine studies (lifetime studies of high consumption) show improved health and cognition, and coffee, from which most of his caffeine comes from, shows even more population benefits

  7. Interesting indeed.

    What are your thoughts on the effects of high caffeine consumption and heart health?

    i.e. stress related to elevated heart rate over a duration of time.

  8. Coffee actually protects against heart disease when consumed at high doses chronically (4 cups + daily): http://circheartfailure.ahajournals....67299.abstract. Smaller amounts of coffee work too, just not as well. There is, however, a 3% increase in incidence of heart disease if you consume 11 cups of coffee a day...which is downright absurd to begin with

  9. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    Coffee actually protects against heart disease when consumed at high doses chronically (4 cups + daily): http://circheartfailure.ahajournals....67299.abstract. Smaller amounts of coffee work too, just not as well. There is, however, a 3% increase in incidence of heart disease if you consume 11 cups of coffee a day...which is downright absurd to begin with
    You're certainly on the money regarding the protective qualities of caffeine against heart disease, but I'm thinking more of the increased risk of heart attack . 11 standard cups of coffee equates roughly to 1,650mg of caffeine which is, as you say, absurd. The OP is taking in approximately 750mg of caffeine (according to his own calculations) which is nowhere near the 11 cup mark, however even 1,000mg of caffeine per day is very high, don't you think?

  10. What is heart disease? In the U.S., it's chiefly what you just said: heart attack, or risk thereof. So your first sentence doesn't make much sense.

    1000mg is daily is high, but is it high enough for me to agree with your initial post about adrenal fatigue/kidney damage? Not quite

  11. Well, actually I'm following what Kiefer recommends in his Carb-Backloading Book. For people being on "Strength Accumulation Protocol" the dose even exceeds the 1000mg threshold.

  12. Quote Originally Posted by cheru2016 View Post
    halting or even reversing your fat-loss
    thanks for your reflection bro. However, why should a higher dose of caffeine hinder fatty oxidation, did you read any studies concerning this topic?

  13. Quote Originally Posted by MaXopA View Post
    thanks for your reflection bro. However, why should a higher dose of caffeine hinder fatty oxidation, did you read any studies concerning this topic?
    I was approaching it from the angle that high caffeine consumption can lead to adrenal fatigue which in turn can result in weight gain.
    However if what Cooper said is correct and caffeine doesn't actually cause adrenal insufficiency, I stand corrected. I'm still not entirely convinced though as I have heard and read about the opposite occurring on many occasions, however I am by no means qualified to recommend my word as gospel. It's certainly worth looking into though, if you have the time/interest.

  14. Quote Originally Posted by cheru2016 View Post
    I was approaching it from the angle that high caffeine consumption can lead to adrenal fatigue which in turn can result in weight gain.
    However if what Cooper said is correct and caffeine doesn't actually cause adrenal insufficiency, I stand corrected. I'm still not entirely convinced though as I have heard and read about the opposite occurring on many occasions, however I am by no means qualified to recommend my word as gospel. It's certainly worth looking into though, if you have the time/interest.
    People "think" they have adrenal fatigue, but here's what they are actually experiencing. Suffice to say, it is largely the uneducated crowd (read: people without a science background, not unintelligent people) who think they have adrenal fatigue because it's tough for them to grasp the complexities of the body.

    "Adrenal fatigue is 99% fiction, and based on the concept of tolerance. When you supplement with caffeine, the body upregulates hepatic CYP enzymes which are oriented at deactivating caffeine. Naturally, in order to produce an equivalent effect, you have to supplement with more and more caffeine. Similarly, the body upregulates central adenosine receptors and so caffeine literally decreases in potency. If you decrease your dose of caffeine, or become abstinent, you will have a withdrawl period which is simply due to the latter mechanism. Eventually, the adenosine receptors downregulate and you return to baseline.

    Fitness "experts" don't understand biology/pharmacology, and blame "adrenal fatigue." Others are trying to make money off of peoples ignorance (i.e. adrenal fatigue supplements).

    Adrenal insufficiency is something different. The only way to produce adrenal medulla insufficiency is to physically denervate the organ. You can produce temporary adrenal medulla atrophy with absence of leptin, cortisol, or corticotropin. The latter two can be induced with exogenous supplementation of glucocorticoids, although the main effect will be directed towards the adrenal cortex (i.e. actual adrenal insufficiency).

    New Fact Sheets Dispel Myths of Adrenal Fatigue and Wilson
    Adrenal fatigue: Is there such a thing? - Mayo Clinic"


    The adenosine receptors in the above excerpt are the receptors that modulate wakefulness. When they get activated, they block the reticular activating system (RAS; responsible for arousal/alertness), which induces sleep. So you use caffeine for a long time, these adenosine receptors increase in number, and then you go off caffeine. You now have a ton of adenosine receptors that are no longer blocked, and the natural feeling you get is a "loss of energy; fatigue." This has nothing to do with adrenal glands.

  15. That's enough science for today, if you don't believe me, I can't help you any further

  16. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    That's enough science for today, if you don't believe me, I can't help you any further
    Awesome stuff - reading through it now.

    Thank you for the information mate.

  17. Thanks coop good info

  18. Now coop, what about adrenalin resistance caused by high circulating levels of leptin..?

  19. In for more info!

  20. Quote Originally Posted by mr.cooper69 View Post
    People "think" they have adrenal fatigue, but here's what they are actually experiencing. Suffice to say, it is largely the uneducated crowd (read: people without a science background, not unintelligent people) who think they have adrenal fatigue because it's tough for them to grasp the complexities of the body.

    "Adrenal fatigue is 99% fiction, and based on the concept of tolerance. When you supplement with caffeine, the body upregulates hepatic CYP enzymes which are oriented at deactivating caffeine. Naturally, in order to produce an equivalent effect, you have to supplement with more and more caffeine. Similarly, the body upregulates central adenosine receptors and so caffeine literally decreases in potency. If you decrease your dose of caffeine, or become abstinent, you will have a withdrawl period which is simply due to the latter mechanism. Eventually, the adenosine receptors downregulate and you return to baseline.

    Fitness "experts" don't understand biology/pharmacology, and blame "adrenal fatigue." Others are trying to make money off of peoples ignorance (i.e. adrenal fatigue supplements).

    Adrenal insufficiency is something different. The only way to produce adrenal medulla insufficiency is to physically denervate the organ. You can produce temporary adrenal medulla atrophy with absence of leptin, cortisol, or corticotropin. The latter two can be induced with exogenous supplementation of glucocorticoids, although the main effect will be directed towards the adrenal cortex (i.e. actual adrenal insufficiency).

    New Fact Sheets Dispel Myths of Adrenal Fatigue and Wilson
    Adrenal fatigue: Is there such a thing? - Mayo Clinic"


    The adenosine receptors in the above excerpt are the receptors that modulate wakefulness. When they get activated, they block the reticular activating system (RAS; responsible for arousal/alertness), which induces sleep. So you use caffeine for a long time, these adenosine receptors increase in number, and then you go off caffeine. You now have a ton of adenosine receptors that are no longer blocked, and the natural feeling you get is a "loss of energy; fatigue." This has nothing to do with adrenal glands.
    I couldn't have said better, or even close to as good myself. Thanks Coop.
    Training Log:
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/workout-logs/261146-workout-log-2-a.html
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