Try aromasin it is an ai that is a suicide inhibitor, that means it stays attached to the aromatase enzyme until it leaves the body so there is no rebound affect
If Letro removes 98% of your estrogen, isnt long term use (well long enough to remove gyno) going to temporarilly cause your lipids to go bad? Or is it the lesser of 2 evils?
Also, whats this talk about AI's causing a rebound? It doesnt seem possible. Now not tapering a SERM down, I can see rebound.
2.5mg/day letro removes 98% estro. It's those high doses that can promote rebound too. 0.1-0.2mg/day only kills about 60% of estro. That's the secret, use low doses! Steroidal AI's don't rebound, only the enzyme inhibitors and SERMs.Originally Posted by Ghosting
Dr.D pulls through again.Originally Posted by DR.D
not sure I'm taking your meaning here, Dr.D - you mean that steroidal AIs are qualitatively defferent from non-steroidal AIs?Originally Posted by DR.D
also - what's your sense of the best time to take letro? AM? PM?
Hey Wiz! Steroidal AIs act as suicide substrates that deactivate aromatase. They don't suppress or induce enzymes so there is no rebound when you stop using them. In fact, if you take them long enough there have been reports of protracted anti-e activity long after the compound is discontinued. Letro, on the other hand, prevents estro formation. Enzymes can rebound hard if big doses of letro are taken for a few months straight. This is well documented in women using 2.5mg daily. It is unnecessary because optimal estrogen suppression occurs at 0.25mg daily. I recommend 0.1mg daily or 0.25mg EOD for an average cycle of aromatizable androgens.Originally Posted by BodyWizard
Letro has a long half-life, so just take it at the same time every day. First thing in the morning would be fine, but it probably doesn't matter too much when.
Hey G, sorry I didn't answer the whole question! Yes, letro hurts lipids, but I still love the stuff and think it has it's place. Especially on high test cycles, but Aromasin and Rebound, 2 steroidal AIs, show possible evidence of improving lipids (or at least lowering LDL), maybe due to the 17b-OH metabolites. If letro is used anyway, use the lowest dose required so that estrogen is just attenuated and not completely destroyed.Originally Posted by Ghosting
1 question, what do you know about ATD causing a rebound? I dont fully understand (from what I know of AI's), how a rebound would be possible.?.? In my mind you would have a reduction of the aromatase enzyme, so Im lost when people say taper AI's. Give us the Dr.D final word on this.Originally Posted by DR.D
ATD will not cause a rebound (ironic that it's named Rebound ) because it's a steroidal AI like Teslac and Aromasin. The aromatase inhibition that they cause can be noncompetetive and irreversible, that's why they don't rebound. When people say to taper AIs they probably mean Anastrazol and Letrozole, they are enzyme inhibitors and suppress enzymes that are needed to make estrogen. The body tries to rebalance that by inducing the production of more enzymes proportional to the degree of inhibition and time that they were used. If you use an enzyme inhibitor like letro, just keep the dose low, use it for the shortest amount of time possible and taper at the end if you choose to use higher doses. It's pretty much that simple.Originally Posted by Ghosting
Ooooh...cool, I could just PCT at 3 caps a day for a while, then drop to 2 maybe and call it quits? no need to taper?
Always full of good info
I get people telling all the time that AI's cause rebound and SERMS dont. of course they never answer me when Nolva is gone then what happens to all the waiting estrogen if you dont taper? They never answer why SERMs need to be tapered. This happens to me a lot. Ugh!Originally Posted by DR.D
Yeah, you could do a little 3,2 taper. It wouldn't hurt, but it's not required either. I actually ramp up 1,2,3 with ATD as my SERM tapers out.Originally Posted by kwyckemynd00
Ohh yeah...that's right....I remember that PCT outline
it is teh funnehOriginally Posted by Ghosting
Hey doc, would using say 2-3 caps of ATD on cycle be enough to 1.) Prevent gyno to the extent of say using Letro @ .25mg EOD or .1-.2mg ED as a replacement since Letro is harder on the cholesterol profile than ATD (this would be of course with a aromatizing compound like test) and 2.) Work as a OTC HCG of sorts. What are your thoughts good Doc. Hope you are doing well brother.Originally Posted by DR.D
Now you can do a cut & paste of Dr.D to defend my honor without it looking like we are gay like we are in real life.Originally Posted by Pioneer
i cant find the thread it was in, i looked at everything i posted in but cant find it.
Likey story. You just dont want anyone to know we are gay. Its cool, I wont let anyone know.Originally Posted by Pioneer
I'm doing fine bro, it's always great to hear for you. I pray you're doing well too. I have not experimented with ATD in this way much, but plan to. 1 or 2 caps should be plenty. It may prove to be a great letro replacement with fewer sides and better anti-gyno effects. 3 caps may be overkill, I'm just now sure at this point.Originally Posted by Grassroots082
Thanks BuddyOriginally Posted by DR.D