- 01-14-2011, 10:12 PM
I was reading Bate's Clinical examination (a med school text book) A Systematic Guide to Physical Exmainatino 5th Ed. about liver damage.
"Anabolic steroids and the contraceptive pill can cause dose-related cholestasis. Fatty liver can occur with alcohol use, tetracycline, valproic acid or amiodarone. Large blood-filled cavities in the liver called peliosis hepatis can occur with anabolic steroid use or the contraceptive pill. Acute liver cell necrosis can occur if an overdose of paracetamol (acetaminophen) is taken." - pg 132 Just interesting the diff mechs by which liver can be potentially damaged by AAS.
I was not able to follow this up with studies, but just thought id like to share this. Im sure there is info about that in terms of mechs etc so if you guys wanna follow it up and give some additional input, that would be good. If not, here is some inteersting info then.
- 01-15-2011, 11:11 AM
- 01-15-2011, 06:42 PM
First of all imm not 165lbs anymore (need to change my profile but dont know how)
Second of all you have no right telling me whether I should be taking AAS or not, whether I am 90lbs or 300lbs.
Third this is a discussion about the diff mechs by which AAS causes liver damage, not whether it does or not.
If you have nothing to contribute please refrain from making unconstructive comments like the one you just posted. Thanks.
01-15-2011, 07:14 PM
Why dont you tell us what weight must you reach before doing AAS is warranted?
This theory is the equivalent to saying a 165 pounder cant knock you out since you are 230. I've seen this happen quite a bit!
01-15-2011, 07:33 PM
Im 185lbs now but I cant figure out how to change my bloody profile!!! I swear I have been trying for the past 2 days
01-15-2011, 07:35 PM
This theory is not true. A true ectomorph at 165 could very well benefit from AAS.
And THANKS for this. Most people's weights start at aorund 145-150lbs before they even workout. I started out at 110lbs. By the time I finished growing naturally I was 150lbs. The rest was AAS help. Im an ectomorph and I was almost born prematurely (birth weight 3lbs).
01-15-2011, 07:38 PM
01-15-2011, 08:30 PM
if ur a 165lber i bet my ass u can gain weight by eating 4k/day if that dnt work. eat more.
if ur 185 at 5-10, yes u could b very close to ur max, but 185 at like 6% is HUGE.
sry not tryina b ****
01-15-2011, 08:37 PM
01-15-2011, 09:39 PM
Yeah tahts exactly my problem. In my first attempt to bulk up i actually listened to advice like GLHF's and ate 4k calories (well more like 4500). I put on a DISGUSTING amt of fat!! It wasnt until I was on AAS that I can eat 4k cals a day and actually put on some quality muscle mass without much fat.
I know a guy who was 165lbs at 5'8 who had 17 inch arms. The guy seriuosly looked monstrous and he was pretty strong too. Actually I know a LOT of people, especially asians, who are light weight, very strong and have great measurements.
01-16-2011, 11:10 AM
I'd have to agree... When I start upping my cals (clean too). I start losing that good physique.
Doing AAS has nothing to do with what you weigh- It has to do with your age, experience, as well as a comprehensive knowledge as to what you putting in your body... There are a few of us that are not addicted to the scale, and would rather be addicted to the strength gains and endurance...
In other words, we all have different goals respectively...
okay, if your 5' 10" 19yrs and 150... worked out for 1 year, probably not so....
But on the other hand, 5' 8" 26yrs and 160... 8 years of training under the belt, I don't see any risk in doing so if you have researched your method properly.... Besides, some of us do it for the strength, not size...
Not everyone wants to get big and walk around with 200lbs of weight on them. As in my case, I'd rather be a solid 160 and be able to outlift/outrun/outtrain most guys that are carrying 40 extra pounds... If I starting putting some estro/fat/creatine in my system... then ya I could get to 190 easily, but it's my choice to stay slim.
Sorry, just venting because I hate hearing people make stupid comments like "you don't weigh enough to be doing aas"... when it should be "Age?, experience?, what are your goals?"
01-29-2011, 12:22 PM
01-29-2011, 02:32 PM
01-30-2011, 10:53 AM
01-30-2011, 11:00 AM
01-30-2011, 09:42 PM
01-31-2011, 12:55 PM
To be clear, we are talking about PH's aka designers ...right ?
01-31-2011, 02:09 PM
I don't get what we're discussing in this thread... If you're going to run methyls, run them with some liver protection. Milk thistle or otherwise.
Celtic Labs Rep
01-31-2011, 02:31 PM
This space for rent
Phenadrol Log http://anabolicminds.com/forum/suppl...-hell-did.html - AMAZING fat loss results so far
02-01-2011, 10:42 PM
people get confused real quick about whether the discussion is about methyls or test or whatever... people seem to assume its methyl no matter what on this particular board... probably because they're more popular lately.
I've heard a lot of people say test injections cause liver damage but... i don't see any real evidence of that. my blood work sure doesn't show it. mdrol? oh yeah. my liver went swiss cheese on me. my doctor even tried to refer me to a nutritionist lol.
anyway... any AAS in a pill is hard on the liver, dbol, winnie and var included so its not just the "designer" stuff.
SO from the original post, the study is stating that use of anabolic steroids will cause cholestasis. this is pretty significant liver damage which inhibits the flow of bile from the liver. one of the sides is darkened urine... which is a side effect of tren, but i've heard some differing opinions of that causing liver damage. I guess this begs the question, WHICH anabolic steroid is this study referring to? the generalization causes a fair bit of confusion. I would say that it's incorrect to assume ALL AAS causes this problem.. but i'm not a doctor. i'm just some guy on the internet.
just to add a little side note here... i'm 195 right now during a bulk phase. I've never been able to gain muscle after 170 without help. the more i eat the heavier i lift the fatter i get. i get strong, sure... but no real muscle volume to speak of. tried every kind of training to change this but to no avail. 170 i'm ripped and veiny, 195 i look like a thick guy who eats to much five guys. when i use any sort of juice i instantly gain 10-15 lbs only to lose it if i don't redo it again within 3-4 months.
02-02-2011, 12:02 PM
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