Test sust

[standoe3]

got my hands on two 10ml vials of test sus plan on a e3d cycle for two months for my first cycle.
Background:

3500 calories balanced diet
workout at least 6 hours a week
cardio consists of 4 hours kickboxing training

im 29, 210lbs, 5-8 around 20%bf (i know i need to drop) plan to lean up with more cardio the next month or two then start.

 

[Smiley]

What dose you plan on running. PCT plans?

 

[bLacKjAck.]

At 20% bodyfat you have no business anywhere near AAS in my opinion. At a decent bodyfat you would be somewhere around 170 lbs. Of course here at AM that is probably the average starting spot sadly...

Obviously this is my opinion, but I just don't see any reason in the world you would need AAS to accomplish anything you couldn't without it at this point. Save it for later, or sell it and use the extra money to buy some grass-fed beef

 

[standoe3]

well im drop down to 185 or 180 and start but yeah i get what your saying black jack with having so much fat on your body that you dont see the gains like you would at say 6%.

I got clomid on hand and from my previous ph cycle of tren and ah89 im going to use anabol ext to get the boys back in order. I did not have a shut down on my last ph cycle but i didnt get results i wanted. I had my bf checked with a pinch test its at 18% but I have the most deposits on my lower back and stomach.

Looking to run once a week at 2 ml=cc which is 500mg or
e3d at 1ml =cc 250mg to take advantage of the prop in it

My goal is to cut what i have now since im already 210-205 and if i gain well ill be happy with that too. My ideal body is to be a cut up 185 pounds and look like 210-215

I have been on creatine for the last 6 months im going to stop that and save it for pct
actually doing the math 20 percent of 200 is 40 lbs so 170 would be some where around 5 % bf that would be nice

 

[bLacKjAck.]

Its not even about seeing the gains dude...

Its about being to the point where AAS would do anything for you that couldn't be done almost as fast without them. Your bodyfat/weight to height ratio tells me there is absolutely non need.

Nothing against you dude, just think it would be a complete waste of your time and money.

 

[standoe3]

Well my point of view is I was 180 back in high school now to years later i have gained to 235 but fat now im down to 210-200. I starting to think blackjack you believe roids are only for the tall and skinny that eat a ton and dont gain anything.

up dated cycle info
im looking at 500mg per week with EOD shots for 8 weeks or i can get another vial and push it to 12weeks or get test prop and kick start my cycle with that

I see what your saying about being stuck in a rut and not growing naturally hench do a cycle approach. I think right now i am in a rut although i have recently switched my techniques to way better form now i did see a strength increase but no growth.

 

[standoe3]

**** the urge to do it was too much I thought about it in my head taking black jacks advise about getting the rip little body then boosting that image right, who doenst want to have the abs chest arms then go big with test .....but its not what im after im a novice muay thai fighter here in my town and well using is just going to step my game up

I just hit my first dose in the quad not bad didnt hurt at all used a # 19 portex and 1ml or 250 mg its all the same i really thought it would be harder than that. I can see why this can become so addicting.

im post my bench is 225 at 8-9 reps thats the third set after starting with a warm up isk what my cold lift would be but i also hit 90lbs. dumbell flat too about my 5 exercise about 9-10 times. cold i can get 100 lbs dumbells 5 reps max.... on the back row machine im put up 5 plates 6-8 reps each arm.. im 210 so i can do about 7-8 pull up in a row max..... wow cant wait to tell u guys the increases.... day one right now...

 

[bLacKjAck.]

Nope I believe AAS are for people who have actually accomplished something notable naturally first, thats all.

 

[standoe3]

ok well thanks for your input i would post a before pic but i know youll flame me for it. I could use your knowledge if something comes up tho. a friend recommende anabolics 101 and anabolic bible. idk they are called something like that gonna buy it later tonight.

 

[UnrealMachine]

i've never even heard of those books. If you're going to spend money on a book, get Seth Roberts' book Anabolic Pharmacology. I thought I knew a lot but just my first read/skim through the book has dramatically improved my understanding.

 

[bLacKjAck.]

i've never even heard of those books. If you're going to spend money on a book, get Seth Roberts' book Anabolic Pharmacology. I thought I knew a lot but just my first read/skim through the book has dramatically improved my understanding.

x2.

 

[jakellpet]

I recommend Neovar & LHJO, that'll gets you jacked!


GICH!

 

[MSE]

i've never even heard of those books. If you're going to spend money on a book, get Seth Roberts' book Anabolic Pharmacology. I thought I knew a lot but just my first read/skim through the book has dramatically improved my understanding.

Word, one of the best books out there....IF you fuc&in muscle heads can read!!! Hahaha

 

[rothyman]

well im drop down to 185 or 180 and start but yeah i get what your saying black jack with having so much fat on your body that you dont see the gains like you would at say 6%.

You're going to drop down to 180 or 185? So you're going to lose 30lbs give or take in like a month or something? And keep muscle?

I don't think you're speaking realistically here, nor do I think you're being realistic about AAS.

In the end you will do what you will, but as someone who just did a 9wk cycle of sustanon, I can tell you that it's probably better to start somewhere below 20% BF as opposed to at or above it.

What exactly are your goals here? I feel like you're taking sustanon just to take it.

And you know what, that's fine. I was guilty of that too.

But I did train for a long time and I was NOT 20% BF.

Just saying.. unless you want to be fat and strong, this is probably not the best thing to do ATM..

 

[standoe3]

fat and strong, i hear you...no well those out there at 6 % bf but to me 10% is perfect 15% is really good to me. I guess it all in the eye of the beholder, and your right im not use to body build seriously but to get stronger and do a **** load of cardio and not lose muscle in the process while getting to my 15-14 % body fat.

So far i have noticed an increase in intensity **** did 7 miles on the bike and 1.5 on the ELLIPITICAL. then did another 2 hours and the boxing gym, bagwork and jujitsu this **** got me on jacked mode. I LIKE IT!

I tracking my diet everyday on mypyrimdtrackerdot org, is a good tool to see balance diet. currently eating 2000-3000 calories but atleast 200 g protein and low carbs range from 100-200g.

Still lifting hard as a mofo cant wait to see my bench go from 225 @ 10 clean reps to ..... and my 90 lbs dumbell presses.....

 

[texastweeter]

so, your standards, as far as i can tell you think that since NFL linemen are usually fat, that they have no need to use aas. same thing with the SHW powerlifters. Not trying to flame, just trying to understand where your coming from. I know this kid is not either of the above, i just dont understand how you can say that someone at 20% bf has no business on aas. A lot of people on here are not bodybuilders, and are not that worried about bf%. Now if he had said he was taking gear to try to lean up thats a diffrent story, but i dont think he posted that, unless i missed it.

Nope I believe AAS are for people who have actually accomplished something notable naturally first, thats all.

 

[bLacKjAck.]

so, your standards, as far as i can tell you think that since NFL linemen are usually fat, that they have no need to use aas. same thing with the SHW powerlifters. Not trying to flame, just trying to understand where your coming from. I know this kid is not either of the above, i just dont understand how you can say that someone at 20% bf has no business on aas. A lot of people on here are not bodybuilders, and are not that worried about bf%. Now if he had said he was taking gear to try to lean up thats a diffrent story, but i dont think he posted that, unless i missed it.

I think you post just to try to find an argument, and your horrible at it. I think to everybody on here it is VERY obvious this guy is neither of those and I also think it is obvious that both of what you just listed have accomplished something naturally before they started juicing. I am not speaking to a forum full of competitive powerlifters or NFL football players. You said yourself "this kid is obviously neither of those" - ok? So why make a futile point, I am aware of the same.

Having several friends that PL and having been there myself, I understand the need for competition and preworkout drugs (cheque's, methyl-tren, halo, test susp). But if you knew anything about PL and aas usage you would know that PL's don't juice very heavy at all. Year round dosages are pretty mild for the most part, and competition its a lot of short acting esters to just lift a lot of weight. Thats way beside the point though....

Someone who has 20% bodyfat, doesn't have any business on AAS unless they are in a field where its needed. Want to know how many of those there are on this forum? Out of the lets say 30k, probably 10-15. I understand who I am talking to and I think my advice is very pertinent.

 

[standoe3]

this thread is getting off topic. Honestly if i was asking about what body fat % you should be before you get on AAS then so be argue away but getting back to the point...

I have be researching and the main debate in sust is the prop and taking advantage of it in a cycle. Now I see a trend of people saying take sust 1000, 750, 500 (more common), and 250 weekly. And Injection times of once, twice, three, daily.

So my theory is why not load up on it and taper off because during the first three weeks your body is going to only see the prop then about 3-4 weeks in the long ester drop...boom you have a good high level consistent of test.

so hows this cycle look
weeks
1.750mgs/ week total eod
2.750mgs/ "..."
3.750mgs/ "..."
Taper down
4.500mgs/ week total e3d
5."..."
6."..."
taperdown again
7 thru 10 weeks 250mgs week total e3d

If some one could do the math on the halflife and how test would be available per week would be great ...cuz im be honest i understand the jest of it just havent done the math...ie. 750ml= 60-70% test 40-30% esters do actually 750 in week one would be 525ml of test and divide that up into the 4 different test and halflife it. **** i might as well figure it out my self....

 

[timmmah]

Whats your PCT look like? Are you planning on running an AI?

 

[texastweeter]

Not trying to find an argument, but this goes into the same catagory as when i made a broad assumption on test dosage. I just do nt think that bf% is a good measure as to weather or not someone is ready to use aas. As far as the if i knew anything about pl's, I am a 9 year undefeated PL with 2 national records and 5 state records under my belt, I know my fair share. I think weather or not it is time for you to start taking aas has to do with hwere you are in relation to the field you compete in, and or your goals.

I think you post just to try to find an argument, and your horrible at it. I think to everybody on here it is VERY obvious this guy is neither of those and I also think it is obvious that both of what you just listed have accomplished something naturally before they started juicing. I am not speaking to a forum full of competitive powerlifters or NFL football players. You said yourself "this kid is obviously neither of those" - ok? So why make a futile point, I am aware of the same.

Having several friends that PL and having been there myself, I understand the need for competition and preworkout drugs (cheque's, methyl-tren, halo, test susp). But if you knew anything about PL and aas usage you would know that PL's don't juice very heavy at all. Year round dosages are pretty mild for the most part, and competition its a lot of short acting esters to just lift a lot of weight. Thats way beside the point though....

Someone who has 20% bodyfat, doesn't have any business on AAS unless they are in a field where its needed. Want to know how many of those there are on this forum? Out of the lets say 30k, probably 10-15. I understand who I am talking to and I think my advice is very pertinent.

 

[slacker86]

well im drop down to 185 or 180 and start but yeah i get what your saying black jack with having so much fat on your body that you dont see the gains like you would at say 6%.


My goal is to cut what i have now since im already 210-205 and if i gain well ill be happy with that too. My ideal body is to be a cut up 185 pounds and look like 210-215

I have been on creatine for the last 6 months im going to stop that and save it for pct
actually doing the math 20 percent of 200 is 40 lbs so 170 would be some where around 5 % bf that would be nice

Im just trying to understand this cause maybe im just reading this wrong and the debate going on right now is confusing me even more, (prob a good reason why i lose all my arguements). Ur trying to cut with Sust??? is this correct?

Secondly are u taking anything to lower the bloat?
and or are u injecting frequently during the week?
Thirdly how long is ur cycle that ur working out? i have seen 3ml a week to 2ml a week then u said eod, which one is it and how long are u running it for?

Just out of curiosity, if u are trying to run a cycle to cut why not use anavar?

its a pretty mild oral and is pretty good for cutting, i mean its not as good as stacking tren with ur test however thats not exactly a beginers cycle.

Whats PCT look like?
Whats ur diet look like?
And what does ur training consist of day to day?

Sorry for all the questions however without them answered it is nearly impossible to give u advice especially these last 3 questions.

 

[timmmah]

I recommend Neovar & LHJO, that'll gets you jacked!


GICH!

LHJO?

 

[standoe3]

I have a estro blocker from max muscle...otc.

I have liquid nolva on hand and im going to run natural test booster (anabol ext) from max muscle also during pct.
I am running 500mgs wk for 8 weeks but have enough to go 12 (if i get hcg..) 500mgs=2ml E3D tuesday/friday...
Diet 3000-3500cal day high protein low carbs
atleast 30min cardio every day
sun chest/tris
mon back/bis
tue abs/legs 1 hr cardio(real kickboxing class)
wed heavy cardio 2 hrs
thurs cardio 1/2hr
friday light chest/back/ arms
sat 1 hr kickboxing class

Yes im cutting with test...keep my strength wile cutting...im not intrested in other anabolics at this moment except for winny.

 

[sethroberts]

If you get my book, great. But even if you don't, please don't get the anabolic bible. It was a complete turd 15 years ago and hasn't changed.

 

[jakellpet]

*Note to self: Anabolic Bible has similarities to actual Bible*

 

[sethroberts]

*Note to self: Anabolic Bible has similarities to actual Bible*

No, the actual bible makes more sense

 

[standoe3]

yeah goggled it...saw that it sold out but that is a good thing, right?

 

[sethroberts]

yeah goggled it...saw that it sold out but that is a good thing, right?

What is sold out? the Bible?

 

[standoe3]

your book at nutraplanet but i think its in stock and meso...something website for 44.95.
So did my sceond injection yesterday in the quad muscle again the other leg tho, it hurt like a beotch but i can run through the pain i think i may have hit a nerve or tendon cuz it sore all the way to my knee from the pin hole. No swelling or redness just feel like someone punched my leg.

 

[sethroberts]

your book at nutraplanet but i think its in stock and meso...something website for 44.95.
So did my sceond injection yesterday in the quad muscle again the other leg tho, it hurt like a beotch but i can run through the pain i think i may have hit a nerve or tendon cuz it sore all the way to my knee from the pin hole. No swelling or redness just feel like someone punched my leg.

It is also available at ergo... something web site.

 

[standoe3]

so seth can you tell me how this cycle/diet looks

Goal:weight loss/retain muscle and develop cuts get 14-15%bf

Weight: 210 with 18-17%bodyfat

6 work out days weight trainning and cardio 6 days a week atleast 1/2 hour on bike.

3-4 days a week boxing gym 1 hr punching kicking sparring/jujitsu

calories:2000-2500 a day 210-bf(20%)=170 times 12calories per pound of lean muscle
protein: 170 times 1 gram = 170-200 grams of protein
carbs: low carbs...100-150 grams all before 3pm aafter that none

cycle: 250mgs sustanon twice weekly for 8 weeks
have estro blocker if needed might do hcg but hoping i dont have to...if I do take eod
pct:
clomid for pct or nolva (have nolva)...
Natural test booster anabol ext...

 

[standoe3]

anyone else please give your opinion

 

[bLacKjAck.]

I'll answer for seth. Your using gear to attempt to get in shape a little bit and lose some weight. Unnecesarry, wasteful, and just dumb. Seth may say it a little prettier, but thats the truth. Do it without using AAS, you won't notice much difference in your results.

Cmon dude, at least get in shape before you start juicing. Seriously.

 

[sethroberts]

so seth can you tell me how this cycle/diet looks

Goal:weight loss/retain muscle and develop cuts get 14-15%bf

Weight: 210 with 18-17%bodyfat

6 work out days weight trainning and cardio 6 days a week atleast 1/2 hour on bike.

3-4 days a week boxing gym 1 hr punching kicking sparring/jujitsu

calories:2000-2500 a day 210-bf(20%)=170 times 12calories per pound of lean muscle
protein: 170 times 1 gram = 170-200 grams of protein
carbs: low carbs...100-150 grams all before 3pm aafter that none

cycle: 250mgs sustanon twice weekly for 8 weeks
have estro blocker if needed might do hcg but hoping i dont have to...if I do take eod
pct:
clomid for pct or nolva (have nolva)...
Natural test booster anabol ext...

Looks pretty good to me. Similar to what I use for fat loss but I go a little lower on carbs all post workout except for high fiber carbs. My only criticism might be that you are a little on the light side for AAS. Just realized that you are 5'10" so probably not too light. The sust is not going to help you lose weight really but should help you retain muscle.

 

[sethroberts]

I'll answer for seth. Your using gear to attempt to get in shape a little bit and lose some weight. Unnecesarry, wasteful, and just dumb. Seth may say it a little prettier, but thats the truth. Do it without using AAS, you won't notice much difference in your results.

Cmon dude, at least get in shape before you start juicing. Seriously.

I might agree with you since it is only a few percent BF he is looking to lose -- could do that without AAS or muscle loss in a pretty short time but if he wanted to get sub 10% then he might need it to preserve muscle -- plus he is a little older so it can be a little harder to hold muscle while dieting.

 

[standoe3]

yes and yes.....my goal is obtainable but honestly I am shooting for 10% .....I like to set a reachable goal and succeed then to set the bar so high and fail you never try again, just my 2 cents. But thank you for both of your input...and blackjack your comments are just fuel for the fire....

 

[standoe3]

Looks pretty good to me. Similar to what I use for fat loss but I go a little lower on carbs all post workout except for high fiber carbs. My only criticism might be that you are a little on the light side for AAS. Just realized that you are 5'10" so probably not too light. The sust is not going to help you lose weight really but should help you retain muscle.[/QUOTE

so what about the test not allowing fat to store and helping fat out of storage on cycle...just bunk?

 

[sethroberts]

Looks pretty good to me. Similar to what I use for fat loss but I go a little lower on carbs all post workout except for high fiber carbs. My only criticism might be that you are a little on the light side for AAS. Just realized that you are 5'10" so probably not too light. The sust is not going to help you lose weight really but should help you retain muscle.[/QUOTE

so what about the test not allowing fat to store and helping fat out of storage on cycle...just bunk?

My opinion is that it is negligable with test.

 

[UnrealMachine]

so seth can you tell me how this cycle/diet looks

Goal:weight loss/retain muscle and develop cuts get 14-15%bf

Weight: 210 with 18-17%bodyfat

6 work out days weight trainning and cardio 6 days a week atleast 1/2 hour on bike.

3-4 days a week boxing gym 1 hr punching kicking sparring/jujitsu

calories:2000-2500 a day 210-bf(20%)=170 times 12calories per pound of lean muscle
protein: 170 times 1 gram = 170-200 grams of protein
carbs: low carbs...100-150 grams all before 3pm aafter that none

cycle: 250mgs sustanon twice weekly for 8 weeks
have estro blocker if needed might do hcg but hoping i dont have to...if I do take eod
pct:
clomid for pct or nolva (have nolva)...
Natural test booster anabol ext...

I think you should add at least 30g of protein more. 170 is really nothing, you should be over 200 everyday. When trying to lose weight I think you're better off eating more protein and less carbs and fat (to a certain extent of course). I like the idea of a breakdown thats like 50p/30f/20c where the carbs are all around the workout hopefully in the morning and the fat after that, protein in every meal obviously.

 

[standoe3]

just bought some froven halibut 40 grams of protein per serving....it kinds fun looking at nutrition label for everything I intend to eat...

 

[standoe3]

well im eating good fats like EFA and CLA.
well Im on my 2nd week of sustanon got some prop to kick start my cycle
I load dose the prop at 2ml of 100mg/ml
plan to run the prop every day at 75mg till i run out which by then the sustano should be kicking in.

Now my cycle looks like this
week
1- 500mgs sustanon "tues/250mgs-fri/250mgs"
2- 500mgs sustanon+350mgs prop 200mgs load/sun eod 75mgs
3- 500mgs sustanon+75mgs prop eod
4- 500mgs sustanon
5- 500mgs sustanon
6- 500mgs sustanon
7- 500mgs sustanon
8- 500mgs sustanon
might extend two more weeks see how i feel?

 

[jakellpet]

might extend two more weeks see how i feel?

is that a question or a statement? onder:

 

[standoe3]

both i kinda feel like the cycle might be too long?

 

[UnrealMachine]

Why would he eat 30%fat on a cut? I'd do something like 60% protein/ 30% carbs/ 10%fat ...yeah it would be very hard, but who said it was supposed to be easy?

Ideally on a cut you'd eat a lot more fat because you'd be on 0 carbs. Ketosis works for me, probably not for eveyrone though.

 

[texastweeter]

Ideally on a cut you'd eat a lot more fat because you'd be on 0 carbs. Ketosis works for me, probably not for eveyrone though.

I keep my carbs in the 50-60% range even on a cut. I have always responded well to higher ammounts of carbs though.right now Im eating around 4200kcals with 60% carbs to bulk. when i go oncycle ill bump that up to 5000kcals probably.

 

[UnrealMachine]

lol dude you and me don't have a lot in common! Besides liking higher doses in general haha. I get fat so quick on high carbs.... the last time I tried was my cycle last year kickstarted with SD. I was up 25 pounds during the 4th week, bloated like a whale.

 

[texastweeter]

but did you just bloat or did you put on fat? I still bloat sometimes, depending on other variables, but when the water and gas and stuff goes away, im a lot leaner than I thought.

 

[UnrealMachine]

Both really. Put on fat rapidly but i get bad water retention from the carbs as well. So fat increased dramatically but bodyweight skyrocketed with a lot of water retention. All muscle definition was gone.

 

[texastweeter]

I can think about sodium and gain 5lbs, but about once a month ill cut water weight to see where I'm really at to keep tabs on my physical appearance.

 

[standoe3]

Hey got a question about aspiration? When i aspirate it very hard to pull back on syringe #19 1" and when i do its like a vacume pulling the bumper back and tiny bubbles seep in between the needle and syringe (two Piece) so is that normal?

And does any body re use the syringe? not the needle i know that, but on a two piece like a lock syringe? when i did i think it hurts more idk maybe im crazy?