People who maintain below 10%
- 11-07-2007, 02:16 PM
People who maintain below 10%
What diet do you guys find most effective for getting below 10% and holding that bodyfat? The reason I ask people who are at 10 or below is that i believe almost any diet can get you to lean up if you are 12+ % bodyfat.. getting below that point seems to be fairly hard for most (including myself)
- 11-07-2007, 09:03 PM
i find that the CKD or some variation works well for getting below 10%.
i've had good success with keeping a low carb diet with a carb load/refeed day once or twice per week - depending on how i feel.
- 11-08-2007, 08:47 AM
My opinion on under 10% bf would be like Hank said, carb intake.
Then of course genetics, metabolism, cardio routine, etc.
11-08-2007, 08:53 AM
i am currently at 10% and trying to cut down to 7%.
i have found that TKD (carbs consumed only pre workout and a banana or fruit with post workout shake)
i have not really included carb up days yet...but i feel like 1 carb up day per week might help...or might not...still not sure.
i have also switched my cardio to after i lift right after i consume my post workout shake...HIIT for about 15-20...mod. intensity for 15-20 4x per week...seems to be working well
11-08-2007, 10:26 AM
11-08-2007, 10:37 AM
i cant even eat a real meal without carbs.....Carbs are a must. I dont know how people eat certain foods without a staple carb to eat with it...
11-08-2007, 10:50 AM
11-08-2007, 11:31 AM
11-08-2007, 11:40 AM
There is a serious misconceptrion that you need to restrict carbs from your diet to get to single digit bf. Plenty of guys (look at sporto, Layne Norton, Beast) are less than 10% and eat more carbs in one meal than I eat all day.
It is about metabolism and set point. Some people have lower set points than others. Restricting carbs is not the magic bullet.
11-08-2007, 11:48 AM
11-08-2007, 12:01 PM
11-08-2007, 12:05 PM
11-08-2007, 12:07 PM
11-08-2007, 12:10 PM
2.slowly lowering cals and carbs
3.give yourself enough time to meet your goals
4.cardio on a regular basis
11-08-2007, 12:14 PM
For me the desired discipline to be below my set point often expires before I achieve it. I believe I could get there (again, I teetered at 9-10% for a few minutes one summer), but a 42yo endo is going to need a greater cost to benefit ratio than because I can.
11-08-2007, 12:33 PM
11-08-2007, 12:37 PM
good points made above.
seems to me that diet is really trial and error to find what works best for you and your body type.
as stated, some like sporto can keep carbs high and get sub 10%.
however, i believe that most are not so genetically gifted, and for them this method will not be as effective.
i know for me personally, when i keep carb intake higher and just reduce total calories in a cut i lose a lot of muscle and still hang on to the bodyfat.
on a ckd type diet i seem better able to retain muscle and lose the stubborn fat needed to drop below 10%.
btw. those refeed days do help you from going crazy!
11-08-2007, 03:26 PM
Not sure if I'm below 10% or not, but 3 things changed the most when I seemed to recomp better this summer and somewhat hold on to it:
1. big conscious effort to reduce stress in every aspect of my life
2. i did more cardio
3. I added in more fiber in the form of fiber cereal
My diet has somewhat been the same. I honestly have no food plan/log still. I just try to eat smart. I know, I know - bad boy. I used to keep a diet log...but it's stressful, lol. I need to get a lot of other things in my life straightened out before I do a food log again.
11-08-2007, 05:57 PM
I am planing to try a low carb diet soon.. I have always used a moderate carb/low fat approach, but think i am going to give "the anabolic diet" a try.
I have never really tried a low carb diet, so i am pretty interested too see how my body will react to it.
11-08-2007, 10:04 PM
i have fluctuated from 6%-9% the past two years, depending on the goal (a little higher if i am trying to put on mass, lower if I am cutting down obviously) however, i dont claim to be "big" or anything, as I am 6'1 at 180
what i have done to stay at that - i havent gone "low" carb, i just eat sensibly. ive tried keto, CKD, TKD, the cut diet, etc etc. and what i found what works best for me is a combination, and i usually get to about 150-200g of carbs before the bloat sets in, so i try to keep it under that, depending on my training intensity for the day.
i usually have cheat meat w/the GF when we go out to dinner (but it is still a healthy cheat)
cardio everyday, training 5 days out of 7, etc.
11-08-2007, 10:48 PM
11-09-2007, 07:02 AM
11-09-2007, 07:03 AM
11-09-2007, 07:56 AM
11-09-2007, 08:32 AM
11-09-2007, 08:37 AM
well what good is weighing 165lb if i don't have a cut stomach yet. i want to reach that 7% mark, then bulk up. i'm strong for my size, so gaining muscle mass has never been hard for me. i place myself in the ecto category cause it seems to fit best
11-09-2007, 08:43 AM
BUt you risk falling into the clasic skinny fat guy when you do things like that. Far too long under your setpoint and you get catabolic and your body will fight tooth and nail to keep the fat and relinquish the LBM. You would do well to learn methods that are less catabolic than startvation. LBM is thermogenic.
11-09-2007, 08:45 AM
You also mention "working harder". THAT'S a HUGE misconception. It's not about how hard your work, it's about how RIGHT you work. It's too often I'll hear someone complaining about how they spend so many hours in the gym (per day) and have nothing to show for it. They might be working harder, but they're not working "right" and they're paying the consequences for it.
11-09-2007, 08:59 AM
I think this also has to do with increasing "acceptable" calorie ranges/ratios. What I mean by acceptable is this:
Two people eat 6 meals per day, but have different maintenance levels.
Dude #1: 3600 kcal/day
Dude #2: 2400 kcal/day (these are divisible by 6 for convenience's sake)
If either dude slips, and has a candy bar after lunch, there's a different caloric ratio involved. We'll say it's a 180kcal Snicker's bar.
For Dude #1, that's 5% above daily quota, and 30% above average mealtime intake.
For Dude #2, that's 7.5% above daily quota, and 45% above average mealtime intake.
Comparing the two dudes, we see that having a little slip up is 1/3 less significant for Dude #1 than it was for Dude#2.
11-09-2007, 09:35 AM
I know the whole train smarter not harder methodology. That doesn't mean smart is easier, which is how you are conveying that notion. Smarter is also subjective. Is it smarter for you to learn about proper nutrition which will take alot longer to achieve your goals, or is it smarter for you to take shortcuts. Is faster smarter? Very subjective... but I do know doing something correctly requires discipline and hardwork, and there is no "smart" way around that.
11-09-2007, 09:49 AM
Genetically, life deals us all a different hand, but it is the commitment and hard-work that leads to success in the areas where we are less gifted.
11-09-2007, 11:29 AM
One of my best friends stays at about 9-10% 200lbs, eats WHATEVER the hell he wants. Never has stuck to any regimented eating plan, Doesn't even eat all that much, his diet is mostly junkfood, with sporadic meals here and there.
Trains just as sporadicly, talks on his cell, talks to people in the gym. Doesn't keep any sort of log book, just goes in uses more or less the same weight everytime, with little to no progress there. Will miss training for weeks at a time.
NEVER does cardio.
And to take it even FURTHER.. I hear him ***** about his genetics to me, because his training partner, and another friend of ours who happens to be black, is like 240 8-9%, NEVER touched anything pro-hormone, or AAS wise. BUT he eats decent, still not great, but MUCH better, and trains like an animal. I always tell my boy, he could be that if he just got regimented about his diet/training.
SO IMO genetics play a big role, people with good genetics, can take a half assed approach and get the same, if not better results, then people with crap genetics busting their ass. OR the gifted person can put in the same amount of effort, and dedication, and far exceed the lesser person.
11-09-2007, 02:23 PM
Bingo. As with the original poster, getting down to 10-14% or thereabouts can be done with anything non-retarded, even with poor genetics (the very poor genetically gifted may have to work slightly harder, but such is life).
Getting below and maintaining beyond your genetically given setpoint has many variables to it and you need to find the best approach for you. Whether it's low carb/ iso caloric, high carb, etc...you need to find the right balance. There are several things physiologically that point you in the right direction on which approach is optimal, so if you pay attention to these, it can sharpen your learning curve.
IFPA Professional Bodybuilder
NASM Certified Personal Trainer
Scivation Sponsored Athlete
11-09-2007, 02:32 PM
I know that physiology plays a huge part in how we process nutrients as well as our setpoint. How have you and or others (Layne and his clients) been able to determine what is ideal nutrition for your phenotype?
I know there is some science behind phenotype dieting but am unsure, without the help of a physiologist, to determine my true physiology and or phenotype. I as surely an endo but (but who knows, may lean to meso somewhat too) but how does one know for sure?
Obviously starving myself or running myself to death on a treadmill is not the answer.
11-09-2007, 02:51 PM
There are some things just within our own bodies that sort of "point" to the right direction for us. For instance, there is a fairly strong correlation between the "endo" phenotype and those particular people having better mood and energy on low carb/ketogenic diets - obvisouly because of the role insulin is playing within their bodies. That, to me, is an obvious sign right there. There needs to be a low carb/ketogenic approach to their dieting methods for cutting/maintaining/bulking. Cutting would involve more refeeds (think CKD, TKD, etc...), maintaining and bulking might be something more along the lines of low carb or iso-caloric. The point being, that you would NOT put someone like this on moderate to high carb approach. They will feel like crap all the time, their energy levels will be a roller coaster with lots of crashes, and they will ultimately just end up quitting.
Take me for instance. I'm extremely insulin sensitive (obvisouly if you've seen my journal and saw how high my carbs were even 1 week out from contest). But, in years past I tried the low carb approach. I was downright miserable. Now? I'm a little lethargic at times just from low calories, but I have excellent mood and energy most of the time. That tells me I'm using the more optimal approach for my body. Incidentally, my body before was telling me to stop the low carb approach LOL
There is more than one way to skin a cat. With some trial and error, paying attention to your body, and some basic common sense, you'll be able to quickly see what route to start with (and then tweak beyond that) to make things optimal for you and whatever your goals are.
Hope this helps...
IFPA Professional Bodybuilder
NASM Certified Personal Trainer
Scivation Sponsored Athlete
11-09-2007, 03:03 PM
11-09-2007, 03:24 PM
11-09-2007, 05:35 PM
I have always used a low fat, moderate carb, moderate protein diet when cutting weight.. I am going to try CKD style diet for a few weeks and see how i feel on that, then make a decision on what is better for me. I always feel decent on the moderate carb diet, but strength losses start to be a problem.
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