[gten79]

Le Magazine February 2007 - On The Cover: Eating Your Way To Prostate CancerLe Magazine February 2007 - On The Cover: Eating Your Way To Prostate Cancer

[sfearl1]

Originally Posted by gten79

Le Magazine February 2007 - On The Cover: Eating Your Way To Prostate CancerLe Magazine February 2007 - On The Cover: Eating Your Way To Prostate Cancer

damnit! just before bulk x factor is supposed to be released this sh!t gets discovered! i wanted to try it too, oh well.

might get some more input if this is moved to the supplement forum btw.

[fitnecise]

That is long term, the purpose of X-factor is to temporarily shift your body into higher inflammation and the potential for increased protein synthesis by maximizing availability of intermediates in the process. Of course long term this is a bad idea, nobody disputes that. That is why MN recommends a 50 day cycle with at least an equal period in between before another one.

[RenegadeRows]

I'll be happier not even risking it

[ReaperX]

Yeah I agree. X-Factor says cut out healthy fats like fish oil. Hm, yeah GREAT idea. A pro-inflammatory is not good for the body. People take medication to get rid of the inflammation, not make it worse.

[fitnecise]

Originally Posted by ReaperX

Yeah I agree. X-Factor says cut out healthy fats like fish oil. Hm, yeah GREAT idea. A pro-inflammatory is not good for the body. People take medication to get rid of the inflammation, not make it worse.

MN doesn't say cut the healthy fats. From what i've read it seems AA uptake is much preferable to other fatty acids in general, anyway.

Inflammation is what makes the body grow and adapt. That starts with contraction induced ROS production which partially mediates intracellular calcium, and depending on the activity will determine the amount which leads to fiber conversion. PGF2alpha mediates the activation of one of the NFAT isoforms by increasing intracellular calcium further. This cascades to eventually myotube fusion & muscle growth.

People take medication because they are doing something else wrong in their lifes, whether it be nutrition, lack of activity, or are exposed to some unnatural environment.

I would agree with you that it is a bad idea to take X-factor if you lack a fat balance and fruits/veg. But a temporary cycle of x-factor should push you into a slightly more anabolic state and it is very highly unlikely to cause any health problems at the dose MN suggests.

That being said, I have never taken it and do not plan to, just outlining some of the basic physiology for you.

[jjohn]

Originally Posted by ReaperX

Yeah I agree. X-Factor says cut out healthy fats like fish oil. Hm, yeah GREAT idea. A pro-inflammatory is not good for the body. People take medication to get rid of the inflammation, not make it worse.

Please be careful now. AA is found high in unhealthy people. BUT, it doesn't mean it's bad. In fact, XF has been proven to reduce IL-6 which proves that inflammation is actually lowered while supplementing. Fish oils act via different pathways, and we are investigating the proper amount to be taken with it.

And inflammation is a good thing by the way. Take 10 aspirins a day, and you won't build any muscle I guarantee you!

[fitnecise]

Originally Posted by jjohn

In fact, XF has been proven to reduce IL-6 which proves that inflammation is actually lowered while supplementing.

Well it isn't that simple, IL-6's inflammatory effects are from its role in energy homeostasis, it signals from the muscle to liver to break down glycogen and mediates other processes like lipid oxidation ... so lowering it would especially be beneficial to endurance athletes because it is directly linked to fatigue

[ReaperX]

Last time I read X-Factor's usage it said something along the lines of reducing omega-3 fatty acids.

I don't doubt this and it would make sense because if you are taking X-Factor then omega-3 fatty acids (anti-inflammatory) would negate the benefits. Simple enough.

I don't know HOW MUCH inflammation X-Factor causes and what extent it does specifically to the body. I've read MN's write up, but I've also ready about other articles involving omega-6 fatty acids too.

I'm not making a judgement call, I'm just trying to reason through what I understand.

[SelfKnowledge]

"Figure 1 clearly demonstrates how consuming a diet of foods rich in arachidonic acid directly provokes the production of the dangerous 5-LOX enzyme, which can promote the progression of prostate cancer. In addition to 5-HETE, 5-LOX also metabolizes arachidonic acid to leukotriene B4, a potent pro-inflammatory agent that causes destructive reactions throughout the body and inflicts severe damage to the arterial wall.41-47"

Well...I'm going on my third week of x-factor. Someone please guarantee me that 50 days on this stuff wont be that harmful...

JJohn....you're my only hope....tell them they're wrong and my prostate wont explode in 50 days...

[w_llewellyn]

This article is quite interesting and fairly well researched, but not a new discovery. We've understood for a while that AA excess, being the potent growth promoter that it is, is not advised if you have cancer. If you read the article carefully it is discussing the role AA plays in promoting the growth of cancer cells...not causing cancer. This is along the same lines of how androgens can promote the growth of prostate cancer cells, estrogens breast cancer cells, and GH/IGF-1 many other types of cancer cells. We don't believe the use of these hormones causes cancer, but they mitigate cell growth that cancer cells can use to grow at a faster pace. AA is not listed as a cause of cancer, and even after a long period of investigation was not shown to be a carcinogen. Still, it would not be advised to shift your fatty acid balance in any major way for long periods of time. I think the take home message of this article is similar to others - if you have cancer, you need to avoid taking agents that can support cell growth.

Remember as well, X-Factor is recommended to heatlhy resistance trained individuals, not a sick sednetary populatiuon. All of the study data thus far shows no signs of "AA excess" in this group. By this I mean no issues with platelett aggregation changes, immune system functioning, IL-6 levels etc., which would be expected of an "AA Excess" issue as described here.

[w_llewellyn]

I will add that there have been a couple of very large studies looking at tens of thousands of people, their intakes of AA, and their rates of cancer. AA intake was shown to be unrelated to the incidence of cancer in these studies. For those subjects that did happen to get cancer, however, those with higher intakes of AA noticed a faster progression of the disease. Again, this data is in line with AA not being a cause of cancer, but being a potent growth promoting agent that you should not take if you have it.

[Rodja]

Lets look at this logically (Reaper pay attention)-

Reducing Omega 3 for 50-60 days is not going to have life altering effects and supplementing with AA for the same time is not going to give you prostate cancer. Cancer is not an overnight mutation, just like any other alteration in someone. I can guarantee that everyone on this board has gone longer than 60 days w/o significant Omega 3 supplementation/ingestion.

Also, think of it in the same terms as fat gain. You will not gain a significant amount of adipose tissue if your diet becomes terrible, but if you continue to eat 2-3x your maintenance kcals for a very long time, then a fat gain will be substantial.

Oral steroids can effect the liver negatively, but, unless you are taking a moronic amount, one 60 day cycle is not going to give you hepatic cancer.

[SelfKnowledge]

Originally Posted by Rodja

Lets look at this logically (Reaper pay attention)-

Reducing Omega 3 for 50-60 days is not going to have life altering effects and supplementing with AA for the same time is not going to give you prostate cancer. Cancer is not an overnight mutation, just like any other alteration in someone. I can guarantee that everyone on this board has gone longer than 60 days w/o significant Omega 3 supplementation/ingestion.

Also, think of it in the same terms as fat gain. You will not gain a significant amount of adipose tissue if your diet becomes terrible, but if you continue to eat 2-3x your maintenance kcals for a very long time, then a fat gain will be substantial.

Oral steroids can effect the liver negatively, but, unless you are taking a moronic amount, one 60 day cycle is not going to give you hepatic cancer.

So would it be safe to do a continuous 50 day ON of x-factor and 50 days off of x-factor for the rest of your life? or would this really have an effect? Is x-factor meant for only 1 or 2 cycles? What is the limit?

I'm just wondering how many times this can be cycled before it will start effecting something....or not effecting anything at all if cycled? I think these are all questions that need to be met. But again...I have heard this before when I researched x-factor countless times before I even considered the product: "x-factor does NOT cause cancer, but it may worsen it" (due to obvious inflammatory issues, which is no surprise to me).

I believe the 50 day cycle is in fact safe...but can we continue to cycle on and off x-factor for long periods of times without issues?

[jjohn]

Originally Posted by SelfKnowledge

So would it be safe to do a continuous 50 day ON of x-factor and 50 days off of x-factor for the rest of your life? or would this really have an effect? Is x-factor meant for only 1 or 2 cycles? What is the limit?

I'm just wondering how many times this can be cycled before it will start effecting something....or not effecting anything at all if cycled? I think these are all questions that need to be met. But again...I have heard this before when I researched x-factor countless times before I even considered the product: "x-factor does NOT cause cancer, but it may worsen it" (due to obvious inflammatory issues, which is no surprise to me).

I believe the 50 day cycle is in fact safe...but can we continue to cycle on and off x-factor for long periods of times without issues?

If you do not have cancer, AA will not cause it. This is like saying if you put gasoline in a bucket without a spark. There will be no fire...

So it is indeed safe and IMO there are no limits, as long as you take your 50 day break as stated on the product.

Enjoy!