[jvb20]

ok when on a cycle what is a good amount of protien to take in post workout.. i have been taking in about 65-70 grams post workout is this to much or to little

[jvb20]

wow anyone at all

[mmowry]

Well Ive always been a believer that if you dont have enough you miss an opportunity for the most muscle growth and if you have too much it just gets turned into fuel to help repair the muscle anyhow.

From all Ive read PreWO is more important.I myself take 75gm pro/75gm carb shake 1/2hr or more before WO and take in 50gm pro post WO.Good luck!

[jvb20]

k thanks bro

[motiv8er]

And to kindly point out, you posted this in the steriod section. try nutrition next time. Unless thats some new methyl whey I havent heard of yet.

But seriously, you will be given more consideration when you post the right questions in the right sections. Thanks--

[Tom 185]

pre-workout- 4:1 carbohydrate to protein ratio
post-workout- 3:1 carbohydrate to protein ratio

remember this is the time of the day when you can be using high GI carbs which will be converted to energy and restoring glycogen

these are based on studies done by my exercise physiology and advanced nutrition professors in college

no matter how big you are your body will not be able to absorb that much protein and it will most-likely store as fat

if you take in too much protein pre-workout, then your body will use it as a source for energy, which certainly is not optimal

[jminis]

I usually have of preWO shake with about 25g/whey and 10g casein and 80g carbs. Then sip on a shake throughout my workout. PWO I eat a meal about 30min after I'm done.

[jvb20]

i figured it went here cause the question has to do with being on a cycle and how much protien you can asourb....

[jvb20]

thanks i guess i have my post workout protien set... just need to work on pre workout did not know it was more important thanks for pointing that out

[AnonyMoose]

Originally Posted by jvb20

i figured it went here cause the question has to do with being on a cycle and how much protien you can asourb....

i have read in the past 35 grams every three hours. i cannot substantiate this with a reference however.

[alan aragon]

Originally Posted by Tom 185

pre-workout- 4:1 carbohydrate to protein ratio
post-workout- 3:1 carbohydrate to protein ratio

these are based on studies done by my exercise physiology and advanced nutrition professors in college

I went to college too. None of my professors had an interest nor a basic working knowledge of bodybuilding nutrition. None of my profs were bodybuilders. I'm willing to bet my ass your profs mirror mine. Profs are not the best source of bodybuilding nutrition information, bro..

Original poster: AAS actually makes your system more efficient at using protein for growth. This means that you can actually use less. I personally wouldn't mess with the guidelines that have worked in my personal practice. Here's the math for you (or anyone else) who might be interested:

60-90 minutes preworkout, have a solid, balanced meal:

Protein = 0.25g/lb TBW
Carbs = 0.25g/lb TBW
Adding fat at this point is fine, use your discretion as long as it fits into your macro goals.

30-0 minutes preworkout - (and/or sipped throughout the workout), have a liquid or easily digested meal:

Protein = 0.25g/lb TBW
Carbs = 0.25g/lb TBW
Fat should be minimized here. Guidelines aren't hard & fast, but I personally wouldn't exceed 20% of the cals of this meal, in other words, keep the fats here incidental, not added.

Sooner the better postworkout - within 30 minutes, but optimally ASAP, have either a liquid or solid meal:

Protein = 0.25g/lb TBW
Carbs = 0.5g/lb TBW
Fats here should be kept minimal to moderate.
I personally start on this shake 60 minutes into my weight workouts, which take 80-90 minutes.

Post-postworkout is simply your next sheduled meal, whether it's 1, 2, or 3 hrs later simply doesn't matter - especially if your immediate postworkout meal (which may be split up into 2 halves) was designed as above.

NOTE: The small differences are mainly geared toward simplifying the guidelines. The rest of the recommendations about food types are pretty much the same. Also note that I no longer give a damn about GI, it doesn't really make a difference one way or another. If you want high GI carbs pre and/or during training, go for it. As time has passed, GI has proven itself to be an irrelevant index. Insulinogenesis is a separate issue, and striving to keep insulin up during & postworkout is a great idea. This is accomplished by both food type & food amount, the latter being more important. There's obviously a lot more to this, but that's the important basics. The rest is fringe.

[Tom 185]

Originally Posted by alan aragon

I went to college too. None of my professors had an interest nor a basic working knowledge of bodybuilding nutrition. None of my profs were bodybuilders. I'm willing to bet my ass your profs mirror mine. Profs are not the best source of bodybuilding nutrition information, bro..

Original poster: anabolic steroids actually makes your system more efficient at using protein for growth. This means that you can actually use less. I personally wouldn't mess with the guidelines that have worked in my personal practice. Here's the math for you (or anyone else) who might be interested:

60-90 minutes preworkout, have a solid, balanced meal:

Protein = 0.25g/lb TBW
Carbs = 0.25g/lb TBW
Adding fat at this point is fine, use your discretion as long as it fits into your macro goals.

30-0 minutes preworkout - (and/or sipped throughout the workout), have a liquid or easily digested meal:

Protein = 0.25g/lb TBW
Carbs = 0.25g/lb TBW
Fat should be minimized here. Guidelines aren't hard & fast, but I personally wouldn't exceed 20% of the cals of this meal, in other words, keep the fats here incidental, not added.

Sooner the better postworkout - within 30 minutes, but optimally ASAP, have either a liquid or solid meal:

Protein = 0.25g/lb TBW
Carbs = 0.5g/lb TBW
Fats here should be kept minimal to moderate.
I personally start on this shake 60 minutes into my weight workouts, which take 80-90 minutes.

Post-postworkout is simply your next sheduled meal, whether it's 1, 2, or 3 hrs later simply doesn't matter - especially if your immediate postworkout meal (which may be split up into 2 halves) was designed as above.

NOTE: The small differences are mainly geared toward simplifying the guidelines. The rest of the recommendations about food types are pretty much the same. Also note that I no longer give a damn about GI, it doesn't really make a difference one way or another. If you want high GI carbs pre and/or during training, go for it. As time has passed, GI has proven itself to be an irrelevant index. Insulinogenesis is a separate issue, and striving to keep insulin up during & postworkout is a great idea. This is accomplished by both food type & food amount, the latter being more important. There's obviously a lot more to this, but that's the important basics. The rest is fringe.

These are 2 guys that have mulitple master's degrees..they back all of their stuff up with science..everything makes great sense and we've done several tests in exercise physiology labs. Metabolic Adaptation has a great post-workout drink that uses the 3:1 theory..they have nothing to do with my professors..GL is superior to GI yes...i still have many disagreements with what you are saying but to each his own..here is an attachment to one of my professors notepages..its not filled in completely..

[alan aragon]

Originally Posted by Tom 185

These are 2 guys that have mulitple master's degrees..they back all of their stuff up with science..everything makes great sense and we've done several tests in exercise physiology labs. Metabolic Adaptation has a great post-workout drink that uses the 3:1 theory..they have nothing to do with my professors..GL is superior to GI yes...i still have many disagreements with what you are saying but to each his own..here is an attachment to one of my professors notepages..its not filled in completely..

Those guidelines are clearly not focused bodybuilding. And by the way, I don't care that they have "multiple masters degrees", I have students & clients who have MD's & PhD's.

This discussion will be interesting, I hope everyone enjoys watching it. Get you popcorn out, folks

[Tom 185]

Originally Posted by alan aragon

Those guidelines are clearly not focused bodybuilding. And by the way, I don't care that they have "multiple masters degrees", I have students & clients who have MD's & PhD's.

This discussion will be interesting, I hope everyone enjoys watching it. Get you popcorn out, folks

haha alright well we can agree to disagree. they both have phD's as well

[alan aragon]

Originally Posted by Tom 185

haha alright well we can agree to disagree. they both have phD's as well

Goddammit Tom, you didn't even give me a chance to mutilate that file you attached

[Tom 185]

hahaha

[rampage jackson]

Not to break up this love fest...but Alan: does Tbw= Total Body Weight, or Target Body Weight?