NEED tips FOr Nutrition ANd SUpplements
- 08-10-2006, 07:32 PM
NEED tips FOr Nutrition ANd SUpplements
Hi i am new to this forum. Im 16 and have been working out for a year now. I have just started taking anator-p70 for the past 3 weeks I havent seen really any improvment. Can any one help me how to eat and suggest any supplements that will make me bigger but wont hurt me too bad.
- 08-10-2006, 07:36 PM
This is possibly the most loaded question I have seen in my time here..lol..Yet, i digress. You have not given us any information about yourself, only that you are 16, and are taking Anator P-70 (which is horribly overpriced). If you want answers, you need to be more specifc as in:
etc., so that we can give you an informed opinion. However, the question you asked is basically stating you wish to be spoon fed, which I am afraid no one here will do for you. Search the Nutrition/Training forums, there is a wealth of information there, and do not be discouraged easily. What you want to know is not going to be contained soley on this site, or in one thread, one post. It is upto you to read as much as you can and combine everything you read.
- 08-10-2006, 07:49 PM
OK - here is a non-answer. Read and research; here and elsewhere. I would suggest you spend the lion's share of your time (at first) learning all that you can about diet. Timing, amount, macronutrients, etc.
Eat and then eat more (if you want to increase mass). Supplements can help in certain instances, but until you know what you want to accomplish - one thing is for sure: Supplements will work best at emptying your wallet.
Reading is free (or relatively cheap).
You'll find that there is NO substitute for hard work and a clean diet.
08-10-2006, 07:58 PM
my height is 5,10
weight is 135 pounds
My work out routine is mostly upper body I start with 30pound dung bells and do curls i do 20 reps and 2 sets. Then i go to 35 pound and do 15 reps and 1 set.
Then i do bench press i start out with 95 pounds and do 25 reps and 1 set. when im done with that i do 135 pounds and do 10 reps and do 2 sets of those. after that i go back to my arms and do my triceps. I forgot what the machine is called but thier is a rope with two balls and you pull all the way down and once you reach your waist you pull the balls out. well any ways i do 50 pounds 30 reps 2 sets and then 70 pounds 10rep 2 set. Then i get on millatry bench press i do about 60 pounds 20 reps and 1 set and then 70 pounds 12 reps and 2 sets. I try to eat high protien things like steak chicken,fish, eggs, whey protien shakes. i usally have about one of those a day.. Then i try to eat alot of fruits like peaches, bannanas, apples etc.... And thats all i do.
08-10-2006, 08:05 PM
I have been trying to pig out on every thing i see but when i take anator i cant eat anything it depresses my appitet it makes me drink like a gallon of water and when i try to force my self to eat i fell like im going to puke.
08-10-2006, 08:07 PM
Read my pics thread if you think you can't gain muscle without supplements.
I was at your weight and am at 170 lbs. now (well - some supps in the last few years...)
Concentrate on the nutrition forums. Save your money on supps for when you get old - like me.
Dude - STAY AWAY from MuscleTech. It's bullsh*t.
08-10-2006, 08:17 PM
if you want a good book buy championship bodybuidling by Chris Aceto. It talks all about the basics.
read as much as possible. you will be surprised at how much you learn in such a short amount of time. concentrate on the stickies in the diet and training forums.
Use fitday.com to track your calories, you're going to need to know how much you need to eat to grow. My last bulk I gained 24lbs in 20 weeks. I spent most of my money on food, I didn't have money to buy supplements with all the food I was eating (about 3500-4000 cals per day).
It takes hard work, but if you're serious then best of luck to you brother. Any questions don't be afraid to ask.
08-10-2006, 08:54 PM
Hey friend. Welcome.Originally Posted by surfnskate98
Please take the advice that the fellas have given you and start with the basics.
What we would give to be in your shoes. At 16, you already have higher testosterone levels than us. Your need for supplementation is minimal in comparison to ours. All you have to do is aquire the knowledge and TRAIN HARD.
Anyways, I just wanted to let you know that the amount of reps and sets that you are doing will definetely make you stronger however, if your goal is to gain size, than you are gonna have to change some things around. Basically, you need to lower the reps.... BIG TIME.
When you do end up researching, please look up myofibrillar hypertrophy and sacoplasmic hypertrophy. These are the two ways that your muscles develop and it completely depends on the way that you workout.
Good luck and keep us posted.
08-10-2006, 09:07 PM
08-11-2006, 07:51 PM
I was thinking about getting no xplode, nitrix, and cell mass what do you think of these products instead of that crappy anator p-70.
08-11-2006, 07:54 PM
I think they'd be a waste of money tbh. Forget about supplements for now and focus on getting your diet in check.
08-11-2006, 08:00 PM
Originally Posted by surfnskate98
None of those products work. You are like every other teen out there that listens to other teens that think they know what they are doing when they don't. Fact is with your test levels where they're at, your GH levels constantly going wild and your ravaging appetite you can grow quite abit in the next 2 years. I'd say you'll attain ATLEAST a 20 pound gain and with a good diet and training you should do that pretty quickly. Carbohydrates are you friend, protein is for muscle, fat is good. Macro Breakdown of 40/40/20. You'll figure that out eventually. Carbs, Protein, Fat 40/40/20.
All of those supplements are garbage. I was in the store the other day and a kid walked in and said "Hey where can I get some of that No-Xplode my friends talk about all the time" Then he commenced to check out buy it and talk about how all his friends take it and how he's gonna get hyooooooooge. Yeah okay. Another thing. At 15-20 reps you won't grow. You'll get endurance and strength but you'll never grow.
Look up Max- OT workouts. It will give you an idea and there are many many other training routines but I figured Max-OT would be the simplest. Good Luck.
08-11-2006, 08:03 PM
Ive worked out a year straight with no supps and had a good diet and havent gotten that muscular (with viens popping out of my arms) but on the other hand my friends do the same exact workout as i do and they take supps and they are way bigger than me now and they are have been working out now for only 7 months and i have been working out for like a year in half.
08-11-2006, 08:08 PM
Visible veins is a clear sign you're not eating enough, up your calorie intake with whole foods and healthy fats. Whole carbs=Oats, pasta, rice, bread. Whole proteins=chicken, fish, beef, eggs. Healthy fats=olive oil, flaxseed oil, fish oil.Originally Posted by surfnskate98
08-11-2006, 08:09 PM
Originally Posted by surfnskate98
It's probably their diet and they may not work out at the same high-rep range.
Why All Muscle Is Not Created Equal | Joe DeFranco
Sarcoplasmic Hypertrophy <---- Your Current Problem
Sarcoplasmic hypertrophy is an increase in the volume of the non-contractile muscle cell fluid, sarcoplasm. This fluid accounts for 25-30% of the muscle’s size. Although the cross sectional area of the muscle increases, the density of muscle fibers per unit area decreases, and there is no increase in muscular strength (2). This type of hypertrophy is mainly a result of high rep, “bodybuilder-type” training (3).
One of the biggest problems I see with the training of power athletes (football players, baseball players, basketball players, wrestlers and even powerlifters) is too much emphasis on training in the 10 – 15 rep range. This type of training has its place, yet should not be the focal point for these athletes. For example, most football lineman benefit from added bulk to prevent from getting pushed around on the field. “Bodybuilding” methods, using these rep ranges, can be beneficial if incorporated during the season to prevent muscle mass loss, as well as after the season to add bulk, which may have been lost during the season. Also, there is some scientific evidence that states a bigger muscle may have a better chance of becoming a stronger muscle once maximal strength training methods are employed. The key to remember is that this type of hypertrophy has little to do with such explosive movements as hitting, running, throwing, jumping or performing a one-rep max. This is why professional bodybuilders, whose training mainly hypertrophies the Type IIA fibers and causes an increase in the non-contractile components of the muscle (sarcoplasmic volume, capillary density, and mitochondria proliferation) are not the fastest or even the strongest of all athletes. This is despite the fact that they generally have more muscle than any other class of athlete! I consider this type of hypertrophy to be form over function.
Myofibrillar Hypertrophy <---- The Solution
Myofibrillar hypertrophy, on the other hand, is an enlargement of the muscle fiber as it gains more myofibrils, which contract and generate tension in the muscle. With this type of hypertrophy, the area density of myofibrils increases and there is a significantly greater ability to exert muscular strength (2). This type of hypertrophy is best accomplished by training with heavy weights for low reps (3). One must remember that the average football play lasts 4.5 seconds, it takes about 3 seconds to complete a 1 RM, it takes less than a second to swing a bat, less than a second to throw a punch and less than a second to jump for a rebound. As you can see, most athletic activities are explosive in nature. This is why it is imperative for athletes to incorporate maximal strength training methods (1-5 reps), which train the part of the muscle responsible for these explosive contractions, into their routines. Repetitions in the 1-5 rep range, using 85 – 100% of a 1RM, also have the added benefit of training the nervous system – which I feel is the most overlooked component of training the athlete. Some of the many benefits of training the nervous system are: increased neural drive to the muscle, increased synchronization of motor units, increased activation of the contractile apparatus, and decreased inhibition by the protective mechanisms of the muscle (golgi tendon organ) (1). These training methods also hypertrophy the pure fast twitch fibers – the high-threshold, Type IIB fibers. Incorporating these training methods into your routine at the right time will undoubtedly improve your muscles ability to generate more force and contract maximally during any sporting activity. In essence, myofibrillar hypertrophy is what I would term functional hypertrophy.
Although the human eye cannot tell these two types of hypertrophy apart, the difference will always become quite apparent as soon as it’s time for an athlete to put his/her muscle to use. As athletes and strength professionals, I feel we all have a responsibility to prevent ourselves from getting into the “3 sets of 10” rut. It is our job to educate ourselves, be creative, and put together the most result-producing programs available for our athletes or ourselves. This may mean incorporating both types of hypertrophy training into your routine, depending on your goal and training phase. But remember that no matter how bad those high-rep sets of leg extensions burn, they will never build the strength, power, and functional hypertrophy of a heavy set of squats or deads!
Poliquin, Charles. Modern Trends in Strength Training. Volume 1. QFAC Bodybuilding, 2001.
Siff, Mel C. and Yuri V. Verkhoshansky. Supertraining. Colorado: Denver, 1999.
Tsatsouline, Pavel. Power to the People. Dragon Door Publications, Inc., 2000.
08-11-2006, 08:12 PM
Their diet might be better than yours.
Or genetics. That can be the difference in muscularity at your age.
PLEASE listen to me. I went through it. I was 130 lbs through high school. I started lifting. I saw results, but not as fast as I'd liked. I listened to my dumb-azz friends and started taking EAS (this was late-90's guys - don't skewer me too much...) products out the whazoo.
Didn't work worth a sh*t.
Dropped A TON of money on them.
Started to focus on post-WO nutrition. Helped me gained a few pounds. Then, I focused more on rest of my diet. And, the rest is history.
Hold off on the supps. I'm telling ya. You are going to enter a period of time when money will likely become tight (college). Don't waste it.
08-11-2006, 09:27 PM
08-12-2006, 06:00 AM
lol well, I mean it's usually a sign that your bf% is low, which means he has to eat more than he currently is if he wants to bulk up.Originally Posted by NO HYPE
08-12-2006, 07:57 AM
Haha! I like a lot of Muscletech's stuff. I feel like I may be the only one, but it works really well for me.Originally Posted by jmh80
08-12-2006, 08:15 AM
Eat! I know you think your eating but like a bizillion before you I can guarantee that you are not eating enough! Count your calories for just one week, like someone else said use fitday.com it makes it easy, and you will see that your diet is lacking. After you do that post up your average calorie and Macro breakdown for the week and we'll tell you where your lacking!
Being a hard gainer doesn't mean you have to be a no-gainer, some struggle to lose and some struggle to gain but we all struggle! At 16 your ripe for gaining muscle, if you get serious with your diet and stick with it you can make some miraculous gains!
08-12-2006, 08:24 AM
I second that. Your body needs lots of good clean food to build lots of good lean muscle. Try to eat the majority of your complex carbs up front, and eat your simple carbs on the back. What I mean by that is from the time that you wake up to the time you work out, eat the majority of your complex carbs, and then the majority of your simple one's post-workout to bed. Not that you'll have an abundance of simple carbs in your diet (some people like to), but you should have some immediately post workout to help with muscle recovery. The only supplementation that I would recommend for you at 16 would be a good multivitamin and protein. And not even a lot of protein. Try to start eating more times throughout the day. Go for 6 or 7 meals. Try to get them in every 2 to 3 hours. I could set up a whole plan for you, but I don't know your whole situation and I'm sure that you can find enough information on here and elsewhere about nutrition to put together a decent (or perhaps better) plan. Good luck man. Don't forget to eat!
08-12-2006, 08:41 AM
Oh I definitely think he could take some protien supps, any hard gainers I've trained I make them drink MRP's with a meal 2 to 3 times a day, that's about an extra 900 cals. Most of these guys can't eat 2000 cals a day without getting sick, MRPs are a great way to break that trend, once they've done that for awhile they find it easier to eat more real food.
08-12-2006, 08:48 AM
That's a good point. I just worry about how much protein he would end up taking in by taking too much of a protein supp. I mean, at 130lbs. (no telling what % of that is lean) he's not gonna need 300g of protein a day. That would probably be overkill. If he's doubling up on servings of whey, he could probably get there pretty easy in conjunction with food. Not sitting down and writing a diet for him, that's the best advice I could give off the hip. :P But, I agree with what you're sayin'. It is easier to drink a shake than to sit down and eat two plain baked potatoes with a side of extra lean beef. lol
08-12-2006, 09:17 AM
Yep, but that is why I said MRP. I would say he should probably start off with at the very least 3000cals a day, and lets say he's doing a 40/40/20 split, that's 300grams of protien a day! I bet you money he's not taking in 100g's now. He can throw some Whey/Oats post w/o but for a hard gainer that shouldn't even be considered a meal, just postw/o nutrition. He needs real cals and if he can't eat 'em (it will be hard) then make up for it by drinking them (MRPs not beer )
08-12-2006, 09:35 AM
08-12-2006, 09:40 AM
08-12-2006, 09:43 AM
08-12-2006, 04:05 PM
How much water should i drink I drink like a gallon in a half a day. I cant eat that much do you think if i drink less i will be able to eat more.
08-12-2006, 04:10 PM
I think recommended is a gallon or so.
You have to train your stomach to be able to digest lots of food. You'll get used to it. Think of it like lifting weights. It takes time for your muscles to adapt to the workload and get stronger.
08-12-2006, 04:11 PM
1-2 gallons per day is spot on. If you don't think you can eat that much then just slowly raise the amount of food you eat until you can comforably eat enough.
08-12-2006, 04:47 PM
08-12-2006, 04:59 PM
I'll have you know that's 3lbs on a cut I'm 9lb on a bulk I remember the days of 2 cookies and no more or I'd feel bloated and sick, what a long way I've come since then.
08-12-2006, 05:05 PM
callmeclark i am already taking century as a mutivitamin i aslo take calcium with vitamin D 600mg, fish oil 1000mg, and magnesium 400mg
08-12-2006, 06:50 PM
I like GNC's Ultra Mega Gold. It's a high-potency multivitamin. As far as the water goes, Ziri's right on. You'll want to take in 1-2 gallons a day. Gotta stay hydrated. Also, don't drink tap. Make it spring water, or at least filtered from a filter on your sink or fridge. And don't forget the milk! Skim milk is excellent for gaining. For you, I'd say 24oz. a day should get it.
08-12-2006, 11:31 PM
Basso would bsn true mass be a good mrp to take. I eat as much as i could today and only got 2,500 cals.
08-12-2006, 11:41 PM
Uh yeah I guess that would work, looks pretty spendy for what you get though. Here is some options
NutraPlanet.com: Products in Meal Replacer
Also Muscle Milk, Grow, there is a million different ones, look at the profiles and make sure the carbs are there. Products labeled as Weight gainers normally carry a lot of sugars and probably aren't the best choice. You don't need to be to picky, just try to find a good value and use it to transition to real food!
08-13-2006, 05:52 PM
08-13-2006, 10:47 PM
Kinda low on the cal side though, that's my meal replacement for cutting! minus the milk thoughOriginally Posted by Ziricote
08-13-2006, 11:29 PM
Right now I think the most important things for you to do at your stage.
Pwo Shake with what was said
20-40 grams of whey protein (i like vanilla, SportsPharma at Sam's Club 17 bucks for 5 pounds)
1/2 cup uncooked oats
1 green apple
1/2 cup low fat cottege cheese
handfull of ice
Take the gnc multi (buy at beginning of month and get a gold card it'll pay for itself. and do the bogo)
Eat clean and often, train hard and consistent and your going to see gains.
Make sure to take your PWO post workout shake asap after your workout no more then 30 minutes later as you need to fuel your muscles with that good old whey protein.
That's all you need, I wish my football and basketball coach told me this, they just told us to keep running and drink water and eat pasta... That's awsome your starting out young, If i knew what I know now back during hs football I would of knocked out 3x as many guys as I did.
Anyones have any takes on creatine after he gets his diet in line, I love my kre akaline. He is still young, and if he stays on here he'll be poppin pills soon enough.
Good luck you struck gold with this joint.
08-14-2006, 06:31 AM
Ah but you see I use mammoth portionsOriginally Posted by Basso
Ziricote's PWO Shake
150g Oats 90g C
60g Whey 60g P
300ml Skim Milk (150kcal)
1 Apple 60g C
Total Kcal = ~990kcal
I prefer my PWO Meal though
Ziricote's PWO Meal
150g Brown Rice 90g C
5 Large Whole Eggs 30g P
100g Chicken Breast 30g P
1 tbsp Oil 15g F
Light Dressing 10g C
Total Kcal = ~730kcal
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