once you hit macros, where to put extra cals?
- 12-24-2012, 08:11 AM
the chest workout you posted before is double the volume of layne nortons PHAT. PHAT is a good program if you follow it
5/3/1 is easy and will meet your goals. buy his e-book online and it'll make more sense. I went from 202-215 in just a few months using 5/3/1.
I don't wanna sound like a dick, but I don't imagine you fully grasp Westside. I still don't
and so what if it's only a 4 day week? you'll want that extra day off. your body needs rest to grow. you aren't letting it do that, especially when you lift for over an hour. lift two on, one off if you'd rather
- 12-24-2012, 09:07 AM
i think im gonna do the 5/3/1 with the westside template to it so i can doa lil DE work but still track my strength progress easily with the bodybuilding accessory exercises
12-24-2012, 09:17 AM
look at the Periodization Bible template w/ 5/3/1
12-24-2012, 09:17 AM
12-24-2012, 11:27 PM
sorry thats not what i meant to say, i menat i woudl get the strenght work and do bodybuilding accessories.......i decided on the 5/3/1 westside hybrid
workout looked liek this
Squat 5/3/1 DE DL
270x17..........also, only go to failure on last set of my hypertrophy work
100x23+7 quick reps
105x22+8 quick reps
seated leg curl
weighted decline crunches
12-24-2012, 11:43 PM
Why is your squat so low? For DE, you generally want to use ~50% of your 1RM. Unless you have a ~470# pull, then your percentage is off.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-24-2012, 11:49 PM
squat was 5/3/1/ max squat of 305 is waht ai used (suggested to start from 90% 1RM for 1st mesocycle).....75%,80%,85%
DL was DE at 60% of 90% 1RM (395)....they site i read said to use 60% wand wave up to 70% by the 3rd week.........quick question what are rest periods for DE...........i was doing 60s, also doing like 2-3min for 5/3/1, thanks
12-24-2012, 11:56 PM
Honestly, you're overcomplicating everything and doing too much. You haven't even run 5/3/1 as written and you've already bastardized the template. Give it 6 months of consistent work with 5/3/1 as written (do yourself a favor and spend $20 on the ebook) before you start to add twists to it. Wendler is about as credible as it gets in the strength world and having the discipline to stick to the template instead of adding useless volume or new elements will benefit you in the long run.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-25-2012, 04:43 AM
12-25-2012, 08:12 AM
you're still doing too much and not in accordance with 5/3/1
where/why did you come up with those assistance exercises?
and as Rodja said, your 3rd working set is to be as many reps as possible. if you can only hit 5, then your 1RM may be wrong
the book tells all. I've seen misleading information on other forums and websites
12-25-2012, 09:20 AM
12-25-2012, 11:16 AM
Bro, stick with bench, squats, deads, presses.
The main point to understand is this, you can go heavy with low volume, but you can NOT go heavy with high volume. You will kill your adrenals and maybe why you are on TRT.
12-25-2012, 11:57 AM
http://www.**********************/wor...ng-system.html this i the site i got my info from........ i did not know it was AMRAP fro the 3rd set........you guys still think thats too much? I used to do way more than that throughout high school training for football and im not much older now, whats the difference? i also woudl then go to basketball practice for 2.5 hours and then go to the gym with my mom afterwards and lift more.....worked well then, got a scholarship to play college football.........dont see how turning 21/22 all of a sudden made it that my body couldnt handle this amount? I coudl understand the amount iw as doing before but i guess i dont grasp how the workout i did yest. can be too much when i used t probably do jsut as much if not more plus 2.5 hours of hard basketball everyday
12-25-2012, 12:07 PM
it's too much. I'll tell you over and over. everyone else that's come to this thread has said the same thing. stop your workout at an hour. if you're taking longer than that-then you're doing too much, not being methodical in how you do your exercises, not following 5/3/1 how it's written, texting on the phone, looking at ass
as for your last rep, you go all out. that's the set that means the most and that makes you strong. sure that website gives you a quick overview of 5/3/1, but you need to read his book to fully understand it and his training principles. yeah your 4 compound lifts are low rep (even though your 3rd set could vary well be high rep) but he preaches that assistance work should be done 10-20 reps. I promise- if you have 20 bucks and 20 minutes to read it, it will be well worth it. he not only explains the program much better, but also basic principles in strength training.
12-25-2012, 12:11 PM
12-25-2012, 12:13 PM
Ok, so you are saying that you used to do more in high school....my question is why?
Why so much training? What is your goal? Why are you stressing your body to the limits?
Why is your testosterone 100?
Obviously there is an underlying issue here......bro, a normal person can train half as much as you do, eat less than you do and gain more weight.
Something is missing here....
12-25-2012, 12:13 PM
it's no prob. I'm not tryin to beat you down here. I did all the homemade bodybuilding splits for years, 6 days a week, 1.5hr long workouts. it did nothing for me. I eventually plateaued and had no direction or progression. 5/3/1 completely changed that for me. merry xmas
12-25-2012, 12:31 PM
Regarding training volume, you're on freaking TRT. That should tell you that you were doing something very wrong whether it be underrecovery, AAS usage at a young age, overtraining, etc. and to continue with that course of attack is foolish. While I completely disagree with the one hour recommendation, it should not take more than 90 minutes for any session unless you're training in gear and prepping for a meet.
M.Ed. Ex Phys
12-25-2012, 01:34 PM
12-26-2012, 03:12 AM
No homo but you have the AM PL specialist whose been shoving you in the right direction since the first page of posts; listen to the advice he brings; he's not saying it for his own benefit nor is he trying to steer you into a direction that will lead to 'minimal' gains, rather the best gains in a reasonable amount of time.
Read 5/3/1 until you understand it then rewrite it again if you have to. If you didn't know it was AMRAP then you obviously didn't sit down and really absorb what the template is all about. I beleive 5/3/1 also works off a submaximal 1rm (not true 1rm- perhaps I think 90% of 1rm then all percentages are based off this).
Read it, learn it, rewrite and repeat.
12-26-2012, 10:33 AM
Not going to go around and beat a dead horse, I believe everyone has already pointed out that your workout is an overkill. I will, though, just point out one thing: if/when you change your workout to a more, let's say, "standard" workout, don't forget to also decrease the amount of calories you eat a little, as you will not be burning as much as you used to while doing 150 reps for chest.
More is not always better when it comes to workout. 5x5 is a basic, easy, well rounded and very effective training method and would already reduce your workload a ton. Hell, my best gains ever were doing Doggcrapp training on the 4 day a week split, which meant that somedays I would only perform 3 exercises (quad, hammy and calf) and it was by far the most satisfying and short workout I've ever had and also had me doing my best gains ever.
Androhard + Andromass Log
12-26-2012, 10:28 PM
12-27-2012, 12:56 AM
12-27-2012, 08:03 AM
I'm glad you are taking advice but please take all of it. The devil is in the details so to speak. When I mentioned these various training methodologies, the suggestion was to read the why behind the what from the authors of each. Really get in to the theories behind the templates and understand them in their appropriate context for the sake of knowledge. Then select one program and complete it before moving to the next goal.
I will say that what you are doing now, although technically incorrect and you should listen to rodja, is better than what you had been doing. And remember, even if you stick with your modified routine, you will see progress. But as mentioned, just slinging weights around and eating will cause muscle and strength growth, maximizing your potential through proper application is better, however.
Just a rhetorical questions to think about, but Wendler and West are both very, very, very accomplished athletes and coaches. What makes you feel experienced enough to modify what they have laid their reputations and careers on the line to create? Both programs are solid yet they are seperate programs. Just like diets take advantage of various metabolic pathways and can look night and day different but get similar results, so do training templates.
Westside is an advanced strength program. I mentioned I started with a 5x5, later moved to westside and with that base on to bodybuilding. If you like Wendler, do his 5/3/1 and do it alone until you "graduate", then tackle West as strength appears to be your goal at this stage. After that, assuming you do it all correctly, your strength levels will be such that if you move on to bodybuilding routines you will be repping serious weight and with the proper nutrition you will get legitamitely hyooooge.
More is better at the gym but only in its right time. Be patient, grasshoppa.
12-27-2012, 08:10 AM
I like muscle and strength though. Good website overall.
12-27-2012, 09:13 PM
i think im on trty cuz of getting really sick and was like 100lbs in the hospital a few years ago and my entire body jsut shut down....although part of me does think overexercise had a large play into that :-(
12-27-2012, 09:25 PM
Think about taking a knife and skinning your arm. The smart thing (other than not doing it, but follow the logic) would be to let it heal. You wouldn't dig in to the cut again and then a third time. You certainly wouldn't start over with the same the following day. Well, inside your body, when you tear your muscles, they need to heal too. Pick the scab all the time and they never will.
Regarding TRT, regardless of what caused it, at this point just do what the doctor tells you. He has a track on your "pulse" and knows all the details. What's done is done, but as another poster mentioned, don't keep doing the same destructive things. Some people say that is the definition of crazy!
Also, a common mantra is that you don't grow in the gym, you grow while you sleep. Meaning exercise may be the stimulus to growth but recovery is the key. You aren't letting yourself recover, or weren't. If you like Wendler, do his program and do it alone, the way he wrote it. Give it time and watch your lifts increase, your body recover better and your training and overall health levels improve.
If you start getting fat, cut back on the food, don't increase the training. Not in your case anyways!
12-27-2012, 10:52 PM
once again i appreciate all the help and insight thanks everyone....tomorrow is def an off day listenin to my body, jsut didint feel right today
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