Carbs, and healthy fats when and how??

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    Carbs, and healthy fats when and how??


    Ok here we go:
    All year i been either on a low carb diet or i would carb cycle and it worked great..Now im trying to get a little bigger and do a lean bulk.
    I workout Mon-Fri and sometimes sat but its mostly Calisthenics and cardio.
    Mon-fri Ill consume about 60-80g of healthy fats (eggs and peanut butter), 120-200g of carbs (oats and banana), and about 240-290 of protein. Im taking in about 2500-2900 Cals on workout days. Now in the weekend im thinking of cutting out carbs bcause i gain fat mighty quick on my midsection.
    Heres my plan:
    Mon-Fri (workout days)- Carbs 120-200g maybe a little higher on some days, Fats 60-80g, and protein 240-290 With cals 2500-2900
    Non workout days Sat&Sun- Little to no carbs, fats 60-80g and protein 240-290 with cals a little lower at around 2000-2300

    My confusion is should i lower my fats on workout days bcause carbs are a little higher?

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    These will clear up a lot of confusion and answer most of ur questions.^^^
    Also, If ur worried about gaining fat in ur midsection then u need to reevaluate ur diet. Any dairy? Another thing to cosider is that when "bulking" you can't expect to stay real pretty (shredded midsection). If you already have the six pack tho, then its a lil easier to keep that belly fat in check.
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    Thanx bruh....When i have time ima try and read through them. I drink one glass one skim milk in the A.m and i put cottage cheese in my before bed shake....I been doing the cottage cheese since the summer so i kept it for the bulk. i have a flat stomache with a four pack lol the lower two is freaking hard to get smh lol....But u right i cant expect to stay lean as i am during a bulk....But i am trying to stay as lean as possible while bulking..I never do a dirty bulk..
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    But i am trying to stay as lean as possible while bulking..I never do a dirty bulk
    most deff man, good luck to ya. Dirty bulk = dirty results.lol
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    Quote from one of the passages: This would defeat the whole point of eating more protein in the first place! In fact, if carbohydrates are too low, it does not matter how much protein you eat, you can lose muscle tissue!

    "Carbohydrates are equally important (if not more so) for muscle growth, muscle maintenance and performance when compared to protein. So although yes, many athletes should consume more protein than they do, they should not consume it at the expense of dietary carbohydrate."
    "The most recent research shows that if protein sources higher in Leucine (dairy, egg, and meat sources) are consumed, less total protein is needed to maximally stimulate MPS at each meal. Meaning, you need less protein if it is of very high quality. This could allow an athlete more room in his or her diet to consume other essential nutrients. So for all you bodybuilders out there consuming whey, eggs, meat and BCAA on a daily basis, especially if you’re in the offseason, you would probably be better served eating the low end of the recommendations and upping those carbs!"


    Interesting. But i sub carbs for fats when i do go low on carbs, so not sure if it still defeats the purpose in a sense.
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    I add cocoa powder to my post shake for the natural antioxidents and sugar for the insulin spike..Does anyone else do the same? what u take with ur post shake?
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    if carbohydrates are too low, it does not matter how much protein you eat, you can lose muscle tissue!
    exactly man.
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    You could stand to eat more carbs, although overall calorie intake is more important for muscle growth then how many carbs you eat. Id try to increase cals by 200-300 every week in the form of carbs/fats until you start gaining fat.
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    At the moment im consuming 2700-2900 cals..My micros are looking good just trying to gain some mass for 16 weeks with minimal fat gain as possible..Than ill recomp..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stri8ted25 View Post
    exactly man.
    Wouldn't put as clear cut like that...

    I have been doing the Metabolic Diet and did a cut / recomp at 200 below maintenance while continuing with heavy lifting and ended up increasing lean body mass while dropping fat mass. So I wouldn't just say that if you don't eat carbs you lose muscle regardless of protein / fat intake cause it is not the case.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bla55

    Wouldn't put as clear cut like that...

    I have been doing the Metabolic Diet and did a cut / recomp at 200 below maintenance while continuing with heavy lifting and ended up increasing lean body mass while dropping fat mass. So I wouldn't just say that if you don't eat carbs you lose muscle regardless of protein / fat intake cause it is not the case.
    I think cyclical dieting is the answer for those wanting to recomp.
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    I'm sure there are advantages to carb cycling as well and same goes for a gazillion different diets out there.

    What I was trying to point out is that there is no clear cut answer, to the fact of making a statement such as that, saying that if you're low on carb it doesn't matter the amount of protein, you still may lose muscle mass. Point I was trying to make is that there is no set recipe; with no carbs or with all carbs, there is always going to be the possibility of losing mass. But that just because one doesn't eat carbs, on the same coin, doesn't necessarily means they are bound to lose muscle, as that is not the case.
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    Wouldn't put as clear cut like that...

    I have been doing the Metabolic Diet and did a cut / recomp at 200 below maintenance while continuing with heavy lifting and ended up increasing lean body mass while dropping fat mass. So I wouldn't just say that if you don't eat carbs you lose muscle regardless of protein / fat intake cause it is not the case.
    Its a lot harder to gain mass w/o carbs. I think so many people are scared of carbs thinking they will make them fat or gain fat which is a huge misconception. IMO it all has to do with A:the type of carbs B: The timing and C: the amount. If you get all 3 of those down to a "T" then going carb free and all that is not necessary
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    Quote Originally Posted by bla55 View Post
    I'm sure there are advantages to carb cycling as well and same goes for a gazillion different diets out there.

    What I was trying to point out is that there is no clear cut answer, to the fact of making a statement such as that, saying that if you're low on carb it doesn't matter the amount of protein, you still may lose muscle mass. Point I was trying to make is that there is no set recipe; with no carbs or with all carbs, there is always going to be the possibility of losing mass. But that just because one doesn't eat carbs, on the same coin, doesn't necessarily means they are bound to lose muscle, as that is not the case.
    Your right. I can lose mass with or without carbs, it depends how much protein, fats, carbs is consumed or if no carb or low carb diet what u do to compensate the carbs. But i do believe without carbs its harder to gain mass. You can gain mass with protein and fats but carbs is important for that mass and fullness. But as u said theres alot of ways to diet
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stri8ted25 View Post
    Its a lot harder to gain mass w/o carbs. I think so many people are scared of carbs thinking they will make them fat or gain fat which is a huge misconception. IMO it all has to do with A:the type of carbs B: The timing and C: the amount. If you get all 3 of those down to a "T" then going carb free and all that is not necessary
    Your pointers are def on point. But....Carbs can be a little different depending on the person. Some can be a little more carb sensitive than others, so consuming a little less than the avg might be a better choice. I just recently learned my body on what it likes and how it responses to certain foods. Some people can still have lots of energy on a low carb diet and others feel very lethargic. Again i think learning your body is key and knowing what, when and how much carbs to take.
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    ....Carbs can be a little different depending on the person.
    O most deff.. I think one thing that screws up most people is gluten. A good friend of mine who competes and myself both find that any kind of bread is bloating.lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stri8ted25 View Post
    O most deff.. I think one thing that screws up most people is gluten. A good friend of mine who competes and myself both find that any kind of bread is bloating.lol
    Yea gluten is a killa lol....Oh thats cool that u compete. How long have u been competing for? Have u won yet?
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    I agree with the above......protein is too high and carbs are too low. Carbs are much more anabolic than protein and much better for performance and metabolism. Dial the protein down to 1g per lb of bodyweight and adjust the carbs and fat so that your weight gain is slow and steady.
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    Absolutely. I been on a very low carb diet since jan and i just started taking in carbs at around 150-200 daily and its def more anabolic than protein. Not saying protein is not important but carbs def play a bigger role when it comes to an all around benefit.

    I read that its better to seperate fats and carbs....Idk how much of that is true. anyone know? My morning meal is mostly carbs of about 60g with 25g of protein and my second meal is mostly healthy fats (eggs) with a banana (carbs). My third meal is a protein shake which consist of whey, peanut butter and cottage cheese (slow digestive protein)...
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    Absolutely. I been on a very low carb diet since jan and i just started taking in carbs at around 150-200 daily and its def more anabolic than protein. Not saying protein is not important but carbs def play a bigger role when it comes to an all around benefit.

    I read that its better to seperate fats and carbs....Idk how much of that is true. anyone know? My morning meal is mostly carbs of about 60g with 25g of protein and my second meal is mostly healthy fats (eggs) with a banana (carbs). My third meal is a protein shake which consist of whey, peanut butter and cottage cheese (slow digestive protein)...
    I wouldnt worry about separating carbs and fats. Your total calorie intake vs. expenditure and the total ratio of the three macro nutrients is what matters most. You will find that fats satiate you when combined with carbs as opposed to eating carbs alone. So if you are naturally a fat ass like myself and have to hold yourself back on calories so you dont gain too fast.....adding fats to your meals keeps you feeling a bit more steady through the day. But, again, the biggest issue is TOTAL numbers at the end of the day. Just hit em any way you can.
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    Oh thats cool that u compete. How long have u been competing for? Have u won yet?
    I myself dont compete, but my boy does and he is doing great. He's w a lot of the SouthernMuscle guys in the Tampa,FL area. We're in the same nutrition program.
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    OK cool....I figured micros is what really counted and the calories coming in. But than again i know is best to keep meals around 500-800 spread out...Some people reading this might say oh yea? cool and than eat a meal containing 1000+ cals...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stri8ted25 View Post
    I myself dont compete, but my boy does and he is doing great. He's w a lot of the SouthernMuscle guys in the Tampa,FL area. We're in the same nutrition program.
    Great partner to have. Good to hear, i wish him success.
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    well it depends on your body structure .... that how much it will impact on your body if you skips some foods .... try to add more protein foods in your diet and keep taking healthy fats like boiled eggs and peanut butter ...
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    OK cool....I figured micros is what really counted and the calories coming in. But than again i know is best to keep meals around 500-800 spread out...Some people reading this might say oh yea? cool and than eat a meal containing 1000+ cals...
    ACtually it would make no difference if you ate 6 meals at 500 calories or 3 meals at 1000 calories. The thermic effect of the food is the same and will yield the same metabolic effects. There are guys having wonderful success using intermittent fasting where they consume 90% of the days calories within a very small window of time. It simply comes down to the numbers and I think as bodybuilders we like to complicate things more than they need to be.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AustrianOakJr View Post
    ACtually it would make no difference if you ate 6 meals at 500 calories or 3 meals at 1000 calories. The thermic effect of the food is the same and will yield the same metabolic effects. There are guys having wonderful success using intermittent fasting where they consume 90% of the days calories within a very small window of time. It simply comes down to the numbers and I think as bodybuilders we like to complicate things more than they need to be.
    Wow! I almost consume all my cals early as well, mainly all before working out.
    I figured the body doesnt use all the necessary nutrients and energy to burn it all so it gets stored, so by having portions spread out avoids foods being stored as fat. That was my assumption and sure it was for many as well.
    My first 3 meals of the day which are all before workout are my main meals and gives me 80% of my daily cals. The other 20% is post workout with no carbs just fats and protein.
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman

    Wow! I almost consume all my cals early as well, mainly all before working out.
    I figured the body doesnt use all the necessary nutrients and energy to burn it all so it gets stored, so by having portions spread out avoids foods being stored as fat. That was my assumption and sure it was for many as well.
    My first 3 meals of the day which are all before workout are my main meals and gives me 80% of my daily cals. The other 20% is post workout with no carbs just fats and protein.
    Interesting but valid meal timing and macros.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattrag View Post
    Interesting but valid meal timing and macros.
    I think this is the best way to go. Kept me the leanest ever and its easy to change when bulking, recomp or cutting. After working out all you really need is the necessary nutrients to replenish what u used for the workout.

    How do u diet? Ik theres a million ways to diet.
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    Wow! I almost consume all my cals early as well, mainly all before working out.
    I figured the body doesnt use all the necessary nutrients and energy to burn it all so it gets stored, so by having portions spread out avoids foods being stored as fat. That was my assumption and sure it was for many as well.
    My first 3 meals of the day which are all before workout are my main meals and gives me 80% of my daily cals. The other 20% is post workout with no carbs just fats and protein.
    I believe it is important to keep a solid serving of your carbs pre and post workout. But thats for the simple fact that it gives you an elevated blood sugar level (energy) when you need it most and the muscle is primed for glycogen replenishment immediately following. As far as a weight loss/gain stand point, it makes absolutely no difference if you stack the rest of your calories early in the morning or immediately before bed time. In fact, my pre-bed meal is one of my largest meals because I dislike going to bed on an empty stomach. It all comes out in the wash as long as your calories are tracked and monitored properly.
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    I dont take carbs pre workout but i do take in simple carbs post. I will never dare have a big meal before bed lol...I cant really see ur avi but is it you? If it is than u doing something right and i wont contest hehehe..
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    Yes, the avatar is me. And I eat a big meal before bed every night. And I am naturally a fat ass. The myth that eating carbs before bed getting stored as fat......its simply that....a myth. I look at it this way......when is my body hard at work repairing the damage I did in the gym? When I sleep. So I give it the nutrients to do so. Its all part of a calculated meal plan where my protein, carbs and fats are tracked daily. Timing is such a minor issue compared to the overall numbers. Go ahead and try eating before bed. Use the same calorie break down. Now, you might be heavier in the morning at first (until you level off) because you are holding the water from the carbs you ingest but your gonna use that fuel the next morning. It all works out evenly in the end.
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    Damn bro! Ur ripped as hell lol....Good job! Very interesting on ur concept on diet with the before bed meal. I might give it a try in 4 weeks bcause i just changed my diet so i want to see what this diet does so i know exactly how my body reacts...I never intake 150g+ carbs everyday..So im eager to see how i get....I guess the whole total intake of macros daily is what counts but for those who like to eat will make it hard to ingest most cals in the am and not in the pm. It'll make them cheat alot or over eat (bad carbs and foods)
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    Oak: Besides ur diet whats ur supplement and training regimen like?
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    Oak: Besides ur diet whats ur supplement and training regimen like?
    My supplementation is pretty basic. Protein, creatine, bcaa's, etc. Since starting with NRC i have been taking their cabergolean for hgh and testosterone boost. I like it quite a bit .....if for nothing else but the sleep and libido help. You can read some of my stuff on diet and training on cabergolean.com. Look under the athletes section and my bio is under there and a few articles I have written for the site. Im currently writing an "FAQ" article that addresses a lot on this topic and that should be on the site within a week. Keep checking in with us for more diet and training.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AustrianOakJr View Post
    My supplementation is pretty basic. Protein, creatine, bcaa's, etc. Since starting with NRC i have been taking their cabergolean for hgh and testosterone boost. I like it quite a bit .....if for nothing else but the sleep and libido help. You can read some of my stuff on diet and training on cabergolean.com. Look under the athletes section and my bio is under there and a few articles I have written for the site. Im currently writing an "FAQ" article that addresses a lot on this topic and that should be on the site within a week. Keep checking in with us for more diet and training.
    Ok cool, yea i def will.....Ur daily supps are very minimal and basic..
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    Ok cool, yea i def will.....Ur daily supps are very minimal and basic..
    The only supp I take at this point that I dont consider "basic" is the cabergolean and I have been taking it for about 2 months. Unless we are talking about PH's and AAS, supplements are really not the answer. Even the AAS is very limited unless you have a good grasp on dieting and training. Dont look for magic in supplements because it just doesnt happen.

    But if you are beating around the bush about asking if im "on" or have ever been "on" the answer is most definitely NO. The WNBF is very strictly drug tested and I have absolutely no desire to go down that road what so ever. Never tried AAS and never will.
    Sean Campbell
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    NRC Sponsored Athlete - Cabergolean.com
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    cabergolean looks pretty good. WOW! in all honesty i thought u atleast have taken AAS or a pro hormone. Ive taken Epi and Hdrol besides that only supps.
    Interesting to know u accomplished ur physique without any gear.
    I have a question? Im bulking obviously and im scared to get a little fat on me do u think i should do light cardio? Say 10-15min hiit on the treadmill about 2-3 times per week? I never went as higher than 2500 in cals and im scared lol i worked hard to get my midsection in tact not 100% how i want it but i came a long way to getting a four pack and almost a six.
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    Interesting to know u accomplished ur physique without any gear. .
    15 years of training on and off......the last three have been very dedicated to competitive bodybuilding. I wanted it so I set a goal, put in the hard work, and just trained, trained, trained. If you check out my bio page on the website......you'll see what I used to look like.

    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    I have a question? Im bulking obviously and im scared to get a little fat on me do u think i should do light cardio? Say 10-15min hiit on the treadmill about 2-3 times per week? I never went as higher than 2500 in cals and im scared lol i worked hard to get my midsection in tact not 100% how i want it but i came a long way to getting a four pack and almost a six.
    First off, if you plan on "bulking" that generally implies you plan to put on a noticeable amount of weight for a limited amount of time. As a natural athlete, you can only expect a few pounds of lean muscle growth per year. That said, anything above that rate of gain will most likely be fat. The only real exception to this is if you are a total newb to the gym and gains come much faster. So, IMOP "bulking" in the traditional sense of the word is not the way to go if you plan on remaining lean. I would advise a "recomp" where you will stay at or very near maintenance calories. Let the weight slooooowly trickle up on the scale. Im talking 1-2 lbs every few months. I believe the rate of muscle gain might be slightly less than what you might achieve on a full-blown "bulk" but without the un-necessary fat gain. The kicker with the bulk is that you might gain a few lbs of muscle along with your 10+ lbs of fat.....youre gonna lose the muscle as you cut anyways......so where'ya going?

    As for cardio......the important thing to keep in mind is that there is nothing magically fat-burning about cardio. Your body doesnt go "oh! im donig cardio now so ill burn some fat". The amount of fat you accumulate is directly related to how many calories you consume versus the energy you spend. Thats it. Very, very simple. The body is CONSTANTLY storing fat. And its constantly burning it. Its actually storing it WHILE its burning it. It comes down to the net storage at the end of the day, week, month, year that makes you appear "fat". So I would advise doing cardio for the circulatory benefits but realize that ultimately its going to be a calorie and/or macro ratio adjustment that allows you to find that sweet spot for weight control. Obviously, the more cardio you do, the more you can eat and vice versa. So if you like cardio.....by all means.....do it and then eat some more!
    Sean Campbell
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    NRC Sponsored Athlete - Cabergolean.com
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    I appreciate ur help. I been working out for 5 years but on and off and for the past 2 years well really past year i been focusing more on diet and trying to learn every aspect of it. Ill start by saying since jan i been recomping and since than i've been consuming about 1800-2000 cals daily while doing cardio 3-5 times per week but not to intense, about 15min only. Now i really dont want to get huge just a little more mass so not a full out bulk so im assuming keep recomping with just a slight increase in cals? At the moment im taking in 2700-3000 cals daily. Maybe keep it that way for a while or lower it a bit? My maintenance is around 2100..I am eating good nothing bad. Complex carbs and healthy fats and of course protein....Would u like my daily meals? maybe u can help me out :-)
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    Quote Originally Posted by halfhuman View Post
    I appreciate ur help. I been working out for 5 years but on and off and for the past 2 years well really past year i been focusing more on diet and trying to learn every aspect of it. Ill start by saying since jan i been recomping and since than i've been consuming about 1800-2000 cals daily while doing cardio 3-5 times per week but not to intense, about 15min only. Now i really dont want to get huge just a little more mass so not a full out bulk so im assuming keep recomping with just a slight increase in cals? At the moment im taking in 2700-3000 cals daily. Maybe keep it that way for a while or lower it a bit? My maintenance is around 2100..I am eating good nothing bad. Complex carbs and healthy fats and of course protein....Would u like my daily meals? maybe u can help me out :-)
    If your maintenance is 2000 calories and you bump your intake to 2700, you will be gaining over a pound of fat per week. I wouldnt do that if you want to keep those abs in sight. If your maintenance is truly 2000 cals, then I might run at 2200-2300 and slowly bring the weight on at less than a half pound per week. But even gaining 1/2 lb per week, you can expect to see a decent amount of fat gain.

    Food choice is really a minor issue if you are counting your macro nutrients. If you are hitting your numbers while eating reasonably healthy, getting a decent amount of fiber, it doesnt matter what foods you eat to get there. If you like white potatos or rice as opposed to sweet potatos and oats, fine. Eat what you want. You want a bowl of ice cream for your nightly carb meal a few times a week? Fine.....count it and enjoy. Maybe you like to pancakes or waffles as a pre-workout. As long as these things dont make up the majority of your diet there is no reason to stick to the same boring foods all the time. Enjoy the sport. Dont be a slave to it.
    Sean Campbell
    Pro Natural Bodybuilder
    NRC Sponsored Athlete - Cabergolean.com
  

  
 

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