should carbs be taken before bed? or no

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    should carbs be taken before bed? or no


    Iam trying to build muscle. I heard that carbs are bad before bed because fat is the primary energy source used when asleep. But than again dont I need carbs to build muscles?

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    A moderate amount of complex carb.s is ideal.....avoid quick digesting carb.s in large quantity....it's about spiking insulin and storage vs a slow burning source of energy/nutrition and reducing cortisol.
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    cottage cheese is ideal right before bed, it contains casien protein, few carbs. Carbs are your bodies main source of energy......how much energy do you need to sleep? a little? sure a little but not alot like cflight mentioned.......
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    i do 6 meals a day so first 3 meals are carbs n protein, last 3 are protein and fat. been working well so far.
    Serious Nutrition Solutions
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    Quote Originally Posted by marcink99 View Post
    Iam trying to build muscle. I heard that carbs are bad before bed because fat is the primary energy source used when asleep. But than again dont I need carbs to build muscles?
    Carbs before bed will not make you fat.
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    I do 2 scoops of now carbo gain (complex carbs) and one scoop of protein about an hour before bed. Im not getting fat.. And I like to feel somewhat full before bed..
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    Quote Originally Posted by SmallTownIron View Post
    Carbs before bed will not make you fat.
    +1

    Too many calories before bed (or any time for that matter) make you fat.
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    I agree with the posts above. I think complex carbs are okay before bed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gamer2be08 View Post
    I do 2 scoops of now carbo gain (complex carbs) and one scoop of protein about an hour before bed. Im not getting fat.. And I like to feel somewhat full before bed..

    i can't stand going to bed hungry! ruins my night until i make myself go and eat something so i can go to sleep.

    so it screws me over in the end if i try to just eat protein before bed.
    For me, the action IS the juice.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nitrox View Post
    +1

    Too many calories before bed (or any time for that matter) make you fat.
    Exactly. Without eating excessive calories, having some healthy fats like nuts, avocado, whole eggs or red meat with some veggies/fiber is a great pre-bed meal. These nutrients will absorb slowly, keeping you satiated throughout the night. The fat content will provide an excellent and preferable alternative to glucose during sleep. The body will burn it slowly and it will not result in extra circulating insulin which is a great way to store fat in your sleep.

    -Alex
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitnessbyalex View Post
    Exactly. Without eating excessive calories, having some healthy fats like nuts, avocado, whole eggs or red meat with some veggies/fiber is a great pre-bed meal. These nutrients will absorb slowly, keeping you satiated throughout the night. The fat content will provide an excellent and preferable alternative to glucose during sleep. The body will burn it slowly and it will not result in extra circulating insulin which is a great way to store fat in your sleep.

    -Alex
    Carbs before bed will blunt GH.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionic View Post
    Carbs before bed will blunt GH.
    Correct.

    -Alex
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    I like my coconut oil before bed in the place of carbs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blacktail View Post
    I like my coconut oil before bed in the place of carbs.
    This is an OK idea. However I advise against it as coconut oil is primarily MCT's which are burned rather quickly as energy; much like glucose albeit via different metabolic pathways. Stick to mono/poly unsaturated fats but feel free to include a little MCT's as the combination can promote some fat loss during sleep.

    -Alex
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    Any amount of food that creates an insulin spike will blunt gh.

    most tend to steer clear of higher carbs meals pre bed. I usually go with some whole eggs or natural peanut butter/whey protein
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bnatural View Post
    Any amount of food that creates an insulin spike will blunt gh.

    most tend to steer clear of higher carbs meals pre bed. I usually go with some whole eggs or natural peanut butter/whey protein
    I too advocate consuming something like whole eggs, salmon or red meat with some greens prior to bed.

    keep in mind that even BCAA's/whey and lean protein will create an insulin spike. Almost any food will. Quick releases of glucose into the blood stream trigger a large pulse in insulin and thus a large increase in somatostatin which will suppress HGH. complex carbs do not create this large insulin pulse. Yes they will cause an insulin release, as will just a whey shake, however you tend to get the best of both worlds here. Also I don't necessarily recommend anyone slam down a meal IMMEDIATELY post training. Stretch, relax, catch your breath, let your CNS cool off and then eat. Digestion will be improved and the hormonal environment will be better suited to utilize the nutrients efficiently


    -Alex
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionic View Post
    Carbs before bed will blunt GH.
    But to what extent?
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    I slam about 24 ounces + of skim milk with a tablespoon of flaxseed oil right before bed. I haven't gotten fat from it.
    Also, I believe studies have shown that eating lots of calories before bed and later in the day hasn't shown to increase fat. BUT eating most of your calories in the morning/earlier in the day and not within 3 hours of bed has shown to increase mass-less fat loss (but I believe the study was only conducted on woman).
    I don't have a link to the abstract but i'm sure you can google it.
    Greek yogurt is good before bed too if you have to get up and pee in the middle of the night (I don't).
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    Quote Originally Posted by lennoxchi View Post
    cottage cheese is ideal right before bed, it contains casien protein, few carbs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bionic View Post
    Carbs before bed will blunt GH.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitnessbyalex View Post
    I too advocate consuming something like whole eggs, salmon or red meat with some greens prior to bed.

    keep in mind that even BCAA's/whey and lean protein will create an insulin spike. Almost any food will. Quick releases of glucose into the blood stream trigger a large pulse in insulin and thus a large increase in somatostatin which will suppress HGH. complex carbs do not create this large insulin pulse. Yes they will cause an insulin release, as will just a whey shake, however you tend to get the best of both worlds here. Also I don't necessarily recommend anyone slam down a meal IMMEDIATELY post training. Stretch, relax, catch your breath, let your CNS cool off and then eat. Digestion will be improved and the hormonal environment will be better suited to utilize the nutrients efficiently
    HGH is good for fat loss and staying leaner, but hasn't been shown to increase muscle mass, LEAN mass yes, but not muscle.
    So if his prime concern is just gaining muscle, then insulin won't be so bad at all. But nobody wants to gain more fat than they have to during a bulk, sooo best avoid the giants fudge/chocolate sundae before hitting the sack.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitnessbyalex View Post
    I too advocate consuming something like whole eggs, salmon or red meat with some greens prior to bed.

    keep in mind that even BCAA's/whey and lean protein will create an insulin spike. Almost any food will. Quick releases of glucose into the blood stream trigger a large pulse in insulin and thus a large increase in somatostatin which will suppress HGH. complex carbs do not create this large insulin pulse. Yes they will cause an insulin release, as will just a whey shake, however you tend to get the best of both worlds here. Also I don't necessarily recommend anyone slam down a meal IMMEDIATELY post training. Stretch, relax, catch your breath, let your CNS cool off and then eat. Digestion will be improved and the hormonal environment will be better suited to utilize the nutrients efficiently


    -Alex
    We can debate timing here (post-workout meal timing), but we are generally on the same page and at the same understanding of nutrients...

    I know about insulin, and what tends to spike it and how every BODY is different when it comes to the macro levels it takes to spike it.
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    I allow only 40 clean carbs max intake before bed.
    I also ingest 60 grams of protein.
    I eat a total of 400 calories before bed.
    90 cal skim milk
    200 cal protein shake
    90 cal whole weat pretzel.
    I lose weight doing this....while gaining muscle.
    Total cals for day 1400....
    I am on a cutting cycle....With a test booster...
    It is working!!!
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    Do you really think your body really stops working when you go to bed? You need to think of your body in terms of a few days worth of nutrition at a time. I eat some kind of fruit and nuts before bed and have had success with suggesting a small balanced meal 2 hours or so before bed to clients. If you need more calories in a day, eat them whenever you can, including before bed. You're not going to get fat unless your totals for the day exceed what they should, not because you decided to eat a little oatmeal/fruit before bed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by wearedbleedblue View Post
    Do you really think your body really stops working when you go to bed? You need to think of your body in terms of a few days worth of nutrition at a time. I eat some kind of fruit and nuts before bed and have had success with suggesting a small balanced meal 2 hours or so before bed to clients. If you need more calories in a day, eat them whenever you can, including before bed. You're not going to get fat unless your totals for the day exceed what they should, not because you decided to eat a little oatmeal/fruit before bed.
    QFE
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bnatural View Post
    We can debate timing here (post-workout meal timing), but we are generally on the same page and at the same understanding of nutrients...

    I know about insulin, and what tends to spike it and how every BODY is different when it comes to the macro levels it takes to spike it.
    exactly. For instance beef - despite its higher fat content, lean beef should/will actually cause a greater rise in BP insulin due to its higher leucine content

    -Alex
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    Quote Originally Posted by wearedbleedblue View Post
    Do you really think your body really stops working when you go to bed? You need to think of your body in terms of a few days worth of nutrition at a time. I eat some kind of fruit and nuts before bed and have had success with suggesting a small balanced meal 2 hours or so before bed to clients. If you need more calories in a day, eat them whenever you can, including before bed. You're not going to get fat unless your totals for the day exceed what they should, not because you decided to eat a little oatmeal/fruit before bed.
    You cannot just nibble all day and then eat a 2,000 calorie meal of fruit, meat, bread and nuts before bed and expect the same results as a balanced intake of nutrients, timed around physiologic/hormonal environments that best utilize the nutrients. I am not saying that you do this, just encouraging everyone to understand that it is best to optimize nutrient timing.

    -Alex
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitnessbyalex View Post
    exactly. For instance beef - despite its higher fat content, lean beef should/will actually cause a greater rise in BP insulin due to its higher leucine content

    -Alex
    BP insulin, elaborate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fitnessbyalex View Post
    You cannot just nibble all day and then eat a 2,000 calorie meal of fruit, meat, bread and nuts before bed and expect the same results as a balanced intake of nutrients, timed around physiologic/hormonal environments that best utilize the nutrients. I am not saying that you do this, just encouraging everyone to understand that it is best to optimize nutrient timing.

    -Alex
    I get where you and the original poster are going, I think you misread what the original fella posted though... he can elaborate on it, but if you reread his statement you'll see you both are on same page
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    A lot of people are caught up in the minutae around here. Yes, its ideal to have balance meals at every possibility with higher carbs around workouts. But this is the real world and I work with real people. Not everybody has the desire or drive to count every last carb and time it exactly. People need flexibility and what has worked best for my clients and friends are hitting total macro goals day in and day out with planned cheats/refeeds on occasion. Until people are 90-95% solid on their totals for the day, every day, for 6-8 weeks, there is no reason to get more advanced.

    In my opinion, diet and exercise are about progression. If you jump in and make things too complicated and advanced too quickly, adherence goes way down. The best food plan with timing and supplements is crap if someone can't/won't follow it.
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    And yes, what is BP insulin? I think you're also getting caught up in little details that don't mean much in the grand scheme. Beef has about 4-5g of leucine in a 250g portion. I'm not too worried about those numbers.

    Here's another tidbit. Just smelling food can release insulin. Does this mean we should walk around with nose plugs unless we're trying to spike insulin?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bnatural View Post
    BP insulin, elaborate.
    blood plasma concentration. It was just a minor micro-management detail.

    I sometimes read through thread's quickly to get caught up and may have misinterpreted the original poster's point. For that I apologize. In fact certain paleo diet principles are founded upon something to the effect of - waking up and drinking lots of water. then snacking on fruit/nuts/leaves for most of the day while hunting. Then feasting on your kill at night. The concept has been applied successfully to those attempting to better their physique (not necessarily to the precision or magnitude of a bodybuilder). There many ways to skin a cat. All just food for thought (no pun intended)

    -Alex
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    Ahhh, k, when I use bp, I think of blood pressure, so I was quite lost.

    In Poliquins book, he advocates a caveman type diet, where you eat similar things to what a caveman ate. Nuts, berries, leafy greens, meat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bnatural View Post
    Ahhh, k, when I use bp, I think of blood pressure, so I was quite lost.

    In Poliquins book, he advocates a caveman type diet, where you eat similar things to what a caveman ate. Nuts, berries, leafy greens, meat.
    yea, most of the time BP is used to refer to blood pressure. I think it was rather late and I was being lazy - in the mood to abbreviate things lol.

    Poliquin definitely has an interesting and successfully applied insight towards nutrition. His suggestions are based on factual and anecdotal evidence to suggest that this is how the human body is design to be nourished. The thing is, is it optimal for today's desired physique? for some people - maybe.. But even though not fully adapted to the outcomes of agricultural industrialization, our bodies have developed the ability to benefit from things like grains etc. I still would prefer someone eat a potato over a grain though. digestion wise- some people have no issues with grains, others find that eliminating them (or close to it) dramatically improves their digestion. Not to digress.... Poliquin has his niche and is a very intelligent guy. He does well with his clients.

    -Alex
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    why potato over a grain, for curiosity sake
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    Complex carbs will still cause an insulin spike. They are broken down to glucose in the GI tract and the body detects and releases insulin. Fibrous carbs (ie vegetables) create less of an insulin spike. Saying that complex carbs won't spike insulin is inaccurate.

    Also, GH does promote muscle growth via local growth factor release.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cubate View Post
    "I allow only 40 clean carbs max intake before bed.
    I also ingest 60 grams of protein.
    I eat a total of 400 calories before bed.
    90 cal skim milk
    200 cal protein shake
    90 cal whole weat pretzel.
    I lose weight doing this....while gaining muscle.
    Total cals for day 1400....
    wow, that's different. 29% of your daily cals before bed. hey, whatever works! i've been doing light cottage cheese & a little avocado or nuts/seeds, sometimes just some casein powder in water. finish it off it some psyllium husks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by julius kelp View Post
    wow, that's different. 29% of your daily cals before bed. hey, whatever works! i've been doing light cottage cheese & a little avocado or nuts/seeds, sometimes just some casein powder in water. finish it off it some psyllium husks.
    not a bad pre-bed meal
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    Hard to imagine he "gains muscle" on a 1400 cal/day diet...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cubate View Post
    I allow only 40 clean carbs max intake before bed.
    I also ingest 60 grams of protein.
    I eat a total of 400 calories before bed.
    90 cal skim milk
    200 cal protein shake
    90 cal whole weat pretzel.
    I lose weight doing this....while gaining muscle.
    Total cals for day 1400....
    I am on a cutting cycle....With a test booster...
    It is working!!!
    I seriously doubt this.
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    Re: Bedtime meal - how long before you go to sleep/bed is best to leave for consuming your nightime meal ie 1hour before bed/directly before etc?

    Currently have mine about 30mins before going to bed, cottage cheese with salad/pepper added works well, sometimes with cashews and a small amount of peanut butter.
  

  
 

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