Can excess meat protein be toxic??!!
- 12-08-2008, 11:32 AM
Can excess meat protein be toxic??!!
6months ago, I had a diet of all red meat for breakfast, lunch, and dinner(organic red meat - Trader Joe's) to raise my ferritin level. I have had a time holding magnesium ever since. The symptoms are hair loss, insomnia, racing heart especially after meals(especially after meals high in electrolytes/minerals such as potassium, iodine, calcium - any mineral besides magnesium), racing heart in early am.
The only hint of what is going on is my 24 urines. All blood tests come back normal. After the crazy diet of all meat, I started eating normal with normal amounts of dairy/meat protein in my diet. However, I continued to suffer from low magnesium symptoms and my 24 urines showed high loss of mag., cortisol, and protein.
I discovered recently that not eating meat/dairy protein brought on less symptoms.
I recently I did another urine cortisol/magnesium/protein since switching to all vegan and not meat/dairy protein. I noticed my urine getting clearer the longer I ate vegan and then on my last 24 urine, my magnesium was not being lost anymore in my urine and my cortisol was within normal levels. I believe the meat/dairy in my diet made me feel worse and was causing some stressors. When I first went vegan, all I could eat was beans and bread, but have been able to eat more variety of fruits/veggies since going vegan - another sign that the meat/dairy was giving me undue stress. My protein 24 urine is still slightly elevated, but much less than when I was eating meat.
I also have high DHEA in blood and saliva. I know high DHEA is a response to stress, so maybe the stress of the meat eating caused this?
24 URINE LABS:
On 11/28/08(vegan) collection: **Meat/Dairy diet Collections:
Creatinine 1.2(.8-1.8) g/24hr **10/14 was 1.3
Calcium unable to calculate due to low calcium result mg/24hr **8/2 was 101 50-150mg/24hr is low average
Magnesium unable to calculate due to low magnesium result mg/24hr **8/2 was 187.2 (73-122 mg/24h) **10/14 241.5
Protein 341 (42-225) mg/24hr **On 8/2 was 360 **10/14 was 455
Epinephrine Ur 9.0(0.0-20) ug/24h
Norepinephrine Ur 34 (15-80) ug/24h
Dopamine Ur 164 (65-400) ug/24h
Cortisol Free 24 hr 22(3.5-45) ug/24h **8/2 was 96 **10/14 was 97
5HIAA 5.3(<=6.0) mg/24h
Total Urine Metanephrines 198(156-561 Normotensive) ug/24h
Aldosterone 24 Ur 7.9 (2.0-20) ug/24h **8/2 was 9.7
Can anyone tell me what is going on? Does it take time away from meat/dairy protein to detox from an excessive meat protein diet? have I damaged something for good or will I be able to eat normal again? My kidney doc and endo. don't know why I feel better on vegan diet right now.
- 12-08-2008, 12:15 PM
Did you -just- eat meat?
If you did than that's where you went wrong. If you only ate meat you would've created a micro nutrient deficiency.
- 12-08-2008, 12:33 PM
12-08-2008, 12:59 PM
If you only eat meat alone you would be missing out on vitamins and fiber at levels that you would require them at. Magnesium and calcium levels would be low if one were to consume an all meat diet.
12-08-2008, 01:19 PM
12-08-2008, 01:25 PM
Yeah thats what I thought at first too until I started to look into it out of curiosity. Even on pure vegetarian diets you can create deficiencies. Multi-Vitamins help, but they aren't as bioavailable as food is.
12-08-2008, 01:27 PM
I really hope this guy is not on an all meat diet...
12-08-2008, 03:37 PM
yeah all meat for 2 mos
Yeah, for 2 months, all I ate was red meat.
Yeah, I was low on magnesium for about 5 months until I started an all vegan diet - I wasn't low on calcium, in fact, it brought on the low mag. symptoms whenever I took it in supplements or food. Now on the vegan diet, no magnesium is being dumped in my 24 urines. But, I still have some low mag. symptoms especially if I eat potassium, calcium, or iodine. I was just wondering how long it takes to fully recover or if I even will.
The high DHEA has got me too - I guess that is the stress of too much protein.
wondering if permanent damage was done or will I be able to eat meat/eggs again some day.
12-08-2008, 04:59 PM
12-08-2008, 06:16 PM
DHEA is a precursor for sterodial hormones. One of the ongoing theroies with low carb diet is that cholestorol doesn't have the same effects as on a regular diet because its used and potentiated into testosterone. DHEA is produced from cholesterol.
Now you say low magnesium symptoms. But if you were only eating meat and milk, you probably had a compound micro nutrient deficiency.
You might feel better just because you're getting in your vegetables now.
12-08-2008, 06:43 PM
All meat diet... Dear God. I'm no pro for sure but i can't even begin to see the benefits of this kind of diet...
12-08-2008, 07:01 PM
I was on all meat for 1 year, 70% fat, 30% protein 0% carbs.
I didn't suffer from any health problems, although everyone on a low carb diet I know took magnesium, that was a given, I took ZMA instead.
The only thing muscle and fat doesn't have is vitamin C and you can take a multi as I'm sure most of you already do.
There hundreds if not thousands of people on 100% meat and are doing just fine, google steffanson+ inuit or the bear+carnivorous diet.
I was in perfect health for one year, probably one of the leanest periods too.
You probably have something wrong with you, it's not the meat.
12-08-2008, 07:43 PM
12-08-2008, 08:04 PM
While it might not kill you, there benefits from vegetables are too numerous to try and even list. "Variety is the spice of life." and "Eat your veggies" I say lol. Or atleast have some spinach and a solid multivitamin.
12-08-2008, 08:04 PM
hmmm.. i will have to look this up.. learn something new everyday i guess
12-08-2008, 08:36 PM
-Love raw food
-Love simple plans
-Love the increased aggression and clarity of mind when I'm on 100% meat (which was a benefit when I stayed on it)
It was very simple, heat the meat to normal body temp and eat it.
I ate kidneys, hearts, liver, tripe, tongue, cheeks, bone/organ/feet stews on some days, no spices, no marinating, just throw and it's cooked, rinse with hot water.
My immunity system was excellent, I got used to even raw chicken, no stomach problems....didn't catch a single cold or feel bad for a single day....
The whole concept was nothing that you couldn't get in the wild with only a knife, Paleolithic diets, the all meat is just an extension of it.
Edit: I also lost 30 lbs and had "dry" abs.....took about 3-3.5 months? didn't even think crack could do it that fast.
12-08-2008, 08:38 PM
How interesting... not enough to make me want to try it.. I was a cook in the Marines and i have seen what raw chicken can do to someone :S
But i eat my meat Rare, or cook it blue anyways so thats not new.
Im really interested in this style of diet.
12-08-2008, 08:51 PM
First time I ever rate raw beef at 10, I had nasty gas for 1 hour
After that I was eating it rare whenever I could, chicken will hurt your stomach first time, send you to the bathroom with diareaha, after that, it doesn't matter.
I've crisped the skin on turkey breasts but 90% of the meat was raw, no problems.
Someone told me on a carnivorous diet your immunity system is stronger, before I started this diet, from experience, I say that's 100% correct.
Now, if I had the money to afford fatty meat every day and was sure I wouldn't be stuck in a hotel room or someplace without food I can eat, I'd do it.
Come to think of it, the only things that aren't carnivorous in my diet are 1 burger bun and 2 protein shakes.
12-08-2008, 10:59 PM
12-09-2008, 11:39 AM
Wow. I could not even imagine. I bet you would win a Fear Factor challenge if you had the chance!
12-09-2008, 11:51 AM
12-09-2008, 12:03 PM
12-11-2008, 11:52 AM
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