Phone Customer Service Needs A Quick Lesson

[Blesum]

Brief summary:
I'm deaf, I use an relaying service to make phone calls. I called your company and got hung up upon twice, and then got the impression that Tim might have been clueless about the products that he sells. Not happy with the customer service I received.

Solution suggested: Give a quick lesson to the phone CSR on how to answer phone calls without rudely hanging up. Explain that there are some deaf customers out there that have to use a relaying service to make phone calls and that CSR's should at least hear these phone calls out before assuming that we're scammers or telemarketers and hanging up on us.

With my last order, I had problems with being misquoted shipping prices and then being stiffed with a higher shipping price (Hawaii) in the end.

Now I'm wondering again about making yet another switch...aranoid:

Phone conversation is copied and pasted below for your review.

-Blesum


To print your document click here, or use your keyboard and press Ctrl-P

Connecting to relay center...

Waiting for next available operator....

Session started at 7:54am on Tuesday, June 16, 2009

Hello! i711.com CA#90350F

Special Instructions:

NutraPlanet, get a live rep at 866-780-3755 GA

THK U DIALING

866 780 3755RINGING 1...

2

(M)

(INTRO CALL PLS HLD)

(EXPLAINING RELAY)

Hi, my name is XXXX and I made an order a few minutes ago on your website and then realized I forgot to add one more item to my order. ga

hello (too fast)

(CALLED PARTY HAS HUNG UP)

(ANOTHER CALL Q GA)

redial ga

Get a name first before you identify yourself as relay ga

(thank you redialing please hold)


RINGING 1...

(M)

(INTRO CALL PLS HLD)

hello this is tim (too fast) i don't think you understand we don't accept these kind of calls (too fast)

(CALLED PARTY HAS HUNG UP)

(ANOTHER CALL Q GA)

Redial, ask for tim and state the following "If you continue to hang up on me, I will consider this blantant discrimination towards a deaf customer of yours, I merely need to add one more item to an order I made a few minutes ago on your website. If this continues, I will intinate the process of filing a formal complant aganist nutraplanet. Are you willing to take my call now or not q ga" GA

(thank you redialing please hold)

RINGING 1...

2

(F)

(INTRO CALL PLS HLD)


(asking for tim)

tim is not available GA

Can I wait for tim to become available please q He was the customer service represntative I spoke with a few minutes ago ga


yes you can wait it will be just a few minutes

(ON HOLD)

(still holding)

i'm gonna put you on hold now and tim will be available in just a few minutes

(advertisement)

(still holding)

(still holding)

(still holding)

(still holding)

we're sorry about the wait but tim will be available in just a few moments if that's ok with you

(ON HOLD)

(advertisement)

(hold time has run more than 3 minutes remain on hold qq ga)

Yes GA

(still holding)

(still holding)

(still holding)

(still holding)

(M)

(relaying instructions)

i am willing to take your call ok i just wanted to tell you that i am extremely sorry for hanging up on you i did not know that you are a customer i thought you were an automated telemarketer so please forgive me i did not mean ahh i did not mean to ahmm inconvenience you again i did not know that you were a customer i thought you were a telemarketer oh ahhm i just wanted apologize because i do not mean to ahhh i do not mean to discriminate or make you uncomfortable or anything like that i just want to apologize ahmm basically i'm happy to take your order and we appreciate your business ahmm just go ahead with what you would like to ahh add to your order GA

I forgot to add the nutraplanet 1 kilo tub of L-Leucine to my order. My order number is XXXXXX ga

i have the order i'm looking at the order right now please repeat what he would like or what they would like to add to the order

1 kilo of nutraplanet's l-leucine ga

(repeating message) ok please spell the product or whatever that was i can't understand GA

l-leucine. It's an ammino acid. do you use supplements or understand the products that you sell at all? I'm starting to get very disgusted wtih nutraplanet again ga

yes we do know what we sell i just could not understand i just could not understand due to the phone connection no don't type this are you a real person that i am speaking to is this an automated service qq GA

Tim, you are speaking to me, XXXX, through an interpreter. The interpreter types every single thing that you say. The interpreter also tells you every single thing that I type. This should not be taking half a hour. Can we please get on with the program here q I spend over a thousand dollars a year on supplements and spent over a decade as Bulk Nutrition's customer. I've only recently made the switch to your company due to some really crappy customer service from BulkNutrition recently and heard that you guys currently had the best service out there, and right now you guys are very quickly doing down the same road as Bulk Nutrition ga

i sincerely apologize XXXX for the misunderstanding i do not wish for you to be frustrated we never had a call like this so i am happy to add add the product you requested to your order please confirm that it is L-leucine 1 kilo ok ahmm i have added the 1 l-leucine kilo to your order and you will be charged (confirming amount) $26.95 i i'm charging your credit card for $26.95 which is the cost of l-leucine that you requested GA

Thank you tim. ga

the total of your order now comes to $286.19 GA

Thank you Tim. are we done here q ga

thank you ahmm your order will now be placed in processing and will ship out today please allow need to inform you that the 2 intra aid 25 serving will arrive separately from your main order at no additional cost to you GA

Is it going to be late or delayed q ga

no it will not be late or delayed it will arrive from a separate location GA

OK, thank you Tim. Can you please let Darren or Sam know that I will be posting about this experience on their store forum at Anabolic Minds, and that they will probably want to respond to my post this morning. Have a good day bye bye ga

(CALLED PARTY HAS HUNG UP)

(ANOTHER CALL Q GA)

No thank you relay, you have a good one too by ebye sk

(you're welcome)

i711.com CA#90350F SKSK

Session ended at 8:28am on Tuesday, June 16, 2009

 

[CrazyChemist]

hey man - i'm sorry that happened to you. I'm sure it must happen all the time when you call places and that must be really frustrating. In Tim's defense it seems he was unfamiliar with the procedure and did remain professional and friendly the entire conversation. I'm sure they didn't mean you any offense but I bet your patience runs out quickly having to deal with this all the time.

 

[Steveoph]

As you can tell by the paragraph starting "i am willing to take your call ok i just wanted to tell you that i am extremely sorry for hanging up on you i did not know that you are a customer i thought you were an automated telemarketer so please forgive me i did not mean ahh i did not mean to ahmm inconvenience you again" Tim definitely had no ill intent; this must have been the first time he experienced the relay service. Personally, I never have.

When trying to add the L-Leucine, you should be quite aware that sometimes things get mispronounced. He asks you to spell out the product since he couldn't understand it when read, at which point you retort "l-leucine. It's an ammino acid. do you use supplements or understand the products that you sell at all? I'm starting to get very disgusted wtih nutraplanet again". When I read that, it does come off a bit harsh, don't you think?

Anyways, from a 3rd party perspective, I'd say Tim did a good job. He had simply never experienced a call like yours before, and this was only the first time, so over the next 10 years there should be no issues. Also the pronunciation of Leucine caused a slight hiccup, but overall I think this was pretty smooth.

Also I know you called in, but we also respond lightning quick to emails directed to [email protected] as well which might be easier should you choose to use that route. Thank you for choosing NutraPlanet :thumbsup:

 

[warnerve]

As you can tell by the paragraph starting "i am willing to take your call ok i just wanted to tell you that i am extremely sorry for hanging up on you i did not know that you are a customer i thought you were an automated telemarketer so please forgive me i did not mean ahh i did not mean to ahmm inconvenience you again" Tim definitely had no ill intent; this must have been the first time he experienced the relay service. Personally, I never have.

When trying to add the L-Leucine, you should be quite aware that sometimes things get mispronounced. He asks you to spell out the product since he couldn't understand it when read, at which point you retort "l-leucine. It's an ammino acid. do you use supplements or understand the products that you sell at all? I'm starting to get very disgusted wtih nutraplanet again". When I read that, it does come off a bit harsh, don't you think?

Anyways, from a 3rd party perspective, I'd say Tim did a good job. He had simply never experienced a call like yours before, and this was only the first time, so over the next 10 years there should be no issues. Also the pronunciation of Leucine caused a slight hiccup, but overall I think this was pretty smooth.

Also I know you called in, but we also respond lightning quick to emails directed to [email protected] as well which might be easier should you choose to use that route. Thank you for choosing NutraPlanet :thumbsup:

agreed. seems Tim just wasn't familiar with the procedure and you seem to be taking it personally. Take a step back and relax. He wasn't trying to disrespect you, the transcript makes that pretty clear.

 

[Blesum]

Yeah, he apologized promptly when I pulled out the "discrimination card" on him which was appreciated, but was it necessary to call him three times just to finally be able to tell him to stop hanging up on me?

The point is, it would be wise to give the phone CSRs a 1 minute brief on how to properly handle deaf relay calls so that they know not to hang up. That way the "excellent customer service" reputation of NutraPlanet can be better maintained.

I typically use e-mail, but wanted to make sure my addition was made right away before the order was shipped due to the excessive shipping charges to Hawai'i.

-Blesum

 

[lector606]

Yeah, he apologized promptly when I pulled out the "discrimination card" on him which was appreciated, but was it necessary to call him three times just to finally be able to tell him to stop hanging up on me?

The point is, it would be wise to give the phone CSRs a 1 minute brief on how to properly handle deaf relay calls so that they know not to hang up. That way the "excellent customer service" reputation of NutraPlanet can be better maintained.

I typically use e-mail, but wanted to make sure my addition was made right away before the order was shipped due to the excessive shipping charges to Hawai'i.

-Blesum

Unbiased opinion if you're interested (I have worked in customer service for a few years): although you were not treated properly initially, it was clearly due to ignorance on the phone CSR's fault and not any sort of rude or malicious intent. The leucine thing appears to have been a genuine misunderstanding that you blew out of proportion, probably because you felt mistreated earlier.

Your situation was probably more of a pain in the ass than it should have been, but even if you're right and the CSR should have been better trained, why take it out on him? It's not his fault he doesn't know how to deal with your call.

As far as training people to take your type of calls, while I agree that as a rule of thumb phone CSR's should be, it's also important to recognize that most of these online companies are not nearly as big as they might seem and
a lot of the time one person has numerous responsibilities and might not be perfect at all of them. I know this isn't an excuse but it's a reason to cut the guy a little slack

Glad it worked out anyways.

 

[quigs]

Yeah, he apologized promptly when I pulled out the "discrimination card" on him which was appreciated, but was it necessary to call him three times just to finally be able to tell him to stop hanging up on me?

The point is, it would be wise to give the phone CSRs a 1 minute brief on how to properly handle deaf relay calls so that they know not to hang up. That way the "excellent customer service" reputation of NutraPlanet can be better maintained.

I typically use e-mail, but wanted to make sure my addition was made right away before the order was shipped due to the excessive shipping charges to Hawai'i.

-Blesum

I think that playing the "discrimination card" was a bit of a low blow on your part. Its pretty obvious that the guy was not trying to discriminate but rather was trying to avoid a solicitation call which would waste his and company time. He stated several times that he'd never had a call like yours, and I would think that you would understand this.

I realize that it must be frustrating on your end, but to take it out on the customer service rep for trying to do his job was inappropriate...as well as were the L-leucine insults. The guy obviously just misunderstood/couldn't hear you...and I'm sure he was just as frustrated as you were. The only difference is that he kept his cool.

To be honest, if you were that rude to me on the phone I'd probably have hung up as well.

 

[verner]

Hello Blesum. We do sincerely apologize about your experience. This was Tim's first deaf relay call, and in fact, No one here has ever taken one to my knowledge except for me, and I only have taken one. Having a hospital background I am more able to recognize when one of these services are used, but it can be difficult at times with the initial delay once the phone is answered. Talking with Tim, he said there was a long delay when he first picked up the phone and then a series of numbers were spoken which I presume was the operator ID. This really threw him off. One other thing that you probably are not aware of, is that the operator had a thick Spanish accent that was hard for him to understand as well. Regardless, how to take a deaf relay call is indeed something that will be touched on and talked about. Tim has been a very good and cordial CSR since coming on board, and his supplement knowledge is expanding every day. He certainly did not mean any discomfort or disrespect, and your next phone experience will be much smoother. We do appreciate you and your support Blesum !

 

[rippedforce63]

wow the discrimination thing was kind of a doosh bag move on your part. Impairment or not threatening him like that came off as sort of bitchy. And don't for one second compare nutra to bulk maybe 5 or 6 years ago but doing it now is an insult. Nutra is far and away the best online retailer out their in regards to customer service it sucks that you had one bad experience but the overwhelming number of people who shop at nutra do not. Like he said he'd never gotten a call like that before and probably thought you kept getting disconnected. Its called a mistake, :tool:

 

[Blesum]

I think that playing the "discrimination card" was a bit of a low blow on your part.

Low blow? OK wise guy, how else would I have been able to get Tim to stop hanging up on me? Try walking in my shoes for a day (or a couple of decades) before you start telling me that pulling the "discrimination card" to get a customer service rep to stop hanging up on me is a low blow. :dunno: If you've got a quicker, and more effective idea, I'd love to hear it. Pun not intended.

as well as were the L-leucine insults. The guy obviously just misunderstood/couldn't hear you...

Standard operating procedure for relay operators is to spell out unusual names. Sometimes they will try to pronounce something first and if it does not go over well, they will automatically spell out the item without prompting me. You will see that I had spelled out the item's name three times already from my end which indicates the operator should have already at least tried to spell it out a few times already. It is quite possible that the operator bypassed this procedure. Verner also mentions that the operator had a thick accent which is disappointing to hear on the relay operating center's part. They are not supposed to be hiring people as relay operators who are difficult to understand. I will report this to the operating center - This is how services for myself and thousands of other deaf people across the US can improve. This is also the reason for this thread - I'm sure I (and other deaf individuals) will never have a problem calling NutraPlanet again in the next several decades as a customer if I ever need to call again for some reason.

To be honest, if you were that rude to me on the phone I'd probably have hung up as well.

And it's a good thing you're not a CSR.

######

No worries Verner, it's all good. Tim apologized, learned something new, the addition was made to the order, and the order shipped out impressively quickly. Thank you for letting me know about the relay operator's accent.



If anybody else wants to keep on beating this horse and keeping this thread at the top of the page.... :disappointed:

-Blesum

 

[Blesum]

wow the discrimination thing was kind of a doosh bag move on your part.

See my first paragraph directed to Quigs in my above post. If you and Quigs want to rationally discuss other approaches, I'm game. I'm open to other ideas and try to at least learn something new every day.

And don't for one second compare nutra to bulk maybe 5 or 6 years ago but doing it now is an insult. Nutra is far and away the best online retailer out their in regards to customer service it sucks that you had one bad experience but the overwhelming number of people who shop at nutra do not.

That's why I stopped buying from BN. I heard great things about Nutra and liked their sale prices (even if some of them turned out to be OOS) and that's why I switched. I believe I've made 3 orders to date, and had problems with 2 out of 3 of them. Not very good stats so far, but like you said, many don't have any issues so I will try at least one, if not two more times.

-Blesum

 

[verner]

All of this aside, you have made some impressive gains going by your avatar. ! You are an inspiration to us all sir !

 

[searl12]

All of this aside, you have made some impressive gains going by your avatar. ! You are an inspiration to us all sir !

agreed. I think we should all stop insulting one another, obviously the guy is frustrated, I mean he probably goes through this crap daily, and he obviously thought wrong of how the CSR was acting. I can vouch for the Nutra CSR, they are good at their job and good people, and as you have all seen they are here remeding the situation.

Noone is perfect, and Im sure Tim feels bad about things getting so messed up. Mistakes might have been made, or might not of, the important thing is nutra corrected the mistake and took care of their paying customer!

I think Nutra needs to teach Tf supplements a thing or 2 about customer service, I was loyal to them, now my future business will be given to Nutra planet!

 

[DAdams91982]

I like how people are quick to hang someone out to dry when they themselves have not gone through any trials or tribulations that blesum endures each day. Take a walk in their shoes and see if you are so damn calm and do not get frustrated. Hell, I get people all pissed off, and riled up over a 2 sentence post many times.

****in Hippocrates.

Adams

 

[searl12]

Ya I can for sure understand him being upset and frustrated, I can only imagine how pd off id always be in his shoes. again kuddos to Nutra for handling it well!

 

[rugger48]

Blesum I am sorry to hear about the problems you have had with Customer service from Nutraplanet. I also keep having problems with Nutraplanet. Stryder keeps sending me pictures of him in lingere with all of my orders. As far as I concerned they have one more chance to make things right.



All kidding aside, I have used Nutra for I dont know how long, but they have been very reliable, and any problem I have had(very raraly have a problem) it is usaully taken care of pretty quickly. Im sure it will be a matter of time before Nutraplanet has this taken care of above and beyond of what you need done.

 

[searl12]

does he look good in that lingerie? I just might have to make an order!

 

[Steveoph]

does he look good in that lingerie? I just might have to make an order!

It was almost our new logo... it's that good :sgrin:

Sidenote: Rugger, all was taken care of on the phone, no outstanding issues here.

 

[searl12]

can u give us a preview? lol

I saw a dude in lingerie once as a joke......It wasnt a pretty site.... things just dont get held in place properly...if you know what I mean!

 

[Iron Lungz]

Agreed.

I like how people are quick to hang someone out to dry when they themselves have not gone through any trials or tribulations that blesum endures each day. Take a walk in their shoes and see if you are so damn calm and do not get frustrated. Hell, I get people all pissed off, and riled up over a 2 sentence post many times.

****in Hippocrates.

Adams

 

[searl12]

IRON BROTHER! your alive! havent seen you in a while? hows the rehab for that leg going?

 

[Iron Lungz]

Rehab is going very well - thanks for asking. You're the first one to ask me that question.

I have been in Ft.Carson for a few weeks gathering/selecting a team to travel with me over to the sh*t hole in August. I am going to Ft.Bragg this coming Monday to finalize a few things. I should be pretty top notch when I make my 4th deployment.

Thanks for asking, man!

IRON BROTHER! your alive! havent seen you in a while? hows the rehab for that leg going?

 

[quigs]

Low blow? OK wise guy, how else would I have been able to get Tim to stop hanging up on me? Try walking in my shoes for a day (or a couple of decades) before you start telling me that pulling the "discrimination card" to get a customer service rep to stop hanging up on me is a low blow. :dunno: If you've got a quicker, and more effective idea, I'd love to hear it. Pun not intended.

Easy. Explain the situation as you did without accusing him of discrimination. You can get your point across without insulting the CSR.

Save the discrimination card for when it really applies.

And it's a good thing you're not a CSR.

haha...agreed. I treat others with respect, and try not to associate with those who do not return the gesture. I'd be a shitty CSR.

 

[Kristofer68SS]

I like how people are quick to hang someone out to dry when they themselves have not gone through any trials or tribulations that blesum endures each day. Take a walk in their shoes and see if you are so damn calm and do not get frustrated. Hell, I get people all pissed off, and riled up over a 2 sentence post many times.

****in Hippocrates.

Adams

Yes sir...........you do.........lol

All of us fortunate folk take these gifts for granted...........When my day is going bad, which really isnt bad, I try to take time to realize the great things in my life and give thanks.

Thank you for reminding me of the gifts i do have........

Reps Adams.........

 

[JJC]

****in Hippocrates.

You mean hypocrites, right? I hope so. Not sure what the Father of Medicine has much to do with this situation... :lol:



And it seems like Tim handled himself pretty well. Deaf or not, after he realized the situation and apologized and was willing to help it seemed quite unnecessary to speak like that. Seems like Tim is owed an apology as well.

 

[searl12]

Yes sir...........you do.........lol

All of us fortunate folk take these gifts for granted...........When my day is going bad, which really isnt bad, I try to take time to realize the great things in my life and give thanks.

Thank you for reminding me of the gifts i do have........

Reps Adams.........

well said brother, I feel the same way these days...didnt used to...then i grew up (damn it sucks lol)

Think for 1 sec, we all see the world..we have our vision
most of us have the use of all our limbs
most of us have felt the touch and love of a woman
etc etc etc.,,,very soon these will all be gone for each one of us....some of us sooner than later too , so again when times get rough, which man for me they are, look outside and be thankful for the sun, the air, your frieds your eyes and your ears, doesnt sound like much with all the luxuries and what not we have, but I tell you one thing its good enough for me these days and those thoughts have been getting me through a whole lot.

sorry to ramble, and after I wipe my tears ill be ok.....jk im fine

In a nutshell be thankful for what you have, cause its all gonna be gone sooner than later!

 

[DAdams91982]

You mean hypocrites, right? I hope so. Not sure what the Father of Medicine has much to do with this situation... :lol:



And it seems like Tim handled himself pretty well. Deaf or not, after he realized the situation and apologized and was willing to help it seemed quite unnecessary to speak like that. Seems like Tim is owed an apology as well.

Nope... I surely meant the father of medicine. I don't know how you didn't get that!

Adams

 

[weltweite]

Pulling the discrimination card when clearly the man doesn't know whats going on (therefore not discriminating) seemed quite unnecessary in my opinion.

Also inspite of your frustration you now understand the translator is not translating properly. You now found out he had a thick spanish accent.. that made it difficult. It seems that you jumped the gun a little.

At my job, one of my secondary responsibilities is to answer the phone when someone calls my business. Half the time it is those bullshit automated sales recordings. I hang up without a second thought. Part of getting our way in life is to be understanding and patient. It seems you got your way... however.

Next time chew your translator out and tell him to talk to the person correctly before you chew the person on the other line out..

You showed complete disrespect when you didn't explain the leucine part after he asked you nicely.

"1 kilo of nutraplanet's l-leucine ga

(repeating message) ok please spell the product or whatever that was i can't understand GA

l-leucine. It's an ammino acid. do you use supplements or understand the products that you sell at all? I'm starting to get very disgusted wtih nutraplanet again ga"

That is not showing patience, understanding, or respect.. I think your wanting others to apologize to you, when you should be the one apologizing.

 

[Jayhawkk]

I'll help with the dead horse beatings...

Let me start out by saying that I have a lot of experience with phone relay services and know how to use them. However, they are not used by all companies on a regular or even a semi-regular basis so it's very possible to run into some companies who have never experienced a phone relay. My impression is that he did not treat 'you' with any disrepect or malice nor did the company.

Misunderstandings are misunderstandings and they happen. You just happen to have a disability that you have to deal with this particular issue a lot. Being deaf doesn't give you an automatic discrimination card to pull at the drop of a dime either.

Being in the military, police,a firefighter,teacher, deaf,blind or another other position/special circumstance does not grant a person to being above anyone else.

While you and some others may believe we should have to walk in your shoes to understand the hardships, don't forget to put yourself in the shoes of the other guy. Someone in a new situation can't be expected to act the same as those who encounter that type of situation all of the time.


/high horse

 

[Blesum]

Oh, I know he had no intention of mistreating me, nor did he have malice.

The two of you are jumping on me for pulling out the discrimination card to get this guy to stop hanging up on me. Like I challenged the others who tried to jump down my throat previously, show me a quicker, more effective way to get a business to stop hanging up on me so I can finally get a word in. Walk in my shoes for a couple of decades making these phone calls and see if you can come up with a better method. If you can, I would LOVE to hear it (pun not intended). Hell, I'll even buy you dinner if you visit my island.

Weltwite - Just how am I supposed to know that one of you guys might have a crap accent? You for example? I only read what the operator types on the screen. That's it. That's all I know about the person. I would imagine that as a general rule for hiring voice translators, that they need to be able to speak clearly so I'm a bit puzzled by this claim. Secondly, like I said earlier, it is standard procedure for these operators to SPELL out names, addresses, and unusual words. If I was a betting man, I would bet that the operator did spell it out.

Dead horse is right. :yup: For all of our sakes, don't bring up something that has already been addressed/pointed out. :wave2: There's no need to have this thread bumped back up to the top of the page, and I don't think Nutraplanet likes it either.

-Blesum

 

[Jayhawkk]

Like I challenged the others who tried to jump down my throat previously, show me a quicker, more effective way to get a business to stop hanging up on me so I can finally get a word in

.
Since you're on this website and have internet access I would of sent a PM or made a public thread detailing my situation and knowledge of how i always get hung up on prior to calling. This would give NP a chance to handle your call better AND to recognize that they may have a certain aspect of CS that has not been addressed to date.

So you could avoid the frustration
You could help a company better it's customer service
You could get your order completed without hassle
Everyone would be happy in the end
threads like this would be averted.


I look forward to dinner!

 

[Blesum]

.
I look forward to dinner!

:lol: The offer is specifically on how to get a business to stop hanging up right away/automatically, but nice try...

I didn't quite know who to PM, so I posted it in the nutraplanet forum. It's not like I posted this in General Chat or Anabolics. Yes, I could have used PM and in retrospect that probably would have been better. But look at it this way, at least 50 more guys know about relaying services now and will be less likely to hang up automatically in the future so... :dunno:

-Paul

 

[Jayhawkk]

Don't get me wrong i'm not jumping down your throat but just as you wanted to outline some issues I wanted to address them as well to make sure third party viewers wouldn't just key in on certain aspects of the conversation and be left with an incomplete picture.

Like I said, I have a lot of interactions with these relays and I know they're frustrating in and of themselves when you're not having to deal with untrained parties. Adding in a couple of hangups and i'd have little patience too.

Either way i'm still holding on to the fact you owe me dinner. Now just got to win an argument to provide a round trip flight