Choline and Brain Fog

  1. Choline and Brain Fog


    Choline seems to give me massive brain fog. Can I take something like one of the racatems in order to reduce the choline in my system?

    Also, do things hyperizine A and ALCAR increase choline?


  2. ALCAR increases acetylcholine in the brain.

    Huperzine acts as an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor, which prevents breakdown of acetylcholine.

    So yes, ALCAR increases it, and huperzine indirectly increases it by keeping it in your system longer.
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  3. Why do you feel you need to take it? Your reaction is not all that uncommon. Choline can cause brain fog and depression when it isn't needed.

  4. It is just very very hard to focus. When I am reading something from my computer I have a very hard to focusing and actually getting meaning from the words. It also feels a bit like tiredness. Kind of like everything I did was after being awake for 24 hours.

    However, I am not 100% sure it was the choline now. I have seemed to resolve the issue by supplementing a couple grams of L-Tyrosine, unless it just resolved itself for a bit.... I am wondering if I was very low on dopamine? The first couple doses of L-Tyrosine were making me feel very euphoric, way too much so for an amino acid. It has leveled out a bit now.

    I am wondering if it is safe to take 2 to 3 grams of L-Tyrosine a day for the foreseeable future. It should be very safe just being an amino, correct?

  5. Quote Originally Posted by drseuss6969 View Post
    It is just very very hard to focus. When I am reading something from my computer I have a very hard to focusing and actually getting meaning from the words. It also feels a bit like tiredness. Kind of like everything I did was after being awake for 24 hours.

    However, I am not 100% sure it was the choline now. I have seemed to resolve the issue by supplementing a couple grams of L-Tyrosine, unless it just resolved itself for a bit.... I am wondering if I was very low on dopamine? The first couple doses of L-Tyrosine were making me feel very euphoric, way too much so for an amino acid. It has leveled out a bit now.

    I am wondering if it is safe to take 2 to 3 grams of L-Tyrosine a day for the foreseeable future. It should be very safe just being an amino, correct?
    It''s pretty safe even in those doses. I mean you're getting gram sized amounts if you eat large amounts of certain proteins anyway your entire life.

    Some people respond better to L-DOPA as it's a more direct precursor to Dopamine. You may also like DOPAMIND it's a blocker of Dopamine and Phenylethylamine breakdown. Kind of similar mode of action as Huperzine A but not for Acetylcholine. Think of it as a natural form of the dopamine drug deprenyl.

    When it comes to focus Phenylethylamine really is the main target you want to enhance as it's how the main ADHD drugs work like Adderall and Ritalin. You can increase it by taking L-Phenylalanine (a precursor to PEA), taking PEA directly in high doses since it breaks down fast, taking MAO-B inhibitors like DOPAMIND or Deprenyl, or lastly taking phenylethylamine related drugs or supplements like Ephedrine, Eria Jarensis Extract, N-Methyl-B-Phenylethylamine, N,N-Dimethylphenethylamine, etc.
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  6. Cool I will look into these. Is it Dopamind by life extension you are speaking of?

  7. Quote Originally Posted by drseuss6969 View Post
    Cool I will look into these. Is it Dopamind by life extension you are speaking of?
    Yes it's also known as Neuravenaģ Wild Green Oat extract.

    We distribute it at the best price here.

    You can read more about it here: http://www.neuravena.com

    Here are some studies: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/?term=Neuravena
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  8. I love l-dopa. I remember the OG BPS Endosurge that had this and, man it made you feel amazing.

  9. Quote Originally Posted by kisaj View Post
    I love l-dopa. I remember the OG BPS Endosurge that had this and, man it made you feel amazing.
    L-DOPA is great especially in 500 mg and higher doses short term. I take it with EGCG to reduce conversion into dopamine in the body and increase levels in the brain. Deprenyl is still one of my favorite Dopamine enhancers.
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  10. Quote Originally Posted by NeuroTropic View Post
    L-DOPA is great especially in 500 mg and higher doses short term. I take it with EGCG to reduce conversion into dopamine in the body and increase levels in the brain. Deprenyl is still one of my favorite Dopamine enhancers.
    That sounds like a good idea! I might have to give it a Try. Thanks for your help!
  11. Choline and Brain Fog


    Quote Originally Posted by NeuroTropic View Post
    L-DOPA is great especially in 500 mg and higher doses short term. I take it with EGCG to reduce conversion into dopamine in the body and increase levels in the brain. Deprenyl is still one of my favorite Dopamine enhancers.
    Short term? How long?
    And for what reason?

    I'm thinking of trying Core ZAP which has a hefty dose of mucuna pruriens, so I want to be careful in how long I take it. I'll probably do 1/2-3/4 scoop due to the 400mg caff at a full scoop

  12. Quote Originally Posted by DCx View Post
    Short term? How long?
    And for what reason?

    I'm thinking of trying Core ZAP which has a hefty dose of mucuna pruriens, so I want to be careful in how long I take it. I'll probably do 1/2-3/4 scoop due to the 400mg caff at a full scoop
    As needed. Really varies on the person and use. Some take as needed, others take daily but cycle off weekends, or some find it works best daily. People tend to take it for either it's HGH releasing effects or it's ability to raise Dopamine levels. Raising Dopamine blocks the side effects of prolactin and can help you reduce your sexual refractory period so you can go again with your sexual partner sooner or right away, in some cases repeatedly. Or for it's effects on memory, mood, and other benefits associated with higher levels of dopamine. As far as it's HGH effects.

    It has been known for over 30 years that it is an effective stimulant of human growth hormone (HGH) release. In 1970, Boyd and colleagues found that a 500mg oral dose …”caused a significant rise in plasma growth hormone in PD patients, initially starting therapy or on chronic L-dopa therapy for as long as 11 months. The rise in plasma growth hormone persisted for 120 minutes after the administration of the drug.” (4). Boden and his co-workers gave 500mg of the drug orally to four male and five female volunteers. “HGH levels rose sharply at 45 minutes from the basal value of 0.8mg/ml, to a maximum of 10.0mg/ml at 90 minutes (p<0.001) and declined thereafter. This rise occurred in eight of the nine subjects.” (5). Hayek and Crawford reported that six out of seven “constitutionally short children” responded to oral L-dopa (200-500mg), “…with elevations in HGH concentration above 7mg/ml, peak levels occurring between 30 and 120 minutes after drug administration..”. (6).

    In 1975, Ajlouni and colleagues reported the effects of 500mg of oral L-dopa on eight normal and 8 non-obese insulin-dependent diabetic subjects. The normal subjects increased their plasma HGH from 1.5mg/ml before L-dopa, to an average 21mg/ml at 90 minutes post L-dopa, with all subjects showing at least a 10 mg/ml increase. The diabetics increased from 2.5mg/ml to 20mg/ml from 60-90 minutes post L-dopa. Giving 100 grams (3 _ ounces) of glucose with, or 30 minutes after the drug totally suppressed the expected HGH increase (7).

    Obesity has been shown to blunt HGH release after oral L-dopa. Laurian and his co-workers tested 17 obese, non-diabetic and six normal weight volunteers. All 17 obese subjects failed to respond to L-dopa, while the normal weight subjects had HGH increases of 10-11mg/ml at 90 and 120 minutes after the drug was administered. The 17 obese men and women subsequently lost 12-50kg. After weight loss, 8 people secreted HGH in response to L-dopa, but at levels only 50-60% of the normal weight people. 9 formerly obese people still failed to respond to it (8).

    Barbarino and colleagues gave 500mg orally to 12 obese people, with no significant HGH increases. When some of the subjects were given 40mg oral Propranolol, two hours before L-dopa, they then showed HGH response, although at only 50-75% of the level shown by 12 normal weight subjects given L-dopa, whose serum HGH levels reached 7 to 32mg/ml 60-120 minutes after L-dopa (9).

    Greenspan et al. compared HGH response to L-dopa in 44 young patients (31-44 years of age) and 42 older patients (64-88 years of age). All were considered “healthy participants”. Plasma HGH increased by 221% in the young patients and 167% in the older patients. The post L-dopa HGH levels were similar in young and old (4.5 and 4.8mg/ml) (10).

    The preceding studies illustrate some of the studies showing that 500mg oral L-dopa is an effective stimulator of HGH release. Whether a person is male or female, young or old, diabetic or not, thin or obese (possibly with Propranolol), a PD patient or not, L-dopa is a natural HGH-releasing agent when taken on an empty stomach. For those who can’t afford HGH injections, or just don’t like self-injecting,L-dopa may provide a reasonable alternative.

    Boyd, A. et al (1970) “Stimulation of human-growth-hormone secretion by L-dopa” New Engl J Med 283: 1425-29.
    Boden, G. et al (1971) “The influence of levodopa (L-dopa) on release of anterior pituitary hormones in man” Clin Res 19:716.
    Hayek, A & Crawford, J. (1972) “L-dopa and pituitary hormone secretion” J Clin Endocr 34:764-66.
    Ajlouni, K. et al (1975) “Effect of glucose on the growth hormone response to L-dopa in normal and diabetic subjects” Diabetes 24:633-36.
    Laurian, L. et al (1982) “Growth hormone response to L-dopa in the thinned obese” Isr J Med Sci 18:625-29.
    Barbarino, A. et al “Growth hormone response to propranolol and L-dopa in obese subjects” Metabolism 27:275-78.
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  13. Oh yeah I was just speaking about its nootropic properties, I'm just worried and undecided on the dosing scheme, because I heard being on ldopa too long messes up ur neurotransmitters? Can't remember, but something to that extent.

    Thanks in advance

  14. Quote Originally Posted by DCx View Post
    Oh yeah I was just speaking about its nootropic properties, I'm just worried and undecided on the dosing scheme, because I heard being on ldopa too long messes up ur neurotransmitters? Can't remember, but something to that extent.

    Thanks in advance
    There's no studies showing any issues in healthy adults. Most people do higher dosing for HGH but like the benefits for dopamine as well which is more short term. I suggest trying it for a week at higher doses and see how you feel.
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  15. Quote Originally Posted by NeuroTropic View Post
    L-DOPA is great especially in 500 mg and higher doses short term. I take it with EGCG to reduce conversion into dopamine in the body and increase levels in the brain. Deprenyl is still one of my favorite Dopamine enhancers.
    Picked up some EGCG. What dose do you recommend?

  16. Quote Originally Posted by NeuroTropic View Post
    L-DOPA is great especially in 500 mg and higher doses short term. I take it with EGCG to reduce conversion into dopamine in the body and increase levels in the brain. Deprenyl is still one of my favorite Dopamine enhancers.
    You donít happen to sell Deprenyl on your site do you? I have wanted to try it out for awhile, but havenít been able to find it.

  17. Quote Originally Posted by drseuss6969 View Post
    Picked up some EGCG. What dose do you recommend?
    At least a few hundred mg to inhibit peripheral dopa decarboxylase levels.
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  18. Quote Originally Posted by ELROCK View Post
    You don’t happen to sell Deprenyl on your site do you? I have wanted to try it out for awhile, but haven’t been able to find it.
    Pm inbound.
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  19. Quote Originally Posted by NeuroTropic View Post
    L-DOPA is great especially in 500 mg and higher doses short term. I take it with EGCG to reduce conversion into dopamine in the body and increase levels in the brain. Deprenyl is still one of my favorite Dopamine enhancers.
    L-DOPA + PEA + DEPRENYL = PARTY TIME

  20. OP - what type of choline are you using?

    I use Alpha GPC or Citicoline and have never had brain fog from these. I use them without nootropics as well.
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