Israeli jets target Gaza tunnels

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    Quote Originally Posted by poison View Post
    Well, I'm here telling how it is, first hand. I was drafted with 500 other recruits, all new and untrained, just like me. We spent a year and 2 months together, straight. Then I went on to sniper school in a different location, to sergeants school in still another place with guys from 20-30 different units, I was in lebanon, in Hebron, you name it. There are, at any given time, ~150 guys just like me, Americans, serving in the IDF, not to mention S. Africans, Mexicans, Filipinos, and a whole lot more, all in different units.
    Did they teach you any Krav Maga techniques? I've heard nothing but positives about IDF training. Like you said, their urban tactics are in a class all their own.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    CSCC, Ohio, Humanities 113. OSU deals the same thing. Get over history. You sound like someone who only reads Dr. Seuss books.....

    Columbus State Community College: Education That Works?

    Bwahahaha....

    Sounds like you also took a course on 'How To Dig Your Own Grave' - hilarious!

    It's not necessary to list my qualifications or achievements, but I will admit to reading Dr Seuss books to my kids.

    Perhaps you should quit while you're ahead there soldier, but if it's war you want I got plenty of ammo
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilentBob187 View Post
    Did they teach you any Krav Maga techniques? I've heard nothing but positives about IDF training. Like you said, their urban tactics are in a class all their own.
    Yes, I learned extensive krav maga, but mostly post-military, in a gov't course.

    Israeli urban tactics are pretty innovative, particularly the use of tanks in urban areas, the use of explosives, and the use of caterpillars.
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    The IDF ethical doctrine:

    The Spirit of the IDF

    The Israeli Defense Force is the army of the State of Israel. Its activities are subject to the authority of the democratic civil government of Israel and to its laws. The purpose of the IDF is to preserve the State of Israel, to protect its independence, and to foil attempts by its enemies to disrupt the normal life within it. The soldiers of the IDF are obligated to fight, and to devote every effort even at the risk of their lives, to protect the State of Israel, its citizens and residents. Soldiers of the IDF shall act according to the values of the IDF and its commands, while abiding by the law, upholding human dignity, and respecting the values of Israel as a Jewish and democratic state.
    Spirit of the IDF-Definition and Sources

    The Spirit of the IDF defines the value identity of the IDF, it ought to underlie the activities of every IDF soldier, throughout his or her regular or reserve service.

    The Spirit of the IDF and the practical rules derived from it are the ethical code of the IDF. The Spirit of the IDF shall direct the IDF, its soldiers, commanders, units and corps in the shaping of their activities. According to The Spirit of the IDF they shall conduct, educate and examine themselves and their fellows.
    The Spirit of the IDF draws on four sources:

    * The heritage of the IDF and its combat legacy as Israel's army of Defense.
    * The heritage of the State of Israel, its democratic principles, laws and institutions.
    * The heritage of the Jewish People throughout the ages.
    * Universal moral values based on the value and dignity of all human beings.

    Fundamental Values:


    Defense of the State, its Citizens and its Residents - The purpose of the IDF is to protect the existence of the State of Israel, its independence and the security of its citizens and residents.

    Patriotism and Loyalty to the State - Service in the IDF is based on patriotism and on commitment and devotion to the state of Israel, a democratic state which is the national home of the Jewish people, and to its citizens and residents.

    Human Dignity - The IDF and its soldiers are obligated to preserve human dignity. All human beings are of inherent value regardless of race, creed, nationality, gender, status or role.

    The Values:


    Dedication to Mission and the Pursuit of Victory - The soldier shall fight and act courageously in the face of all dangers and obstacles and shall pursue his mission with determination and good judgment, even risking his life when necessary.


    Responsibility - The soldier shall see himself as an active participant in the defense of the state of Israel, its citizens and residents. His actions shall be characterized by constant involvement, initiative and diligence, demonstrating good judgment within the scope of his authority, and he shall be ready to take responsibility for the consequences of his actions.


    Reliability - The soldier shall present matters truthfully, fully and accurately, in planning, in execution and in reporting. The soldier shall act so that his comrades and commanders will be able to rely on him in the fulfillment of missions.


    Personal Example - The soldier shall conduct himself as required, and shall behave in the manner he expects of others, out of the recognition of his ability and responsibility, both within the army and without to serve as a role-model for others.


    Human Life - The soldier shall always act with reason and caution, baring in mind the supreme value of human life. In combat, he will endanger himself and his comrades to extent necessary for the fulfillment of the mission.


    "Purity of Arms" (Morality in Warfare) - The soldier shall make use of his weaponry and power only for the fulfillment of the mission and solely to the extent required; he will maintain his humanity even in combat. The soldier shall not employ his weaponry and power in order to harm non-combatants or prisoners of war, and shall do all he can to avoid harming their lives, body, honor and property.


    Professionalism - The soldier shall endeavor to acquire the professional expertise and proficiency required to carry out his role and shall implement them, continuously seeking to improve his own achievements and those of his unit.


    Discipline - The soldier shall do his utmost to carry out fully and successfully whatever is required of him, according to the letter and the spirit of the orders. The soldier shall issue only lawful orders and shall not obey those which are manifestly unlawful.


    Comradeship - The soldier shall act out of solidarity and devotion to his fellow-soldiers, and shall always come to their assistance when they are in need or depend upon him, despite all danger and hardship, even at the risk of his life.


    Vocation - The soldier shall see his military service as a vocation; he shall be willing to contribute all he can to defend the state of Israel, its citizens and residents. The soldier shall consider himself a representative of the IDF, operating on the basis and within the constraints of the authority assigned to him by military orders.
    http://web.archive.org/web/200707041...sp?sl=EN&id=32

    Every IDF soldier carries a small booklet, call Tohar Ha'Nashek, or 'Purity of Arms'. This book pertains to the moral use of weapons, and how to use that power humanely and for good.
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    I know I"m wading in late, but I can't believe someone is on here touting their "knowledge" from a humanities 113. Are you effing kidding me?
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    If you guys haven't picked up on it, the gaza op is in cooperation with Egypt and Jordan, neither of whom wants the Islamists to gain power anywhere, even Israel or Gaza. No one wants that **** around.

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/topNew...50138J20090102
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    Quote Originally Posted by poison View Post
    If you guys haven't picked up on it, the gaza op is in cooperation with Egypt and Jordan, neither of whom wants the Islamists to gain power anywhere, even Israel or Gaza. No one wants that **** around.

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/topNew...50138J20090102
    yeah, I was figuring that was the reason...

    I'll tell you what, in our part of the world Malaysia is real hardarse on the extremists - throw their arses straight into jail.

    Indonesia on the other hand is riddled with them - a real threat to the region, and in particular Australia.
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    Quote Originally Posted by poison View Post
    If you guys haven't picked up on it, the gaza op is in cooperation with Egypt and Jordan, neither of whom wants the Islamists to gain power anywhere, even Israel or Gaza. No one wants that **** around.

    Egypt and Jordan crack down on anti-Israel rallies | Top News | Reuters
    This is what the Bible says about it:

    Psalm 83 (NIV Bible)

    1 O God, do not keep silent;
    be not quiet, O God, be not still.
    2 See how your enemies are astir,
    how your foes rear their heads.
    3 With cunning they conspire against your people;
    they plot against those you cherish.
    4 "Come," they say, "let us destroy them as a nation,
    that the name of Israel be remembered no more."
    5 With one mind they plot together;
    they form an alliance against you-
    6 the tents of Edom and the Ishmaelites,
    of Moab and the Hagrites,
    7 Gebal, Ammon and Amalek,
    Philistia, with the people of Tyre.
    8 Even Assyria has joined them
    to lend strength to the descendants of Lot.
    9 Do to them as you did to Midian,
    as you did to Sisera and Jabin at the river Kishon,
    10 who perished at Endor
    and became like refuse on the ground.
    11 Make their nobles like Oreb and Zeeb,
    all their princes like Zebah and Zalmunna,
    12 who said, "Let us take possession
    of the pasturelands of God."
    13 Make them like tumbleweed, O my God,
    like chaff before the wind.
    14 As fire consumes the forest
    or a flame sets the mountains ablaze,
    15 so pursue them with your tempest
    and terrify them with your storm.
    16 Cover their faces with shame
    so that men will seek your name, O LORD.
    17 May they ever be ashamed and dismayed;
    may they perish in disgrace.
    18 Let them know that you, whose name is the LORD—
    that you alone are the Most High over all the earth.

    What this sounds like is an Arab/Muslim force coming against Israel, consisting of Saudi Arabia, yes Jordan too it seems, Lebanon, Iraq, Syria and Iran. Turkey can go either way. Egypt apparently won't join the Arab federation and may even be an ally to Israel in the end, though it says they do get hit hard anyway just being in that area when certain events occur.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakellpet View Post
    Columbus State Community College: Education That Works?

    Bwahahaha....

    Sounds like you also took a course on 'How To Dig Your Own Grave' - hilarious!

    It's not necessary to list my qualifications or achievements, but I will admit to reading Dr Seuss books to my kids.

    Perhaps you should quit while you're ahead there soldier, but if it's war you want I got plenty of ammo
    Considering I have laready lost any confidence you know anything of history, go ahead. You have yet to argue history, you have only acted like an angry child.
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    Quote Originally Posted by poison View Post
    The IDF ethical doctrine:



    http://web.archive.org/web/200707041...sp?sl=EN&id=32

    Every IDF soldier carries a small booklet, call Tohar Ha'Nashek, or 'Purity of Arms'. This book pertains to the moral use of weapons, and how to use that power humanely and for good.

    And plenty of Christians carry bibles..... and um....it says not to do many of the things they end up doing. So......what makes you think soldiers, in war, would follow alittle booklet, of much less importance?
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    Quote Originally Posted by atjnutrition2 View Post
    I know I"m wading in late, but I can't believe someone is on here touting their "knowledge" from a humanities 113. Are you effing kidding me?
    As in the basics. There is much more info in history about it. Have any of you looked into it? No.....just content with your own illusionary self satisfied knowledge.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DR.D View Post
    Why is Israel hitting back so hard now? If you keep getting punched in the face, how many times would it take before you finally got pissed and hit back? Why do the Arabs hate them so much? Because they do not share in the Jews inheritance and it make them envious. Sibling *****ry is a common phenomena, it's not hard to grasp this concept. The Bible said his hand (Ishmael's) will always be against his brother (Isaac). Which part of the word always don't people understand? Ishmael has birth right, but he's not the chosen son, that's the nature of the problem. There is no diplomatic solution and there never was!
    I think that this is true to a degree. However, it runs deeper.

    Over the many centuries that this has gone on, there has been little to no attempt at resolution. And please no one quote anything attempt post WWI as resolution. I am speaking as a jew, and I can tell you that both sides have been "crapped" on by powers greater than theirs. However, as it stands now, the Israeli's and the IDF are not going to lay back. in fact, they will push harder and harder. To be honest, Hamas and any other organization is going to have to tread very carefully at this point.

    Regardless of justification, millenia of persecution and mistreatment have led to what will unfold during the months and years ahead, and the larger, and greater industrialized nations have no one to blame but themselves and their ancestors

    Oh and zero, please dont think that a humanities course is going to offer you even the least bit of insight, especially an "entry level" one. THat is just silly. No offense
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    And plenty of Christians carry bibles..... and um....it says not to do many of the things they end up doing. So......what makes you think soldiers, in war, would follow alittle booklet, of much less importance?
    Because I've been there, in that war, and seen it in action.
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    You guys don't get it. Hamas is an avowed terror organization, recognized as such by the US, EU, UN, Japan, Jordan, Egypt, and many others. The Human Rights Watch stated in 2002 that Hamas' leaders "should be held accountable for the war crimes and crimes against humanity" that have been committed by its members.


    Hamas is listed as a terrorist organization by Canada,[18] the European Union,[19][20][21][22] Israel,[23] Japan,[24] and the United States,[25] and is banned in Jordan.[26] Australia[27] and the United Kingdom[28] list only the military wing of Hamas, the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, as a terrorist organization. The United States and the European Union have both implemented restrictive measures against Hamas on an international level.[19][29]
    You should listen to Jordan, they know WTF they're dealing with:


    September 1970 is known as the Black September (Arabic: أيلول الأسود) in Arab history and sometimes is referred to as the "era of regrettable events." It was a month when Hashemite King Hussein of Jordan moved to quash the autonomy of Palestinian organizations and restore his monarchy's rule over the country.[2] The violence resulted in the deaths of tens of thousands of people, the vast majority Palestinian.[1] Armed conflict lasted until July 1971 with the expulsion of the PLO and thousands of Palestinian fighters to Lebanon.

    In the late 1960s, the Fatah faction of the PLO had set up a state within a state, inside Jordan. Increasing numbers of armed, uniformed Palestinians set up checkpoints, collected taxes, and refused to travel with Jordanian license plates on their cars. In the southern zone, bordering on Israel, they demanded and seized autonomous control, rejecting the king's authority in Jordan. The aligned Palestinian organizations carried out a series of deadly attacks against Israel, from Jordanian territory. Guerrilla raids against Israel, were mounted from bases in the West Bank, Lebanon and Jordan. King Hussein who became increasingly devoted to the promotion of peace in the region, made various peaceful attempts to re-establish his authority in Jordan, attempting a seven-point agreement with the PLO in November of 1968, along with fostering peace between Israel and Egypt.

    Ultimately, Palestinian fighters aimed to control increasing amounts of territory, and Fatah were gaining volunteers. At the beginning of September 1970, the activities of the leftist Palestinian organizations in Jordan turned into open defiance of King Hussein himself. On September 1, a failed attempt on Hussein's life was made while he was on his way to the Amman airport. Within a few days, Palestinian groups hijacked planes on multiple international flights. The Jordanian king quickly lost control of his kingdom. At the height of the drama of the hijacked planes, the Palestinians declared the area of Irbid in the north of the country a "liberated region," and announced that they were preparing for "the showdown."

    The Jordanian army began plans to expel the Fedayeen and PLO. On the morning of September 16, Hussein declared martial law. On September 17, the military attack began. Patton tanks from the 60th armored brigade, accompanied by armored vehicles, entered Amman from all sides, and attacked the headquarters of the Palestinian organizations.
    Hamas' charter is full of anti-semitic, conspiracy theoryist rhetoric, and vows for the destruction of the state of ISrael:

    They stood behind the French and the Communist Revolutions and behind most of the revolutions we hear about here and there. They also used the money to establish clandestine organizations which are spreading around the world, in order to destroy societies and carry out Zionist interests. Such organizations are: the Freemasons, Rotary Clubs, Lions Clubs, B’nai B’rith and the like. All of them are destructive spying organizations. They also used the money to take over control of the Imperialist states and made them colonize many countries in order to exploit the wealth of those countries and spread their corruption therein. As regards local and world wars, it has come to pass and no one objects, that they stood behind World War I, so as to wipe out the Islamic Caliphate. They collected material gains and took control of many sources of wealth. They obtained the Balfour Declaration and established the League of Nations in order to rule the world by means of that organization. They also stood behind World War II, where they collected immense benefits from trading with war materials and prepared for the establishment of their state.

    the Hamas has been looking forward to implement Allah’s promise whatever time it might take. The prophet, prayer and peace be upon him, said: The time will not come until Muslims will fight the Jews (and kill them); until the Jews hide behind rocks and trees, which will cry: O Muslim! there is a Jew hiding behind me, come on and kill him! This will not apply to the Gharqad, which is a Jewish tree (cited by Bukhari and Muslim).
    Hamas, in Decmber, was considering the official enstatement of Taliban-style Sharia:


    The Hamas parliament in the Gaza Strip voted in favor of a law allowing courts to mete out sentences in the spirit of Islam, the London-based Arab daily Al Hayat reported Wednesday.
    Hamas leader Ismael Haniyeh...

    Hamas leader Ismael Haniyeh attends the first session of Hamas-dominated Palestinian parliament.
    Photo: AP [file]
    Slideshow: Pictures of the week

    According to the bill, approved in its second reading and awaiting a third reading before the approval of Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas, as the Palestinian constitution demands, courts will be able to condemn offenders to a plethora of violent punitive measures in line with Sharia Law.

    Such punishments include whipping, severing hands, crucifixion and hanging. The bill reserves death sentences to people who negotiate with a foreign government "against Palestinian interests" and engage in any activity that can "hurt Palestinian morale."

    According to the report, any Palestinian caught drinking or selling wine would suffer 40 lashes at the whipping post if the bill passes. Thieves caught red-handed would lose their right hand.
    This has been in effect, unofficially, for some time now:


    So-called honour killings have been carried out here in the past, but even in this ramshackle, anarchistic and fractured society, women have never before been hunted down so blatantly.

    Gaza, more so than anywhere else in the Palestinian territories, has been a feudal battleground of countless agendas, historical enmity, ideology and greed. Historically, clans and tribes have ruled the roost here, with factionalised militant ideologies running a close second. But the balance appears to have shifted during the past six months. Strict observance of Sunni Islam seems to have encouraged a fundamentalist trend that is making a play for influence, through the rigid enforcement of radical Islamic law espoused by the global jihad network that follows the bin Laden world view.

    Sharia law appears to have drifted into Gaza, alarming Muslim and militant groups alike and sharply rattling the neighbour across the security barrier, Israel.

    Change had begun in Gaza long before its women began to fall. Late last year, several internet cafes and music stores were bombed. In February, six pharmacies in the southern town of Rafah were also attacked because they persisted in selling Viagra to youths. In the past year, the name of a new group, first heard of after the capture of Israeli soldier Gilad Shalit last June, persistently has been linked to the unrest.

    It calls itself the Army of Islam and consists of self-styled morality warriors who claim links to al-Qa'ida. Hamas, the most powerful of the militant groups and a joint partner in the new unity government, steadfastly denies that al-Qa'ida has established an organised presence in Gaza. If it is true that al-Qa'ida has done so, it cripples Hamas's claims to be fighting for a Palestinian state alone and not being standard bearers of the global jihads.
    In other words, Hamas is full of ****. Gaza voted en masse for Hamas, and brought them into power, despite their agenda being known. And some of you guys here are DEFENDING them? What kind of ****ed up alternate reality allows you the moral and intellectual 'flexibility' to see Hamas as the good guys and Israel as the bad?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    As in the basics. There is much more info in history about it. Have any of you looked into it? No.....just content with your own illusionary self satisfied knowledge.
    hush now child. I hear the bells at community college ringing and mommy has packed you some sandwiches for lunch.

    Run along now, you have plenty of learning to do.
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    Rah Rah Hezbollah~


    I'm rooting for Gaza.
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    Quote Originally Posted by dexterford View Post
    I'm rooting for Gaza.
    innocent gazans, or 'gaza'?
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    Just take the names out and look at it like this

    1) Group a has been firing rockets at group b during a cease fire

    2) Group b has restrained themselves for quite a time while their members were in danger

    3) Group b has aked numerous times for group a to stop the rockets and group a has responded by more rocket fire


    What should group b do?

    A) keep getting pounded by a lesser force (who says they will never stop) and put their citizens even more at risk but keep the media happy

    or

    B)



    Im an option B man


    Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths . Proverbs 3:5-6
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    Quote Originally Posted by poison View Post
    You guys don't get it. Hamas is an avowed terror organization ...
    Check out what this person has to say about it, copied from another discussion board. It explains Hamas from the perspective of a man who lives in Jerusalem, and how he ties it into Biblical prophesy.

    Nuclear war in the Middle East, Isaiah 14 & Zephaniah 2

    The destruction of Damascus in a time line of Isaiah and Zephaniah. The beginning of the prophecy in Isaiah starts at:

    Isa 14:28 In the year that King Ahaz died this oracle came:

    Note that you will not see a new time marker in this oracle till Isaiah 20:1, so that is the end of the oracle. Not the chapter and verse numbers that were added by the English translators. A more logical starting point for Chapter 14 would have been 14:28.

    Now what I propose is that you read Isaiah 14 and Zephaniah 2 at the same time as they are parallel prophecies. Note that they have the same format as follows:

    -Puzzle or timelock
    -Warning to the Palestinian believers
    -Judgement on the Palestinian non-believers and Muslims
    -Description of the action of the day
    -The destruction of Moab (central Jordan)


    When you see the puzzle take place, you know that the time of the prophecy is at hand.

    What will make it easier is that the prophecy has already started. I look on this prophecy series like it was a bomb in the Middle East, the old kind with a fuse. The last part of Isaiah 14 and the first part of Zephaniah 2 is the story of the destruction of the Palestinians. First we must see the lighting of the fuse by identifying the time of its start in the world events around us.

    The 1'st puzzle…

    Isa 14:29 "Do not rejoice, O Philistia, all of you, Because the rod that struck you is broken; For from the serpent's root a viper will come out, And its fruit will be a flying serpent.

    In order to understand this text you need to see the pattern in the world around you that fits the pattern of the text. Who is Philistia? Most commentaries say that this prophecy took place 4000 years ago when David wiped out the Philistines and captured Gaza for the tribe of Judah. All we really know about them is that they were a Greek fishing culture that invaded Canaan and were called the ancient Hebrew name for invader, Philistine. When they took over the Gaza strip they adopted the Canaanite gods and became one of the many pagan kings that were living in the lands given to Abraham.

    We know very little about them as David wiped them completely out. What we do know says that the people called Falaseia (Arabic pronunciation of Palestinian) that live there today are NOT the same Palestinians of old as the “new” Palestine is Semitic not Greek in bloodlines.

    As a side note, when I hear the Arabs speaking on the radio in Israel about themselves they call themselves the Fallacya. And a fallacy they are indeed. For they are Islamic invaders to the land of Israel, not the return of 4000 year old dead Grecian fishing culture.

    How can the standard explanation of the prophecy be called fulfilled if we have no idea of the history of the Palestinians beyond those days?!

    You must also separate the term Palestinian from the land called Palestine. Islamic politics is very deceptive. Deception is one of the primary war tools of Jihad. When Israel first became a nation the Jews were called Palestinians, the Arabs would get very upset if you called them a Palestinian. The Jerusalem Post newspaper called the Palestine Post. It later changed its name when the Jews began to call themselves Israeli’s instead of Palestinians. The Arabs, seeing the propaganda value then began to call themselves Palestinians!

    Another thing to keep in mind that Palestine is a place name, not a nation name. There never was a Palestinian nation before WW II, so this prophecy is a political identification. If you were speaking to Palestinians today you would be talking about the Arabs in the Gaza strip, or the West Bank, or to someone who is a member of the Palestinian political party, not a geographical location as there is not a ‘Palestine’ now.

    The first time that the geographical area of Palestine spawned the present political party of the Palestinians is when the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem in WW II created a local coalition of Islamic Arabs and joined politically with Hitler. He favored the “final solution” that Hitler espoused for the Jews.

    However, when Germany lost the war the power of the Grand Mufti was broken. I’m sure it wasn’t fun to have a Nazi master, but God warns “Isa 14:29 "Do not rejoice, O Philistia, all of you, Because the rod that struck you is broken;” he goes on to say: “For from the serpent's root a viper will come out,”…

    Who is the Rod? The Nazi Master, The Grand Mufti. From his root (his bloodlines) came his grand nephew, Yassir Arafat. He was the next generation of Palestinian leadership.

    While the Grand Mufti was a rod that struck them, he was but a serpent. From him came a much worse government (Nazi’s) who was a viper, a poisonous serpent and a terrorist government. Arafat is the leader that began to use their children as bomb fuses, he invented bomb belts and air plane hi-jacking.

    The scriptures indicate a third generation of Palestinian government: “And its fruit will be a flying serpent.” The third generation of Palestinian government is far worse than just a terrorist government, it is a Islamic fundamentalist government.

    The serpent, became a poisonous viper, that became a dragon! I would call today’s Palestine Hamastien. They are like a cross between the Taliban and Arafat. Poison not only to their own people but to everyone around them.

    A resident of Gaza city was walking on the beach downtown with his bride to be and with his little sister as an escort. In Islam, an unmarried couple must never be anywhere without a family escort as it is considered improper. A local Hamas group decided that the teenaged sister was “insufficient escort” and when the couple and his little sister got into their car to leave the beach, Hamas drove up blocking their car with their pickup truck. When they got out of their truck they all emptied their AK 47’s into the fiancé killing her. They drug her body from the car and beat it with steel pipes to show their displeasure and then beat the young man and his sister so badly that they were both hospitalized.

    This is life in modern Palestine under the dragon.

    The 2’nd puzzle…

    Zep 2:1 “Gather yourselves together, yes, gather, O nation without shame,

    What makes this a puzzle, and how can you see this in a way that opens the prophecy that its starting?

    Consider this, you can talk to Islamics and ask them if they are a Palsetinian and they will loudly pronounce yes! If you ask them where they are from, often they will tell you Syria, or Saudi Arabia. If you continue to probe (and they do not get wise to where you are headed with it) you can ask where their parents are from and they’ll usually tell you the same thing, Syria or Saudi or whatever.

    You see, Palestinian is a Political party not a nation! The Palestinian Liberation Organization which changed its name to the Palestinian Authority is/was the leading party of the Palestinians in generation two. It is now Hamas. Both of their political platforms state their intention to destroy Israel. Palestine is a “nation that is gathering together” from all the surrounding Islamic Nations! And it truly is a “Nation without shame” or “Unwanted Nation” as the Bible states.


    The next part will discuss the next stage in these two prophecies, the warning to the Palestinian Christians.

    Warning to the Palestinian Christians found in Isaiah:

    Isa 14:30 "Those who are most helpless will eat, and the needy will lie down in security…”

    Since this prophecy is directed to the Palestinians, who among them are the most helpless and needy? The answer is the Palestinian Christians. The Moslems view them at best as a slave class. They cannot get Jobs in Palestine, their homes are being confiscated by the Islamic militants, and they have nobody to protect them. Ever since the US in the Oslo Accords got Israel to give Bethlehem over to Palestinian Authority control, the city has gone from 85% Christian residence to somewhere under 5%. The Muslims are driving the Christians out.

    A friend of mine has lived in the SE part of Jerusalem, a housing tract called Gilo. Just down the hill is the Palestinian controlled area called Bet Jalla on the NE edge of Bethlehem. My friend is an American Christian and his friend is an Arabic Christian that lived “next door”, down the hill about 300 yards away in Bet Jalla. Before the Intifada or Jihad war called for by Arafat (that started in the year 2000) there was free travel between the two edges of the towns. On weekends, they would have dinner at each others houses and things were peaceful.

    But once the Intifada started, the Palestinian Jihadi would come into Bet Jalla and break into a Christians house to set up a sniper to shoot into the Jewish apartments up on top of the hill in Gilo. They hoped the IDF would shoot back so they could claim the Jews were shooting at Christians in the news!

    One day the friend from Bet Jalla was able to come into the city to visit the American on the hill and told him that the day before a Moslem youth gang broke into his house and pulled his family out in the street. They then proceeded to beat his wife and daughter in front of him for being a Christian. He said with tears streaming down his face that he could do nothing. “If I tried to stop them, I would have been arrested for the crime of an infidel striking a Muslim. My family would never see me alive again.”

    In the Sharia Law, no infidel is allowed to testify against a Muslim. So there were in effect, no witnesses. That is the last we heard from his friend in Bet Jalla, we never saw him or his family again. Truly in all of Israel, the Palestinian Christians are the most helpless.

    Now turn to Zephaniah for the second parallel in the prophecies after the puzzle:

    Zep 2:3 "Seek the LORD, All you humble of the earth…

    Remember that this prophecy is to the Palestinians, and who among them Is humble? Certainly not the Muslims who claim to be the masters of the earth and scream threats to all who will listen. It is the Christians who are humble in that society. In the places where Islam has had power over other peoples it is a common law that only a Muslim can ride a horse. For if an infidel were to ride a horse his head might be lifted above a Muslims and that is forbidden. When an infidel meets a Muslim on a sidewalk, the infidel must walk in the street to avoid his head being higher than the Muslim. This law is not yet in effect in Palestine, but the attitude sure is. Any Palestinian Christian without humility around his “superiors” is soon humbled. He will not continue to be proud if he survives.

    Zep 2:3 "…Who have carried out His ordinances; Seek righteousness, seek humility….

    The first part of this is easy to identify, the Muslims do not carry out the ordinances of God: Do not kill, Love your neighbor as yourself, etc. It is the Christians that follow Gods Laws.

    Zep 2:3 Perhaps you will be hidden in the day of the LORD'S anger.

    Uh oh, here there is a warning, and not just any warning but one that is repeated. It is a rule in Bible interpretation that when God repeats Himself, you had better listen. Anything said twice in the Bible is major. There is something scary coming.

    But the question remains, why? The key to that question is the preceding statement, “Seek righteousness, seek humility”. The funny part is He just said they were “the humble of the earth” in the sentence before! There is a real clue here, and once again the clue is in the scripture, the statement is the humble of the earth.

    On the earthly side, the Palestinian Christians are very humble, but in the spiritual they have a real problem. They hate the Jews, they have a very strong replacement theology that goes so far that I have heard Arab Christian pastors say “We do not read parts of the Bible because it is too nice to the Jews.” God does not view that very well.

    The following scripture are a lesson to us all that is well illustrated in the plight of the Palestinian Christians we being spoken of…

    Rom 11:17 But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree,
    Rom 11:18 do not be arrogant toward the (natural) branches; but if you are arrogant, {remember that} it is not you who supports the root, but the root {supports} you.
    Rom 11:19 You will say then, "Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in."
    Rom 11:20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear;
    Rom 11:21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either.
    Rom 11:22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God's kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off.

    What we see here is God has little room for bad attitudes towards the family that we were adopted into. If you are arrogant against them, you might just find yourself loosing your ‘adoption papers’.

    God is warning the Palestinian Christians to seek spiritual humility, so that the principle of Romans 11 does not disqualify them from His protection in the day of his Judgment on the Palestinian Arabs!

    Lets hop back over to Isaiah to see the parallel warning there:

    Isa 14:30 "Those who are most helpless will eat, And the needy will lie down in security; I will destroy your root with famine, And it will kill off your survivors.”

    Who is the Palestinian Christians root? Just like the previous scripture about the root of the serpent, the roots are the bloodlines. What God is saying is that He is going to destroy the Palestinian Arabs with famine, and in a way, God repeats Himself here.

    Normally when the repeat rule is used though, is when a scripture literally repeats the same words, but here he does not exactly repeat Himself. However, there appears to be a hidden meaning in this section. For what God may be saying is that famine will destroy the Arabs, but then something else will hit them, and anyone that survives that, they will be in turn finished off by the famine. Basically, ‘there will be NO SURVIVORS’.

    Lets jump to Zephaniah for more of that pronouncement of destruction:

    Zep 2:4 “For Gaza will be abandoned…”

    An interesting point here is the word “abandoned” describing Gaza is azuvah in Hebrew. It means passively abandoned. Indeed Gaza was passively abandoned as the Jews gave the land to the Arabs for peace as demanded by the US in “the Road Map” peace dealings. But the word for Ashkelon is desolation! It will not be passively abandoned, it will be destroyed.

    There is an interesting point about Gaza being abandoned that I would like to mention here, first that when Gaza was abandoned, the land that was given to the Arabs had over 1,000 massive greenhouses full of a crop that was worth TEN MILLION dollars in exports annually. Gaza provided 20% of the fresh vegetables to Europe at that time. It was right at the first of the harvest, but instead of harvesting the crop the Arabs trashed the greenhouses and stripped them for the plumbing, pumps and wiring.

    With no pumps, the crops all died in 2 weeks. They are doomed to starvation, not because the Jews aren’t feeding them, but because the food the Jews could have used to feed them was given to them already and they destroyed the crops! The Palestinians are supplying their own judgment, and God is not the bad guy here. The Palestinians are doing it to themselves. God is going to show his wrath by not saving them from themselves.

    They also took those same town sites, and turned them into Jihad training camps and rocket launching pads to fire rockets into Israel. All last year, daily, they had been firing rockets into Israel towns and suburbs. I say town sites not towns, because the Palestinian Authority demanded that all the Jewish homes, grocery stores and schools be destroyed before the land be returned to them. They did not want “dirty Jews houses defiling the land”.

    However, a very key thing started to happen then. America made Israel hand the security zone between Gaza and Egypt over to Egypt to patrol. Needless to say part A of the Islamic Empire is not the best way to keep part B of the Islamic Empire from getting arms shipments from Part C of the Islamic Empire.

    Where the arms shipments once were smuggled into Gaza on ships by trying to sneak past the small Israeli Navy at sea, now they can be landed safely in Egypt and just driven over the border.

    Iran is part C. They now ship full sized Russian designed modern Artillery rockets to the Jihadi in Gaza to fire at Israel. The town that is being targeted with these new much more powerful and long range rockets is the town to the north of the northern tip of Gaza, Ashkelon. Israel’s 13’th largest city.


    The written date for the above post was last summer. After reading it, I thought it was interesting when I saw that missiles targeted Ashkelon today.
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    Here's parts 3 and 4 of his post, he never finished the part 5 he promised.

    More insight on Ashkelon:

    Part three…

    Zep 2:4 “For Gaza will be abandoned And Ashkelon a desolation...

    Ashkelon is being targeted not just because it is now in range but because it is one of the main power plants for Israel. It is also the oil port where Israel’s oil supplies are imported, and is also one of the main chemical refinery plants. It happens to be the city where all the chlorine gas that is used to sterilize the water supply for the nation is produced, and it is stored in compressed liquid form in a huge pressure tank there in Ashkelon. Ashkelon is being targeted because it is a highly strategic military target that is critical to the proper functioning of the nation.

    Jump to Isaiah, an important part of the story there right now:

    Isa 14:31 "Wail, O gate; cry, O city; Melt away, O Philistia, all of you… For smoke comes from the north, and there is no straggler in his ranks.

    This is a good moment to point out that the literal interpretation of prophecy is not just important, it is surprisingly accurate! But in order to see its accuracy you have to really look at what is going on, where its going on, at the time that its going on.

    For we see through a glass darkly. Like looking through frosted glass, when you look through it at something, even the right thing, it is hard to tell what it is, unless you hold the glass right up to the object! For when the time is right and you are close to it, it is pretty easy to see what is happening. But when it is years away and you are trying to figure it out or years later as the memory of the actual events fade, the understanding of the prophecy tends to fade as well because we can no longer see it as well. Less things match in our sight. Prophecy is not just literal, it is supernaturally literal. It is so accurate that no man could have figured it out on his own. That is how we know, besides it being in the Bible that the prophecy is from God.

    Gaza has only one true city and it is a huge one, it has one million inhabitants the Arabs claim, it is called simply Gaza City. And at its southern border is the Gate to Egypt. This is the border gate that Hamas has broken through twice in the last few months. The first time Hamas blew up about a 75 foot section of the wall between Gaza and Egypt and the Hamas leaders stood in the gap handing three one hundred dollar bills to any Palestinian that would go into Egypt to go shopping. Seeing that the average income of a Palestinian has shrunk to only two thousand a year since Israel gave control of the land to the Palestinian Authority in the Oslo Accords, you can imagine the scene for the news cameras. Thousands of “poor helpless Palestinians” rushing for the chance to buy “supplies” in Egypt. The news media played it up like that was because they could not get supplies in Gaza as Israel was “blocking” access from Gaza to Israel for supplies.

    Nah, they ran in there because they were paid big bucks to go, and this was the first time they had money for years. The media never mentioned that part, nor did the three letter news agencies responsible to keep us informed tell us that the free hundred dollar bills turned out to be counterfeits.

    Needless to say Egypt was PISSED. Hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars of goods were “bought” with rubber bills. The Egyptians finally got the Palestinians driven back across the border and rebuilt the fence. The Egyptians like guarding the gate, because they get a “piece of the action” on all smuggling done there. It is so a part of the Egyptian Muslims culture they even have a word for it, “Baksheesh”. You can’t even buy postage stamps in the post office in Egypt with out a little baksheesh for the clerk. But nobody likes Palestinian Muslims, because they kill people. In every country they have been hosted in, they have tried to kill the hosts and overthrow the government to take control for themselves. Jordan, Syria, Lebanon to be specific. In Kuwaiti they did not try to overthrow the government themselves, but they worked as forward agents of Saddam Husain in Iraq and they led the troops into the country and acted as spys for Iraq while they were employed there. That is why, everywhere they go, they are imprisoned in Arab societies. The Palestinian breed of Muslim is just to virulent to be let run free in your homeland.

    The Palestinians were able to break through again just a month ago, but not near as big of a hole this time. And this time the Egyptians had backup troops and were able to drive them back over the border after a brief riot.

    I said all that to show you the next part of the scenario. To bring you to there and now in the picture so you can see just how literal prophecy is.

    Part 4, the end of Palestine…

    You need to read part three to get the background story to really understand this part, so if you skipped to here, do yourself a favor and read the last part of three so it is fresh in your mind.

    We continue with the story of the destruction of the Palestinians in Gaza:

    Isa 14:31 "Wail, O gate; cry, O city; Melt away, O Philistia, all of you; For smoke comes from the north, And there is no straggler in his ranks.

    I quote here also the Darby translation:

    Isa 14:31 Howl, O gate! cry, O city! thou, Philistia, art wholly dissolved; for there cometh from the north a smoke, and none remaineth apart in his gatherings [of troops].

    I had my neighbor the Cantor for the local synagogue help me in understanding it. They are the singers of the scriptures in the synagogue and are experts in ancient Hebrew. His comment that this was very difficult to put into English, he would translate it that there is smoke coming from the north and every one has a place in it.

    Remember that I mentioned that the chlorine gas for the entire Nation of Israel is stored in Ahskelon? What do you think will happen if in an artillery bombardment one of those artillery rockets hit that liquid chlorine tank? It will create a huge smoke cloud of poisonous gas. Any oxygen breathing thing that gets in that cloud will instantly die. One lungful of chlorine gas will kill a man, it will scar the lungs so bad there is no cure.

    So back to Zephaniah for the continuing story:

    Zep 2:4 For Gaza will be abandoned And Ashkelon a desolation; Ashdod will be driven out at noon And Ekron will be uprooted.

    Ashdod is a small town south of Ashkelon, Ecron is a tiny little village that is north of Ashkelon. If Ashkelon is shelled and burns, I beleve Ashdod and Ekron will be evacuated for fear of the chlorine tank rupturing.

    Now this is the scenario I propose, Right after the evacuation of Ecron, Ashdod will not be uprooted like in an evacuation, but “driven out” because I believe the wind is going to be blowing south and the tank will rupture. Know what is south of Ashkelon? The Gaza strip! It is called a strip because it is only five miles wide, and goes twenty mile or so down the coast to the border with Egypt at Gaza City, where south of it is the Raffa Gate into Egypt. When that deadly cloud of smoke from the city that the Palestinians have destroyed comes south the people will run the only directon they can go, south into Gaza city to wail at the gate to be let into Egypt.

    However the Egyptian Army has very strict orders to not allow the Palestinians into Egypt. Those soldiers have heard about every excuse and lie there is for why they should let Palestinians into Egypt and they are not going to believe this new “lie” that the Jews are using poison gas to attack Gaza. They know Jews hate poison gas and do not have that as part of their arsenal due to their abhorrence of the use of poison gas on their people during the Holocaust. They will not believe it until the gas hits them and by then it will be too late.

    Wail oh Gate, cry oh city… Sends chills up my spine thinking of the horror of that day.

    Once again the Palestinians will be given a very just justice. As they have decided to kill themselves to kill Jews, they will be allowed to kill them selves indeed! Once again it is Gods justice not to kill horribly, but to not save them from themselves.

    The day of God’s wrath for Palestine is at hand. And those lucky enough to survive the gas, that somehow by luck are in a place that the gas does not pass over? Remember this scripture?

    Isa 14:30 … I will destroy your root with famine, And it will kill off your survivors.

    The survivors will starve, for there will be nothing left, if the chlorine is strong enough, it will kill all the plants too. Lets finish the story with a jump back into Zephaniah:.

    Zep 2:5
    Woe to the inhabitants of the seacoast, The nation of the Cherethites! The word of the LORD is against you, O Canaan, land of the Philistines; And I will destroy you So that there will be no inhabitant.

    Gaza strip today is on the seacoast, in the exact spot of the ancient land of the Cherethites. The Philistines, (said in English “invaders), became Canaanites when they adopted the Canaanite gods of the Cherethites when they took that land for their own. There is an ancient Canaanite altar in the museum in Jerusalem. It is a ring of stones with a single altar head stone. Carved on the face of the headstone is two uplifted hands holding a crescent moon. Exactly like the crescent moon on top of every Mosque.

    What this is saying is “Woe to the inhabitants of Gaza strip. The word of the LORD is against you, O Muslim s, the land of the invader. And I will destroy you So that there will be no inhabitant!

    No survivors… scary.

    Zep 2:6 So the seacoast will be pastures, {With} caves for shepherds and folds for flocks.

    Zep 2:7 And the coast will be For the remnant of the house of Judah, They will pasture on it. In the houses of Ashkelon they will lie down at evening; For the LORD their God will care for them And restore their fortune.

    Here God returns the land of the Gaza Strip to the Jews, and it sounds like they do not build on it again. However the city of Ashkelon is reinhabited.

    Lets flip back to then end of Isaiah 14, the last verse, to see the parallel of the return of the land to Judah. . There is one tiny part left in this story and it is not just scary, it is VERY scary, because here in the scriptures after the Palestinians are gone from the Gaza strip God speaks to the Jews and tells them to tell the United States something:

    Isa 14:32 "How then will one answer the messengers of the nation? That the LORD has founded Zion, And the afflicted of His people will seek refuge in it."

    And for clarity another translation, this time the NIV:

    Isa 14:32 What answer shall be given to the envoys of that nation? “The Lord has established Zion, and in her his afflicted people will find refuge.”

    Who are the messengers or envoys that the Jews have to answer to about the Gaza strip? The United States, the nation that demanded they give it away. And what is Gods message? It is a rebuke for our meddling, He established Israel, and His people will live in it, NOT THE ARABS.

    See America is in prophecy, we are rebuked because we have sinned against God by taking His land from the Jews.

    Our story comes later, but this is the end of the story for Palestine as you will see in part five.

    What is next is the destruction of Moab, and after that is the destruction of Damascus…


    Now I don't know if this guy's opinion is valid or not, but it makes sense and his Biblical refs are accurate as far as I can find.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakellpet View Post
    hush now child. I hear the bells at community college ringing and mommy has packed you some sandwiches for lunch.

    Run along now, you have plenty of learning to do.
    You dont even deserve my my time.... I would make a comment about the poor knowledge you will pass onto another generation, but I am sure time will show that.

    How can you bash OSU?

    Man, it is depressing, I am finding it harder to meet people who value knowledge anymore....

    At least others can argue a point, all you do is whine and complain. A child rasing children....
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    I bought an Oil fund right after this happened. I sold it off a day later at a 10% profit, gambling that the cease fire would happen and the price would drop. Doh. It soared up another 5% later that day, and I'm guessing it will continue to fly up on Monday. Oh well 10% in a day isn't shabby
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobInKuwait View Post
    I bought an Oil fund right after this happened. I sold it off a day later at a 10% profit, gambling that the cease fire would happen and the price would drop. Doh. It soared up another 5% later that day, and I'm guessing it will continue to fly up on Monday. Oh well 10% in a day isn't shabby
    Hahaha, not bad indeed Rob! That can balance out the -4.10 on your Au today.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DR.D View Post
    Hahaha, not bad indeed Rob! That can balance out the -4.10 on your Au today.
    Actually, my AU currency shares only went down .33%...guess it doesn't track the currency like it should.

    Its horrible that I actually root for wars and economic collapse so my stocks and ETFs go up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    You dont even deserve my my time.... I would make a comment about the poor knowledge you will pass onto another generation, but I am sure time will show that.

    How can you bash OSU?

    Man, it is depressing, I am finding it harder to meet people who value knowledge anymore....

    At least others can argue a point, all you do is whine and complain. A child rasing children....
    you're in no position to evaluate whether I have knowledge worthy of passing on, or my ability as a parent for that matter.

    You're 22 years old and pigsh1t ignorant.

    So here's the solution: open your eyes and spend some time exploring the world we live in rather than jerking off to Benny Hinn in your parent's basement.

    Chances are in 20 years time you'll be 42 and still pigsh1t ignorant.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakellpet View Post
    you're in no position to evaluate whether I have knowledge worthy of passing on, or my ability as a parent for that matter.

    You're 22 years old and pigsh1t ignorant.

    So here's the solution: open your eyes and spend some time exploring the world we live in rather than jerking off to Benny Hinn in your parent's basement.

    Chances are in 20 years time you'll be 42 and still pigsh1t ignorant.
    Hey! Is that kind of smut talk and insults really necessary? As if Benny Hinn was even jokingly spank worthy!

    Seriously, I wish you boys would kiss and make up so we can get back to relevance. Don't you remember being 22 J?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero V View Post
    Man, it is depressing, I am finding it harder to meet people who value knowledge anymore....
    There's your problem right there: you think you know everything because you read a book, and heard a lecture. Try touching something with your hands, for real understanding.
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    I think the current stage of the ground offensive is the right move. A reluctance to use ground troops makes a country look unwilling to pay the price to win a war with their own blood (U.S., we're the most guilty). I also wish Israel was receiving an accurate reporting by journalists for what they are doing. My heart goes out to all of those who are the collateral victims of this campaign, but IMHO you reap what you sow.
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    Quote Originally Posted by slow-mun View Post
    I think the current stage of the ground offensive is the right move. A reluctance to use ground troops makes a country look unwilling to pay the price to win a war with their own blood (U.S., we're the most guilty). I also wish Israel was receiving an accurate reporting by journalists for what they are doing. My heart goes out to all of those who are the collateral victims of this campaign, but IMHO you reap what you sow.
    I agree about the ground troops. One thing you can never say about Israel is that they don't have balls.

    I also agree that a lot the press is clearly in the tank for Hamas. Its disgusting how numbers of "civilian casualties" provided by the terrorists themselves are all over the news.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobInKuwait View Post
    I agree about the ground troops. One thing you can never say about Israel is that they don't have balls.
    couldnt have said it better myself. I dont know if people realize how severe the Israeli's truly are. The more time goes on, the more people will realize
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    couldnt have said it better myself. I dont know if people realize how severe the Israeli's truly are. The more time goes on, the more people will realize
    They are a formidable fighting force to say the least. I wish them the best of luck in the coming days, but I'm sure they'll do just fine on their own. This was a long time coming for those familiar with the region in the last few years. You cannot build peace upon concessions to a side who just wants you dead. They should also be admired for the amount of patience they have shown over the years.
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    Quote Originally Posted by slow-mun View Post
    They are a formidable fighting force to say the least. I wish them the best of luck in the coming days, but I'm sure they'll do just fine on their own. This was a long time coming for those familiar with the region in the last few years. You cannot build peace upon concessions to a side who just wants you dead. They should also be admired for the amount of patience they have shown over the years.
    agree 100% at the end of the day, there are no such things as negotiations when you are dealing with someone who desires your ultimate annihilation. I think what the world is about the find out, is what was shown in small glimpses throughout the mid 20th century, there will be brutality, and the Israeli's will prevail
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    Quote Originally Posted by slow-mun View Post
    They should also be admired for the amount of patience they have shown over the years.
    Exactly. They have given many concessions to Palestinians over the years that they did not have to give. Compare how Saddam treated Kurds as the ethnic minority in their country to how Israel treated Palestinians.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakellpet View Post
    you're in no position to evaluate whether I have knowledge worthy of passing on, or my ability as a parent for that matter.

    You're 22 years old and pigsh1t ignorant.

    So here's the solution: open your eyes and spend some time exploring the world we live in rather than jerking off to Benny Hinn in your parent's basement.

    Chances are in 20 years time you'll be 42 and still pigsh1t ignorant.

    you act and talk like I did when I was 15 years old and got ticked in a video game or something..... And I have no need to justify my intelligence at the age of 22 in comparison to you or your insults. I am quite done with partaking in your lil fun filled world. Be wary, because if you are the same in person as you are on this thread, then I cant see you being a very fulfilled person. Enjoy yourself though, and best of luck to you. Seriously, I have no beef, and even though my one posts says so, I never did neg you. I guess I could care less about lil green bars that mean zip.

    In a place made for learning, all you did was bash and be closed minded.

    And btw according to your last neg and post, you attacked my religious beliefs which makes you a fascists right? Hypocrite?

    As a side note, I actually am a very questioning person. Which is why I use the term test the waters, I am not a fan of Benny Hinn, or Rod Parsely, or any famous preacher actually. I just love doing what I can to help other people. And having a relationship with my God and Savior. At the same time I have studied evolution, biology, chemistry. Other things like Anthropology, ecology. I love psychology, hate philosophy. And am often engaged with gentlemen much older than you in historical debates and discussions. Unlike you think, I have seen plenty, and often look for multiple sources to verify information. I love history. The fact that I know how much time I have put into studies, most of which are actually outside of any schooling, and you would insult it. Is disappointing, but expected from the average American.

    I am done with this thread. It has come to lack too much. Like watching a ping pong game without the ball.
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    speaking about economy.

    America is in shambles

    hows other parts of the world, speaking from people who live there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ari4216 View Post
    speaking about economy.

    America is in shambles

    hows other parts of the world, speaking from people who live there.
    I live in America, but I've been studying up on this exact question. Essentially, the rest of the world either experienced the exact same economic decline or greater than the rest of the world. I don't think any sector avoided decline.

    Essentially, when the rest of the world decouples their economies from the US and exposure to the dollar, countries such as Japan and China should have an economic surge that should propel them past the collapsing house of cards that is the US economy. This will also cause an American economic collapse that the current one pales in comparison to. Many analysts believe that China will take over the role of economic superpower from the US in the next couple of years, and after reading up on it, I'm inclined to believe them.
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    rob,

    I think we are looking at another 2 years max prior to china and then possibly japan powering past hte US economically.

    This was bound to happen
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reaper329 View Post
    rob,

    I think we are looking at another 2 years max prior to china and then possibly japan powering past hte US economically.

    This was bound to happen
    What's ironic is that both these countries have already powered past the US economy in terms of real goods. We've essentially sold the cow to buy some milk at a macroeconomic level. Our country living on credit now and when the final bubble, the dollar bubble bursts, our economy will collapse.
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    look at the plus side.

    at least we dont live in china
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    Quote Originally Posted by ari4216 View Post
    look at the plus side.

    at least we dont live in china
    It may be the place to be a few years down the road.
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