Lifting for gains

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  1. The weird thing is that in some ways I wish I was you. I don't know what you look like like but I will assume smaller framed. I wish I could have the cut full but sleek look. I am just big. Bigger then most. With my size in order for me to have that sleek look I need to get the muscle really big. Harder to sustain then a guy 60 pounds lighter. When I do diet and hit the gym hard I look great but if I screw up my routine for anything over a week, week an a half. I go down hill fast. It's nice being big, but it is costly in more then just money. I feel the smaller framed guys don't pack on the weight like a big framed guy(fat+muscle). But the weight they do pack on is kept better by the smaller framed guys. Idk


  2. Ok since i feel i'm a prime candidate for the subject of "over-training" i'll shed some of my experience with it to help you out!

    First off, i don't believe you can over-train entirely BUT there is a point where you will need a few days off to recover/grow. ANYWAYS i have been busting the crap out of this "myth" for the past 5 months. I believe that with the intensity of the training reflects how much more you should be eating to FUEL yourself and the increased metabolism resulted from more frequent/longer training sessions.
    Currently i train Full body 3-4x a week like this.

    Day 1: Full Body (Chest/Back PRIORITIZED) That means i start with chest/back.
    Day 2. OFF completely
    Day 3: Full Body (Legs PRIORITIZED)
    Day 4: OFF completely
    Day 5: Full Body (Shoulders/Arms PRIORITIZED)
    Day 6: OFF completely
    Day 7: Either OFF depending on how i feel or i will do weak point training PRIORITIZED along with full body

    Sessions average approximately 3 hours and i consume a BCAA/Carb drink (like Size-On or something of the sort)
    I also consume around 1-1.5 gallons of water and have energy through the entire session (99% of the time)
    After a few weeks (being around 3-4) i may take a few extra rest days and consume higher calories.

    You can doubt this training all you want but there's a reason why the guys back in the day trained this way for a few reasons i can think of being:
    1. Burning more calories (Less reliance on boring cardio)
    2. Better cardiovascular conditioning (this is due to super-setting two different exercises for different muscles and taking minimal rest)
    3. Faster strength and size gains (Depending on your calorie intake VERY IMPORTANT)
    4. More practice with exercise movements.
    5. Improved Muscular conditioning.

    These are the effects I HAVE experienced, the biggest determining factor that will also determine your progress is the CALORIES. (The highest point i was taking in 6-7k calories for a few days then dropping back down to 5-6k) You cannot eat like a RABBIT and train this way effectively! Who knows though this may work for some and others may not work so well but it will almost always boil down to intake of food. Also when you start feeling very run down through sessions is the point where i would take a few days off until you feel 100%.

    Here's my older training log: thetinyguy's ALL OUT training log!! *CAUTION OVERTRAINING*

    When i first began trying to gain weight i made 2 choices: To train as hard as i possibly could and to eat as MUCH as i possibly could. I believe in high calorie/super high intensity training. During that period i trained 3 hours with a Chest/Back, Legs, Shoulders/Arms split and it worked really well i went from 170-240lbs over a winter and proved to myself what i was capable of. I went of the beaten path and tried something that seems to have been buried in the modern training world. Arnold and the golden era guys trained that way for a reason.

    Hope this helps you out man! Impossible is nothing and anything is achievable.
    I hope everybody thinks i'm crazy, because you cannot be a sane person and go through the type of pain i am willing to put myself through to be where i want to be, Once I completely win the war between my mind and body, my reign will begin. ~Me
    •   
       


  3. I got a program that trains 3 days a week...

    Shoulders & Legs
    Chest and Tris
    Back & Bis.

    Keep moving fast and get it done quick.

    Everything works differently for every person.

    I like that routine because, 1)I work a lot so 3 days is a nice time saver for me.
    2) full body work outs are exhausting to me, just can't seem to get it done & part of it is because I usually hit a few more reps/exercises and it gets me tired quicker and I usually want to be out in under an hour. 3) the 5/6 day a week 1 muscle group deal doesn't work if for people that don't absolutely destroy that muscle group, basically the gains take longer to come I think personally.

    What I posted above is 1 day followed by 2 days off.... It's easy if u want to carb up or fast and/or get cardio and abs in on the off days so I think people need to try many styles and routines and see what fits them best.
    Hardcore Purus Labs {Rep}
    Lift the fücking weight from the floor, or leave it on the ground. The thoughts are supposed to be daunting. The pain is meant to be tormenting.

  4. Quote Originally Posted by thetinyguy
    Ok since i feel i'm a prime candidate for the subject of "over-training" i'll shed some of my experience with it to help you out!

    First off, i don't believe you can over-train entirely BUT there is a point where you will need a few days off to recover/grow. ANYWAYS i have been busting the crap out of this "myth" for the past 5 months. I believe that with the intensity of the training reflects how much more you should be eating to FUEL yourself and the increased metabolism resulted from more frequent/longer training sessions.
    Currently i train Full body 3-4x a week like this.

    Day 1: Full Body (Chest/Back PRIORITIZED) That means i start with chest/back.
    Day 2. OFF completely
    Day 3: Full Body (Legs PRIORITIZED)
    Day 4: OFF completely
    Day 5: Full Body (Shoulders/Arms PRIORITIZED)
    Day 6: OFF completely
    Day 7: Either OFF depending on how i feel or i will do weak point training PRIORITIZED along with full body

    Sessions average approximately 3 hours and i consume a BCAA/Carb drink (like Size-On or something of the sort)
    I also consume around 1-1.5 gallons of water and have energy through the entire session (99% of the time)
    After a few weeks (being around 3-4) i may take a few extra rest days and consume higher calories.

    You can doubt this training all you want but there's a reason why the guys back in the day trained this way for a few reasons i can think of being:
    1. Burning more calories (Less reliance on boring cardio)
    2. Better cardiovascular conditioning (this is due to super-setting two different exercises for different muscles and taking minimal rest)
    3. Faster strength and size gains (Depending on your calorie intake VERY IMPORTANT)
    4. More practice with exercise movements.
    5. Improved Muscular conditioning.

    These are the effects I HAVE experienced, the biggest determining factor that will also determine your progress is the CALORIES. (The highest point i was taking in 6-7k calories for a few days then dropping back down to 5-6k) You cannot eat like a RABBIT and train this way effectively! Who knows though this may work for some and others may not work so well but it will almost always boil down to intake of food. Also when you start feeling very run down through sessions is the point where i would take a few days off until you feel 100%.

    Here's my older training log: thetinyguy's ALL OUT training log!! *CAUTION OVERTRAINING*

    When i first began trying to gain weight i made 2 choices: To train as hard as i possibly could and to eat as MUCH as i possibly could. I believe in high calorie/super high intensity training. During that period i trained 3 hours with a Chest/Back, Legs, Shoulders/Arms split and it worked really well i went from 170-240lbs over a winter and proved to myself what i was capable of. I went of the beaten path and tried something that seems to have been buried in the modern training world. Arnold and the golden era guys trained that way for a reason.

    Hope this helps you out man! Impossible is nothing and anything is achievable.
    Cool man. You really put on some weight. I like the work out you have going. I just think the full body work outs will help me feel more solid at the same time. I am going to try your routine .

  5. Quote Originally Posted by AaronJP1 View Post
    I got a program that trains 3 days a week...

    Shoulders & Legs
    Chest and Tris
    Back & Bis.

    Keep moving fast and get it done quick.

    Everything works differently for every person.

    I like that routine because, 1)I work a lot so 3 days is a nice time saver for me.
    2) full body work outs are exhausting to me, just can't seem to get it done & part of it is because I usually hit a few more reps/exercises and it gets me tired quicker and I usually want to be out in under an hour. 3) the 5/6 day a week 1 muscle group deal doesn't work if for people that don't absolutely destroy that muscle group, basically the gains take longer to come I think personally.

    What I posted above is 1 day followed by 2 days off.... It's easy if u want to carb up or fast and/or get cardio and abs in on the off days so I think people need to try many styles and routines and see what fits them best.
    if its 1 day on, 2 days off, then you are working out 3 times every nine days, not seven...so it isnt 3x/week workout. i would shrink if i did that
    Performax Labs Product Specialist

    •   
       


  6. Quote Originally Posted by Big boy D View Post
    Cool man. You really put on some weight. I like the work out you have going. I just think the full body work outs will help me feel more solid at the same time. I am going to try your routine .
    Definitely, like i said though you may have to ease into it but i swear it to anyone who asks me it works really well. Let me know how you like it!
    I hope everybody thinks i'm crazy, because you cannot be a sane person and go through the type of pain i am willing to put myself through to be where i want to be, Once I completely win the war between my mind and body, my reign will begin. ~Me

  7. Quote Originally Posted by R1balla

    if its 1 day on, 2 days off, then you are working out 3 times every nine days, not seven...so it isnt 3x/week workout. i would shrink if i did that
    Technically it's Sunday, Monday, Thursday. This would leave Fri, Sat, Tues, Wed off but you can kind of tailor it. The goal is to hit all it 3 times a week and leave 2 days of rest between each muscle group.

    How is you're routine set up R1?
    Hardcore Purus Labs {Rep}
    Lift the fücking weight from the floor, or leave it on the ground. The thoughts are supposed to be daunting. The pain is meant to be tormenting.

  8. i cycle through around 4 of them a year. and each time i go, i do different exercises but keep the same routine with same reps for that specific routine i am doing for a month or two. i literally changed maybe every other month. always confusing my body

    but i have seen best results with DC. ive been on a 4 day split these past three weeks, and starting monday im gonna go back to DC lol
    Performax Labs Product Specialist


  9. Quote Originally Posted by R1balla
    i cycle through around 4 of them a year. and each time i go, i do different exercises but keep the same routine with same reps for that specific routine i am doing for a month or two. i literally changed maybe every other month. always confusing my body

    but i have seen best results with DC. ive been on a 4 day split these past three weeks, and starting monday im gonna go back to DC lol
    Nice yeah I'm going to have to look into that further.
    Hardcore Purus Labs {Rep}
    Lift the fücking weight from the floor, or leave it on the ground. The thoughts are supposed to be daunting. The pain is meant to be tormenting.

  10. Quote Originally Posted by thetinyguy

    Definitely, like i said though you may have to ease into it but i swear it to anyone who asks me it works really well. Let me know how you like it!
    I work out for about two hours now. I do one body part for the most part. I hit up other parts that I want to pump during the work out super set stuff,. Have you been lifting for a long time?

  11. see, i used to do bodybuilding splits, but i never saw real growth from them. only definition. when i cut, ill throw them into the mix, but the rest of the year i only train for about 50 minutes. either DC or my own 4 day split.

    i used to be so against three day workouts, but if you do them right, the rest can be so beneficial. i love it
    Performax Labs Product Specialist


  12. Quote Originally Posted by Big boy D

    I work out for about two hours now. I do one body part for the most part. I hit up other parts that I want to pump during the work out super set stuff,. Have you been lifting for a long time?
    This is most likely ur problem with growing. U can't be hitting one body part for 2 hours a day. Thats way over training and I'm surprised you haven't had an injury. Also cortisol is realesed after about an hour after working and this prevents muscle growth. Limit your workouts to about 45 min to an hour especially with one body part.

  13. IMO I feel like you have to lift as heavy as possible for the 6-8 rep range to illicit results. I can increase actual muscle size a bit with higher reps like 10-12 however I see biggest gains at lower reps with heavier weight. My thoughts are are the same as Ronnie Coleman's "Everybody want to be a bodybuilder, but ain't nobody want to lift no heavy ass weight." Although I think this is the case for the majority of people I also know there are some who respond better to volume. Mainly I guess what ever creates hypertrophy in the muscle is good and time under stress. just my 2 cents.

  14. everybody responds to different rep ranges. i respond best, for muscle growth, around 8 - 10 reps.
    Performax Labs Product Specialist


  15. Quote Originally Posted by R1balla
    everybody responds to different rep ranges. i respond best, for muscle growth, around 8 - 10 reps.
    How do you figure out what you respond to best. It seems impossible to actually be able to tell

  16. Quote Originally Posted by cg123 View Post
    How do you figure out what you respond to best. It seems impossible to actually be able to tell
    lift in low rep ranges with a steady bulking diet for around 3 months, taking measurements, tracking weight, and logging lift increases. Then lift high rep ranges and for 3 months and compare.

  17. I find that lifting heavy weight as many times as I can until failure, absolutely destroys my muscles to ensure huge gains. Just make sure rest is part of your split, it's vital.

  18. Quote Originally Posted by R1balla View Post
    see, i used to do bodybuilding splits, but i never saw real growth from them. only definition. when i cut, ill throw them into the mix, but the rest of the year i only train for about 50 minutes. either DC or my own 4 day split.

    i used to be so against three day workouts, but if you do them right, the rest can be so beneficial. i love it
    Definitely, once you find out what works the best it's pretty smooth sailing (except all the blood sweat and tears haha) The main thing is experimenting!

    Quote Originally Posted by cg123 View Post
    This is most likely ur problem with growing. U can't be hitting one body part for 2 hours a day. Thats way over training and I'm surprised you haven't had an injury. Also cortisol is realesed after about an hour after working and this prevents muscle growth. Limit your workouts to about 45 min to an hour especially with one body part.
    That's verryyy subjective, maybe for a complete beginner who has never lifted. I do 3 hour sessions of lifting heavy for squats/deadlifts/bench in 1 workout for 3-4 sets each and still left the gym feeling awesome, In fact I've made better gains training that way. So you are right, but it does depend on your muscular conditioning. It's all about how much training your body allows you to RECOVER from. Some people can get away with training every day with 1-2 days off a week. Problem is, is that most people are limiting themselves to this 45 minute rule.

    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewStone16 View Post
    I find that lifting heavy weight as many times as I can until failure, absolutely destroys my muscles to ensure huge gains. Just make sure rest is part of your split, it's vital.
    100% agree with this, main thing is to notice when you need a few days off as well. Some days i'll just feel like i'm dragging ass. Then i'll take 2 straight days off and consume higher calories. Once you recognize this pattern then you ensure you'll always get max gains because you'll always be progressing. High reps definitely work to (12-20) the trick is to FAIL at 20 reps or so, HUGEEE burn/pump but i usually stretch after getting the pump to stretch the fascia like in DC.
    I hope everybody thinks i'm crazy, because you cannot be a sane person and go through the type of pain i am willing to put myself through to be where i want to be, Once I completely win the war between my mind and body, my reign will begin. ~Me

  19. Ok! I looked into the DC work out a bit. What's the scoop? Save me some time!! What's the work out that you do guys? Like I said I'm 260 6'2" with a body fat of let's say 19. I want to get beastly!! It sounds Like this DC would be good for me. And yes that's my pic up there, I am already kinda beastly, but I want to get BEASTLY!

  20. Quote Originally Posted by Big boy D View Post
    Ok! I looked into the DC work out a bit. What's the scoop? Save me some time!! What's the work out that you do guys? Like I said I'm 260 6'2" with a body fat of let's say 19. I want to get beastly!! It sounds Like this DC would be good for me. And yes that's my pic up there, I am already kinda beastly, but I want to get BEASTLY!
    Here's EVERYTHING you need to know about DC training!

    http://dc-training.blogspot.com/
    I hope everybody thinks i'm crazy, because you cannot be a sane person and go through the type of pain i am willing to put myself through to be where i want to be, Once I completely win the war between my mind and body, my reign will begin. ~Me

  21. I grew pretty well with the "typical" bodypart split, although my exercise selection was modeled a lot like westside. The exception was that I stalled pretty hard with squats after a point, and it was only after I switched to DC that I saw my squat go up again.

    I think one of the biggest problems I see in people's routines is when they deadlift for high reps, and the weight they're using is like sub 300 (arbitrarily picking 300 for a minute). Like if you're doing 225 for sets of 12, you need to stop bothering with that weight and start using heavy ass weight - relative to YOU - for low reps until you can handle serious weight. The deadlift is such a great mass builder, why waste it with light weight? And 225 is light weight for anyone, sorry. I could "deadlift" 225 totally untrained (back when I benched and squatted 95, lol).

  22. Quote Originally Posted by tilldeath View Post
    lift in low rep ranges with a steady bulking diet for around 3 months, taking measurements, tracking weight, and logging lift increases. Then lift high rep ranges and for 3 months and compare.
    Such an on-point suggestion. Listen to this guy. Also, don't forget to experiment with rep/set ranges in between.

    I think a good rule of thumb is to use lower rep ranges for compound movements, higher rep ranges for isolation movements. But try different things out, but make sure to give whatever programming you chose a decent amount of time to see results before passing judgment. Like don't do 5/3/1 for 8 weeks and then say "****, my 1RM only went up 5lbs, forget this program."



    P.S. don't do 5/3/1 if you're a beginner, though LOL. It's slow gains, and it's honestly best for people with advanced totals.

  23. How effective are the dips, pull ups, push ups do you guys think?

    Most guys I know that do that are lean and have that dial shower comical in shape look
    Hardcore Purus Labs {Rep}
    Lift the fücking weight from the floor, or leave it on the ground. The thoughts are supposed to be daunting. The pain is meant to be tormenting.

  24. Quote Originally Posted by AaronJP1 View Post
    How effective are the dips, pull ups, push ups do you guys think?

    Most guys I know that do that are lean and have that dial shower comical in shape look
    The first two are honestly awesome. The third can be good, but is largely unnecessary if you're comfortable doing bench presses (Zir Red likes push-ups for various reasons; I'm not sure they're at all necessary for a decent program though).

  25. Quote Originally Posted by Torobestia
    The first two are honestly awesome. The third can be good, but is largely unnecessary if you're comfortable doing bench presses (Zir Red likes push-ups for various reasons; I'm not sure they're at all necessary for a decent program though).
    Dips hits the chest, tris and core.
    Pull ups the back and Bis and push ups chest and shoulders....

    Almost do that stuff at home and hit legs later on at the gym...

    Wonder what the outcome of that would be if ppl did body weight exercises and used weights either very minimally or not at all...
    Hardcore Purus Labs {Rep}
    Lift the fücking weight from the floor, or leave it on the ground. The thoughts are supposed to be daunting. The pain is meant to be tormenting.
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