couture vs lesnar
- 11-09-2008, 03:49 AM
- 11-09-2008, 09:46 AM
if randy loses then UFC loses. the reputation of UFC will go down the drain. im pretty sure since he is "one" of the faces of the UFC that they are hoping randy wins. they have already lost a vast majority of their top fighters to other companies. the ufc isnt as good as it was a few years back. a lot of top notch fighters are not there or are no longer in their prime. they are no more "big names" out there to watch and excite anymore. chuck is starting to fall apart. i think hes lost 3 outta last 4 fights. if randy loses i only see the UFC going further down hill.
11-09-2008, 10:02 AM
actually I think Dana would love to see Randy completely dominated. He is looking for a heavyweight he can build around and Lesnar is a marketing dream. He knows how to sell himself, for good or bad, and if he dominates Couture (which is very likely) then all of a sudden he is an MMA superstar
11-09-2008, 10:33 AM
its about credibility. if randy loses (who has fought many many good fights) they have no credibility to mma. if a nobody walks in with very little skill and just sits and pushes randy around b/c of his size it doesnt show the talent of the UFC. i do not see lesnar as a marketing tool. hes a nobody with nobody skills. you saw how easily he got submitted to a bjj fighter. i do not think dana wants to see randy lose. its all about watching legit real fighters compete and show of their talents and perform at the highest level. i do not see lesnar as the "highest level" of competition. you cant market someone with no fighting experience.
11-09-2008, 11:05 AM
11-09-2008, 11:07 AM
People wish to see powerful, strong, and explosive athletes. The segments of Dana's market who think in the way you are expressing are few and far between; mostly relegated to forums such as this one. The average MMA fan does not know nor care about talent - it is for this reason they boo two BJJ practitioners who are not throwing punches.
Of course Dana wants to see Lesnar crush Randy, or this match would not have been made.
11-09-2008, 11:19 AM
been watching since 03'. seen every ppv event since then. i do agree that most fans do not understand nor care about talent. you brought up a good point about them "booing two bjj practitioners". me personally i appreciate the grappling/submission much more than a punch. this match happend b/c randy had no one else to fight. the only person he wanted to fight was fedor and that wasnt going to happen. he left b/c he was getting screwed out of money. when randy won against tim he got paid less than when chuck lost to rampage. thats why he left. now that hes back there are only new faces for him to fight.
11-09-2008, 11:22 AM
Awesome, so you have seen every crowd for the past 3-5 years boo any two fighters who dare play a technical ground game? People do not want to see:
As sad as that is for me to say, it is by far the case. Brock is a 285lb former NCAA Div I wrestler with a marketable personality and crossover market segments from the WWE - a segment which Dana is very, very clearly marketing towards. He is a marketing dream (rightfully or wrongfully).legit real fighters compete and show of their talents and perform at the highest level.
11-09-2008, 12:06 PM
I'm w/ Mulletsoldier in this one.
Lesnar is Not a Kimbo SLice if that's what you're thinking Ryaroberts. That guy is an Exceptional Wrestler, about the same level or better than Randy Couture's. Better than Koscheck's. And his hands are heavy, seeing how he made Mir topple with one or two hits.
If Randy loses, it's OK because Lesnar is just as if not more accomplished a wrestler than Randy. If Mir (Black Belt in BJJ) loses that would've been unacceptable because Lesnar isn't a BJJ expert.
Edit: It would be a good match I think with Randy's great boxing skills vs. Lesnar's heavy hands. 2 wrestlers of the same level fighting tend to end up striking.
11-09-2008, 08:10 PM
This fight is a win-win for the UFC. It should do big numbers first of all. If Couture wins, he's built up and can handle a huge, accomplished wrestler. If Brock wins, he positioned to be the next superstar with a recognizable name and legit wrestling cred.
Brock's new, but has some great credentials.
UFC loses cred? If you mean the sport in general, I get what you're going for (don't necessarily agree). But if you mean the UFC specifically, who has more cred than them? EXC's gone, strikeforce is a good but small promotion, affliction is on shakey financial ground as is Dream, and Sengoku is sort of blah in terms of quality fights.
11-09-2008, 08:30 PM
rya I hate to say that you have it all backwards. Dana and the UFC cant lose. Brock looked dominant against Mir, before making a rookie mistake, which was expected by many. Against Herring, he dominated a solid fighter with a lot of experience. Should he beat Randy, he flys into the marketing stratosphere. As was said here by Mullet, Brock hits quite a few different markets for the UFC, and he sells himself exceptionally well, I guess being in the WWE paid off for him.
He is a very skilled athlete, who is still learning. However, his natural skills, size and strength should get him through
11-10-2008, 02:23 AM
i have a feeling that dana is trying to make the next superstar at a legends expence and if dana gets his way and gets fans to cross over from wwe to ufc.then look out have u seen how many fools watch wwe but it will also bring in even more posers
11-10-2008, 12:18 PM
11-10-2008, 12:41 PM
11-10-2008, 02:01 PM
There are still so many guys out there that are at such a high level. In just the UFC (in addition to Rodja's mentions)
Forrest (I hate to admit that)
Miguel Torres etc....
I wpuld have said Filho, until last week. yikes
11-10-2008, 05:00 PM
i hate to say it, but it's a known fact lesnar is a roid freak big time. He put on soooo much mass when he left d1 and went to pro wrestling. If he takes off in ufc then expect more guys to "bulk up" and have it be more about size, show, etc...it's a short route to WWE. I hope it doesn't happen and i hope the guys like mir shut lesnar down hardcore. "keep it real" imo...i don't want to see more people leave d1, do anything to bulk up and get bigger then the next guy, then join ufc. I don't have a problem with steroids, but imo ufc is pretty clean and i hope it stays that way and agood start is shutting down lesnar HARDCORE. I hope someone absolutely dominates him. don't let him tap out, let him go and pound him, pound him more, and pound him back to WWE.
11-10-2008, 05:22 PM
11-10-2008, 06:01 PM
11-10-2008, 06:30 PM
11-10-2008, 06:35 PM
I was surprised he was champ as long as he was.
Furthermore, Brock Lesnar isn't some shmuck, ogre beast who's only talent is strength. His Division I "CHAMPION" wrestling background places his Resume toward the upper portion of the stack. Lots of successful UFC fighters emerged and started from a strong wrestling background, and MOST weren't "champions" like Brock was.
Chuck was a big name of popularity, not a big name of talent. Using Chuck Lidell to defend MMA culture or the legitimacy of the UFC is a real bad example.
I could go on for days, but I'll just have to say I respectfully disagree.
NSCA - CSCS
11-10-2008, 06:38 PM
IF randy was to beat lesnar would you not contemplate that WWE fans would sit up and say "wow these ufc guys are for real". That would be assuming WWE fans actually care about talent and who would actually win in a fight, over, who says the most badass things and looks big.
On the other hand if brock won..... How many fans would the UFC pick up?
I just dont see lesnar bringing a solid five round fight to randy, if he slips up he's done.
Has brock even been hit yet???
Before he beats randy think about if he can take a punch.
I see brock winning a controversial descision if randy cant capitalise early, not cause he's better but the UFC's descisions are horrendous.
11-10-2008, 06:38 PM
11-10-2008, 06:48 PM
11-10-2008, 06:53 PM
Brock's probably used, of course, but he just passed a random drug test a few weeks ago. He looked pretty damn big as a D-1 wrestler too. A little oil, tan, and lighting in the WWE probably made him look much bigger too. A lot of his mass is just genetic and a result of hard work and a huge frame IMO.
This fight will be won in the first few minutes IMO. If Brock gets a takedown and a dominant position early then it will be his night. If Couture can establish a rythm and start to wear Brock down, it's his. Couture can wear Brock down and gas him out if he can establish control. Brock's so big that he will gas out under these circumstances.
11-11-2008, 05:48 AM
this is a little off subject but i decided god knows why that i should search lesnar on youtbe and it came up wit all his old wwf stuff and dude he was pretty huge but what desturbed me the most is when the camera went thru the crowd there was dudes wearing tapout shirts that amuses me no end but in all seriouseness lesnar is a beast and if he beats randy then he could be an actual star in ufc but i would prefer if captain america gator roles him in 2nd round
11-11-2008, 02:20 PM
NSCA - CSCS
11-11-2008, 02:59 PM
11-11-2008, 03:13 PM
11-11-2008, 04:17 PM
11-11-2008, 05:23 PM
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