Genova metabolic results

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    Genova metabolic results


    I have completed a Genova metabolic test, as suggested by JanSz. I was hoping it would provide some clues to my insomnia and low serotonin, however most seem in range. I know its weird to be bummed when your tests come back normal JanSz, what do you think?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    I have completed a Genova metabolic test, as suggested by JanSz. I was hoping it would provide some clues to my insomnia and low serotonin, however most seem in range. I know its weird to be bummed when your tests come back normal JanSz, what do you think?
    Body is not converting to FAD the active form of b2
    need to use converted form of b2 and it should help alot of issues. Also looks like undermethylation as well since dopamine and serotnin levels are at the low end. Kreb cycle gets going but it fizzles out at the end. Are you expierencing alot of joint paint. YOu may need malic acid supplement to help feed into it where it is left off.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Body is not converting to FAD the active form of b2
    need to use converted form of b2 and it should help alot of issues. Also looks like undermethylation as well since dopamine and serotnin levels are at the low end. Kreb cycle gets going but it fizzles out at the end. Are you expierencing alot of joint paint. YOu may need malic acid supplement to help feed into it where it is left off.
    Thanks for the response. I do get achy joints sometimes. So... should I take extra B2 (is there a special active kind?), methionine/sam-e, malic acid? My doctor didn't really give me any suggestions-- just said its not too bad and not to worry.
    •   
       

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    LeanGuy,

    Did you get the Genova test done through your doc, or did you just do it on your own? Btw, your results DO look pretty good - You should be fairly happy with them!

    Mac
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacDonnell View Post
    LeanGuy,

    Did you get the Genova test done through your doc, or did you just do it on your own? Btw, your results DO look pretty good - You should be fairly happy with them!

    Mac

    I got it from my doc, but you can get them yourself here:
    Welcome to Integrative Psychiatry Mental Health Testing and Treatment (a doctor-run site)

    Yeah, I am glad the results are ok, but I was hoping for an answer as to why I can't sleep!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    Thanks for the response. I do get achy joints sometimes. So... should I take extra B2 (is there a special active kind?), methionine/sam-e, malic acid? My doctor didn't really give me any suggestions-- just said its not too bad and not to worry.
    I would need to do further evalution from a clinical stand point examinng lifestyles, blood work , dietary and supplmemntation interventions. Sleep problems are simple lifestyle changes as well as identifying the cause to way you can not sleep which is evident in your metabolic panel., I bet your wife sleeps like a baby..
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    I would need to do further evalution from a clinical stand point examinng lifestyles, blood work , dietary and supplmemntation interventions. Sleep problems are simple lifestyle changes as well as identifying the cause to way you can not sleep which is evident in your metabolic panel., I bet your wife sleeps like a baby..
    Actually she has similar problems! I'll PM you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    I have completed a Genova metabolic test, as suggested by JanSz. I was hoping it would provide some clues to my insomnia and low serotonin, however most seem in range. I know its weird to be bummed when your tests come back normal JanSz, what do you think?
    Well what I think, you turnaround and get NutrEval test asap.
    I am glad that you posted on this and not any other board.
    On this board, nobody bothers people doing Genova testing, plus posts can be edited. I value editing capability.

    I have excuse, I am learnig this stuff about Genova testing.
    I did
    Metabolic analysis
    then
    ONE
    then
    Fatty acids

    finally I will do my NutrEval on May22/08
    But I am posting my experience so others can learn from it.

    You have no excuse, specially now when you have a doc who deals with Genova.
    -----------------
    You have not posted the whole test, add/edit the missing pages.

    On my page #5 there is
    Interpretation at glance

    table with three columns.

    If you are going for NutrEval, do not use any supplements, vitamins, minerals or additives or anything 2 -3 weeks before test.
    you want to see what you body does on its own, without any help, just plain food + water.

    From NutrEval test you will get clean list of any supplements that you may need.

    That will be fine for you.
    If you get in touch with HAN, you will get aditional expert opinion on details, like you see, he already picked up same possibility in vit B2 area.

    There are versions of same supplements that work better in some situations.

    .
    On page #5 of your report, you see:

    J. Relative need for Riboflavin 5 - 50 mg/d
    the mark is on 4

    so your need for supplementation is 40%
    maximum supplementation they consider 50mg/d

    When mark is
    0-3 no need to supplement
    4-6 mild defficiency
    over 6 high defficiency

    You are not really supposed to look at that page (sort of),
    their opinion about you is summarized in the table: Interpretation at glance.

    .............................. .............................. .............................. ...........................
    Well, your neurotransmitters are within ok area, but still they have overal grade #3, so you are missing tiny bit there.

    Catecholamine Metabolites
    Homovanillic Acid (HVA)
    (HVA = dopamine metabolite)

    Low

    Suspect

    Possible low precursors or neurotransmitters
    (phenylalanine,
    dopamine, DOPA, norepinephrine);
    possible low cofactors (B2, B3, B6,
    Mg, or Fe); possible impaired
    methylation

    L-tyrosine & B6, generally good response to NE reuptake
    inhibitors (e.g., imiprimine); consider B2, B3 or
    Fe (if low); support methylation (methionine or
    SAMe, B6, B12, folate, Mg)

    -----------------------------------------------------------------



    .Good luck.
    .
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    You have no excuse, specially now when you have a doc who deals with Genova.
    -----------------
    You have not posted the whole test, add/edit the missing pages.

    Thanks for the response. I have attached the other pages.

    My excuse for not getting Nut***** right away is not enough money, LOL
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    Thanks for the response. I have attached the other pages.

    My excuse for not getting Nut***** right away is not enough money, LOL
    I handle these test on a daily basis from people with CFS and other metabolic disorders. I was the one that sifted through all jansz blood work, ONE test and his supplementation program. Corrected his problems associated with BPH, got him off adex which people have deamed almost impossible, corrected the imbalances in with middle of the road recommendation based upon my own past expereinces which have composed of the most complex medical issues one can endure and even of come. Technically I am not suppose to even be here but I have come back from deaths door. My time is not over yet, but instead I was given a gift of comprehensive knowledge to help make a difference in peoples life..MY jouney has just begun..
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    I handle these test on a daily basis from people with CFS and other metabolic disorders. I was the one that sifted through all jansz blood work, ONE test and his supplementation program. Corrected his problems associated with BPH, got him off adex which people have deamed almost impossible, corrected the imbalances in with middle of the road recommendation based upon my own past expereinces which have composed of the most complex medical issues one can endure and even of come. Technically I am not suppose to even be here but I have come back from deaths door. My time is not over yet, but instead I was given a gift of comprehensive knowledge to help make a difference in peoples life..MY jouney has just begun..
    Right to the above, but..

    Other than ONE I also had Faty Acid analysis,
    so really what I was missing from NutrEval is

    Elemental Analysis, Packed Erythrocytes (RBC's)

    not only that, I am missing,
    but also advice that come with complete test. That advice is not included in incomplete tests.


    For anybody who reads this and would like to do this testing but is short of money:

    wait

    save money

    then do the correct test.

    The correct test is NutrEval.


    .
    .
    Yes HAN helped me a lot,
    on top of the advice I got with the tests.

    It is since Mar30/08 that I do not use Arimidex/Anastrozole.
    Wonder if that will continue.

    Also urination urgency and frequency is easier to live with.

    ..


    If possibe, keep Genova tests discussion on this board only.
    Dr John told me to not discuss Genova on his board,
    I have to listen to his request to be able to learn from his wisdom.
    .
    http://www.matrixnutritionandfitness...8&postcount=26
    .
    .
    .
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    Thanks for the response. I have attached the other pages.

    My excuse for not getting Nut***** right away is not enough money, LOL
    Well, just read your report.
    Look at what they sugest you do, page 7 & 8.
    You are also eating some funny supplements that cause problems, change DL-fumaric or DL-mali acid supplements to L-forms.

    L-phenylalanine 500-2000 mg/d
    L-tyrosine 500-2000 mg/d
    L-methionine 500-1000mg/d
    Magnesium 100-200 mg/d
    Detoxification (well first you have to confirm that you need it by RBC elememt analysis, they suspect that you may have some toxic substances to get rid of)
    Molybdenum 50-250 μg/d,
    B2 5-50mg/d (riboflavin)
    .
    .
    Well three more item to clarify, Pyruvic, Lactic & Malic acids.
    I buy all of the above stuff from LEF.org


    Man, you have got a full plate, make correction to what you now know, save mone for the next test in 3 -4 months.

    I am stopping all my supplements for over 2 weeks, going for my NutrEval.
    Sort of a semi-clen slate approach.
    .
    .
    Just look what happened when you posted (only) list of results.
    Well, very little happened.

    This is what you would get (and did) from you doc or other people, do not hold it agains him, you are lucky, he facilitated the test for you.

    But Genova have given you their opinion, rather long list of actions.

    It will get better when you do NutrEval.


    Good luck.
    .
    .
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    You are also eating some funny supplements that cause problems, change DL-fumaric or DL-mali acid supplements to L-forms.
    Thanks for the review. I don't understand this, I'm not taking anything too weird:

    Multi Vitamin/Mineral
    Vitamin C 2000mg
    Pantothenic Acid 2000mg
    Zinc 30mg
    MethylCobalin B-12 (sub) 1mg
    Sam-E 400mg
    Rhodiola 500mg
    CoQ10 100mg
    EPA/DHA fish oil 1000mg
    Nettle Root 500mg
    Maca Root 6000mg
    Stoked (Resveratol, Quercitin, Icariian) 800mg
    Trib Test Extreme (rotated with Stoked) 500mg
    L-Tryptophan 1000mg
    L-Lysine 500mg
    Probiotic 100mg
    DHEA (sub) 50mg
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    Thanks for the review. I don't understand this, I'm not taking anything too weird:

    Multi Vitamin/Mineral
    Vitamin C 2000mg
    Pantothenic Acid 2000mg
    Zinc 30mg
    MethylCobalin B-12 (sub) 1mg
    Sam-E 400mg
    Rhodiola 500mg
    CoQ10 100mg
    EPA/DHA fish oil 1000mg
    Nettle Root 500mg
    Maca Root 6000mg
    Stoked (Resveratol, Quercitin, Icariian) 800mg
    Trib Test Extreme (rotated with Stoked) 500mg
    L-Tryptophan 1000mg
    L-Lysine 500mg
    Probiotic 100mg
    DHEA (sub) 50mg
    You may want to involve HAN.
    Possibly what you are eating have DL without specifying it.


    You should have stopped all supplements for (2 weeks or a month) before going for that test.
    Now we are guessing.




    Look at page #2 item #25
    Fumaric Acid is very low, on the bottom.

    Fumaric Acid
    (Metabolite of succinic acid,
    precursor of malic acid); also
    produced during urea cycle and
    formed from phenylalanine and
    tyrosine)

    Page #1 item # 14 Vanilmandelic Acid (VMA) low, red (below low range)
    Page 1 item #16 MHPG is low, on green but low.
    Suspect
    Possible low precursors or neurotransmitters
    (phenylalanine,
    dopamine, DOPA, norepinephrine);
    possible low cofactors (B2, B6, Mo,
    Cu, or Fe); possible impaired
    methylation (if MHPG also low)



    .
    .
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    You may want to involve HAN.
    Yeah, I am preparing a bunch of docs for HAN
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    Yeah, I am preparing a bunch of docs for HAN
    Good move.

    HAN does not have Excel capabilities.
    So I am sending him screen captures of my spreadsheet, not easy route.

    I just thought of using Google spreadsheet and documents capabilities.
    If that would work, it would be much easier to communicate.

    I did not tried this yet, myself.
    I imagine that you may complete your stuf on your own Excel then copy paste to Google's spreadsheet, then publish it.
    Off hand Googles spreadsheet looks different and less capable or possibly just takes time to learn it.

    .
    Post on your progress, if anything, I want to learn.
    .
    .
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    I printed everything to PDF.

    I'll post back my results.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    I got it from my doc, but you can get them yourself here:
    Welcome to Integrative Psychiatry Mental Health Testing and Treatment (a doctor-run site)

    Yeah, I am glad the results are ok, but I was hoping for an answer as to why I can't sleep!!
    For what it's worth, I went through the ringer in ascertaining what would help my sleep. It ends up, I have autonomic dysfunction, which causes adrenalin to flood my system based on the movement of my body. I now take Coreg (an alpha/beta blocker, to tame the adrenalin, and to reduce the lability of my BP and pulse) and a benzo (Klonopin, to help balance the autonomic system, particularly during sleep hours).

    My strongest recommendation is to get a sleep study. That's a no brainer. I had 2 of them. As it ends up, the CPAP never did anything for me. But my primary issue is alpha intrusions, from surges of adrenaline at night. If you dont have insurance, the sleep study could be spendy.

    Good luck and hang in there. I feel like I am finally seeing the light, having slept well for about 8 of the last 10 days, which is better sleep than I've had in a few years. I look a world better, and am feeling better as well.

    Best,
    J
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    I got it from my doc, but you can get them yourself here:
    Welcome to Integrative Psychiatry Mental Health Testing and Treatment (a doctor-run site)

    Yeah, I am glad the results are ok, but I was hoping for an answer as to why I can't sleep!!
    Loks like some Genova tests can be ordered by that site, directly thru internet, without need to see doctor.

    I see there Metabolic Analysis Profile
    Metabolic Analysis Profile (Urine) by Genova Diagnostics
    but I cannot find NutrEval

    There is also a Specracell test that HAN is so fond of.

    But it look like any test can be ordered:
    Laboratory Diagnostic Tests

    Quote:
    If there is a test that you are interested in please call or email our office, chances are we can
    order it for you.

    ---------------
    Wonder if they help with insurance filing if the test is ordered thru internet?

    .
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    Loks like some Genova tests can be ordered by that site, directly thru internet, without need to see doctor.
    A little expensive, but yes I love the site!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    A little expensive, but yes I love the site!!
    Expensive, that depends who pays.

    For Metabolic test you paid less than my insurance did for the same test, (I paid $0).

    Gad that you have found (and posted) about that site, thank you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    Expensive, that depends who pays.

    For Metabolic test you paid less than my insurance did for the same test, (I paid $0).

    Gad that you have found (and posted) about that site, thank you.
    Site I found also was cheaper 200 bucks for organic acid test and I would prefer them over genova for that since they where one of the orginal designers of the test..
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanGuy View Post
    A little expensive, but yes I love the site!!
    Leanguy, you need a polysomnogram. These tests will reveal nothing about your sleep issues, just as it is unlikely to resolve the cause of anxiety. There are loads of guys with sleep issues on the forums, and I am yet to hear of any whose issues were resolved after metabolic testing. Sure, you may have elevated NE, or low Serotonin, as measured from urine, but that is not going to resolve the issue. Get a sleep test.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jinxie View Post
    Leanguy, you need a polysomnogram. These tests will reveal nothing about your sleep issues, just as it is unlikely to resolve the cause of anxiety. There are loads of guys with sleep issues on the forums, and I am yet to hear of any whose issues were resolved after metabolic testing. Sure, you may have elevated NE, or low Serotonin, as measured from urine, but that is not going to resolve the issue. Get a sleep test.
    Jinxie,

    How much were your sleep tests? I have good health insurance, but I've heard that often, there is no compensation for these things. It's been something I've thought about for a long time, but frankly, I'm wondering if it's just going to be another $1000 for a, "Well, we've confirmed that you're an insomniac, and there is nothing we can do about it." OR "Have you ever tried melatonin?" OR "You know benzodiapines work really great, but of course, they're addictive." Blah, blah, blah. I guess it also depends on the clinic you go to. Being that Coreg is an alpha/beta blocker, do you find that it interferes with erection quality?

    J
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacDonnell View Post
    Jinxie,

    How much were your sleep tests? I have good health insurance, but I've heard that often, there is no compensation for these things. It's been something I've thought about for a long time, but frankly, I'm wondering if it's just going to be another $1000 for a, "Well, we've confirmed that you're an insomniac, and there is nothing we can do about it." OR "Have you ever tried melatonin?" OR "You know benzodiapines work really great, but of course, they're addictive." Blah, blah, blah. I guess it also depends on the clinic you go to. Being that Coreg is an alpha/beta blocker, do you find that it interferes with erection quality?

    J
    Hey MAC lets keep this site PG buddy
  

  
 

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