Trying to go off of HRT, could use some advice

[Kroms_laugh]

Hey bros,

I've been on HRT for about 3 years now. When I was diagnosed, I had testicular atrophy, slightly low levels of FSH, LH, and normal sperm concentration. My testosterone was low (below normal ranges), and so I went on HRT.

Blood test before HRT:
Testosterone: 315 (Normal: 400-1080)
LH: 2.7 (Normal: 1.5-9.3)
FSH: 1.3 (Normal: 1.4-18.1)

Looking back at my results, and having read much more research into hypogonadism and HTPA suppression, I speculate that my diagnosis was incorrect and that had I only gotten more sleep, put my diet in check, and stayed on my vitamins consistently... I would have had normal levels. But it's too late now... nor does it matter.

After 3 years, I'm trying to come off of HRT (for reasons I cannot list here). My last test results were as follows; (blood drawn on the day I would have normally injected the testosterone)

Total testosterone = slightly elevated, 1100ng/dl (420-1080)
LH = less than .3 (Normal: 1.5-9.3)
FSH = less than .3 (Normal: 1.4-18.1)

So now I've been taking 100mg Clomid and 10mg Nolvadex for the last 30 days and the following is what's happened so far;
Larger testicle size
More ejaculation
Lower sex drive (takes me a while to get it up)

But I will say, I don't have depression or anxiety like I used to which I attributed to hypogonadism. I'm getting another blood test in 5 days after having come off of the Clomid for 5 days to see what my levels are. I know they'll probably come in normal or slightly elevated because Clomid's half-life is 5 days, so it'll just be leaving my system as the test is done.

My worry is that my levels will gradually drop again to substandard, and that I'll need to go back on HRT. I will be getting another blood test about 4 half-lives after coming off. If levels are low, I'll do another 30 day cycle of Clomid/Nolvadex (probably with more Nolvadex and only 50mg of Clomid). I'll repeat the process and if levels are still low, I'll do it all over again. I've heard it can take up to 1 year to restart HTPA productivity after having come off of HRT.

Here are my questions;
1) Just because I have increased sperm production it doesn't mean I have increased testosterone, right? Sperm production is solely the burden of FSH?

2) Since before the Clomid, I had some (not much, but some) FSH and LH hormones present.. that means my HTPA is not shutdown totally, correct?

3) Has anyone here successfully come off of HRT and maintained healthy testosterone levels?


Sorry for such a long post (and the grammar and spelling errors).

Thanks in advance!

-Krom

 

[bigironkiller]

im looking to try the same thing here pretty soon. im only 23 and been on trt for over 2yrs. ive read a few studies where taking clomid at 75mg qd for 6wks was enough to see if a restart would work. how worried are you that once off the test shots you will begin to feel like hell all over again? your only a little older than me, but since these are some of the best years of our life to feel good, it gets overwhelming to deal with this.

 

[Kroms_laugh]

im looking to try the same thing here pretty soon. im only 23 and been on trt for over 2yrs. ive read a few studies where taking clomid at 75mg qd for 6wks was enough to see if a restart would work. how worried are you that once off the test shots you will begin to feel like hell all over again? your only a little older than me, but since these are some of the best years of our life to feel good, it gets overwhelming to deal with this.

I'm already off the testosterone. It's day 31 for me. I take a blood test in 10 days (I accidentally put 5 days above) to see if 100mg Clomid / 10mg Nolvadex ED for 30 days has worked in boosting a restart. I don't feel like ****. I suppose I'm a little lethargic, but that's because my diet sucks. The only negative side-effect I've encountered thus far is it takes me a little more effort to get an erection. My ejaculation has probably tripled in volume, and my balls are a little bigger.

But as far as the debilitating lethargy, I don't feel any of that.

Tomorrow, I plan on quitting chewing tobacco. I've already quite drinking all together. After my blood test I'm going to fast and clean out my system, then probably start another Clomid / Nolvadex treatment to help things along. I'm really convinced that had I got more sleep, ate better, and not drank all the time, I wouldn't have needed to go on HRT.

 

[Trevor Miller]

I'm already off the testosterone. It's day 31 for me. I take a blood test in 10 days (I accidentally put 5 days above) to see if 100mg Clomid / 10mg Nolvadex ED for 30 days has worked in boosting a restart. I don't feel like ****. I suppose I'm a little lethargic, but that's because my diet sucks. The only negative side-effect I've encountered thus far is it takes me a little more effort to get an erection. My ejaculation has probably tripled in volume, and my balls are a little bigger.

But as far as the debilitating lethargy, I don't feel any of that.

Tomorrow, I plan on quitting chewing tobacco. I've already quite drinking all together. After my blood test I'm going to fast and clean out my system, then probably start another Clomid / Nolvadex treatment to help things along. I'm really convinced that had I got more sleep, ate better, and not drank all the time, I wouldn't have needed to go on HRT.

Good luck bro, seriously. It would give me overwhelming hope for my own condition if you could do this. But I am afraid that you will be disappointed in the end and still have low test and lethargy when you get off of the Clomid. I was diagnosed at age 29 with secondary hypogonadism, but I suspect I had been suffering since I was 21 or so.

IF you end up in the same boat as before, promise me that you will get a good doctor, such as Dr. John or Dr. Shippen to treat you since you are so young.


NOONE in their early 20s sleeps enough, and we all drank heavily and smoked weed at that age, so don't blame it solely on that. I 100% wish you the best of luck, and I will personally fly out to see your doctor AND suck your **** if this works, but I hope you aren't too disappointed when it doesn't.

 

[Kroms_laugh]

Good luck bro, seriously. It would give me overwhelming hope for my own condition if you could do this. But I am afraid that you will be disappointed in the end and still have low test and lethargy when you get off of the Clomid. I was diagnosed at age 29 with secondary hypogonadism, but I suspect I had been suffering since I was 21 or so.

IF you end up in the same boat as before, promise me that you will get a good doctor, such as Dr. John or Dr. Shippen to treat you since you are so young.


NOONE in their early 20s sleeps enough, and we all drank heavily and smoked weed at that age, so don't blame it solely on that. I 100% wish you the best of luck, and I will personally fly out to see your doctor AND suck your **** if this works, but I hope you aren't too disappointed when it doesn't.

LOL! Well played. I'm hoping it works as well, bro. But the conditions that are required for a person with a sensitive HTPA to create endogenous test are almost to difficult for me schedule for because I have to get up before God and any reasonable individual (hint as to my profession). Which basically translates to; I agree... I don't know that this will work because of the lack of sleep, history of alcohol abuse, etc.

But it's worth a shot. I think you'll agree.

And I don't know that anyone has ever posted blood tests after attempting to restart HTPA function. Maybe someone can link me if they have.

I'd hate to drive all the way to the Man-Cave, but Lansing isn't that far and I know I could keep my condition under wraps with him.

 

[Trevor Miller]

I flew to the Man Cave and so far it has been worth it.

 

[jinxie]

I flew to the Man Cave and so far it has been worth it.

Trevor, how were you disappointed by the man? Is the protocol not working for you. I see another doctor, but am on a protocol similar to the standard Crisler protocol. I will get my first round of blood work later this week. It will be interesting to see it.

Hope things improve for you. And you're not actually as big as you claim, are you?

 

[Kroms_laugh]

Trevor, how were you disappointed by the man?

and so far it has been worth it.

He wasn't disappointed.

 

[cpeil2]

I'm already off the testosterone. It's day 31 for me. I take a blood test in 10 days (I accidentally put 5 days above) to see if 100mg Clomid / 10mg Nolvadex ED for 30 days has worked in boosting a restart. I don't feel like ****. I suppose I'm a little lethargic, but that's because my diet sucks. The only negative side-effect I've encountered thus far is it takes me a little more effort to get an erection. My ejaculation has probably tripled in volume, and my balls are a little bigger.

But as far as the debilitating lethargy, I don't feel any of that.

Tomorrow, I plan on quitting chewing tobacco. I've already quite drinking all together. After my blood test I'm going to fast and clean out my system, then probably start another Clomid / Nolvadex treatment to help things along. I'm really convinced that had I got more sleep, ate better, and not drank all the time, I wouldn't have needed to go on HRT.

You're pretty young aren't you - in your twenties? I was always a little puzzled by your problem. Maybe it was bad habits and lifestyle. I hope things work out.

 

[jinxie]

Trevor, how were you disappointed by the man? Is the protocol not working for you. I see another doctor, but am on a protocol similar to the standard Crisler protocol. I will get my first round of blood work later this week. It will be interesting to see it.

Hope things improve for you. And you're not actually as big as you claim, are you?

Ah, sorry, I misread your post, Trevor. My bad.

 

[The Matrix]

You're pretty young aren't you - in your twenties? I was always a little puzzled by your problem. Maybe it was bad habits and lifestyle. I hope things work out.

In combination with medication route sounds to me like you have alot of unbalanced lifestyles that eventually caught up to you which is probably the primary cause of your HPTA issues as it is with majority of people I have worked with in the past. They have been on TRT for years, but it was the proper life style changes and also proper integration into supplements what there body require to get them back to feel good. Your sleep is probably the main issue.

 

[Trevor Miller]

Hope things improve for you. And you're not actually as big as you claim, are you?

Yes, I am quite large these days :rofl: Gained around 25lbs after starting HRT, mostly bloat from my e2 getting up to 69. Thankfully I'm not a complete fatty, I lift weights and am decently strong.

 

[krazy]

Looking back at my results, and having read much more research into hypogonadism and HTPA suppression, I speculate that my diagnosis was incorrect and that had I only gotten more sleep, put my diet in check, and stayed on my vitamins consistently... I would have had normal levels. But it's too late now... nor does it matter.

Just to play devils advocate here.... Do you REALLY think thats the cause? Wouldnt you suspect that your body is somewhat more weak than average and, thus, more highly susceptible to external factors?

It is fairly standard practice these days to not get enough sleep, not get enough (healthy) food to eat, etc.

Even over a long term... you truly believe little things like that would wreck a person's entire HPTA? Low levels, sure. The ENTIRE endocrine system, though?


Dont get me wrong... I do believe they can help. But I think they are more secondary than primary in this case.

Id love your input on an argument against...