Long Readbut Will Make You Think Twice About Fish Oils !! - AnabolicMinds.com - Page 2

Long Readbut Will Make You Think Twice About Fish Oils !!

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  1. Professional Member
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    Is this supplement a complete solution

    http://search.lef.org/cgi-src-bin/Ms...&hiword=EFA%20
    ============================== ================

    Total EFA Junior
    500 mg, 90 softgels $11.24
    Item Catalog Number: 31093
    Health From The Sun The Total EFA Juniorô supplies the daily needs of your children for essential fatty acids (EFAs) in an ideal ratio of omega-3 and omega-6.* Essential fatty acids are nutrients which children must obtain fro foods or dietary supplements.

    The Total EFA Junior is nutritionally complete with omega-6 GLA from Borage seed oil, omega-3 ALA from flaxseed oil and omega-3 EPA and DHA from Fish oil, plus omega-9 fatty acids. The easy to swallow 500 mg softgel is a convenient way for your children to get a comprehensive, well-balanced blend of EFA nutritional oils.

    Supplement Facts
    Serving Size 1 softgel

    Alpha-Linolenic Acid [ALA] (omega-3) 91 mg

    Docosahexaenoic Acid [DHA] (omega-3) 18 mg

    Eicosapentaenoic Acid [EPA] (omega-3) 28 mg

    Gamma-Linolenic Acid [GLA] (omega-6) 40 mg

    Linoleic Acid (omega-6) 86 mg

    Oleic Acid (omega-9) 70 mg

    Ingredients: certified organic flaxseed oil, borage seed oil, fish oil, gelatin, glycerin, water and mixed tocopherols.


    Dosage and Use
    Children under three, empty contents of one softgel and mix with food.
    Three to seven years, one to two softgels daily.
    Eight to ten, two to three softgels.
    Over ten, three to four softgels.

  2. DLA
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    Quote Originally Posted by DLA View Post
    A brief synopsis of the article.

    The main point: Most people are deficient in unrefined/unprocessed PEO's (Parent Essential Oils). Brian Peskin coined this term.

    This term “Parent Essential Oils” refers to the only two true essential fatty acids: parent omega-6 (LA) and parent omega-3 (ALA). The term “parent” is used because these are the whole, unadulterated form of the only two essential fats your body demands, as they occur in nature. Once PEOs are consumed your body changes a small percentage of them—about 5%—into other biochemicals called “derivatives,” while leaving the remaining 95% in parent form.

    The Parent Essential Oils have very important functions.

    Supplementing with derivatives like fish oil can exacerbate health problems, resulting from a low Omega 3 (ALA)EPA/DHA) ratio.

    Since many of the Omega 3 and Omega 6's we consume are processed, this can lead to a deficiency of the Parent Essential Oils, linoleic acid, and alpha-linolenic acid.

    PEO's should be supplemented in a ratio of 1:1 to 2.5:1, Omega 6:Omega 3.

    Most people don't supplement the PEO alpha-linolenic acid, making it doubly important.


    Do I believe this guy? Not sure, but his research is compelling, and he has definitely done his homework. Most of the research is not his own. He has borrowed it from other scientists and freely admits this.

    I don't trust Quackwatch at all. You'll notice almost every single "alternative" practicitioner is listed on that site. The fact that one is not in :mainstream" medicine is sufficient evidence to being labelled as a quack, apparently no matter how good the research.

    Dopamineloveaffair
    Any comments?

    The authors distinction that LA and ALA have the main biological functions (95%), as opposed to GLA, EPA, and DHA's minor roles, is interesting.

    As well, the small prevalence of unadulterated LA and ALA in our natural diet.

    Is this guy talking out of his ass, or may there be some truth to this? I'm not a big fan of authoritatively shooting down arguments.

    Dopamineloveaffair

    LOL Yes, I just quoted myself.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DLA View Post
    Any comments?

    The authors distinction that LA and ALA have the main biological functions (95%), as opposed to GLA, EPA, and DHA's minor roles, is interesting.

    As well, the small prevalence of unadulterated LA and ALA in our natural diet.

    Is this guy talking out of his ass, or may there be some truth to this? I'm not a big fan of authoritatively shooting down arguments.

    Dopamineloveaffair

    LOL Yes, I just quoted myself.
    I found black current oil and hempseed oil to be the best for supplementing over all it has a 4:1 ratio of 6:3 ratio and may be 1 tsp of fish oils a 3 times a week if you eat fish in not then evry day is fine provided it is balanced with GLA with ratio of 2 GLA:1 (DHA/epa). Then there should be no issues
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    Bump for nuclear ...
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    I don't know if this was mentioned already in this thread, but people shouldn't worry about balancing their EFA's at all when supplementing (i.e. balancing omega 3 with 6).Most diets are already ultra high in omega-6, unless you completely stay away from omega-6 rich veggies/grains and ONLY eat grass-fed beef.

    I used to use Udo's oil because it's balanced, but then realized that it's not necessary since omega 6 is plentiful in our food, if not too abundant.

    I only use omega 3 fish oil from - Stronger Faster Healthier

    They also have a great testing kit you can buy, to see if you're levels are correct/optimal:Omega-3 Index Assay - Stronger Faster Healthier
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    OP's article was just a sales pitch. Sentences like, "I was amazed!" aren't science. Nor was there any actual significant data.
    Bulk Performance Solutions
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gutterpump View Post
    I don't know if this was mentioned already in this thread, but people shouldn't worry about balancing their EFA's at all when supplementing (i.e. balancing omega 3 with 6).Most diets are already ultra high in omega-6, unless you completely stay away from omega-6 rich veggies/grains and ONLY eat grass-fed beef.

    I used to use Udo's oil because it's balanced, but then realized that it's not necessary since omega 6 is plentiful in our food, if not too abundant.

    I only use omega 3 fish oil from - Stronger Faster Healthier

    They also have a great testing kit you can buy, to see if you're levels are correct/optimal:Omega-3 Index Assay - Stronger Faster Healthier
    The body can fool you and it has many Doctors with common misinformation. Times have changed dramatically biologically speaking..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    The body can fool you and it has many Doctors with common misinformation. Times have changed dramatically biologically speaking..
    I'm not sure what you mean here.

    All I know is that the typical diet is PACKED full of omega-6, unless you have a very organic, grain free diet. Most people only need to supplement with omega-3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gutterpump

    I'm not sure what you mean here.

    All I know is that the typical diet is PACKED full of omega-6, unless you have a very organic, grain free diet. Most people only need to supplement with omega-3
    Due.to.evolution and toxic intervention from.modern men our.bodys are no.longer tolerating that of esikimo or.innuit lifestyle. Its back firing on majority of.clients and cases I am dealing with. To comprehend this.go.against general.principles and why everything i.have been mentioning almost a decade ago is.coming to.forefront of.medicine..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    I don't live in the arctic though, and I am sure that I'm not living an innuit lifestyle. I don't eat only fish all day long and live in igloos or hunt. And I don't megadose omega 3 either.

    I'm still confused here??? I think we're on two different topics possibly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix
    everything i.have been mentioning almost a decade ago is.coming to.forefront of.medicine..
    Uh, no it's not. Matrix, I'm going to say this the nicest way possible: get over yourself. You're not in the forefront of medicine. Your holier than thou attitude is tiresome sometimes. People come to this forum with questions and your standard response is that their Dr is an idiot or their clinic sucks or whatever. To my knowledge, you haven't published any of these 'ideas' of yours. If I'm wrong, feel free to correct me.

    As you know from our previous conversations, I do medical research for a living, and am a published author in the area of spinal cord injury. Until your ideas can stand up to a peer review process, please don't portray the image that the info you present is anything other than your opinion. I also am concerned that you use this forum, albeit in a discreet fashion, to drum up business for yourself. I haven't given much time thinking about the ethics of this, but it seems a bit shady to me.
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    Whether it be mental or whatever, I like taking fish oil. I think it helps my thinking and dose help my old creaky knees from years of skateboarding.
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post
    Uh, no it's not. Matrix,Hardasnails I'm going to say this the nicest way possible: get over yourself. You're not in the forefront of medicine. Your holier than thou attitude is tiresome sometimes. People come to this forum with questions and your standard response is that their Dr is an idiot or their clinic sucks or whatever. To my knowledge, you haven't published any of these 'ideas' of yours. If I'm wrong, feel free to correct me.

    As you know from our previous conversations, I do medical research for a living, and am a published author in the area of spinal cord injury. Until your ideas can stand up to a peer review process, please don't portray the image that the info you present is anything other than your opinion. I also am concerned that you use this forum, albeit in a discreet fashion, to drum up business for yourself. I haven't given much time thinking about the ethics of this, but it seems a bit shady to me.
    Well said!



    That's why he got the boot at ATM, trying to portrait as a medical professional, or rather being light years ahead in biology, biochemistry, Endocrinology and Physiology.

    Makes for entertaining reading!
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    To his defense, he does know a lot - practices what he preaches, and is pretty cutting edge - and has helped many people.

    But I still would like a clear answer as to why supplementing with a bit of omega 3 is bad. Not talking about mega dosing here. Also would like to discuss why people recommend supplementing with a balanced omega 3:6 ratio when omega 6 is overly abundant in most people's diets (whereas omega 3 is not).
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gutterpump
    To his defense, he does know a lot - practices what he preaches, and is pretty cutting edge - and has helped many people
    Hey gutter, he's not licensed or certified in anything and the people he 'helps' are under the care of a physician, not him. Granted he does have a good bit of knowledge, but anyone can get that if they read enough. The thing that gives me the red ass is his 'i had this person do this' or 'i had the doc do this.' he does none of that, the physician does.

    Any recommendations he may have HAVE to be signed off on by a physician. If something goes wrong, it's the doc's ass, not his. Do we really know that any of his cutting edge ideas are his? Or does he find them in obscure journals somewhere? Who knows. If these ideas are indeed his, all he has to do is find a doc to co-author an article and submit it to a journal. If it's that cutting edge, it will get published.

    I respect your opinion gutter, but IMNHO, I think he's taking credit for other people work and passing it off as his own. Don't get me started on using the forum looking for business. That's about as unethical as it gets.

    Bottom line s that he does nothing, the docs do. He writes no orders or scripts and takes care of no one.

    That's all I have to say...
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    It depends on the person biochemistry..Why one tests to evaluate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gutterpump View Post
    To his defense, he does know a lot - practices what he preaches, and is pretty cutting edge - and has helped many people.

    But I still would like a clear answer as to why supplementing with a bit of omega 3 is bad. Not talking about mega dosing here. Also would like to discuss why people recommend supplementing with a balanced omega 3:6 ratio when omega 6 is overly abundant in most people's diets (whereas omega 3 is not).
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post
    Hey gutter, he's not licensed or certified in anything and the people he 'helps' are under the care of a physician, not him. Granted he does have a good bit of knowledge, but anyone can get that if they read enough. The thing that gives me the red ass is his 'i had this person do this' or 'i had the doc do this.' he does none of that, the physician does.

    Any recommendations he may have HAVE to be signed off on by a physician. If something goes wrong, it's the doc's ass, not his. Do we really know that any of his cutting edge ideas are his? Or does he find them in obscure journals somewhere? Who knows. If these ideas are indeed his, all he has to do is find a doc to co-author an article and submit it to a journal. If it's that cutting edge, it will get published.

    I respect your opinion gutter, but IMNHO, I think he's taking credit for other people work and passing it off as his own. Don't get me started on using the forum looking for business. That's about as unethical as it gets.

    Bottom line s that he does nothing, the docs do. He writes no orders or scripts and takes care of no one.

    That's all I have to say...

    I hear what you're saying, and already knew these things. I've chatted on the phone with him. He works with a Dr in PA as a consultant...and he will consult with patients directly - in realtime - to tweak their protocols as well. I am not just speaking about HRT protocols, but general supplementation, etc. I don't see what's wrong with consulting. It's the same as if you or I paid for a personal trainer or nutritional consultant - if we were doing a show. We pay someone we trust to get the job done...and I'd rather pay someone who has the longevity and the know-how, over someone with only school to back them up and isn't on HRT or doesn't have an athletic background. For this reason, I also hold Dr. John very highly. He has both backgrounds in HRT and sports.

    HAN/Matrix has been through it all before! With himself, and many many others. Because of this, he is a wealth of knowledge. I've even thought about charging for my own services as a consultant for nutrition/general health/fitness. The longer we're in this game, the more knowledgeable we become through practice and helping others.
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post
    Hey gutter, he's not licensed or certified in anything and the people he 'helps' are under the care of a physician, not him. Granted he does have a good bit of knowledge, but anyone can get that if they read enough. The thing that gives me the red ass is his 'i had this person do this' or 'i had the doc do this.' he does none of that, the physician does.

    Any recommendations he may have HAVE to be signed off on by a physician. If something goes wrong, it's the doc's ass, not his. Do we really know that any of his cutting edge ideas are his? Or does he find them in obscure journals somewhere? Who knows. If these ideas are indeed his, all he has to do is find a doc to co-author an article and submit it to a journal. If it's that cutting edge, it will get published.

    I respect your opinion gutter, but IMNHO, I think he's taking credit for other people work and passing it off as his own. Don't get me started on using the forum looking for business. That's about as unethical as it gets.

    Bottom line s that he does nothing, the docs do. He writes no orders or scripts and takes care of no one.

    That's all I have to say...
    You are right the research is out there. Problem is there are few people to existing research and instead of looking at it for black and white look at it as gray. Medicine is black or white "you in or out of range" Same thing applies with research. Take pre existing ideas to create new ideas is how we make progress. Published paper are definitely in the near future with well respected MD's. I was very selective who I have been trying to associate myself. Many Drs are in the process of writing books and co authoring they are leaving their practice to do so. Another few months, I will go off the radar ...too many projects, conferences, and seminars on top of doing what I do..Will be no time..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gutterpump View Post
    I hear what you're saying, and already knew these things. I've chatted on the phone with him. He works with a Dr in PA as a consultant...and he will consult with patients directly - in realtime - to tweak their protocols as well. I am not just speaking about HRT protocols, but general supplementation, etc. I don't see what's wrong with consulting. It's the same as if you or I paid for a personal trainer or nutritional consultant - if we were doing a show. We pay someone we trust to get the job done...and I'd rather pay someone who has the longevity and the know-how, over someone with only school to back them up and isn't on HRT or doesn't have an athletic background. For this reason, I also hold Dr. John very highly. He has both backgrounds in HRT and sports.

    HAN/Matrix has been through it all before! With himself, and many many others. Because of this, he is a wealth of knowledge. I've even thought about charging for my own services as a consultant for nutrition/general health/fitness. The longer we're in this game, the more knowledgeable we become through practice and helping others.
    Gutter I am shifting my gears towards educating the medical doctors through future conference which I have been asked to speak at, seminars and doing one on one and group presentations with medical professionals. I plan on doing a few Published papers with MD's as well as to help set up future studies to research. The medical professionals I surround my self are the pioneers in the field. I am now doing genetic testing which is helping autistic,lyme, CFS, FM, soldiers where modern medicine has not been successful. I just got an email from one of best lyme drs in the state. Meeting with her this saturday for lunch to discuss working together. Yes I think out side the box and Drs are skeptical. When Drs see progression in their patients, the ones who care will start asking questions. Majority of cases are referred to me when the Dr's hit the wall. The patient is under the Dr's care, but it further research and evaluation with proper understanding helps them to break that wall. Hormones is the last thing on the totem pole, Finding out why they can not detox due to genetic expressions is top on the list then everything else is just downstream. I have been in contact with one specific Dr who is very humble, pure heart of gold, could care less about credentials and more of what you know. If I am successful I will not have to pursue anything else. To people in her area she would represent a Dr Crisler or Dr Shippen to us..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    You are right the research is out there. Problem is there are few people to existing research and instead of looking at it for black and white look at it as gray. Medicine is black or white "you in or out of range" Same thing applies with research. Take pre existing ideas to create new ideas is how we make progress. Published paper are definitely in the near future with well respected MD's. I was very selective who I have been trying to associate myself. Many Drs are in the process of writing books and co authoring they are leaving their practice to do so. Another few months, I will go off the radar ...too many projects, conferences, and seminars on top of doing what I do..Will be no time..
    i'm glad you chimed in matrix. tbh, the biggest problem i have is the 'holier than thou' schtick. i respect the fact that you've put in as much time as you have studying hrt. really, i do. gutter brought up a couple of very good points, however we disagree on a couple things: there's nothing wrong with consulting - but the rub is that consultants usually have an education/certification in whatever field they're consulting in. the same thing with trainers and nutritionists. and consultants that have longevity and know how, but not the education have a PROVEN track record in one way or another. imo, they're also the minority.

    if part of what you do is nutrition/supplement consulting, then for christ's sake man, there's a million certs out there, some of which are very good. get one. if you want to consult in hrt, a degree in biology or even neurobiology would give you credibility. if you want people to REALLY pay attention to what you're saying, get some letters after your name. i'll use Zir Red as an example here. Dude's got a PhD in exercise science or kinesiology, i can't remember which. anyone want to debate programming or exercise technique/selection with him? and if you have seminars lined up, great. that's all resume food dude, and that's exactly what you need for what you're trying to do.

    we all hand out advice around here. hell, i spend most of my time in the training sections and pass out advice. but i never take credit for any of the advice i give out. can you say the same? and if you want people to take you seriously, for christ's sake, write a coherent sentence. i understand you're on your phone but i can't follow wtf you're trying to say half the time.

    Steve
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    I am now doing genetic testing
    oh for fcks sake i just saw this.

    no, you're not, unless there's an abstract with your name on it...
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    Quote Originally Posted by napalm View Post
    oh for fcks sake i just saw this.

    no, you're not, unless there's an abstract with your name on it...
    Labs are doing the testing LOL, I am just helping MD understand / educate about the implications which takes existing research then elaborates on it. The research is out there, but people do not know what is hidden with in it which can be used for other purposes. People just read the articles, extracting valuable information then applying it to something else which may not even be related is what I do. Napalm I agree, I am actually looking into get a CCN degree as well as publishing a few papers in near future with MD's. Its not an over night process thats for sure, but wheels are in motion and going strong. I am not against medical professionals, I am just getting tired of people who when the finally the Dr calls you they are half dead because of medical incompetency when there was no need to suffer in the first place. I do not deal with joe public, cases Dr's referred out have blown through 100k or more, 50 plus drs, and 10 years of being bounced around the system. It's when "The drs basically run into a brick wall". I could care less what people think, but when Dr's give your name to other medical professionals it much more meaningful. Its the no names behind the science which can make the biggest impact..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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