How much of injected test is absorbed?

[Nemesis RR]

The human body makes 11mg of test at BEST a day. At 100mg of test a week in 2 doses (50 2X every 3.5 days) results in 15 to 11 mg per day. Yet some people to not reach the top of the range. What is going on?

 

[Joejoebaggins]

From my understanding you absorb about 70% of a test injection.

 

[Kasumeat]

Testosterone injections are not pure testosterone. They contain a lot of oil.

 

[rick055]

Testosterone injections are not pure testosterone. They contain a lot of oil.

I could be wrong, but I don't think the issue is the oil.

If you have testosterone enanthate at 100 mg/cc, if you inject 1 cc, you are, in fact getting 100 mg of testosterone enanthate.

That said (and similar to what you noted about not being "pure test"), testosterone enanthate (or cypionate, propionate, etc...) is an esterfied version of testosterone.

The esters are attached to the testosterone to slow its release, and you have to figure that into the net measured weight of the testosterone.

Said another way, 100 mg of testosterone enanthate contains less testosterone than, say, 100 mg of straight testosterone suspension due to the weight of the enanthate ester.

100 mg testosterone enanthate contains approximately 72 mg testosterone.

So if you are injecting 1 cc of 100 mg/cc TE per week, I would think that would be 72/7 or an average of 10 point something per day testosterone.

But, you also have to take into consideration the PKs of the particular ester and I don't think you're getting an average dose per day; I believe most release in a somewhat "frontloaded" fashion with a taper towards the end of the week.

I understand this to be why it is recommended to inject hCG on the two days prior to your shot.

-----------------------------

However, that still doesn't speak to the original question which was

"The human body makes 11mg of test at BEST a day. At 100mg of test a week in 2 doses (50 2X every 3.5 days) results in 15 to 11 mg per day. Yet some people to not reach the top of the range. What is going on?"

I think "what's going on" is a complex issue which involves the way an individual is metabolizing the testosterone.

For example, you would have to consider the resultant decrease in your endogenous production, how much is aromatizing to estrogen and how much is converting to DHT, among other things.

Again, my resounding disclaimer is that I am basically regurgitating from a book, Anabolics 2007, which I think is a must read.

 

[hardasnails1973]

I could be wrong, but I don't think the issue is the oil.

If you have testosterone enanthate at 100 mg/cc, if you inject 1 cc, you are, in fact getting 100 mg of testosterone enanthate.

That said (and similar to what you noted about not being "pure test"), testosterone enanthate (or cypionate, propionate, etc...) is an esterfied version of testosterone.

The esters are attached to the testosterone to slow its release, and you have to figure that into the net measured weight of the testosterone.

Said another way, 100 mg of testosterone enanthate contains less testosterone than, say, 100 mg of straight testosterone suspension due to the weight of the enanthate ester.

100 mg testosterone enanthate contains approximately 72 mg testosterone.

So if you are injecting 1 cc of 100 mg/cc TE per week, I would think that would be 72/7 or an average of 10 point something per day testosterone.

But, you also have to take into consideration the PKs of the particular ester and I don't think you're getting an average dose per day; I believe most release in a somewhat "frontloaded" fashion with a taper towards the end of the week.

I understand this to be why it is recommended to inject hCG on the two days prior to your shot.

-----------------------------

However, that still doesn't speak to the original question which was

"The human body makes 11mg of test at BEST a day. At 100mg of test a week in 2 doses (50 2X every 3.5 days) results in 15 to 11 mg per day. Yet some people to not reach the top of the range. What is going on?"

I think "what's going on" is a complex issue which involves the way an individual is metabolizing the testosterone.

For example, you would have to consider the resultant decrease in your endogenous production, how much is aromatizing to estrogen and how much is converting to DHT, among other things.

Again, my resounding disclaimer is that I am basically regurgitating from a book, Anabolics 2007, which I think is a must read.

You may absorb 70 mgs from 100 mgs shot but how fast one metabolises is another story

 

[Rodja]

You absorb 100% of the test, but part of the weight is in the ester. For Test E, about 30% of the weight is in the ester, but the rest is test.

 

[Kasumeat]

I could be wrong, but I don't think the issue is the oil.

The ester is oil. . . .

 

[jminis]

what were injecting is synthetic. Nothing beats the real deal

 

[rick055]

The ester is oil. . . .

I think we need an expert here.

My understanding is that the ester is a carbooxylic acid attached to the testosterone molecule.

Though that will make it more oil soluble, I don't think the ester is the oil.

 

[Kasumeat]

I think we need an expert here.

My understanding is that the ester is a carbooxylic acid attached to the testosterone molecule.

Though that will make it more oil soluble, I don't think the ester is the oil.

Okay, I think that you're right.

What's important is that the reason that 100mg of test e (or any other injectable) is not the same as 100mg of test is because test e is not pure test.

 

[rick055]

Okay, I think that you're right.

What's important is that the reason that 100mg of test e (or any other injectable) is not the same as 100mg of test is because test e is not pure test.

With the exception of testosterone suspension - which is a non-esterfied T injectible - that's correct.

In fact the same book I reference above gives these net values per 100 mg of the T ester:

Acetate - 87 mg

Propionate - 83 mg
enenthate - 72 mg
cypionate - 70 mg
undecanoate - 63 mg

Again, the book I get this from is Anabolics 2007 by Llewellyn. It is very comprehensive but written in a very "accessible" manor. I think anybody on TRT could benefit from reading it.

 

[pistonpump]

what were injecting is synthetic. Nothing beats the real deal

im gonna have to agree with this.

The ester is a given, we should know that there is ester weight involved. I think it has to do with conversion and absorbtion...its not the same as natural production.

 

[rick055]

I think it has to do with conversion and absorbtion...its not the same as natural production.

In fact, I think that's the more relevant answer to the original question.


Regardless of how much net test weight you're left with - whether it's 60 or 70% - where the test goes (metabolites E2, DHT, etc...) and the individual's metabolism are key issues.

 

[Nemesis RR]

With the exception of testosterone suspension - which is a non-esterfied T injectible - that's correct.

In fact the same book I reference above gives these net values per 100 mg of the T ester:

Acetate - 87 mg

Propionate - 83 mg
enenthate - 72 mg
cypionate - 70 mg
undecanoate - 63 mg

Again, the book I get this from is Anabolics 2007 by Llewellyn. It is very comprehensive but written in a very "accessible" manor. I think anybody on TRT could benefit from reading it.

This what I got from the product insert for depo-test:

Each mL of the 100 mg/mL solution contains:
Testosterone cypionate................................................................................... 100 mg
Benzyl benzoate .............................................................................................. 0.1 mL
Cottonseed oil ................................................................................................ 736 mg
Benzyl alcohol (as preservative) ..................................................................... 9.45 mg

I got it from here: http://www.allthingsmale.com/pdfs/testosterone20cypionate.pdf

I am wondering at what dose would someone be at he high end or at dose X you should be at total test of X.

Also does your present muscle mass have an effect?

 

[rick055]

I am wondering at what dose would someone be at he high end or at dose X you should be at total test of X.

Also does your present muscle mass have an effect?

Interesting questions.

I don't think you could correlate an X:X relationship, but I would bet that for most people, somewhere around 250 - 300 mg of test cyp a week would put them at the high end of the physiological range.

Of course, I'm basing that on straight math; you still have to take into consideration how much would aromatize to E, convert to DHT.

I don't know if muscle mass per se would have an effect, but I would think fat storage (especially central adiposity) would play a role in aromatization.