[JanSz]

Originally Posted by hardasnails1973

yep dr can order it for 80 bucks tells pst 3 months

Dot you like their pages
11 SUGGESTED VITAMIN AND MINERAL SUPPLEMENT SCHEDULE
12 SUGGESTED AMINO ACID SUPPLEMENT SCHEDULE

http://www.gdx.net/home/images/reportpdf/ONE.pdf

===============================================

HAN
I have a dr's visit comming real soon
and he wants to do this "Metabolic Oxidative Profile"

I usually go FULL BORE on my tests, so
I need to make real good list and you are the one to make sure that it is good list.

If you have a time, lets work on that list.
List must include name of the test and URL to that test.
Looks like other than Hair Analysis the other tests could/should be done at Genova Diagnostics.
----------------------
Hair Tissue Mineral Analysis (HTMA)
Hair Analysis
----------------------
ONE Optimal Nutrition Evaluation
GDX ONE - Optimal Nutrition Evaluation
----------------------
EstroEssence
Genova Diagnostics EstroEssence
----------------------
Comprehensive Digestive Stool Analysis (CDSA)
http://www.gdx.net/home/images/reportpdf/CDSA_2.0.pdf
-----------------------
Detoxification Profile (Comprehensive)
GDX Detoxification Profile Sample Report
-----------------------
Oxidative Stress Profile
GDX Oxidative Stress Analysis
--------------------------
Essential and Metabolic Fatty Acids
GDX Essential and Metabolic Fatty Acids Assessment
-------------------------
Comprehensive Cardiovascular Assessment
GDX Comprehensive Cardiovascular Assessment Application Guide
-------------------------
Adrenocortex Stress Profile
GDX Adrenocortex Stress Profile Application Guide
--------------------------------------


OK;
That is a lots of tests.
Some of the tests may be bundles by GDX and therefore repetitive.
Some may be indicated when some specific complaits are present.
You are the expert, go at it, take out some, add some.
Remember that once/year I am doing my long blood test so I do not need to be repetitive in my testing, unless justified.

.
.If you happen to know prices for some of these tests, please add them on.
.

[SufferingEd]

Originally Posted by anyman

Even though I intellectually understand that this is beyond my control and I did nothing to cause it, I still feel uncomfortable with having to depend of meds to fully be a man. I know this is silly to some, but when I go to the gym and see guys in even better shape than I am breeze through life without having to worry about being emasculated by a rather stupid affliction I get a bit down.
No doubt you ask "Why"? The answer is simple. The most commonly known effects of low T are all sexual in nature--and none of them something to brag about. I am uncomfortable with others knowing or thinking that I might need a little help in the manhood department. I value self reliance to no small extent and don't like dependence of any type or kind.

Over the last few months, however, I have been forced to accpet the fact that sometihng has gone awry in my body. I can either ignore it or work around it, as I am doing. But, before I sentence myself to a lifetime of TRT I need to first make sure that I have first exhausted all other options.

Do not be embarresed man. I am sure some if not a lot of those guys are on some type of medication, TRT, ect, and are in the gym to help emprove their health. It sucks getting older, last year I was taking nothing no meds what so ever. Always prided my self on being in such good health. Today, I am on Testim for Low T, Cialis for erections, a multi vitamin for over all health, fish oil, zinc , protein, and creatine. I get upset by all that I am taking, yet I feel good, and I am enjoying life and this is what matters most. Take it easy, get your meds right, and get back to enjoying life. Good Luck.

[jaydee]

To add to Suffering Ed's post, you dont really know if all of those guys you see at the gym ARE really healthy or not. You might be surprised at how many people out there look fine, but are actually hiding an illness or other problem.

I reckon your being too hard on yourself regarding your meds. There are HEAPS of guys in there 20's who have to take T these days for all kinds of reasons.....its modern living - drugs, lifestyle, diet, environment......its all part of life.

[anyman]

Update for those that might be interested:

Dr S started me first with 500iu of HCG 3x/week and I saw pretty much nothing. Barely budged from a T level of 200 to all of 224 (whoa--- I thought I was cured!).

The next step was to go to 1000iu 3x/week. Due to scheduling I tested after only 3 injections or so over 9 days or so. This time I did see a change--from 200 t0 371. But--Estradiol went from under 32 to about 44. That explains why I havn't felt all that much better. At least I know my testes can do something! Damned E2......

Dr S is still trying to shock them (and me) into working a bit better. He has directed me to go to 1500iu for 3x/week and retest after 2-3 weeks. Based on my results, I expect E to possibly go higher, which may trigger unpleasant results. If that does happen, I'll call him ASAP.

Yes, I know that some here are pushing me to go faster, but I am going to go along with his recommendations and see how much--if any-- of my natural production I can re-stimulate and save. The less I dependent I am, the better, even if this process takes longer than I like and delays my feeling better sooner. He assures me that 1500iu 3x/wk for 2-3 weeks after 2 weeks at 1000 and another 4-5 wks at 500iu will be fine.

Any comments? Concerns? Other issues? As always, all are welcome and appreciated.

[JanSz]

Originally Posted by anyman

Update for those that might be interested:

Dr S started me first with 500iu of HCG 3x/week and I saw pretty much nothing. Barely budged from a T level of 200 to all of 224 (whoa--- I thought I was cured!).

The next step was to go to 1000iu 3x/week. Due to scheduling I tested after only 3 injections or so over 9 days or so. This time I did see a change--from 200 t0 371. But--Estradiol went from under 32 to about 44. That explains why I havn't felt all that much better. At least I know my testes can do something! Damned E2......

Dr S is still trying to shock them (and me) into working a bit better. He has directed me to go to 1500iu for 3x/week and retest after 2-3 weeks. Based on my results, I expect E to possibly go higher, which may trigger unpleasant results. If that does happen, I'll call him ASAP.

Yes, I know that some here are pushing me to go faster, but I am going to go along with his recommendations and see how much--if any-- of my natural production I can re-stimulate and save. The less I dependent I am, the better, even if this process takes longer than I like and delays my feeling better sooner. He assures me that 1500iu 3x/wk for 2-3 weeks after 2 weeks at 1000 and another 4-5 wks at 500iu will be fine.

Any comments? Concerns? Other issues? As always, all are welcome and appreciated.

dr Delgado would like your TT to be at 1200
how are you going to get there?
=================================
http://anabolicminds.com/forum/male-...tml#post991716
I will also suggest that aging is going to include a decline of hormones,
within genetic differences, expect to augment back Testosterone,
I keep mime and my clients under doctors monitoring,
around 1000 to 1,200 ng/ml Total T,
and Free T at upper range of 200 to 300 (or 20 to 40 pg/mldepending on the nomenclature)
Aldosterone is best at 10 to 40 ug/24 hr,
IGF-1 around 250 to 400 ng/ml.
DHT 60 to 70 ng/dl,
DHEA 300 ug/dl,
insulin under 5,
SHBG 10 to 30 nmol/l,
Estradiol 35 pg/ml,
with about 20 (2OHE) to 1 -16aOHE.

[anyman]

Originally Posted by JanSz

dr Delgado would like your TT to be at 1200. How are you going to get there?

I don't think I'll ever get there. Based on my lab results, Dr S feels that I may be good at 600-700 due to my lower shbg and theoretical easier ability to get greater free T.

If I had to guess, he is not trying to get me up to full levels with hcg alone, but is instead trying to jump start what natural production capacity I still have so as to increase and preserve it. I have little doubt that supplemental T will eventually be introduced, probably sooner than later. But, I want to preserve what I have and reduce the degree to which I become dependent, at least to the extent possible.

[plymouth city]

1200TT is crazy high

Most teenagers don't have TT that high

Some of Dr Delgados stuff is a bit wacky

[anyman]

Originally Posted by plymouth city

1200TT is crazy high

Most teenagers don't have TT that high

Some of Dr Delgados stuff is a bit wacky

I do not know this Delgado guy, but even to my uneducated eyes 1200 seems way too high. I can't imagine Dr J getting guys there lest he suddenly desire to put his license at risk.

Me? I'm just trying to resolve this the best I can, even if the "right" way takes longer. I can't imagine how trying to preserve, expand and protect my natural capacities is a bad thing. It might not work, but I must at least try. External T would be the fastest and easiest--but not necessarily the best in the long run. I don't doubt that I'll be there-and often wish I was already, but don't want to rush and will allow Dr S to do his thing. It's likely safe to assume he knows far mor than I do and has greater experience many times over.

[plymouth city]

I have seen tons of BW from healthy teenagers/young adults 18 - 25

Most have TT levels 600 - 800
FT mid 20's
E2 low 20's

[plymouth city]

Hang tight anyman

Does the Dr have you on a good, natural and non synthetic form ov Vitamin E?

Vit E increases Leydig cell sensitivity, something someone in your shoes wants.

I like carlsons

[anyman]

Originally Posted by plymouth city

Hang tight anyman

Does the Dr have you on a good, natural and non synthetic form ov Vitamin E?

Vit E increases Leydig cell sensitivity, something someone in your shoes wants.

I like carlsons

I'll have to look into "Carlson's". Got any favorite suppliers? I wonder if it's available locally. I do take an "E" supp every other day, but it's a generic store brand. Didn't know there was a difference.

I know some here think I'm nuts (slight pun intended) for letting this go on so long, but I am convinced that rushing is a bad idea. If there is even a modest chance of recovering some of my former self I have to at least try. At almost 44 yrs of age I could have 40 more years on meds if I'm not careful. Why not minimize this to the extent possible? If I can't trust Dr S then who can I trust and why I am paying him out of pocket?

While I trust the Dr, I do like to do my own research and verify. This is why I value the thoughts and opinions of those here, even if they think I'm dragging my feet. While I trust Dr S, I take what I learn here and combine it. For example, I asked if his suggestion of 1500iu of hcg 3x/week might possibly be a bit strong. He reassured me and said to do it for only 3 weeks and then retest. Looks like he is trying to do a jump start of the Leydig cells. I still wonder what'll happen if that works. Will the hcg then just shut down the H and P parts of the HPTA?

[plymouth city]

Originally Posted by anyman

I'll have to look into "Carlson's". Got any favorite suppliers? I wonder if it's available locally. I do take an "E" supp every other day, but it's a generic store brand. Didn't know there was a difference.

I know some here think I'm nuts (slight pun intended) for letting this go on so long, but I am convinced that rushing is a bad idea. If there is even a modest chance of recovering some of my former self I have to at least try. At almost 44 yrs of age I could have 40 more years on meds if I'm not careful. Why not minimize this to the extent possible? If I can't trust Dr S then who can I trust and why I am paying him out of pocket?

While I trust the Dr, I do like to do my own research and verify. This is why I value the thoughts and opinions of those here, even if they think I'm dragging my feet. While I trust Dr S, I take what I learn here and combine it. For example, I asked if his suggestion of 1500iu of hcg 3x/week might possibly be a bit strong. He reassured me and said to do it for only 3 weeks and then retest. Looks like he is trying to do a jump start of the Leydig cells. I still wonder what'll happen if that works. Will the hcg then just shut down the H and P parts of the HPTA?

Do not be so quick to jump to HRT.

I like the approach.

Your right, you might be stuck for awile if you do.

The way current technology is going another 40 years might be a very conservative guess, you might be looking at 60 or more.

I like betterhealthfoods, its free shipping over 50 bucks, can't beat that.

Yes, you need natural, not synthetic vitamin E. The store brand you have is probably useless.

http://www.thebetterhealthstore.com/index.asp

[Scottyo]

better health store is a bit pricey though. i like iherb and vitacost. vitacost has the cheapest carlson's fish oil i found...and their NSI brand supps (like b vitamins) are excelletnly priced and well-formulated.

iherb is great...and great shipping options and times too (as wel as price).

[jaydee]

Originally Posted by anyman

I'll have to look into "Carlson's". Got any favorite suppliers? I wonder if it's available locally. I do take an "E" supp every other day, but it's a generic store brand. Didn't know there was a difference.

I know some here think I'm nuts (slight pun intended) for letting this go on so long, but I am convinced that rushing is a bad idea. If there is even a modest chance of recovering some of my former self I have to at least try. At almost 44 yrs of age I could have 40 more years on meds if I'm not careful. Why not minimize this to the extent possible? If I can't trust Dr S then who can I trust and why I am paying him out of pocket?

While I trust the Dr, I do like to do my own research and verify. This is why I value the thoughts and opinions of those here, even if they think I'm dragging my feet. While I trust Dr S, I take what I learn here and combine it. For example, I asked if his suggestion of 1500iu of hcg 3x/week might possibly be a bit strong. He reassured me and said to do it for only 3 weeks and then retest. Looks like he is trying to do a jump start of the Leydig cells. I still wonder what'll happen if that works. Will the hcg then just shut down the H and P parts of the HPTA?

I wonder why 1500IU and not 500IU. Has he mentioned going any higher than 1500 if it doesnt work?

What has he said about the propecia use?

[anyman]

Originally Posted by jaydee

I wonder why 1500IU and not 500IU. Has he mentioned going any higher than 1500 if it doesnt work?

What has he said about the propecia use?

From discussions with others it appears as though this is something new. I suspect he is trying to jumpstart things with an escalating series of doses. He only decides what to do after bloodwork, so I won't know more for another 3-4 weeks after I've been on it for a bit.

I am anxioous to move things along and feel more like my old self, but want to give this time to work and see where it goes.

As for propecia, he said it is possible, even though it was for only a month or so and several years ago. There is no way to know for sure. I suspect it is a factor, however.

[JanSz]