Follow-up Endo visit (1 month on androgel) - advice needed

[Rausch]

I just got done with my follow up visit after 1 month on androgel. I gotta tell you, I am not happy. I haven't gotten the blood results back quite yet, but I wanted to talk about what I found out.

I asked the doc if she thought I was primary or secondary hypogonadism. I did do a steroid cycle in the past, so she assumed I was secondary. She said since my LH and FSH levels were both below normal, I must be secondary - fine. I asked her why I am using Androgel then, since TRT is really used to treat primary hypogonadism. She says the androgel is simply to help me feel 'normal' while we wait and see if my FSH and LH level increase on their own. It's been 15 months since I came off my steroid cycle back in January 2006. If my LH and FSH levels have not increased by now, what are the chances they will just kick start in the next 3 months? Wouldn't androgel make secondary hypogonadism even worse? I asked the doc what happens IF my LH and FSH levels magically come back to normal. She responded simply with 'drop the androgel and hope for the best'. I was appalled. Perhaps my hormonal comprehension is terrible, but it seems to me that if I were to drop Androgel all of a sudden, even with LH and FSH being normal, my testes production would be suppressed and I would crash again. It seems like clomid or nolva could be used there, just as if I were coming off a regular cycle. It just doesn't make sense.

Anyway, after a month of Androgel I dont feel any better than when I started at 143 (total). No morning erection, low sex drive, fatigue, the whole nine yards. The doc doesn't seem to care how I 'feel', she simply cares what the numbers are in my blood tests. SO now I wait, feeling just as ****ty as ever, for my blood test results. I'm 24 years old and she says as long as I get into the 400-500 total test range, I should be fine. It doesnt matter how I feel.

Is it time to find ANOTHER endocrinologist? I'm about to lose my mind here. It'd be awesome if someone could reassure me.

 

[JanSz]

I just got done with my follow up visit after 1 month on androgel. I gotta tell you, I am not happy. I haven't gotten the blood results back quite yet, but I wanted to talk about what I found out.

I asked the doc if she thought I was primary or secondary hypogonadism. I did do a steroid cycle in the past, so she assumed I was secondary. She said since my LH and FSH levels were both below normal, I must be secondary - fine. I asked her why I am using Androgel then, since TRT is really used to treat primary hypogonadism. She says the androgel is simply to help me feel 'normal' while we wait and see if my FSH and LH level increase on their own. It's been 15 months since I came off my steroid cycle back in January 2006. If my LH and FSH levels have not increased by now, what are the chances they will just kick start in the next 3 months? Wouldn't androgel make secondary hypogonadism even worse? I asked the doc what happens IF my LH and FSH levels magically come back to normal. She responded simply with 'drop the androgel and hope for the best'. I was appalled. Perhaps my hormonal comprehension is terrible, but it seems to me that if I were to drop Androgel all of a sudden, even with LH and FSH being normal, my testes production would be suppressed and I would crash again. It seems like clomid or nolva could be used there, just as if I were coming off a regular cycle. It just doesn't make sense.

Anyway, after a month of Androgel I dont feel any better than when I started at 143 (total). No morning erection, low sex drive, fatigue, the whole nine yards. The doc doesn't seem to care how I 'feel', she simply cares what the numbers are in my blood tests. SO now I wait, feeling just as ****ty as ever, for my blood test results. I'm 24 years old and she says as long as I get into the 400-500 total test range, I should be fine. It doesnt matter how I feel.

Is it time to find ANOTHER endocrinologist? I'm about to lose my mind here. It'd be awesome if someone could reassure me.

#1, that will tell you little bit about doing steroid cycle.
Not everybody shuts down on steroids.
not everybody goes blind trying to recover with Clomid and Nolva.
But this board is a land of broken toys.
If you have a better doctor, drop this one.
If this one will give you a scripts you need, keep her.
If you want you can do 3 months trial to see if you recover.
Use
HCG 100IU/day
HMG 75IU/day
There are names of HCG and HMG, pick any you can get.
PharmaCare - Fertility Clinical Resource | Infertility Medication: Brand vs. Generic1-00
In the first month you probably should keep Androgel then stop and see what happens.

 

[Rausch]

#1, that will tell you little bit about doing steroid cycle.
Not everybody shuts down on steroids.
not everybody goes blind trying to recover with Clomid and Nolva.
But this board is a land of broken toys.
If you have a better doctor, drop this one.
If this one will give you a scripts you need, keep her.
If you want you can do 3 months trial to see if you recover.
Use
HCG 100IU/day
HMG 75IU/day
There are names of HCG and HMG, pick any you can get.
PharmaCare - Fertility Clinical Resource | Infertility Medication: Brand vs. Generic1-00
In the first month you probably should keep Androgel then stop and see what happens.

It's not that easy. She's quite sure her methods work. I don't see her EVER prescribing HCG and HMG. The only time she said she would even prescribe HCG is if fertility is an issue. She would run a sperm count test first, then if it is low she would take me off androgel and run HCG ONLY for the time me and my wife are trying to get pregnant. She never once mentioned running HCG and HMG to recover.

It's really much harder than one would think to find another endo. For that I need a new referral from my GP, and my GP usually works only with this endo that I'm currently seeing. I feel trapped. I almost wish I could run my own treatment.

 

[JanSz]

It's not that easy. She's quite sure her methods work. I don't see her EVER prescribing HCG and HMG. The only time she said she would even prescribe HCG is if fertility is an issue. She would run a sperm count test first, then if it is low she would take me off androgel and run HCG ONLY for the time me and my wife are trying to get pregnant. She never once mentioned running HCG and HMG to recover.

It's really much harder than one would think to find another endo. For that I need a new referral from my GP, and my GP usually works only with this endo that I'm currently seeing. I feel trapped. I almost wish I could run my own treatment.

I do run mine.
My doc is in ZIP 07410
Osteopats often have heart.
Look for one here:
American Osteopathic Association

Thyroid Disease Information Source -- Bestselling Books, News, Information on Living Well With Hypothyroidism, Autoimmune Disease, Thyroid Diet, Home Page of Mary Shomon

 

[hardasnails1973]

I just got done with my follow up visit after 1 month on androgel. I gotta tell you, I am not happy. I haven't gotten the blood results back quite yet, but I wanted to talk about what I found out.

I asked the doc if she thought I was primary or secondary hypogonadism. I did do a steroid cycle in the past, so she assumed I was secondary. She said since my LH and FSH levels were both below normal, I must be secondary - fine. I asked her why I am using Androgel then, since TRT is really used to treat primary hypogonadism. She says the androgel is simply to help me feel 'normal' while we wait and see if my FSH and LH level increase on their own. It's been 15 months since I came off my steroid cycle back in January 2006. If my LH and FSH levels have not increased by now, what are the chances they will just kick start in the next 3 months? Wouldn't androgel make secondary hypogonadism even worse? I asked the doc what happens IF my LH and FSH levels magically come back to normal. She responded simply with 'drop the androgel and hope for the best'. I was appalled. Perhaps my hormonal comprehension is terrible, but it seems to me that if I were to drop Androgel all of a sudden, even with LH and FSH being normal, my testes production would be suppressed and I would crash again. It seems like clomid or nolva could be used there, just as if I were coming off a regular cycle. It just doesn't make sense.

Anyway, after a month of Androgel I dont feel any better than when I started at 143 (total). No morning erection, low sex drive, fatigue, the whole nine yards. The doc doesn't seem to care how I 'feel', she simply cares what the numbers are in my blood tests. SO now I wait, feeling just as ****ty as ever, for my blood test results. I'm 24 years old and she says as long as I get into the 400-500 total test range, I should be fine. It doesnt matter how I feel.
[
Is it time to find ANOTHER endocrinologist? I'm about to lose my mind here. It'd be awesome if someone could reassure me.

Call Dr John and run as far as you can and as fast as you can

:icon_lol:

 

[cpeil2]

I just got done with my follow up visit after 1 month on androgel. I gotta tell you, I am not happy. I haven't gotten the blood results back quite yet, but I wanted to talk about what I found out.

I asked the doc if she thought I was primary or secondary hypogonadism. I did do a steroid cycle in the past, so she assumed I was secondary. She said since my LH and FSH levels were both below normal, I must be secondary - fine. I asked her why I am using Androgel then, since TRT is really used to treat primary hypogonadism. She says the androgel is simply to help me feel 'normal' while we wait and see if my FSH and LH level increase on their own. It's been 15 months since I came off my steroid cycle back in January 2006. If my LH and FSH levels have not increased by now, what are the chances they will just kick start in the next 3 months? Wouldn't androgel make secondary hypogonadism even worse? I asked the doc what happens IF my LH and FSH levels magically come back to normal. She responded simply with 'drop the androgel and hope for the best'. I was appalled. Perhaps my hormonal comprehension is terrible, but it seems to me that if I were to drop Androgel all of a sudden, even with LH and FSH being normal, my testes production would be suppressed and I would crash again. It seems like clomid or nolva could be used there, just as if I were coming off a regular cycle. It just doesn't make sense.

Anyway, after a month of Androgel I dont feel any better than when I started at 143 (total). No morning erection, low sex drive, fatigue, the whole nine yards. The doc doesn't seem to care how I 'feel', she simply cares what the numbers are in my blood tests. SO now I wait, feeling just as ****ty as ever, for my blood test results. I'm 24 years old and she says as long as I get into the 400-500 total test range, I should be fine. It doesnt matter how I feel.

Is it time to find ANOTHER endocrinologist? I'm about to lose my mind here. It'd be awesome if someone could reassure me.

She doesn't seem to know much about TRT. It is pretty unlikely that your LH and FSH will recover while on TRT. At the very least, they will probably stay right where they are at, or they could drop even lower. If you are getting T from an outside source, in classic negative feedback loop fashion, it will signal your system to cut back on your native T production by decreasing your level of LH and FSH, which signal your testes to produce T.


Give serious thought to finding another doc. As has been suggested, osteopaths are often a better bet, or an age management doc.

 

[Rausch]

She doesn't seem to know much about TRT. It is pretty unlikely that your LH and FSH will recover while on TRT. At the very least, they will probably stay right where they are at, or they could drop even lower. If you are getting T from an outside source, in classic negative feedback loop fashion, it will signal your system to cut back on your native T production by decreasing your level of LH and FSH, which signal your testes to produce T.


Give serious thought to finding another doc. As has been suggested, osteopaths are often a better bet, or an age management doc.

There are no osteopaths on the 'find a doctor' section of my health insurance website. I located a few osteopaths on the AOA website, but it doesnt look like my insurance covers them.

I guess you guys must have some damn good insurance or a lot of money.

 

[Rausch]

Call Dr John and run as far as you can and as fast as you can

:icon_lol:

I cant afford anything about Dr. John. I already checked.