Latest test results...looking better?

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  1. Latest test results...looking better?


    Ok, here are my latest results. I have talked to my secondary doctor about them but I dont see my primary until APril 12th. Any help would be appreciated.

    Right now, I am on 100iu HCG daily. .6ml 50mg/ml test cream. I take 100 DIM at dinner, and sometimes 100mg at breakfast. I am also (just recently switched from 8 pills isocort) on 20mg cortef, which has made me feel a lot better. Also on 1 grain armour thyroid, trying to move it up to 1.5 grains.

    I had a couple of other questions. My blood pressure is still quite low, and I get weird leg/calf cramps or what feels like too much or too little blood flow there. Also, I have a real bad FACIAL FLUSH. always in the morning and pretty much throughout the day its still there. Almost like a sunburn or maybe even a niacin-like flush. Any idea the cause or what it means? Ok, onto the tests.

    Here are the latest:

    Estradiol 21 (0-53) Looks good?
    Testosterone Serum 584 241-827
    Albumin, Serum 5.0 3.5-5.5
    SHBG Serum 23 13-71


    TSH 1.738 .350-5.500
    T4 5.4 4.5-12
    t3 uptake 37 24-39
    Free thyroxine index 2.0 1.2-4.9

    AST 29 (0-40)
    ALT 36 (0-55) First time these two have been normal in years....could it be because I havent worked out before testing?

    CBC, Platelet, no differential:

    WBC 4.6 (4-10.5) Finally no longer LOW
    RBC 4.68 (4.10-5.60)
    Hemoglobin 14.8 (12.5-17)
    Hematocrit (43.4) (36-50)
    MCV 93 (80-98)
    MCH 31.7 (27-34)
    MCHC 34.2 (32-36)
    RDW 14.3 (11.7-15)
    Platelets 213 (140-415) STill lower than id like

    Homocysteine, Plasma: 4.0 (5-12) I had this checked on a suspicion and its Low.

    Prostate-Specific Ag, Serum .2 (0.0-4)


  2. Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    Ok, here are my latest results. I have talked to my secondary doctor about them but I dont see my primary until APril 12th. Any help would be appreciated.

    Right now, I am on 100iu HCG daily. .6ml 50mg/ml test cream. I take 100 DIM at dinner, and sometimes 100mg at breakfast. I am also (just recently switched from 8 pills isocort) on 20mg cortef, which has made me feel a lot better. Also on 1 grain armour thyroid, trying to move it up to 1.5 grains.

    I had a couple of other questions. My blood pressure is still quite low, and I get weird leg/calf cramps or what feels like too much or too little blood flow there. Also, I have a real bad FACIAL FLUSH. always in the morning and pretty much throughout the day its still there. Almost like a sunburn or maybe even a niacin-like flush. Any idea the cause or what it means? Ok, onto the tests.

    Here are the latest:

    Estradiol 21 (0-53) Looks good?
    Testosterone Serum 584 241-827
    Albumin, Serum 5.0 3.5-5.5
    SHBG Serum 23 13-71


    TSH 1.738 .350-5.500
    T4 5.4 4.5-12
    t3 uptake 37 24-39
    Free thyroxine index 2.0 1.2-4.9

    AST 29 (0-40)
    ALT 36 (0-55) First time these two have been normal in years....could it be because I havent worked out before testing?

    CBC, Platelet, no differential:

    WBC 4.6 (4-10.5) Finally no longer LOW
    RBC 4.68 (4.10-5.60)
    Hemoglobin 14.8 (12.5-17)
    Hematocrit (43.4) (36-50)
    MCV 93 (80-98)
    MCH 31.7 (27-34)
    MCHC 34.2 (32-36)
    RDW 14.3 (11.7-15)
    Platelets 213 (140-415) STill lower than id like

    Homocysteine, Plasma: 4.0 (5-12) I had this checked on a suspicion and its Low.

    Prostate-Specific Ag, Serum .2 (0.0-4)
    Free & Bioavailable Testosterone calculator
    FreeT=137 pg/dL (100-250)
    BAT=372 ng/dL (desirable 550)
    need more T
    get test for
    FreeT3
    DHEAs
    progesterone
    TotalE
    Estrone
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  3. We tried getting DHT and freet3. For whatever reason, neither showed up in the bloodwork. Im a little frustrated about that.

    So your saying Im still on the low end of good? The doctor I saw said my testosterone was HIGH. Not sure what the hell he was thinking if that was true. This wasnt my primary but another doctor.

    Anything to say about the low Homocysteine either? Also, where can you look to get a good reference range for test levels? esp. bioavailable?

  4. Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    We tried getting DHT and freet3. For whatever reason, neither showed up in the bloodwork. Im a little frustrated about that.

    So your saying Im still on the low end of good? The doctor I saw said my testosterone was HIGH. Not sure what the hell he was thinking if that was true. This wasnt my primary but another doctor.

    Anything to say about the low Homocysteine either? Also, where can you look to get a good reference range for test levels? esp. bioavailable?
    Yep bank on dhea being in the crapper. Low homocysteine levels means usually you got detoxification problems. 400 mgs sam-e once a day for 2 days then goto 200 in afternnon then 1000 mgs TMG BID, metyl b-12, 5000 mcg, 5000 mcg folionic acid will help raise that up. Low homosyeteine = low methylation and methyl donnors. you numbers are right where mine are !!
    low homocystein leads means you got something in you trying to detoxifiy and I bank its copper or estrogen or both !!
    Leaky gut and also possible some kind of infection becareful to balance out the Dhea/cortisol ratio and check Lp(A). People with that low of homocystein have tendency to build plaque on arteries

    The link between adrenal fatigue and DNA methylation Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients - Find Articles

  5. Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    Yep bank on dhea being in the crapper. Low homocysteine levels means usually you got detoxification problems. 400 mgs sam-e once a day for 2 days then goto 200 in afternnon then 1000 mgs TMG BID, metyl b-12, 5000 mcg, 5000 mcg folionic acid will help raise that up. Low homosyeteine = low methylation and methyl donnors. you numbers are right where mine are !!
    low homocystein leads means you got something in you trying to detoxifiy and I bank its copper or estrogen or both !!
    Leaky gut and also possible some kind of infection becareful to balance out the Dhea/cortisol ratio and check Lp(A). People with that low of homocystein have tendency to build plaque on arteries

    The link between adrenal fatigue and DNA methylation Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients - Find Articles


    ive been on sam-e 400mg since october, plus 500mg tmg 2-3x a day as is.....and those are my numbers. not sure what else to do.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    ive been on sam-e 400mg since october, plus 500mg tmg 2-3x a day as is.....and those are my numbers. not sure what else to do.
    my bank is your estrogen is elevated at the tissue levels and increasing progesterone with hcg if on TRT may do the trick ..DUH add in 150 mcg chelated molydbenum reason being it will increase metylation from sulfate pathway

  7. Did you take the test before or after taking HCG/androgel?

    JH

  8. scotty with low homocysteine you have fat metabolism problems your body is storing fat in the liver and can not burn it despite normal blood tests.. look at ldh, vldl, ldl i bet they are low normal. watch the fish oils because undermethylators do not tolerate them well. I bet you your arachoncidonic acids are low and your RBC LNA and ALA are also low. molybednum with help u more then anything uric acid are probably low too

  9. my cholesterol has been VERY low for a long time. even triglycerides were low (didnt know possible), and my vitamin d levels were in the dumps. I have also been on 50mg of pregnenolone because that was low, but its oral so im not sure im absorbing any of it. So how do I improve fat metabolism? Whats with my facial flushing, and my calf cramps?

    And im wondering Dr. John's take on the hormones?

  10. [QUOTE=hardasnails1973;759530] Low homosyeteine = low methylation and methyl donnors. QUOTE]


    But the recommended approach for HIGH homocysteine is to take methylating agents and/or methyl donors.

  11. Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    my cholesterol has been VERY low for a long time. even triglycerides were low (didnt know possible), and my vitamin d levels were in the dumps. I have also been on 50mg of pregnenolone because that was low, but its oral so im not sure im absorbing any of it. So how do I improve fat metabolism? Whats with my facial flushing, and my calf cramps?

    And im wondering Dr. John's take on the hormones?

    Same boat here low triglycerides, low cholesterol, low homocystein levels can be from over abusing fish oils which have caused congestion in your liver from not being oxidixed properly. You need to really examine the phospholipid bi layers to see where the abnormalities occur. If your cell membranes are screwd up you can not get toxins out (estrogen, smog, ect.) you need high dosages of biotin 10-15 mgs with 2000 mgs of b-5 , inostiol, to really start flushing out that liver, but if you did a RBC fatty acid profile I guarrantee you find low arachondic acid, and elevated dha, epa if you have used fish oils in the past. I was doing 2 tsp for 4 months and I had 3 times highest EPA,dha in the cell which was choking off my AA production. With out AA you can not help to trigger the cAMP neceesary for hormone cascade..

    Entrez PubMed

  12. Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    ive been on sam-e 400mg since october, plus 500mg tmg 2-3x a day as is.....and those are my numbers. not sure what else to do.

    Just speculating - but maybe you are overdoing on the methyl donors.

  13. [QUOTE=cpeil2;759628]
    Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    Low homosyeteine = low methylation and methyl donnors. QUOTE]


    But the recommended approach for HIGH homocysteine is to take methylating agents and/or methyl donors.
    if you are low in homocystein you your transulfuration pathway is over loaded and homocysteine is not recycleing back to methione. When it comes to this stuff I understand it fully!! this is indicating that there is some type of toxic exposure and his body is trying to get rid of it by increasing gluthione and bile production and I can pretty much assure you its copper or estrogen. Watch your sulfur intake because that will deplete moly and
    i can pretty much guarrantee your zinc levels are low as well due to leaky gut

    Why i recommended
    methy b-12, folonic acid, TMG, selenium methioinne, zinc mono methionne, 200 mcg they are used for underethyators not over methylation..
    if you are taking niacin keep it to 250 mgs or less this will also deplete methy donors.

  14. Quote Originally Posted by cpeil2 View Post
    Just speculating - but maybe you are overdoing on the methyl donors.
    Not true the TMG acts as a saftey value if you get the sam-e cycle spinning to fast..And i can guranntee right now his cell membranes since they are not getting enough methyl donors that they are going into aptosis and breaking down the phosphocholine bi lipid layer to get the choline that is not being supplied this is lowering his acteylcholine levels as well which is not good!! ..hence why I can see his arachonic acid being low. Been here before myself..

  15. Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    They look pretty good to me.

    You need a Free T3 assay.

    Thanks Dr. John. Now, the question is...why do I still feel so bad so often? I still am unable to work out. When I try, even lightly, the next day my temp is all over the place, I feel light headed/brain fog and my stomach starts acting up all over again. Its been since january where I have been pretty much inactive besides a 40min walk almost every day. I would really like to start back in the gym.
    A good example of this abnormality is when I try to use the heart rate monitors (which are generally fairly accurate) at the gym. I have trouble getting the heart rate monitor above 120bpm despite getting to a level that used to have me (easily) at 150-160bpm. Even when I push hard, it still will not raise higher than 140. Yet it seems my thyroid levels are fairly normal, no?

    Is it the cortisol issues still? also, any concern about the facial flush or low homocysteine/low cholesterol?

  16. Quote Originally Posted by legenden1999 View Post
    Did you take the test before or after taking HCG/androgel?

    JH

    Am I the only one who don't know if these test were taken before or after hcg/gel?

    Does that not make a difference on how to interpret the result?

    JH

  17. Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    Yes, how on earth could we see how much medication is getting into the blood if we don't take the drug?!
    Well, I read lots of places to test in the morning BEFORE taking androgel/hcg.

    If you say to test AFTER applyig androgel and/or taking HCG, I would think its important to know how long after the test was taken, right?

    JH

  18. Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    No one who would say such a thing knows what they are talking about.
    OK I see. But then how long after the drugs are taken, should one get the test done?
    And how will one know how low the levels go?

    Just asking, since neither me or my Doc are experts in this area.

    Thanks!

    JH

  19. Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    No one who would say such a thing knows what they are talking about.

    I tell my guys to wait two hours prior to their lab draw for T gel, and to have them done the same time each time.

    For those on the Crisler HCG Protocol, they do not take their HCG that week, so I can titrate the T by itself.

    For those on daily, or QOD HCG, they still take it.
    Now, this is great info. Thank you Dr. John.
    But I still can't figure out how you determine what the lowest T level is, or maybe that doesn't matter...

    JH

  20. Low homocysteine levels are common in autism, diabetes, and genetic mutations in the 5- mthrr, renal disfunction, fatty livers.

    Low Total Plasma Homocysteine Concentrations in Patients With Type 1 Diabetes -- Cotellessa et al. 24 (5): 969 -- Diabetes Care

  21. Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    Low homocysteine levels are common in autism, diabetes, and genetic mutations in the 5- mthrr, renal disfunction, fatty livers.

    Low Total Plasma Homocysteine Concentrations in Patients With Type 1 Diabetes -- Cotellessa et al. 24 (5): 969 -- Diabetes Care

    There does appear to be a scant body of literature on the condition "hypohomocysteinemia." From a quick read, it seems that the treatment for it is to give sulfur-containing amino acids-cyteine, cystine and methionine.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by cpeil2 View Post
    There does appear to be a scant body of literature on the condition "hypohomocysteinemia." From a quick read, it seems that the treatment for it is to give sulfur-containing amino acids-cyteine, cystine and methionine.
    low homocysteine = low gluthione because methione is not recylced = undermethylation and with out proper methylation or cell membranes fall apart due to lack of PC incorportated in the cell membrane. I have been to one of the top drs in the world on this topic and with out proper methyation your cells come unglued, hormones can not bind to the receptors and whole llot of nasty things happen.

    TO raise homocystein levels TMG folonic acid and methyl cobaloomin or sam-e

    coming up with possible connection that people can not properly metabolise estrogen are undermethylators and have low or normal homocysteine but there pathways are altered from the methylation and over loaded in the transulfuration pathways and over time this will lead to gluthione depletion. My homocystein levels where perfect untill i first went on TRT (estrogen imbalances) and then they dropped to 3.9 but no one picked up on it but dr kane and she jumped right on it with flushing out the liver and having me use methylated forms of folic acid and b-12..

  23. Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    No one who would say such a thing knows what they are talking about.

    I tell my guys to wait two hours prior to their lab draw for T gel, and to have them done the same time each time.

    For those on the Crisler HCG Protocol, they do not take their HCG that week, so I can titrate the T by itself.

    For those on daily, or QOD HCG, they still take it.

    Just another reason that im probably switching to dr. john, once i get back to Michigan for the summer. All those tests were done PRIOR to taking my daily HCG and daily T-gel. I meant to respond to this post earlier in regards to taht. All my doctors previously had told me to do the bloodwork first thing am BEFORE I take anything. Now, this would imply that my TEST levels are going to be significantly higher than they show there....probably too high (id imagine). But that is how I have been testing all along.....

    Should I get a new baseline test (or baseline after medications at least) done. this time 2 hours after my hcg and test gel? (im on daily hcg).

  24. Quote Originally Posted by Scottyo View Post
    Just another reason that im probably switching to dr. john, once i get back to Michigan for the summer. All those tests were done PRIOR to taking my daily HCG and daily T-gel. I meant to respond to this post earlier in regards to taht. All my doctors previously had told me to do the bloodwork first thing am BEFORE I take anything. Now, this would imply that my TEST levels are going to be significantly higher than they show there....probably too high (id imagine). But that is how I have been testing all along.....

    Should I get a new baseline test (or baseline after medications at least) done. this time 2 hours after my hcg and test gel? (im on daily hcg).

    Also, could you explain a little more Dr. John regarding the too much or too little parasympatic nervous system stuff. any way to check to see which it is?

    Would adding daily hcg to a person with low normal test, elevated dht, low LH, estodial 19 (but E/T ratio out of balance), elevated fsh on 5% tcreame help to bring it up to more suitable ranges as well as possible drive down the DHT.

  25. Quote Originally Posted by Dr. John View Post
    No one who would say such a thing knows what they are talking about.

    I tell my guys to wait two hours prior to their lab draw for T gel, and to have them done the same time each time.

    For those on the Crisler HCG Protocol, they do not take their HCG that week, so I can titrate the T by itself.

    For those on daily, or QOD HCG, they still take it.
    Taking a blood sample two hours after Androgel application assures the highest (peak) blood T level is measured. Eybaling chart looks like the mean blood T level any other time is about 100 points lower. Figure 2 on page 5 of:
    http://androgel.com/images/ProfessionalInfo.pdf

    ie; someone who tested 850ng/dL (on 10grams of Androgel) would actualy have level of about 750 (or less) thruout the rest of the day.

    I do not have a data for the 5% gel or other T products.
    Consistency of testing is paramount,
    are you considering any corrections for the variabilty I just described.
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