Thyroid, Adrenals and working out
- 02-13-2007, 02:22 PM
Thyroid, Adrenals and working out
A few unresolved questions from some others threads have led me to ask everyone's advice...especially Dr. John's on these related questions?
For those on cortisol and thyroid treatment, what is your opinion on exercising or avoiding exercise? Ive heard opinions of both...some people say to just rest your adrenals for a while, while others (a few docs included) see no reason to ever stop exercising...although a week or so off is of course beneficial.
Secondly, for someone recovering from these issues, what is the ideal diet to go along with supplementation? Some say keto, or at least very low carb to prevent insulin swings, others say moderate but lower GI carbs.
- 02-13-2007, 02:38 PM
I can't exactly comment on thyroid/diet exactly, but I can tell you this - basically every study coming out in the last few years points to a moderate, low GL carb based diet(basically the south beach/paleo/mediterranean) as bieng the most ideal, healthy diet out. The undeniable cholesterol/hormonal data just can't be refuted.
One would assume that like most organs in the body, they tend to work in harmony - meaning if alot of data is out there proving this type of diet is best at achieving stable cholesterol levels, blood sugar, hormone profiles, heart disease markers, etc. that it would have similar effect on the adrenals/thyroid. I'd bet the farm on it.
I would shy away from completely low carb diets. Fruits, veggies, nutts, legumes, yogurt, mushrooms, etc have just to many disease fighting compounds/antioxidents in them.
02-13-2007, 07:29 PM
Although I felt great on the low carb..high protein..high fat diet, I feel this may be part of the cause of my problems over a decade ago. Along with the overtraining I was doing.
02-13-2007, 07:33 PM
02-13-2007, 07:44 PM
02-13-2007, 08:23 PM
02-13-2007, 08:44 PM
Still the high eggs? Im doing 3 eggs in the AM 3 at dinner time, plus some brown rice and half a cup of oatmeal for lunch. a few other carbs and mostly lean meats besides. cals are fairly low compared to what i used to eat i think...but im pretty much sedentary right now.
thus, the reason i asked about working out and adrenal fatigue.
02-13-2007, 08:57 PM
Reason i know this is what is going on is that
1. My urine histamines are 6 times the highest level
2. organic acid test showed elevated hippruic acid which after 2 years i finally figured out that it was telling me I was dealing with excessive histmaines and amines which where directly lreated to the food born pathogen. i have ecoli and it was never treated and further researching it found it to release excessive histamines as well as all the other lovely critters down there.
Biogenic Amines & Histamine Intolerance
As to question of high fat diets an inuslin resistance. I think my point was made
ScienceDirect - Neurobiology of Aging : High-fat diets, insulin resistance and declining cognitive function
Science and Reason: High-fat diet and type 2 diabetes
02-13-2007, 09:16 PM
So copper is a big one eh?
I can't pinpoint the source of mine, although I know I have bad dysbiosis and candida (from a CDSA), and have leaky gut from years of NSAID use and 5-6 times a year i used to use antibiotics....so besides the dieting, dnp, androgens etc. Ive done some very bad things to my body. Since I was a sickly child (asthma, allergies etc.) I think some of this is something thats always been present with me. Plus, I used to use a lot of prednisone for my asthma and would play sports evne while on it (and very ill).
But to my other questions, what diet exactly? and im still waiting on an answer from you and others on the exercise. yay or nay?
02-13-2007, 09:24 PM
I notice after I eat sometimes, that my nose gets stuffed up. This is really prevelant when my nervous system seems to be stressed. Could this be related to high histamine levels?
02-13-2007, 09:32 PM
02-13-2007, 09:36 PM
02-14-2007, 10:42 AM
my wbc is always low. dietary wise ive pretty much cut out everything, although my CDSA did not show inflamation to any degree in the stomach (could the cortisol i was on blunt this...ie the isocort). im on the full 8 pills of isocort, and i think its not enough. if i even take a good 30 minute walk outside, ill 'feel it later'. cant sleep, pain in midback around kidneys, and cant feel like i can take a deep breath. its frustrating as all hell.
02-14-2007, 10:47 AM
Low white blood cells is from lack of cortisol or biounavailable copper or plain copper defieincy. Have your serum copper, ceruoplasm and also RBC SOD checked this will identify if there is a copper imbalance. if there is an imbalance next thing needs to be done is 24 hour piss test to see if you are retaining are excreting copper. Again source of the porblem could be a hidden allergie or sensitiy you are not aware off and allergie scratch test can identify it. I bet you are pissing out a crap load of histamines even though whole blood is normal thats because your inability to metabolize estrogen/ and histmaines is altered probably due to your undermethylation of the liver as trouble has idenitfied. Did you have low DHEA-s levels? People that are undermethyated have a defect in the metallothionein process and this means that alterations in heavy metals and detoxifications will be altered as well as fungus infection and immune system impairment. If your copper metabolism is altered so is your selenium enzymes and also vitamin E as well as methylation .ITs one vicious cycle thats for sure
02-14-2007, 10:51 AM
i originally had fairly low dhea-s levels. then i did the saliva and my DHEA was high, but that was after supplementing with 50mg ED. I am now down to 25mg a day. So what form of copper should I be taking? I cant really get many tests done, my main doc is in michigan and I am NYC. My endo here sucks...i pretty much refuse to see him as he never even did anything but give me androgel...and wanted me to take it every Other day.
02-14-2007, 11:01 AM
That guy is a freaken idiots IMO. Well what needs to be identifed if you need copper or need to chelate it. How much vitamin C, zinc are you taking and what form of copper is in multivitmain if it is oxide its CRAP. IM on yahoo or aol as my screen name here. Low dhea levels could be from magneisum, copper, or chromium deficeincy which again goes back to your infection which depelted the hell out of your minerals. Copper is a tricky thing with people with adrenal fatigue. Most people have biounavialble which means you might have to give a little bit to get the well pumping so to speak but not too much..2 mgs would be a good start to experiment with.
02-14-2007, 11:04 AM
02-14-2007, 11:08 AM
exactly what i thought. one big question I have for you, and for anyone on thyroid and cortisol:
they say to take the thyroid and then wait an hour for food. I have been taking my isocort (3-4 pills) at the same time as the thyroid. but now im reading that the cortisol should be taken with food. whats your solution?
02-14-2007, 11:11 AM
02-15-2007, 09:42 PM
Absolutely true although with anything too much of a good thing can be a bad thing and lead to over training and hormonal imbalances as we all have experienced at one time on another. Even too much sex can be bad for some one and even can kill some body with preexisting heart conditoins, but that person be going out with a big ass smile on their face
02-16-2007, 12:23 PM
I understand this in a general framework, and since I used to be competing (bodybuilding) I can assure you my body is/was in incredibly good shape muscularly and aerobically.
But my question is, if I am having trouble (anxiety, etc.) from my 1 grain thyroid dose, and my temperature is fluctuating all over the place, both over the course of the day and between days, should I NOT work out.
When I work out, the next two days are genearlly my worst, emotionally, physically and psychologically. Its frustrating, because its something I love to do.
02-17-2007, 08:37 AM
03-02-2007, 03:53 PM
Even with treatment, I am still only able to work out (bodyweight, light weights and cables, light "shadow boxing" style striking, not all at once but a different combination each week) once a week. Sometimes I can also walk 2 or 3 times a week for 45minutes, but only for a few weeks at a time before I fatigue again. I've got lumbar and cervical issues (stenosis, herniated discs, arthritis and narrow spinal canal) as well and when I get fatigued the muscles in my neck spasm and I get nausea, headaches, disequilibrium, parasthesias down both arms, and other fun stuff. I really have to take it slow and careful. I monitor whether or not I've got that "clutching chest" feeling from anxiety, my overall muscle pain and trigger points, and disequilibrium, etc from neck, sciatica from lumbar and energy levels to determine workouts. I have to be really up on it because my natural disposition is to work out (hard/to failure) no matter how much pain I'm in, that's what got me where I am now, so I've got to train myself to make haste slowly and carefully.
Massage helps/has always helped me out GREATLY but who can afford it regularly?
My best diet results have always been cutting out all grains,
eating a lot of veggies and fruit and meat, with a lot of fish oil. Whenever I manage to stick to that STRICT for a few weeks I always think about how great I feel, but human nature, I slide out of it again.
03-03-2007, 07:21 PM
You may have a genetic disorder called pyroluria which mean your produce excess of specific enzyme that binds with zinc and b-6 and your can not produce over 200-300 enyzmatic reactions ..Look into it i bet you that may be your possible ticket to getting better since your genetics are predisposed to it. Ask dr to run a RBC EFAS PROFILE and I bet you either have acessive arachonsdonic acid or a deficiency. This is how I came about to finding out that I probably had it and nevr even knew it. There is also a simple urine test you can do as well to verify it, but stop all supplement of zinc and b-6, for 3 days prior. Taking fish oils well if you have a genetic component its only going to make you worse and you would never even suspect it. Get tested and find out if it is necessary because one can be doing more harm then good..
03-03-2007, 08:48 PM
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