- 11-27-2006, 08:11 PM
Glad to find another forum and thank heavens for the internet, without it I'd have believed all the docs who told me everything was in my head...
36yo male - for the last 10-12 years been suffering from low libido, lack of energy, no nocturnal erections, well you know the drill.
Been thru 4 doctors PCP, Urologist and 2 Endos. Along with other battery of tests which I'll get from my dr. office and post - my T has come back anywhere from low 500's to under 300. Last couple were 400 and 295. After the 295 test, my endo agreed to try Androgel. Tried 5mg at first and after a month had bloodwork done. Received a message from the nurse that endo wanted to up to 10mg. I didn't even talk to him, but knowing how I felt, had no complaints. After a few weeks on 10mg Andro, ran more bloodwork and received a call from the nurse "doctor said results for T came back at 325, so you're all set". I freaked! Huh? I feel like dirt, does that matter?
Libido - no improvement (but realize early stages)
Erections - improved slightly (topicals increase DHT more i believe)
Mood - still anxious (this told I was too low regardless if libido was ok which it wasn't)
Complexion - surprising thing to notice, but more color, less puffy face.
Still, the 325 number didn't instill much confidence that big improvements were down the road. So, I pushed to try Test Cyp and he relented.
Endo pushed for 200mg every 2 weeks and we did that in his office and nurse showed me how to self-adminster. 3 days later I felt like I do when T is low - very restless, anxious. Been in enough forums and try to keep up with Dr. John and read Dr. Shippens book, so right or wrong I switched myself to 100mg every week. Did my my first 100mg shot Thanksgiving Day. Don't feel any better, but I know I've only had 2 injections. Still, I have a strong feeling 100mg isnt enough, but we'll see when I retest.
My endo thinks everything is in my head and noone will ever convince me of that. We'll see what my test results are and what his response will be, but I'm thinking of going back to my PCP. I don't think he has any knowledge about TRT, but he's the only doctor I've had that admits he doesn't know everything and is willing to listen. So, I think I may be able to open him up to Dr. Johns protocol and maybe we can arrange for him to consult with him.
Any words of encouragement? Would appreciate anyones personal experience in how long to feel improvements on Test Cyp. Trying to be patient, but feel like I have lost 10 years of my life and am anxious to get on with it.
Thanks for listening to my rambling and look forward to learning more and especially to feeling better.
- 11-27-2006, 08:28 PM
You sound exactly like me. And just like you, I am new to all of this as well. I also recently started 100mg of Test C each week after 3 months on the gel with little improvement. I'm begining to think I have a high estrogen problem. Read the stickies, they are a god-send! Especially the one about Male Hormone Modulation. It is long, but well worth it. I copied it into a word document for more reading later.
And probably like you, I need to get more blood tests done. I've never done any anabolic steroids, and all I want is my life back. So if you want someone to talk to, I'll listen. Maybe we can do this and learn from each others experiences? Just a thought. But you aren't alone either. This is by far the best source of information I have been able to find.
You will also want to visit the AllThingsMale site. It is packed full of information. Hit me up if you need to.
- 11-27-2006, 08:44 PM
11-28-2006, 01:49 PM
You both sound like your Estradiol is up on the high side need it tested and good test for men like this one.
I use an OTC product called Indolplex/DIM to keep my E2 in check worked for a long time.
PhytoPharmica Indolplex with DIM
Today I use Arimidex but feel men should try this first Arimidex is dam strong and you can go to low very fast. Have you been tested for Thyroid a TSH, Free T3 and FREE T4 men that don't do good on gels could have thick skin do to a bad thyroid. If in doing shots 100mgs every week and you feel up and down with big problems with high E2 try doing the shots 2 x's a week or every 3 days.
If you try the DIM don't take more then one tablet at dinner time or you will go down dam fast and miss the libido coming back with morning wood.
11-28-2006, 06:42 PM
Originally Posted by pmgamer18
I'll answer this over on my thread so as not to hijack wondering's thread. May make it a bit more confusing, but it is easier for me to track the conversation.
11-28-2006, 07:06 PM
Im not convinced E2 is my issue. I dont have numbers handy, but i was tested before and believe I came back in the low 20s.
Also, I haven't had ANY period of time where mornign wood appeared and then disappered. I haven't had mornign wood EVER in almost 10 years.
Today is Day 6 after my last test and I can feel myself dropping. I really think that if T is the issue that I need to be at a higher dose and maybe add HCG at Day 6 and 7 per Dr. Johns protocol. We'll see when I get retested.
My plan is to get myselfto 650 or higher for a somewhat extended period of time and see if i feel better. If not, then I read a post from Marianco that it would then be time to explore other reasons.
My biggest concern is getting my endo to work with me. Hence, my thoughs of returnign to my PCP who is not very knowledgeable in this area, but I believe is more open to learning and finding help.
Jut getting so impatient.. as life keeps passign by..
11-28-2006, 07:34 PM
Originally Posted by wondering
I certainly know how you feel. My Urologist is the first MD to work with me. He isn't a TRT/HRT specialist, but after talking to him, he understands I'm not trying to be 18 again. Like you, I just want my sex life back. I hate to leave him only to find someone that is as understanding and willing to be as cooperative.
I'm 6 days ahead of you on the Test C injections. This Friday will be my 3rd injection, and I've not noticed anything yet. I'm going to go to 5 weeks and follow the blood work protocol Dr John recommends.
When do you plan on getting re-tested?
11-29-2006, 11:37 AM
I know it's hard to believe this but I have not had morning wood for over 20 yrs. I had my E2 tested got it down and was suffering from ED and trouble reaching an orgasm for over 10 yrs. My E2 was dam high and getting it down the first thing that happened was my morning wood came back then I was able to have sex with my wife with out having to use a pump to pump it up and a ring to keep it up. Now today at age 63 all is good with sex. If I let my E2 go up just over 35 I have problems again. I do best keeping my E2 at 20 pm/ml. E2 goes up and down fast have it checked.
Originally Posted by wondering
11-29-2006, 08:46 PM
Thanks! I'm certainly going to have the full panel done at week 5!
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