My Cenegenics Experience

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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    I started this thread. In the beginning I posted some intial blood test results and I think I may have given some background. I plan to update this the end of June.

    i talked to Dr silverman and no where on there webste does it lists prices, but for 2500 you get the program. WTF does that consist of ? what tests and how evasive are their testing? If nothing is covered by insurance. I mean my insurance could pay for all the testing detoxification, mineral anayalsis ect, what they charge 2500 for? just a consultation?

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    Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    i talked to Dr silverman and no where on there webste does it lists prices, but for 2500 you get the program. WTF does that consist of ? what tests and how evasive are their testing? If nothing is covered by insurance. I mean my insurance could pay for all the testing detoxification, mineral anayalsis ect, what they charge 2500 for? just a consultation?
    Yep, it's a day-long thing - all sorts of testing. At the end of the day, you meet with a physician and they recommend a program: supps, HRT, diet and exercise. They like to supply all of the supps and the hormones, but I don't know if it is required. They operate, as most anti-aging physicians do, on a pay-as-you-go basis. They will not bill third party payors, although they will provide the docs you need in order to submit your own claim.

    They used to be cutting-edge. But, as Dr. John has indicated, the field has sort of passed them by.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpeil2 View Post
    Yep, it's a day-long thing - all sorts of testing. At the end of the day, you meet with a physician and they recommend a program: supps, HRT, diet and exercise. They like to supply all of the supps and the hormones, but I don't know if it is required. They operate, as most anti-aging physicians do, on a pay-as-you-go basis. They will not bill third party payors, although they will provide the docs you need in order to submit your own claim.

    They used to be cutting-edge. But, as Dr. John has indicated, the field has sort of passed them by.
    Have HCG, tcreame, DIM. pregenonlone creame, may be arimdex will travel

    Thats why i like dr john approach whole lot better..I am starting to see the method behind his madness. Using the pregnenolone cream which body can use to convert to what it needs. More so it converts to progesterone when entering the through the skin providing the building blocks and using it raise progesterone and even possibly testosterone, dhea, while choking off the estrogen metabolism with the DIM if need be. I have always loved this mentality give the body what id needs and let it rebalance it self..
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    Quote Originally Posted by hardasnails1973 View Post
    i talked to Dr silverman and no where on there webste does it lists prices, but for 2500 you get the program. WTF does that consist of ? what tests and how evasive are their testing? If nothing is covered by insurance. I mean my insurance could pay for all the testing detoxification, mineral anayalsis ect, what they charge 2500 for? just a consultation?
    Hey,, they have to pay for the ads that appear in the sports section of my daily newspaper.. My 11year old son gets a kick out of seeing the, "old muscle man" in the photo
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    "They used to be cutting-edge. But, as Dr. John has indicated, the field has sort of passed them by."

    I have been concidering this program and have found this post very intresting. Could somebody please expand on the comment made above. What programs are more advanced then them?

    Colkurtz_spf, its been almost a year. Are you happy with the results this far and would you do it again? Is the program worth the price of admission?

    I am not a body builder just a guy who use to be an athlete who as let him self go and am looking for a program to help me get back in shape and start some good habits.

    Thanks for all the comments so far.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Concerned1963 View Post
    "They used to be cutting-edge. But, as Dr. John has indicated, the field has sort of passed them by."

    I have been concidering this program and have found this post very intresting. Could somebody please expand on the comment made above. What programs are more advanced then them?

    Colkurtz_spf, its been almost a year. Are you happy with the results this far and would you do it again? Is the program worth the price of admission?

    I am not a body builder just a guy who use to be an athlete who as let him self go and am looking for a program to help me get back in shape and start some good habits.

    Thanks for all the comments so far.
    Personally I would prefer overall health care, not only specific TRT and nothing else.
    In post 09-05-2006, 01:48 PM
    colkurtz_spf
    there is pdf file with tests.
    For the tons of money he is spending they could have checked few more things in his blood even if they are not relevant to erection.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Concerned1963 View Post
    "They used to be cutting-edge. But, as Dr. John has indicated, the field has sort of passed them by."

    I have been concidering this program and have found this post very intresting. Could somebody please expand on the comment made above. What programs are more advanced then them?

    Colkurtz_spf, its been almost a year. Are you happy with the results this far and would you do it again? Is the program worth the price of admission?

    I am not a body builder just a guy who use to be an athlete who as let him self go and am looking for a program to help me get back in shape and start some good habits.

    Thanks for all the comments so far.

    They see themselves as leaders and standard-setters in the field of anti-aging medicine. Meanwhile, individual practitioners like Dr. John and Marianco are adding to the knowledge base and developing more refined methods which the Cenegenics practitioners tend not to pay much attention to.


    A good example of this is Dr. John's TRT protocol that combines testosterone and small doses of hCG. Cenegenics also uses hCG in TRT, but as a monotherapy in very large doses- which are unneccesary at the very least, and possibly harmful.


    Marianco, who I don't believe posts to this board, is a psychiatrist who is single-handedly developing a new medical specialty - neuroendocrinology - that studies the interplay between the endocrine, nervous and immune systems.
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    Its not any specific groups or programs that are passing them by, but new and more advanced methods/drugs/dose and tweaks to already existing plans by individual doctors working together that are passing the cenegics people by.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Concerned1963 View Post
    "They used to be cutting-edge. But, as Dr. John has indicated, the field has sort of passed them by."

    I have been concidering this program and have found this post very intresting. Could somebody please expand on the comment made above. What programs are more advanced then them?

    Colkurtz_spf, its been almost a year. Are you happy with the results this far and would you do it again? Is the program worth the price of admission?

    I am not a body builder just a guy who use to be an athlete who as let him self go and am looking for a program to help me get back in shape and start some good habits.

    Thanks for all the comments so far.
    The results have been good, but I'm not happy with their panel choices, and I worry about their methods. My treatment has consisted of HCG only, and recently the addition of Arimidex to combat estrogen. The results from my last draw showed total test at 1400 with free at 425 and estradiol at 62. My protocol had been HCG 4000 IUs per week prior to the draw. I was using 10,000 IUs when the first panel was posted.

    My contract with Cenegenics is up the end of next month, and I have been in contact with Dr. John's office. Currently I'm weaning myself off HRT. I have reduced HCG to 500 IUs per week and will be completely finished by the end of this month. My next draw will be June 12. I'm curious to see how I'm going to feel. I feel great now, but I'm aware that will probably change.

    Fortunately I have never had ED. My problem was lack of energy and an increase in body fat. It wasn't until I had a bone density test that I discovered my Oteopedia. Before Cenegenics I used an online doc who prescribed testosterone cream and nothing else. I was on for a year. I started with a baseline total of 475 for total testosterone, but don't remember the free.

    I will keep the board posted with my progress.
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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    The results have been good, but I'm not happy with their panel choices, and I worry about their methods. My treatment has consisted of HCG only, and recently the addition of Arimidex to combat estrogen. The results from my last draw showed total test at 1400 with free at 425 and estradiol at 62. My protocol had been HCG 4000 IUs per week prior to the draw. I was using 10,000 IUs when the first panel was posted.

    My contract with Cenegenics is up the end of next month, and I have been in contact with Dr. John's office. Currently I'm weaning myself off HRT. I have reduced HCG to 500 IUs per week and will be completely finished by the end of this month. My next draw will be June 12. I'm curious to see how I'm going to feel. I feel great now, but I'm aware that will probably change.

    Fortunately I have never had ED. My problem was lack of energy and an increase in body fat. It wasn't until I had a bone density test that I discovered my Oteopedia. Before Cenegenics I used an online doc who prescribed testosterone cream and nothing else. I was on for a year. I started with a baseline total of 475 for total testosterone, but don't remember the free.

    I will keep the board posted with my progress.
    4000/week=571/day probably too much
    500/week=71/day probably not enough
    100/day supposedly is enough or slightly more.
    There was link to research floating around.

    You must have very good testis, tt=1400
    Your estrodial is high at 62
    but since your testosterone is 100% your own, possibly it is what you body needs.

    I would do (free, bioavailable and Total testosterone) test at Quest.
    Adjust HCG so you are at the top of range of either freeT or BioT, and the other is wherewer it falls.
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    checking on cenegenics experience


    colkurtz,

    Have you been able to maintain your regimen with cenegenics? Any specifics you can share?
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    Quote Originally Posted by randal View Post
    colkurtz,

    Have you been able to maintain your regimen with cenegenics? Any specifics you can share?
    I took an eight month break from HCG but didn't care for the way I felt. In December I started back on the HCG protocol at Cenegenics - this time at 2000 IUs per week. Six weeks later my draw revealed total testosterone at 957 with Fee at 233 and estradiol at 26. I'm also taking 1.5 mg of Arimidex per week, 25 mg of progesterone daily and 75 mg of DHEA. I feel great.
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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    I took an eight month break from HCG but didn't care for the way I felt. In December I started back on the HCG protocol at Cenegenics - this time at 2000 IUs per week. Six weeks later my draw revealed total testosterone at 957 with Fee at 233 and estradiol at 26. I'm also taking 1.5 mg of Arimidex per week, 25 mg of progesterone daily and 75 mg of DHEA. I feel great.
    I think I am going to talk with my doc about doing 500-600 IUs of hCG EOD, and lose the T Cyp. It will be cheaper, easier and less meds. Colkurtz, do you have any suggestion as to whether I should taper off the T Cyp? I'm wondering if my T levels will remain fairly stable if I stop the T and triple my hCG level. I would imagine that my TT would remain in the range of 1,000. Right now, that is about the trough. Thanks in advance for any thoughts/advice.
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    I don't know how much HCG you'll need to maintain your TT level. You may need a higher level to start. I did after coming off of the test cream. You'll probably need to titrate your dose based on your labs. I would draw every six weeks until you get it right. Arimidex may be needed eventually.

    Quote Originally Posted by jinxie View Post
    I think I am going to talk with my doc about doing 500-600 IUs of hCG EOD, and lose the T Cyp. It will be cheaper, easier and less meds. Colkurtz, do you have any suggestion as to whether I should taper off the T Cyp? I'm wondering if my T levels will remain fairly stable if I stop the T and triple my hCG level. I would imagine that my TT would remain in the range of 1,000. Right now, that is about the trough. Thanks in advance for any thoughts/advice.
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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    I don't know how much HCG you'll need to maintain your TT level. You may need a higher level to start. I did after coming off of the test cream. You'll probably need to titrate your dose based on your labs. I would draw every six weeks until you get it right. Arimidex may be needed eventually.
    I'm already on Arimidex. So, when you go of from T-cyp/hCG, to hCG monotherapy, you need to start off higher on the hCG? This is the sort of stuff I will just be figuring out with my doc; he doesnt seem to know, other than by trial and error. He'll invite me to propose a starting dose. Do you have any ideas? Maybe it should be 800 EOD to start. I recall you saying to Gator that ED is unnecessary given half life, right?

    Thanks dude!
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    Quote Originally Posted by jinxie View Post
    I'm already on Arimidex. So, when you go of from T-cyp/hCG, to hCG monotherapy, you need to start off higher on the hCG? This is the sort of stuff I will just be figuring out with my doc; he doesnt seem to know, other than by trial and error. He'll invite me to propose a starting dose. Do you have any ideas? Maybe it should be 800 EOD to start. I recall you saying to Gator that ED is unnecessary given half life, right?

    Thanks dude!
    I started from a very different place. I had been on the cream alone for a year then stopped and crashed. My doc started me on 5000 IUS twice per week for the first two months. By no means is that my recommendation to you.

    I think you could start with 1000 IUs every other day. That would be around 3500 per week. Draw blood in 6 weeks and see what you get. If your levels are perfect than remain at that dose for another six weeks and test again. If E2 is too high increase your Arimidex. You may see that your levels continue to increase every six weeks on the same dose - I did. At that point you can start to trim your dose until you are at a comfortable level.
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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    I started from a very different place. I had been on the cream alone for a year then stopped and crashed. My doc started me on 5000 IUS twice per week for the first two months. By no means is that my recommendation to you.

    I think you could start with 1000 IUs every other day. That would be around 3500 per week. Draw blood in 6 weeks and see what you get. If your levels are perfect than remain at that dose for another six weeks and test again. If E2 is too high increase your Arimidex. You may see that your levels continue to increase every six weeks on the same dose - I did. At that point you can start to trim your dose until you are at a comfortable level.
    Thanks bro. Remind me, is hCG more likely to aromatize, or is it merely dependent on how much TT is increased? I recall people saying that hCG is morely succeptible to aromatization. If that is so, I would imagine that I may run into some significant E2 issues. 100 mgs of T-cyp and 500 IUs/week of hCG sent my E2 from 20 to 82; my TT on Day 6 was 1182 (hCG injections were days 5 and 6, and T cyp on Day 7 of the preceding week), from 350. From this, I inferred that I am a strong responder to hCG. Would you agree?

    Thanks for all your help. I plan to discuss this with my doc in the next week.

    J
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    Are you primary?? I am primary and was on solo 5000 units of HCG a week. It only managed to raise my TT to 375..
    I am on 100 mg of test cyp right now with no HCG.
    My TT went up to 900 and my free went to 245..

    If you are primary you will probaby drop to a number you were at before the test cyp therapy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by biker340 View Post
    Are you primary?? I am primary and was on solo 5000 units of HCG a week. It only managed to raise my TT to 375..
    I am on 100 mg of test cyp right now with no HCG.
    My TT went up to 900 and my free went to 245..

    If you are primary you will probaby drop to a number you were at before the test cyp therapy.

    That's correct. HCG only works if the problem is not the testes. With me it's the hypothalmus and low LH.
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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    I started from a very different place. I had been on the cream alone for a year then stopped and crashed. My doc started me on 5000 IUS twice per week for the first two months. By no means is that my recommendation to you.

    I think you could start with 1000 IUs every other day. That would be around 3500 per week. Draw blood in 6 weeks and see what you get. If your levels are perfect than remain at that dose for another six weeks and test again. If E2 is too high increase your Arimidex. You may see that your levels continue to increase every six weeks on the same dose - I did. At that point you can start to trim your dose until you are at a comfortable level.
    I like this post, looks like a good/practical way for someone deciding to find out if he is secondary.

    I have used your post as a reference here:
    http://forum.mesomorphosis.com/583167-post7.html
    ------------------------------------------------

    What is you definition of comfortable (testosterone) level?

    Going by numbers I saw floating around, I am thinking of

    FreeT=>160
    when one is using HCG only, plus Arnastrozole but no external testosterone.

    To find out that FreeT #
    one would use either Quest Diagnostics test
    Testosterone, Free, Bio/Total (LC/MS/MS)
    or
    dr Shippen's chart using TotalT and SHBG values, post #41
    http://anabolicminds.com/forum/male-...oodtest-2.html
    or
    calculator:
    http://www.issam.ch/freetesto.htm
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    You are the resident expert on these types of issues, Jan, but I am fairly confident I will bust 200 FT on 2k IUs of HCG (600 IUs EOD) and ~1.5 mgs of Arnastrozole.
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    That's a good question. Maybe the answer depends on the individual. FT at 160 should be enough for anyone. I feel good at 233, but felt better in the 300 range. I didn't see much of an added benefit at 425. It only raised my estrogen level.
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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    That's a good question. Maybe the answer depends on the individual. FT at 160 should be enough for anyone. I feel good at 233, but felt better in the 300 range. I didn't see much of an added benefit at 425. It only raised my estrogen level.
    Solid information, thank you.

    .
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    So if ones issues was varicocele the HCG treatment would not be advisable correct ?

    Thanks
    Jason
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    Quote Originally Posted by beckerj View Post
    So if ones issues was varicocele the HCG treatment would not be advisable correct ?

    Thanks
    Jason
    Becker, not sure what you are inferring that from, but I dont think that is the case. hCG could be the proper treatment, in spite of a vericocele.
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    Primary = Varicocele ?


    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    That's correct. HCG only works if the problem is not the testes. With me it's the hypothalmus and low LH.
    I had bilateral varicocele so I wonder if the HCG protocol would even be a right course of action for those with varicocele, seeing as though colkurtz_spf is saying that HCG only works if the problem is not the testes ....

    Right now I am on androgel .... I have been for 2 1/2 weeks .... I had the "WOW" "Eurphoric" experience and now I have, as of today upped the dosage to 6 pumps, seeing as though I have had the crash ....
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    Quote Originally Posted by beckerj View Post
    I had bilateral varicocele so I wonder if the HCG protocol would even be a right course of action for those with varicocele, seeing as though colkurtz_spf is saying that HCG only works if the problem is not the testes ....

    Right now I am on androgel .... I have been for 2 1/2 weeks .... I had the "WOW" "Eurphoric" experience and now I have, as of today upped the dosage to 6 pumps, seeing as though I have had the crash ....
    Becker, it all depends on how impaired the testes are. You can have vericoceles, and still produce optimal levels of T, theoretically.
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    I have yet to hear from one person on here that has had varicocele and surgery recover their T .... if you search the forum for varicocele and read through the posts .... most of us are on T or trying anyting and everything to get back to normal .....

    Not sure where my testes are .... I know i am not right though ....
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    Quote Originally Posted by beckerj View Post
    I have yet to hear from one person on here that has had varicocele and surgery recover their T .... if you search the forum for varicocele and read through the posts .... most of us are on T or trying anyting and everything to get back to normal .....

    Not sure where my testes are .... I know i am not right though ....
    Well, you need to consider your audience . . . on a steroid forum. When I thought I had a varicocele (ended up being a testicle that did not completely descend, with a thick spermatic cord), I did a fair amount of research, and I am fairly certain there are some with varicoceles with optimal testosterone. That said, there likely is some impairment; but that doesnt mean hCG is not worth a try.

    Good luck.
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    Quote Originally Posted by beckerj View Post
    I have yet to hear from one person on here that has had varicocele and surgery recover their T .... if you search the forum for varicocele and read through the posts .... most of us are on T or trying anyting and everything to get back to normal .....

    Not sure where my testes are .... I know i am not right though ....

    becker,

    what were your LH and FSH levels before surgery.If LH level was low and FSH normal, then you dont have any problem with testes
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    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    That's correct. HCG only works if the problem is not the testes. With me it's the hypothalmus and low LH.
    Didnt you go for any surgery for curing hypothlamus disorder
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    jinxie - I hear ya .... There may be some with optimal T after surgery but is is a fact that varicocele does cause a drop in T .... There is even more information that shows that there is a threshold of T .... Once you drop below it you experience the symptoms ....

    I was thinking of trying the HCG after my 30 day trial of Androgel, if the DR will even entertain it .... We all know how DR's are .... So I am fairly sure, unless after meeting with the new Endo in July, I am stuck with Androgel for the time being ....

    I did up my dosage to 6 pumps a day and added the under arms as a application point .... 2nd day on 6 pumps and my energy is great .... been a busy little bee here at work ... installing monitors and building pc's left and right .... SMILE

    I just wish that more info was out there letting first time users of Androgel of the WOW and Crash .... It really made me feel like stopping the Androgel ....
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    Quote Originally Posted by beckerj View Post
    jinxie - I hear ya .... There may be some with optimal T after surgery but is is a fact that varicocele does cause a drop in T .... There is even more information that shows that there is a threshold of T .... Once you drop below it you experience the symptoms ....

    I was thinking of trying the HCG after my 30 day trial of Androgel, if the DR will even entertain it .... We all know how DR's are .... So I am fairly sure, unless after meeting with the new Endo in July, I am stuck with Androgel for the time being ....

    I did up my dosage to 6 pumps a day and added the under arms as a application point .... 2nd day on 6 pumps and my energy is great .... been a busy little bee here at work ... installing monitors and building pc's left and right .... SMILE

    I just wish that more info was out there letting first time users of Androgel of the WOW and Crash .... It really made me feel like stopping the Androgel ....
    Glad to hear your feeling well! Good luck with the doc.
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    Thanks man ....

    I am gonna put out a general question ....

    How do we overcome the performance anxiety that we have when we start to get better ?

    I get so nervous when my other half wants to get busy .... Now if i am the one that is chasing it i am not so nervous ....
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    Quote Originally Posted by beckerj View Post
    Thanks man ....

    I am gonna put out a general question ....

    How do we overcome the performance anxiety that we have when we start to get better ?

    I get so nervous when my other half wants to get busy .... Now if i am the one that is chasing it i am not so nervous ....
    My best advice, which is easier said than done, is to be a man, and admit your anxieties and insecurities, so that you and yours can conquer them together. I understand that women find such admissions very endearing.
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    Good Advice .... Thanks
  37. The horror
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkblue1 View Post
    Didnt you go for any surgery for curing hypothlamus disorder
    My Hypothalmus does not produce an adequate level of LH for my testosterone production. My baseline is 3.9. For some that may be enough, but not for me. I'm not sure that brain surgery is the answer. My deficiency could be due to aging or environmental factors. I didn't have this problem when I was younger, and in any case my therapy is working.
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    colonel kurtz,
    with a resting heart rate of 60bpm, you must be really fit. do you do lots of cardio ?


    Quote Originally Posted by colkurtz_spf View Post
    My visit started Friday morning at Florida Atlantic University’s MRI unit. That’s where I had my bone density test. Upon ar***** I was greeted by Dr Willix’s assistant. She stayed with me and then I followed her back to the main office at Cenegenics. When I arrived, another assistant welcomed me; there was a sign in the waiting room with my personal greeting. Apparently the day was set aside for me. They prepared a nicely appointed room with a laptop, fruit, water and an assortment of teas. A menu was waiting on the table for my lunch selection. And in that room my first test began. On the laptop I went through a series of mental tests ranging form memory to response time.

    Later I moved into the examining room for weight and height measurements. For some reason I measured only 6’2.5. That last time, which was several years ago I measured 6’4.” My weight was 257lb, and the body fat tests revealed 20% body fat – higher than I expected. I was given a strength test and flexibility test. I did well on both. Then my blood pressure was taken and I was given an EKG. It was 119/65 with a resting pulse rate of 60. My EKG showed no abnormalities. They served me a wonderful lunch followed by a video explaining insulin levels and degenerative disease before my consultation and final exam with the doctor.

    Dr Willix was cardiovascular doctor and thoracic surgeon. He gave up a lucrative practice years ago to pursue preventative medicine. He studied Ayurvedic medicine and is also a shaman. His decision was not popular in the medical community at that time. He also competed regularly in Iron Man events. At 66 he is in remarkable condition. His exam was thorough, and included eye, reflexes, hernia and rectal. He also examined my tongue which surprised me. Since I was young I’ve had a pronounced geographic tongue. He explained that it was due to poor intestinal exorbtion, and probably a cause of demineralization in my spine and hips – nothing severe, but slightly in the high range for my age. I found it hard to believe, so he pulled out an Ayurvedic chart that showed my aberration. He prescribed probiotics and yogurt, and I was told to avoid sodas because they rob bones of calcium.

    My blood panels, which were extensive (I gave 6 vials of blood after a 12 hour fast) looked very good. My glucose panel showed no sign of impending diabetes. My thyroid levels were good. Kidney and liver functions were very good. My HDL was a little low. My test levels had crashed as expected and my estradiol was very low.

    Prior to my visit, I listed all of the supplements I take along with diet and workout logs (both weights and cardio). The doctor explained that Niacin can lower both good and bad cholesterols and suggested I take 1200 mgs of red rice yeast at bedtime instead. He prescribed 75 mgs of DHEA to be taken in the morning and 5000 IUs of HCG twice a week for the next eight weeks. He will follow up with a blood test to see how I respond and then set my maintenance dosage. Based on my panels and exam he thinks I will respond well. He is keeping me on 7.5 IUs of HGH per week. My current IGF level is 300. He told me to keep taking the rest of my supplements and not change dosage with the exception of EFAs. He wants me to make sure my omegas have EPA of 2- 3 grams. As an Ayurvedic doctor, he was impressed with the USPLab supplements I have been taking. I was glad because they make me feel pretty good and I don't want to give them up. I promised myself and the doctor to give this at least six months. Although I’m somewhat skeptical (as usual) I want to give it a fair chance.

    He put me on a low GI diet and revised my workout plan. I will be doing cardio 5 days per week. My heart rate will have to be between 140 and 150 beats per minute for at least 20 minutes during each session. No overall duration was mentioned. He wants me to hit only one body part per week. There will be 7 sets per exercise with a pyramiding rep range between 6 and 12 reps. Rests between sets will only be for one minute. He wants me to maintain this workout until I reach a target weight of 220lbs. Later I will be able to resume lower reps with longer rests for strength.

    I’m sure that I left out quite a bit. The doctor will be monitoring my progress, and I will post updates and answer any questions.
  39. The horror
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    Quote Originally Posted by living2die View Post
    colonel kurtz,
    with a resting heart rate of 60bpm, you must be really fit. do you do lots of cardio ?
    I do three 30 minute cardio sessions per week, and play three hours (one hour on three different days) of hard tennis against good players who are much younger than me. Tennis will make your heart beat right through your chest if you're any good. I did my first pro tour in '75.
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    Very interesting information. We are going to see a doctor in Northern CA for HRT, but it is incredibly expensive. The tests for women cost a bit more than men -- it was 1002.00 per person for lab work and initial consultations. The charge for the 6 month contract for oversight plus the first 5 weeks of medications was about $1950 per person. We are getting GH, hormone creams, pills (Pregnenolone, DHEA, thyroid and adrenal support). I'm not sure how this compares to other plans, but it is pretty expensive for us. Almost 3000.00 each. Does that seem reasonable?
  

  
 

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