- 01-10-2006, 06:21 PM
I just had a complete physical done with blood work.
Everything came out great, except the total testosterone level which was 300.
I told the doctor that I have been having a problem with ED and I believe it was because to the low test. I asked to be put on some type of HRT.
He refused saying that they don't do anything until you get around 240, and threw a sample pack of Viagra at me.
Has anyone had any luck with OTC supps like Diesel Test, Blue Rhino, Activate, etc.. I don't feel that Viagra is the answer for low test..
- 01-10-2006, 06:28 PM
I would let him know that you want a better quality of life and that you will find another Doc if he doesn't want to work with you. Tell him that it's not your fault that the super freaks of bodybuilding abuse Test. Ask him if he prescribes pain killers and if he does, why doesn't the same stigma apply to those drugs as well (since they are abused on a grander scale). Then, I would point to all of the female HRT coffee cups, pens, posters and **** hanging all over his office and ask what the discrimination is all about. Ask him if he knows that 80% of his female clients who have been prescribed HRT drugs other than bio-identical hormones will be back for anti-depressants within a year. Ask him how he feels as a supposed care provider about ****ing up their lives with his lack of knowledge. Then I would slap down a pile of Pub-Med studies and tell him to study up and get back to you. If he still feels the same way...fire him because he obviously is retarded
01-10-2006, 07:44 PM
01-11-2006, 08:12 AM
01-11-2006, 08:53 AM
maybe its an insurance thing rather then a doctor thing. My insurance is the same they won't cover it unless your blood work looks like it was from a woman . Mine was 290. I found a new doc, that isn't covered by my insurance and just pick up the bill myself, it sucks but it does make you feel better.
01-11-2006, 02:48 PM
Find another doc, he doesn't sound like he 's to concerned about your quality of life. Maybe an endocrinologist or urologist. I went to an endo with similar complaints; ED, lack of energy, low/no gains. My total test came back at 320. I'm now on 200mg/cyp a week that BC/BS is covering. They don't cover HCG though.
01-11-2006, 05:15 PM
Thanks for the replies, I will go back and talk to the doc and see if I can get a referall ( sucks, HMO ) to see a Urologist. I also have BC/BS so it was good to see that it's covered
I think it is one of those things that if you bitch hard enough they will do what you want.
How long have you been on the cyp, intv?? Have you noticed any strengh gains from it?? I have never had mine tested before and I am glad I did..
I always wondered why I can workout five days a week, have a great diet and gain nothing.
01-11-2006, 08:38 PM
01-12-2006, 12:51 AM
i'm on hrt .... i had a test lvl of 283 at the age of 22 after testicular cancer...... i'm on hrt with skyhigh test and i feel much better
i say trash the doctor he is an idiot and find one that will help u .... your going to need more blood work done then just total test
01-12-2006, 09:08 AM
01-12-2006, 03:53 PM
I've been on 8 weeks now. He initially put me on 200mg every 2 weeks, but my prescription is for 10ml (200mg/ml) a month, so I have plenty of cyp, and I thought 2 weeks was too long, so I went with 200mg/week EXCEPT for the last 2 weeks before I went in, so that the bloodwork would reflect test levels at the end of 2 weeks. Sure enough, total test was at 200! The nurse called and told me he wanted me to up it to 200mg/week. Hopefully the next time I'll have better numbers! I also mentioned testicular atrophy last checkup, so he prescribed me HCG, which is not covered by ins.Originally Posted by biker340
So far I feel much better, I'm up 8lbs, strength is up some, but I'm not pushing, I know it will take time. Libido is great, especially with HCG. Energy and motivation are up also. I didn't feel the test for the first 4-5 weeks at all, but knew it was coming.
01-12-2006, 04:03 PM
i suggest cutting your every 2 week dose in half and shooting once a week that is what i do... i'm shotting 120mg a week so far and getting my blood test done next week to see if it needs to go p higher... fi not HCG TIME!Originally Posted by intv
01-12-2006, 04:37 PM
I'm in the same boat as you. This past summer and into the fall I was just drained, so I went to have some blood work done. My Total Test. was 238, my doctor said well that is close to the range 240-800.
She said lets wait a month and see what happens, so I went back in after a month and my total test was 168. It fell even more.
So she recommended a Urologist, what a waste of time. I went to see him and he did a ultra scan of my testies and then a cat scan of my stomach (worried about cancer) everything check out fine. So all the Urologist did was throw some Viagra at me.
I said great this will help me get it up, but I'll have zero energy to perform. (I hate the lack of energy more than anything, I'm turning into a couch potato)
So I decided to take some M4OHN I had laying around, well a month later I went in, after only two weeks of M4OHN, and my total test was 398.
So is goes to show you that we need some outside help to boost your hormones. I just think some of us, have a tendency to get low Test. ( I remember growing up my dad was aways tired, maybe it runs in the family)
I did a lot of research and found that at my age mid 30s the average test was around 600. I'm not saying that is the norm, but I'm way off if that is the case.
Let me know if I can help with anything.
Ps. I'm still not taking anything and still fighting with my Dr. I go for a check up in a week, will update.
01-12-2006, 05:26 PM
What's with these doctors?? they think that just throwing Viagra at us will make us happy?? There is more to life than just sex, (spoken like a guy with low test, lol) There is quality of life issues.
I tried to search for M4OHN but it appears that it feel victim to the pro-hormone ban and is no longer available.
I also agree with you that low test runs in the family. My brother was diagnosed with low test a few years ago and was put on the patch.
I have to see the Doc next month so I may try the "squeeky wheel" method and bitch a lot..
01-12-2006, 06:17 PM
yea the prob with doctors is they don't know how to treat these problems..... very few doctors or even endos know how to treat it..... and if u got a problem they throw viagra at ya and said u will be fine.... as 4 giving u an ultrasound it's good to get one but not needed...and i did have test cancer.... all u needed was a blood test to figure out what was goign on just form that.... lh fsh total/free test, e2, dht is the basics.... then u can get into thyriod cortisol and so on.........Originally Posted by biker340
doctors don't understand the health risks with low test... from being tired to CANCER..... if u guys want a great place to find out about hrt and so on this is the place to go.....
01-12-2006, 07:00 PM
Well you are not alone and I would just get physical (lol) with your Doctor. But in all seriousness low test. levels point to so many things. Depression, lack of energy, lack of libido and they try to put you on a pill that treats each instead of treating the Test levels, which in return would fix all of the rest.
When I go next week I'm telling my Doctor I don't care, I want this fixed. So if that means HRT then so be it.
As far as the M4OHN, it is off the market, but I would recommend the Doctor's advice. I picked up some because it was suppose to be gentle, I didn't want big muscles, I just wanted some va voom back. It did help, which adds to my frustration with my Doctor.
BigRagu thanks for the link, I'm reading some stuff over there.
01-13-2006, 01:04 AM
I have a question about HRT. So when docs put you on it, is this a permanent thing or do you need to take a break from it to avoid similar side effects of PH's or AAS's?
It just doesn't seem healthy or logical for a doctor to prescribe 200mg Test a week for a year or years??? Am I missing something? Wouldn't this mess up your endocrine system similar to a yearlong cycle of AAS?
Also, add in HCG and it can spike your estrogen as well as stimulate test so how common are the gyno side effects of people that go on and off HRT?
01-13-2006, 02:19 AM
1)u don;t cycle hrt.. your body dosn't cycle.... think of this as giving yoru body back what it should haveOriginally Posted by 64bit
2)it will shut u down.... hcg will keep your guys working... and yes it is heatly conosidering it gets fine tuned to each person.. (with the right doctor)
3)hcg can spike e2 lvl that is where an anti will come into play IF needed.....
01-13-2006, 06:33 PM
01-13-2006, 06:41 PM
I took it for two weeks. I just wanted to see if I felt better, which I did...
Remember I wasn't after big muscles, I was just trying to find out if I could spike my test levels. No sides at all!
It wasn't like I'm experimenting on myself, but you can't get answers, well, I had to try something.
As a note; My doctor mentioned a patch, not sure what she meant, but.. I'll know more next week.
01-13-2006, 08:46 PM
there is a test patch that u can get.... one that is allied to your balls the other is allied to your back..... u get to choose which u use... the one u put on your back is much larger though..... problem with transadermals is they have higher dht conversion then shots and most people always get a skin reaction to them... i took androgel 4 about 1month 1 week and my skin was so scaley it could of sanded a table with it......... another down side to them is i believe there more expensive then shotsOriginally Posted by osr436
01-23-2006, 08:46 PM
After you quit taking it(M4ohn) how long did it take for your test levels to drop again? Did the M4ohn also cause your estrogen level to go up any.Originally Posted by osr436
Would like to see the blood work on that stuff(I have a ton of it laying around)
06-13-2006, 11:49 PM
When placed on Androgel or Test Cyp alone, I went polycythemic in a big way (another term for too many red blood cells or high hematocrit). The answer was twofold: split the weekly dosage of 200mg into two biweekly injections of 100mg each ~ but this left my levels a little lower than the doc wanted, especially the free or unbound testosterone. His response to that was to add in 100mg of deca as a chaser. I now do 2 shots per week consisting of 1/2cc of test and 1/2cc of deca. This gets me into a healthy range with acceptable impact on hematocrit.
06-14-2006, 12:22 AM
Mohn is actually weak anti-estrogen.Originally Posted by okboy63
Here is some info with using ATD instead.
06-14-2006, 12:31 AM
200mg of test in one shot is almost always high for any1. the normal dose for some1 is 100mg once a week i'm currently on 120mg and it's pushing my test to the very top of the normal range. usually the 2 days b4 your shot u will take LOW dose hcg to give alittle boost those days. i would suggest talking to your doctor about going back on all test cyp but starting at a dose of 100mg and working your way up or down from there after u get some labs.Originally Posted by PSBigJoey
as for the deca it has NO place in hrt
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