8 months on Serms....I would appreciate some feedback/recommendations.

[Blastic]

Hi there

I'm 33 and have been taking prescribed Novaldex for a couple of months now after a Low T diagnose back in March. I initially started on Clomid ( 25ED). My current protocol on Novaldex is 20mg/daily + Aromasin 12.2mg twice a week. I have experience some improvements in some areas but I think that the medication is masking the benefits of improved levels.

Pros:

- Muscles seem fuller
- A little less anxious


Cons:

- Bloated belly. ( this has been a problem since first week of treatment )

I have not gain any weight since starting treatment but stomach is bloated. My diet is clean, drink only water and take probiotics.


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BLOODS


October:

Total Testosterone : 20.2 ( 6.1-27.1) nmol/L

Free T : 495 ( 110-660) pmol/L

Bio-available T : 11.6 ( 2.8-15.5) nmol/L

SHBG: 27 ( 13-84) nmol/L

Estradiol : 87 (40-160) pmol/L

FSH: 2.7 ( 1.0-19.0) IU/L

LH: 3 ( 1.0-9.0) IU/L

DHEAS : 6.6 (2,9-12.6) uml/L

Free T3: 6.1 (3.3-6.0) pmol/L High

T4: 11.9 ( 9.0-19.1) pmol/L



BASELINE

APRIL

Total Testosterone : 6.3 ( 6.1-27.1) nmol/L

Free T : 196 ( 110-660) pmol/L

Bio-available T : 4.4 ( 2.8-15.5) nmol/L

SHBG: 11 ( 13-84) nmol/L

Estradiol : 78 (40-160) pmol/L

FSH: 2.1 ( 1.0-19.0) IU/L

LH: 2 ( 1.0-9.0) IU/L

DHEAS : 7.7 (2,9-12.6) uml/L

Free T3: 5.4 (3.3-6.0) pmol/L

T4: 11.9 ( 9.0-19.1) pmol/L

Prolactin: 8 (3-13.) ug/L

Progesterone: 4 (0.5-6.6) nmol/L

Prolactin: 6 (3-13.) ug/L

HDL: 1.5 (1-10) mmol/L

LDL: 2.5 ( 0.00-3.5) mmol/L


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As you can see there was a nice rise in numbers but symptoms still persist. Lethargy, mood, libido.......That said my doctor is open to injections but I would like to get some feedback about my situation. thanks for any input !

 

[Blastic]

Could this be an explanation ?

" The question is however, are you getting the full biological effect of testosterone when you are taking a SERM?

This is an interesting question since it has been observed by many SERM users that the subjective physical response one gets from a SERM often does not correlate with the measured substantial increase in circulating testosterone. In other words, you don’t feel the same when your blood testosterone is doubled by taking a SERM as compared to when it is doubled by a testosterone injection or testosterone gel. Why is that?

There are some theories. Number one, SERMs may act as estrogen antagonists in the brain and it is well known that many of the effects of testosterone upon libido and mood are due to its local conversion to DHT as well as estrogen (estradiol) in the CNS. Therefore blocking the effects of estrogen upon key levels of the brain may blunt the psychological response one would expect from testosterone.

SERMs also are known to act as estrogen agonists (active estrogens) in the liver. This can have a couple of relevant effects. First of all, estrogens strongly promote the production of sex hormone binding globulin (SHBG). This protein circulates in your blood and irreversibly binds to sex hormones such as testosterone, rendering them inactive. So with a SERM you may have high total testosterone levels but actual bioactive testosterone may not be so high.

Another consequence of SERM estrogen agonist action in the liver is suppression of IGF-1 production. IGF-1 is a systemic hormone responsible for whole body anabolism and it is produced in the liver under the positive influence of growth hormone, as well as other hormones such as insulin, thyroid hormone, and androgens. Estrogens on the other hand suppress IGF-1 production in the liver. In a recent study* it was directly demonstrated that administration of either tamoxifen or raloxifene to males increased LH and testosterone levels (as expected). However they also significantly reduced circulating IGF-1 production. Given the fact that it is well demonstrated that exogenous administration of testosterone increases IGF-1 levels in the blood you begin to see that this may be a big part of the SERM testosterone mystery. Systemic IGF-1 levels may not do much for contractile muscle tissue growth but they can lead to overall body composition changes and increases in bodyweight. The difference between the suppressed IGF-1 state (compared to control) of the SERM user to the heightened IGF-1 state (compared to control) of the exogenous testosterone user may indeed be quite profound.

In conclusion, I suspect that once all this information is considered and digested by people then the use of SERMs may go out of favor as an alternative to testosterone replacement therapy. It is my personal opinion that carefully titrated estrogen control via use of an aromatase inhibitor (perhaps combined with a proven natural testosterone elevator such as D-Aspartic Acid) may be a smarter way to achieve the end goal of natural testosterone elevation."

patrickarnoldblog.com/serms-as-an-alternative-to-testosterone-replacement-therapy/

 

[Mkgain1]

Hey man I mean i can't speak for anyone else but I know if I was offered legal medical grade test I wouldn't ask any question lol

But I think in reality there's no reason not to make a change, you don't feel good you can't lay pipe to the wife plus you get legal test that may make you feel better and provide even better physical results