HCG as a stand alone TRT

[valheruking]

I was recently prescribed HCG as a stand alone TRT because of my age (31) and I'm confused as to whether or not I should start administering it because of conflicting information that I was provided by the doctor and the research that I have done so far. Also I'm not sure of the dosage that I'm getting per shot so please help me out here.

Here is what the script says

HCG 10000 Units - 3 vials - mix with 10 CC - Inject .4 CC SC 3 times per week.

The reason I'm hesitant to start is because I was told HCG has no bad side effects but my research shows that it can desensitize the lydig cells and can raise estradiol and DHT. I'm also slightly above the threshold of what can be considered low (17nmol/L) and I don't want to further damage and possibly cause primary hypogonadism. I have all of the classic low T symptoms and weight about 120lb with very muscle tone.

I was told if HCG doesn't help then I would be on testosterone.

 

[w8lifter]

Can you post any recent blood work? Need to know why T is low: whether it be primary or secondary hypogonadism. If Primary, HCG will be of less value than if you were secondary. There are a lot of posts and stickies about it.

 

[valheruking]

Can someone calculate how many IUs I would be injecting per shot with the above information?

 

[vassille]

I was recently prescribed HCG as a stand alone TRT because of my age (31) and I'm confused as to whether or not I should start administering it because of conflicting information that I was provided by the doctor and the research that I have done so far. Also I'm not sure of the dosage that I'm getting per shot so please help me out here.

Here is what the script says

HCG 10000 Units - 3 vials - mix with 10 CC - Inject .4 CC SC 3 times per week.

The reason I'm hesitant to start is because I was told HCG has no bad side effects but my research shows that it can desensitize the lydig cells and can raise estradiol and DHT. I'm also slightly above the threshold of what can be considered low (17nmol/L) and I don't want to further damage and possibly cause primary hypogonadism. I have all of the classic low T symptoms and weight about 120lb with very muscle tone.

I was told if HCG doesn't help then I would be on testosterone.

So if Im doing my math right you taking 400iu 3x a week?

 

[Mr.TT]

400IUs per shot.

Do you know your LH numbers?

EDIT (your faster than me, vassille)

r)

 

[vassille]

400IUs per shot.

Do you know your LH numbers?

EDIT (your faster than me, vassille)

r)

It's ok I excel at figuring out dosages been doing this for too long lol as you can see

I second the LH number as well!

 

[valheruking]

400IUs per shot.

Do you know your LH numbers?

EDIT (your faster than me, vassille)

r)

One of the reasons I am hesitant to start is that the doc give me blood test to do before starting therapy and one after but he is not my regular doctor and is located in another city and I will be seeing him in about 2 months. So I have a two month supply of HCG without a recent blood test.

He has ordered these tests to be done before I take my first shot AST- GGT- LH -Prolactin- Total T- Highly sensitive CRP- DHEA- Estradiol and a few others for liver enzymes. He basically wrote me a script based on older blood test, based on mental and physical symptoms and a physical check.

But I assume 400 IUs is a small enough dose to raise T but not do any damage, correct?

 

[vassille]

One of the reasons I am hesitant to start is that the doc give me blood test to do before starting therapy and one after but he is not my regular doctor and is located in another city and I will be seeing him in about 2 months. So I have a two month supply of HCG without a recent blood test.

He has ordered these tests to be done before I take my first shot AST- GGT- LH -Prolactin- Total T- Highly sensitive CRP- DHEA- Estradiol and a few others for liver enzymes. He basically wrote me a script based on older blood test, based on mental and physical symptoms and a physical check.

But I assume 400 IUs is a small enough dose to raise T but not do any damage, correct?

yes.

 

[valheruking]

Would 300 IUs would be even safer or is this a negligible dose and do I have to worry about Estradiol or DHT as this amount 3 times per week?

 

[w8lifter]

300 3x week is Ok. Generally don't want to take any more than 500 at once without AI. I do test cyp every 6 days, with 250-300 iu HCG twice a week, with one the day before my t-cyp injection. At these amounts I need very little if any AI, but I do take it twice a week with the HCG. I take so little that I break off a tiny chunk that sticks to the moisture in my fingertip. I'm slightly sensitive to Anastrozole do need very little one Pill lasts 2 weeks.

 

[kisaj]

Like mentioned, you need to review blood work and determine why you are low. You may be better off starting with Clomid as an option to see if that can kick start your natural production.

Inevitably, there are follow up posts about the problems HCG caused and now what can be done about it.

 

[vassille]

I wouldnt stress taking 400iu of HCG.

 

[kisaj]

Go for it and report back on the progress it offers.

 

[valheruking]

how long can I store HCG in the fridge, the pamphlet says 30 days. The reason I ask is that my insurance declined it and its ****ing expensive for a months supply which comes to $152. Maybe I should call the doctor to see if there is a cheaper or maybe generic version available. The doc told me it would be covered but they denied it.

 

[vassille]

how long can I store HCG in the fridge, the pamphlet says 30 days. The reason I ask is that my insurance declined it and its ****ing expensive for a months supply which comes to $152. Maybe I should call the doctor to see if there is a cheaper or maybe generic version available. The doc told me it would be covered but they denied it.

Does it come premixed? If it is, only lasts 30 days in the fridge. Get smaller bottles that comes in powder form and reconsitute it when you need it.

 

[valheruking]

No I mixed it myself. But still pamphlet says 30 days.

 

[vassille]

No I mixed it myself. But still pamphlet says 30 days.

If it's powder form it lasts 2 years from the manufacturing date. Once you mix it only lasts 30 days. Store both in the fridge.
How much HCG does it come in a bottle?

 

[valheruking]

If it's powder form it lasts 2 years from the manufacturing date. Once you mix it only lasts 30 days. Store both in the fridge.
How much HCG does it come in a bottle?

10000 units, which is a waste because I'm injecting 400 units 3 times a week. It would last me 8 weeks if it wasn't for the 30 day expiry date. I will call the office to see if they can rewrite a script for 5000 units which hopefully is a bit cheaper.

 

[vassille]

10000 units, which is a waste because I'm injecting 400 units 3 times a week. It would last me 8 weeks if it wasn't for the 30 day expiry date. I will call the office to see if they can rewrite a script for 5000 units which hopefully is a bit cheaper.

yeah that's too much. Are you geting this from a pharmacy or comounding pharmacy?
here are your options:
HCG comes in smaller bottles of 5000iu. If the pharmacy doesnt have them they can order them.
Also, the doctor needs to change the prescription to 5000 iu or 10000 but tell the pharmacy to split it. Sometimes they cant do that based on prescription. You just have to look into it.
I think you got the 10000 because it was prescribed to you that way. I just did the math you need bottles of 5000iu.

 

[valheruking]

I still don't understand quiet how this works, assuming that HCG raises my T levels to what is considered acceptable and I no longer have low T symptoms, do I have to continue taking it for the rest of my life or are the results somewhat permanent. I have a few other questions along with this one that I plan to ask the doc when I see him in about two months.

 

[kisaj]

Here is a long read with a lot of answers.

http://testosteronewisdom.blogspot.com/2011/10/use-of-hcg-to-increase-testicular-size.html

 

[techlogik]

You could probably take 150-200 3x/week and be fine. Only labwork will tell. So, anybody that says take xxxx per inject doesn't have a clue.

Most people say to take way more hCG than necessary, that includes most idiot doctors who really don't know **** except when dealing with pregnant woman.

The only way to know if start with a dose like above, after a week or two, do some labs to see where Test/E2 is. Go from there.

Also, you can reconstitute and freeze hCG. It won't effect the efficacy of it over several months frozen. I can get about 3 months of syringes/dosages almost with a 10,000iu vial.

Just take a bunch of 31cc syringes, fill them up to like 125mcg each, freeze them. Take it out, 5 minutes later after a shower in the morning, thawed and inject, 3x/week I do this. I also take Tcyp, so my hCG dose is a bit lower, but anything more causes aromatase in me personally.

I've also done 100mcg 3x/week, and was around 450TT on labs, no Tcyp, just mono...so there is some proof that with two good working nuts, you can produce a descent amount of test with even smaller dosages..

YMMV

 

[vassille]

You could probably take 150-200 3x/week and be fine. Only labwork will tell. So, anybody that says take xxxx per inject doesn't have a clue.

Most people say to take way more hCG than necessary, that includes most idiot doctors who really don't know **** except when dealing with pregnant woman.

The only way to know if start with a dose like above, after a week or two, do some labs to see where Test/E2 is. Go from there.

Also, you can reconstitute and freeze hCG. It won't effect the efficacy of it over several months frozen. I can get about 3 months of syringes/dosages almost with a 10,000iu vial.

Just take a bunch of 31cc syringes, fill them up to like 125mcg each, freeze them. Take it out, 5 minutes later after a shower in the morning, thawed and inject, 3x/week I do this. I also take Tcyp, so my hCG dose is a bit lower, but anything more causes aromatase in me personally.

I've also done 100mcg 3x/week, and was around 450TT on labs, no Tcyp, just mono...so there is some proof that with two good working nuts, you can produce a descent amount of test with even smaller dosages..

YMMV

Why would you take HCG with Cyp...what's the thought behind it to have 2 complete different sources of test competing at the same time?
Just curious

 

[valheruking]

Doc's office says to just continue using it after the 30 day mark. Apparently there is no to little degradation in efficacy for up to 2 months.

 

[kisaj]

Well, that is a straight up false statement and anyone that has used HCG knows this. As a visual clue, you will notice your boys drop a bit depending on how bad you suffer from atrophy. Pretty quick after the 30 day mark, you will notice this no longer happening and the atrophy back. The potency of HCG is one that is tied in close to the 30 day mark once it is mixed with bac water. In my case, I was wondering why I felt so good after the 30 days and it was because I was no longer feeling the effects of it. haha

 

[vassille]

Well, that is a straight up false statement and anyone that has used HCG knows this. As a visual clue, you will notice your boys drop a bit depending on how bad you suffer from atrophy. Pretty quick after the 30 day mark, you will notice this no longer happening and the atrophy back. The potency of HCG is one that is tied in close to the 30 day mark once it is mixed with bac water. In my case, I was wondering why I felt so good after the 30 days and it was because I was no longer feeling the effects of it. haha

I agree and this also applies to HGH reconstitution as well.
Val,
just have them break down the prescription into 5000iu bottles....that will solve your issue.

 

[kisaj]

Regardless of my stance on HCG, I have never understood the point of giving people 10,000 IU bottles. Very few will ever use that amount and it would seem just as easy to prescribe 2 smaller bottles and allow them to get the full potency and not waste money.

 

[valheruking]

Just a quick update, libido and appetite are considerably higher than before and noticing slight improvement in mood. I had a varicocele that I think did irreversible damage to my left testicle and had its shaped changed, I see no improvement in that regard except a slight increase in its size. I'm waiting to see the same urologist that fixed the varicocele to see what else is going on there. Also sperm count has gone up considerably as well.

Ironically now that the left testicle has gained some of its size back, the pain has gone up a little too.

 

[valheruking]

I'm not seeing the same positive effects that I initially experienced when I started this regimen, is it possible that I'm developing a tolerance to HCG?

 

[vassille]

yeap it happens