My estrogen is out of range, I need your opinion on why

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  1. As you know a lot of men in the past are messed up big time from using finasteride.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    I am working on multiple cases of this now and what I am finding is alot of guys with excellent T numbers and e2 ratio which tells me its not in the hormone system, but immune and neurological systems.


  2. Quote Originally Posted by pmgamer18 View Post
    As you know a lot of men in the past are messed up big time from using finasteride.
    Yes and I am working at looking at ways to establish dopamine pathways on d1-d5 receptors. I am getting deeper into immune and neurotransmitters as I feel that is where the missing link is in a lot of cases. It may also explain the difference in how people can feel good on low T naturally and other need higher amts to get benefits. The brain and epigenetics is the next frontier in medicine.

    Imagine if a guy had optimum detoxfication and neurological pathways along with optimum bio-individual endocrine system. You talking life expectency of 120 or more years..Its not that far off...I'm type of guy live to 70 with good quality of life rather then live to 100 being a vegetable and in pain. Give me will or give me a bullet in the head..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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  3. Thank you guys for the replies, very helpful.

    I stopped the fin and am now on Lyrica. Blood test in a month. Will my T levels rebound you think?

    Embarrassing story that happened today: I was with a hot 21 year old (I'm 33 and yes I can pull young hotties with ease) and failed to get it up. My ego is destroyed.

    The Matrix: Is there a cost-effective way to monitor my T levels beside blood tests? Is there like a portable device like for people with diabetes? Or a way to test at home that doesn't involve a lab? If there isn't I should invent this.

  4. I'm coming in late to the party, but Fin has a terrible reputation for messing with the hormone levels. Depending on dosage and a person's sensitivity, it can literally be chemical castration. Having E.D. is extremely common in relation with Fin usage. Hopefully with time and SERM/AI therapy you can reverse its effects.

  5. Quote Originally Posted by mcr View Post
    Thank you guys for the replies, very helpful.

    I stopped the fin and am now on Lyrica. Blood test in a month. Will my T levels rebound you think?

    Embarrassing story that happened today: I was with a hot 21 year old (I'm 33 and yes I can pull young hotties with ease) and failed to get it up. My ego is destroyed.

    The Matrix: Is there a cost-effective way to monitor my T levels beside blood tests? Is there like a portable device like for people with diabetes? Or a way to test at home that doesn't involve a lab? If there isn't I should invent this.
    Lyrica is chronic pain which will deplete testosterone its self (chronic inflammation) There are too many varaibles to content with and proper evaluation and case history is needed. Alot of red flags going up..

    NO must have blood work done.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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  6. Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    NO must have blood work done.
    Sorry what is NO?

    I had a lot of blood work done.

  7. Quote Originally Posted by mcr View Post
    Sorry what is NO?

    I had a lot of blood work done.
    "N" "O" what part of it don't you understand LOL
    Blood is only way to monitor the results to get it back the quickest. There is urine by it a pain in the butt, and takes much longer to get back. saliva I never trust.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.

  8. Oh I see you were responding to my question about testing T levels at home.

    What about saliva tests? Are they reliable?

  9. Quote Originally Posted by mcr View Post
    Sorry what is NO?
    I know that I have asked my wife this question before.
    Pain is just weakness leaving the body...

  10. Hey guys, one more question: I am reading a lot of contradictory information on whether pseudogynecomastia can be eliminated with E blockers.
    Any thoughts?

    Thanks!

  11. Quote Originally Posted by mcr View Post
    Hey guys, one more question: I am reading a lot of contradictory information on whether pseudogynecomastia can be eliminated with E blockers.
    Any thoughts?

    Thanks!
    Only to the degree that an "E blocker" can help someone lose bodyfat. Pseudogyno is just fat that collects on the chest. Reduce your bodyfat and you will reduce pseudogyno. Gyno tissue is the hard nodule behind the nipple that does react (shrink) to and anti-E. Letro, Raloxifene, and mesterolone are the best options in the case of real gyno.
    Pain is just weakness leaving the body...

  12. There is nothing hard behind the nipple. However endo calls it gynecomastia or pseudogynecomastia. This is not just the stuff from being fat. My bf is low. It also correlates with my E2 being high. It started developing when I added pregabalin to finasteride.

  13. Quote Originally Posted by mcr View Post
    There is nothing hard behind the nipple. However endo calls it gynecomastia or pseudogynecomastia. This is not just the stuff from being fat. My bf is low. It also correlates with my E2 being high. It started developing when I added pregabalin to finasteride.
    The least "harsh" way to deal with the E2 issue while still is either mesterolone (proviron) or its OTC prohormone androsterone/epiandrosterone found in AndroHard or Stanodrol. It will raise the DHT levels, reversing the drop in DHT that finasteride lowered/caused. DHT is also an Estrogen antagonist. I'd start there and see how things go. You could add exemestane (aromasin) or an OTC anti-e like Erase to the above recommendation, but be careful-your joints are going to start drying up when you drop the E2 too low.
    Pain is just weakness leaving the body...

  14. So far one week off finasteride.

    Yesterday for the first time in a long time, I had a rock hard erection and maintained it until orgasm. This was watching porn (for scentific purposes of course).

    I was so happy I started masturbating furiously so I could finish before the boner betrayed me, but it stayed with me til the end. It's too early to tell but I may be one of the lucky ones who won't suffer persistent side effects.

    The bad thing is that I'm shedding a lot of hair. I really do not want to lose my hair at any cost.

    If I take only .2mg of finasteride, will it block enough DHT to save my hair without raising E2 to abnormal levels? Is there a proven way to block DHT in the scalp only?

    IMPORTANT NOTE: I never had gyno with finasteride. ONLY after I added pregabalin. Now I'm off both, but I eventually will have to get back on it because it's an amazing mood stabilizer and anti depressant and anti anxiety med.

  15. Better to lose your hair, than erections and sex drive. You can always shave your head and will have more sex than men with hair anyways.

  16. Quote Originally Posted by rfarns01 View Post
    Better to lose your hair, than erections and sex drive. You can always shave your head and will have more sex than men with hair anyways.
    I started balding in my early 20s...by 30, I shaved it all off. The response? Everyone said it looked great and I got more attention from women than before (wife not so happy about that).

    For the OP... if you insist on blocking DHT, then using a DHT increaser will just be a waste of time for both goals. OTC you can get Erase or Rx/RCs are those I mentioned above that will deal with E2. Those may work in conjunction with Fin.
    Pain is just weakness leaving the body...

  17. Shaving not for me. So while on fin I need to take something to prevent E2 from being too high. Anything over the counter that can do this?

  18. Quote Originally Posted by mcr View Post
    Shaving not for me. So while on fin I need to take something to prevent E2 from being too high. Anything over the counter that can do this?
    Erase is pretty popular. Good luck with the follicles.... fighting mother nature is a bitch.
    Pain is just weakness leaving the body...

  19. Quote Originally Posted by mcr View Post
    So far one week off finasteride.
    If I take only .2mg of finasteride, will it block enough DHT to save my hair without raising E2 to abnormal levels? Is there a proven way to block DHT in the scalp only?
    Azelaic acid topical treatment will block DHT locally. Maybe not enough for everyone but it works for many.

  20. Got the results of another blood test, this time I am not on finasteride or lyrica or anything

    Total T: 434 ng/dL (ref range 250-1100)
    Free T: 65 pg/mL (ref range 35-155)
    Estradiol: 14 pg/mL (normal is below 29)

    Questions:

    Is it normal that my total T went from 950 8 years ago to 434 now? It seems like a huuuuuge drop. I know T levels fluctuate but in all my recent tests my T is in the 400s or 500s. That seems quite low for me.
    Is my free T okay for bodybuilding purposes?

    I will do another blood test in a few days to see what happens in I take lyrica but not finasteride.

  21. a single test that showed 950 could have been an anomaly, potentially a lab error. I'd have to question even why you had a testosterone level test at 25?

    Also, diet plays a HUGE part in hormone levels. If you used to eat more saturated fat then, and eat a lot less now it would most definitely impact that.

    You have to define "bodybuilding purposes" - are you trying to get to a ripped 175? a competition stage ready 175? a ripped 200? all are different. Ripped 175 sure, competition level bodyfat at 175 is a little iffy, but possible. Probably reaching a really ripped 200 would be hard at that T level, but it would be hard at your prior level too if that was accurate.

  22. Quote Originally Posted by EasyEJL
    a single test that showed 950 could have been an anomaly, potentially a lab error. I'd have to question even why you had a testosterone level test at 25?

    Also, diet plays a HUGE part in hormone levels. If you used to eat more saturated fat then, and eat a lot less now it would most definitely impact that.

    You have to define "bodybuilding purposes" - are you trying to get to a ripped 175? a competition stage ready 175? a ripped 200? all are different. Ripped 175 sure, competition level bodyfat at 175 is a little iffy, but possible. Probably reaching a really ripped 200 would be hard at that T level, but it would be hard at your prior level too if that was accurate.
    Improper sleep or.immune system dysfunction can lower testosterone by 60%. Why all areas need to.be explored
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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