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High E upcoming Endo appt

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    High E upcoming Endo appt


    Went to see my primary care physician a few weeks ago because I suspected my T levels might be low. Doc was very reluctant to check anything other than total T but after much pleading I also got him to check free T as well as E2. My T levels fell in the normal range (674 ng/dl total and 89.6 pg/ml free) however my E2 was pretty high 133.4 pg/ml.

    I have an appt w an endo in another 3 weeks and I'm just trying to educate myself a little more before I see him. Should i expect to have any more bloodwork done? If so what else should they check for? Is there any ways I can lower estrogen levels naturally?

    Also I should mention that after I found out my E2 was high I decided to start a cycle of forma stanzol mainly because at the time my endo appt wasn't until another 6 weeks and the high E was really F ing up my relationship ... it was almost impossible fo r me to cum. Like I said before my appt isn't for another 3 weeks so i was wondering if I should stop taking the forma now or how much longer I can stay on it for.

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    Did the formestane help? It also lowers DHT so that may be a confounding issue. If T is high and E is high... I really think that's a DHT problem. That's not fact, simply a suggestion.

    I don't know what the endo does for high estrogen levels. No idea if they are willing to prescribe AIs or anything like that. If your lipids aren't bad atm, you could try slowly dosing an AI like exemestane to get E2 in check. But going to the endo first is the best idea. Good luck man.
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    Yeah the formestane does seem to help at least in the libido department. I think I had gone nearly a week without ejaculating before I started taking it (and believed me I tried!). But I'm not sure if I'm dosing high enough or if forma is even capable of bringing me down from 133 to an optimal range which is somewhere around 25-35 I believe (found that range on another thread here).

    Anyways the forma is more of a bridge until I see the endo. Hopefully he does prescribe me an AI as my E2 is through the roof right now. But I'm still wondering if its a bad idead to be taking the forma before I see the endo. Anyone have any input here. I obstained from all supps for 5 weeks before I had the initial bloodwork taken so I could get a fair assesment of where I was at.

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    You definitely want to be off the forma at least for 2 weeks if not longer prior to next blood draw. I'd stop now, with your appointment in 3 weeks as odds are fair the endo will draw more blood.
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    Thanks I'll b dropping the forma asap. Only other supp I'm taking is topical magnesium oil which claims to raise dhea levels, do u think I should stop taking that as well? Common sense tells me I should but I was a mess the last time I stopped taking all supps and don't really want to go through that all over again, ya know

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    with e2 that high i wouldnt bother with otc stuff. that calls for the big guns. hopefully you have a good endo and he'll get you right

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    Did the formestane help? It also lowers DHT so that may be a confounding issue. If T is high and E is high... I really think that's a DHT problem. That's not fact, simply a suggestion.
    thanks for a heads up on the dht possibility, I didn't know that formestane lowered dht. I'm still a total noob when it comes to this stuff so there is still much to learn. From what I've read dht competes w estrogen for receptor sites and kind of acts like an ai, correct? So I guess it would be wise for my endo to check for low dht levels.

    What else would a good endo look at? Only reason I ask is because I am going to Fallon health clinic and am not really sure how qualified or caring the doc is gonna be.

    And if u read this The Matrix I would really value any input you have to offer. Ive been having problems with depression, anxiety, and lethargy pretty much half my life (I'm 27 btw), I thought it was a chemical imbalance but come to find out that high levels of estrogen can cause these same symptoms. So that's why I'd really like to get my levels in check asap so I don't have to wait endless months chasing my tail w a clueless endo

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    Guess I'm on my own here ... That's cool I'll just heal myself w the power of my mind ... Winning!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpk20x View Post
    Guess I'm on my own here ... That's cool I'll just heal myself w the power of my mind ... Winning!!
    May want to check into other reason to why you are feeling like this. One needs to look at all factors because symptoms can over lap. From personal expereince, I thought it was my thyroid and it ended up being something totally different. You can not out guess the body because it will throw you a curve ball unless it can me medically validated. Going on your own is not a bad idea, but bewarned with out proper guidennce as I found my self barking up the wrong tree too many times.

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    May want to check into other reason to why you are feeling like this. One needs to look at all factors because symptoms can over lap. From personal expereince, I thought it was my thyroid and it ended up being something totally different. You can not out guess the body because it will throw you a curve ball unless it can me medically validated. Going on your own is not a bad idea, but bewarned with out proper guidennce as I found my self barking up the wrong tree too many times.
    no I'm all done trying to figure this one out on my own that's why I set up the endo appt and started this thread looking for a little extra help and guidance.

    I've tried several OTC depression aids as well as several ssris hoping to alleviate my symptoms with only minimal success. Currently I am taking full dose of paxil, 60 mg a day, and haven't really noticed any improvement in mood or well being.

    I've have really cleaned up my diet and reduced my caffeine intake the last month or so in hopes of gaining more energy. I have gone organic, eliminated all sugar, dairy, and gluten products, and try to only eat hormone free protein sources. At my worse I was probably taking 1500+ milligrams of caffeine daily just to make it through an 8 hour workday. I've cut that amount significantly but it still takes around 600 milligrams for me to function and actually accomplish anything.

    Guess I'll just have to wait to see how I feel once I get my e2 in check. What other factors do you think need to be examined?

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpk20x View Post
    no I'm all done trying to figure this one out on my own that's why I set up the endo appt and started this thread looking for a little extra help and guidance.

    I've tried several OTC depression aids as well as several ssris hoping to alleviate my symptoms with only minimal success. Currently I am taking full dose of paxil, 60 mg a day, and haven't really noticed any improvement in mood or well being.

    I've have really cleaned up my diet and reduced my caffeine intake the last month or so in hopes of gaining more energy. I have gone organic, eliminated all sugar, dairy, and gluten products, and try to only eat hormone free protein sources. At my worse I was probably taking 1500+ milligrams of caffeine daily just to make it through an 8 hour workday. I've cut that amount significantly but it still takes around 600 milligrams for me to function and actually accomplish anything.

    Guess I'll just have to wait to see how I feel once I get my e2 in check. What other factors do you think need to be examined?
    caffeine can increase e2 by up to 80%..

    You need to really get to root cause and this endo is a fuken waste of time. They can not even figure out primary or secondary hypogonadism alone your biological trainwreck. As I went to 4 of them told me wait it out. Screw that. They only test half assed and make you wait 8 weeks to come back to do anything. In mean while you are feeling like crap. Sorry bro, but looks like you self castrated your self due to poor lifechoices like many of the people end up coming to see me. Probably suffering from insulin resistance, low cortisol low catecholamines, low testosterone, high e2 (from excessive of caffines consumption), low potatssium, sodium, magnesium (from excessive caffeinie), low serotonion, t4/t3 conversion issues. You need to do a complete metabolic over hall. Caffiene will erode away your Gi lining in stomach and intestines causing irritation so you probably are not absorbing 1/2 of what you eat or nutrients. YOu really need help my freind and endos are last person you want to goto..

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    Is there anyone you can recommend in Massachusetts? I was hoping to get this taken care of w insurance but everyone I have seen so far has been a f'ing waste of time like u said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpk20x View Post
    Is there anyone you can recommend in Massachusetts? I was hoping to get this taken care of w insurance but everyone I have seen so far has been a f'ing waste of time like u said.
    If you are going to boston university there are complete off there rocker and will rush you in and out in 15 minutes. Pm me

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    Quick update ...

    Just saw my endo a few days ago I requested a full indepth hormone and thyroid panel but all he tested me for was estradiol, cortisol, prolactin, and Free T4

    free t4 was 1.05 Ng/dl standard range .8 - 1.8

    Prolactin 8.7ng/ml standard range 2.1 - 17.7

    estradiol 36pg/ml standard range 0 - 54

    still awaiting cortisol results


    So as you can see my e2 really isn't that bad afterall. I was having a major blonde moment ... The initial test my pcp did was estrogens total (serum) ... So my e2 wasn't 133 pg/ml that was my total estrogen... sorry about the confusion.

    So now I'm wondering if I should really b concerned about my estrogen as it isn't as bad as I nearly thought. Also I'm wondering if the formestane I was taking had any affect at all on my recent E2 test as I only stopped taking it roughly 2 weeks prior to bloodwork. When I had my total estrogen measured a few months ago I had stopped taking all supplements for an entire month prior to bloodwor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpk20x View Post
    Only other supp I'm taking is topical magnesium oil which claims to raise dhea levels, do u think I should stop taking that as well?
    Matrix, what is the possibility that this is causing the rise in estrogen???

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpk20x View Post
    Also I'm wondering if the formestane I was taking had any affect at all on my recent E2 test as I only stopped taking it roughly 2 weeks prior to bloodwork. When I had my total estrogen measured a few months ago I had stopped taking all supplements for an entire month prior to bloodwork.
    I would test it again after being off at least 4 weeks. I believe it could have given you a false reading. You also need to know your SHBG level.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonRider View Post
    I would test it again after being off at least 4 weeks. I believe it could have given you a false reading. You also need to know your SHBG level.
    i see alot of nutrient deficiency at cellular level, metabolic road blocks that are preventing nutrient uptake, recreation drug abuse, smoking, leaky gut, stagnant liver, dysbiosis, piss poor lifestyle, xenoestrogen causing phase 1 and phase 2 to get out of balance, lack of sleep, over weight, NASH, list goes on and on. I just did evaluation on 3 guys that where on adex and saw imbalance in their cellular metabolism as well as liver pathways resulting in rises in e2. They all had gut issues, protein malabsorption, and many cellular road blocks, and highly hyperpermeable membrane which is just letting all toxins in and not letting it out. When I get the result from cellular testing there is no hiding anything. i have a blue print of your cells and will be able to tell more information about you then one needs to know. I have been reading these things for 2-3 years better then most Dr's out there because they do not look deep enough into things. People I work write a detailed bio and eating plan. I love it when they tell me they eat healthy What a joke and totally imbalanced. Once i compare the bio eating log and cellular testing its all she wrote !!

    i also am beginning to wonder how much of these people really want to get well?
    The only problem is they are not willing to do what it takes to do it so they most likely wont
    I see the same people with same issue never getting better year after years. Why because they do not need to do what it takes better

    Example
    From intercellular testing I saw pattern resemebling alcohol abuse on drs patient. "oh I forgot to mention that" he replied. I asked him how many a day. He goes 3 beers a day and 2 6 pack on weekens. Wondering why we was on armidex all has all these estrogen related issues. I see cases like this all the time. People get pissed off about, nutrients deficiency can not cause this or that. Sorry charlie if you are slamming down beers all the time no freaken wonder you have issues.

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    Matrix, what is the possibility that this is causing the rise in estrogen???
    Probably not the problem man, just starting taking mag oil only a few months prior to the initial bw. I've been feeling 'not well' for the last 15 years or so. Anyways I'm saving up to see a good endo as the last two docs I saw are barley scratching the surface. I tell them I feel tired all the time, am depressed, have bad anxiety, have barely any sensitivity left in my penis, and they tell me everythings ok, just take a multi

    Matrix let me ask you a question ... suppose my problems aren't hormonal ... say I am just clinically depressed and have a chemical imbalance .. Is that something you would be able to test for?

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    Quote Originally Posted by dpk20x View Post
    Probably not the problem man, just starting taking mag oil only a few months prior to the initial bw. I've been feeling 'not well' for the last 15 years or so. Anyways I'm saving up to see a good endo as the last two docs I saw are barley scratching the surface. I tell them I feel tired all the time, am depressed, have bad anxiety, have barely any sensitivity left in my penis, and they tell me everythings ok, just take a multi

    Matrix let me ask you a question ... suppose my problems aren't hormonal ... say I am just clinically depressed and have a chemical imbalance .. Is that something you would be able to test for?
    i would keep digging until I am satified that i have exhausted all possiblities.
    THis can be done with minimal testing and with in 3 weeks I would have all answers you have been seeking or ruled out several factors that have not been examined by traditional medicine.

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    What's the common or correct dosing time for arimidex when on TRT? I mean for instance if you do shots first thing AM, should you take your arimidex at whatever dose/frequency (EOD for example) you are dosing it at also in the AM along with the shots?

    Or shots in the AM, and arimidex in the PM? Or does it really not even matter?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliThaDon View Post
    What's the common or correct dosing time for arimidex when on TRT? I mean for instance if you do shots first thing AM, should you take your arimidex at whatever dose/frequency (EOD for example) you are dosing it at also in the AM along with the shots?

    Or shots in the AM, and arimidex in the PM? Or does it really not even matter?
    Armidex reaches plasma levels in about 4 weeks then you just need to keep the levels stable. with minimal dosage being once every 3 days taking in account the half life of the drug.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Armidex reaches plasma levels in about 4 weeks then you just need to keep the levels stable. with minimal dosage being once every 3 days taking in account the half life of the drug.

    thanks matrix. Reading this article: http://www.smart-drugs.com/ias-estrogen.htm

    Wondering, what is the correlation between high estrogen and LH levels? If your estrogen is too high, does it plummet your LH levels to well below normal values? Or does it have no affect specifically on LH levels?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliThaDon View Post
    thanks matrix. Reading this article: http://www.smart-drugs.com/ias-estrogen.htm

    Wondering, what is the correlation between high estrogen and LH levels? If your estrogen is too high, does it plummet your LH levels to well below normal values? Or does it have no affect specifically on LH levels?
    The hypothalamus has both androgen receptors and estrogen receptors. When the level of either hormone gets too high, the receptors become more highly activated, and the hypothalamus stops sending Gonadotropin Releasing Hormone to the pituitary. The pituitary, in turn, stops sending lh - leutenizing hormone - and FSH - follicle stimulating hormone - to the testes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DragonRider View Post
    The hypothalamus has both androgen receptors and estrogen receptors. When the level of either hormone gets too high, the receptors become more highly activated, and the hypothalamus stops sending Gonadotropin Releasing Hormone to the pituitary. The pituitary, in turn, stops sending lh - leutenizing hormone - and FSH - follicle stimulating hormone - to the testes.

    thank you for the explanation. So basically high estrogen DOES cause a drop in LH.

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