First Hormone Test: Highish LH and High FSH. Lowish Testosterone. May take DAA.

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    Question First Hormone Test: Highish LH and High FSH. Lowish Testosterone. May take DAA.


    LH: 6.6 U/L - Range: 1.5 - 7.7
    FSH: 16.9 U/L - Range: 1.5 - 14
    Testosterone: 4.40 ng/mL - Range: 2.70 - 15.00
    SHBG: - 40 nmol/L Range: 13 - 71

    Prolactin: 118 mU/L Range: 53-360
    Estradiol: 38.2 pg/mL Range: <56

    Growth Hormone: - 0.14 ng/mL Range: 0.06 - 5.0

    Only my FSH levels were out of range, but my growth hormone looks quite low and based on the range the lab uses, my testosterone seems kind of low, no? The highish LH and lowish Test concerns me since my dad has had testicular failure and is on TRT.

    For what it's worth my Uric Acid was high, Chloride low, HDL slightly low, HC03 a bit high and Insulin levels low (but glucose levels are perfect).

    I'm 32 and in pretty good shape (not overweight at all).

    My last cycle of anything was a short cycle of pro-hormones back in 2004.

    I'm seriously thinking about starting Monday @3grams of DAA per day for a month and getting everything tested again at that point. Any advice or thoughts on my results that you guys could offer are greatly appreciated.

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    Could be thyroid or prolactin, among other things. You want estradiol lower than that. around 10 pg/ml is a good range for men.

    Outside of that, I wonder what others will have to say.

    Could also be cortisol issues.

    DAA probably won't help as much as you think. IMO, try Erase or Sustain alpha. Bring estrogens down a bit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigBlackGuy View Post
    Could be thyroid or prolactin, among other things. You want estradiol lower than that. around 10 pg/ml is a good range for men.

    Outside of that, I wonder what others will have to say.

    Could also be cortisol issues.

    DAA probably won't help as much as you think. IMO, try Erase or Sustain alpha. Bring estrogens down a bit.
    Again you need to look at other factors, but if your LH is high and FSH is high this is indication on primary hypogonadism/ I have some cases I dealt with that when proper balance was brought back to the body the LH started to come down. Please examine thyroid,adrenals, lifestyle, nutritional imbalances ,e2, heavy metals, and hidden infection to rule these out
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    Again you need to look at other factors, but if your LH is high and FSH is high this is indication on primary hypogonadism/ I have some cases I dealt with that when proper balance was brought back to the body the LH started to come down. Please examine thyroid,adrenals, lifestyle, nutritional imbalances ,e2, heavy metals, and hidden infection to rule these out
    Here are the rest of my results:

    Red Blood Cells 4.63 10x12L Range: 4.5 - 5.9
    Hemoglobin 141 g/L Range: 132 - 175
    Hematocrit 43% Range: 40 - 51
    MCV 92 fL Range: 80-100
    MCH 31pg Range: 27 - 33
    MCHC 330 Range: 315 - 360
    RDW 12.7 Range: 11.5 - 15.5
    Platelets 285 Range: 150 - 410
    White Blood Cells 6.80 Range 4.0 - 9.8

    Neutrophilis % 64.3% Range: 48 - 72
    Neutrophils abs. 4.35 10x9/L Range: 1.92 - 8.00
    Eosinophils % 2.0% Range: 0.3 - 5.4
    Eosinophils abs. 0.14 Range: 0.02 - 0.53
    Basophils % 1.5% Range: 0.0 - 2.0
    Basophils abs. 0.1010x9/L Range: 0.00 - 0.20
    Lymphocytes % 27.0% Range: 18.0 - 42.0
    Lymphocytes abs. 1.8310x9/L Range: 0.72 - 4.00
    Moncytes % 5.2% Range: 2.0 - 11.0
    Moncytes abs. 0.3510x9/L Range: 0.08 - 1.21
    ESR 10mm/h Range: 1 - 15
    Iron 16.8µmol/L Range: 6.6 -28.3

    Urea 5.0mmol/L Range: 1.7 -8.3
    Creatinine 103µmol/L Range: 30 - 106
    Glomerular Filtration rate 106ml/min/1.73
    m˛ Range: >90

    Uric Acid 227µmol/L Range: 270 - 470
    Glucose (Plasma) 4.50mmol/L Range: 3.30 -5.89
    Total Protein 75.3g/L Range: 65.0 -85.0
    Albumin 47.4g/L Range: 34.0 -50.0
    Bilirubin - total 11.9µmol/L Range: 1.1 - 19
    SGOT(ASAT) 20U/L Range: <37
    SGPT(ALAT) 16 U/L Range: <41
    Alkaline Phosphatase 73U/L Range: <117
    Sodium 140.0mmol/L Range: 135.0 -150.0
    Potassium 3.64mmol/L Range: 3.50 -5.30
    Chlorides 82mmol/L Range: 98-107
    Calcium Calcium 2.46mmol/L Range: 2.10 - 2.60
    Magnesium (serum) 0.87mmol/L Range: 0.60 - 1.10

    Cholestrol 3.86mmol/L (149 mg/dL) Range: <5.00
    HDL Cholesterol 0.98mmol/L Range: >1.10
    LDL Cholesterol 1.98mmol/L Range: <3.0
    Triglycerides 0.68mmol/L Range: <2.0
    25-OH-Vitamin D3 61ng/mL
    HCO3 31.2mmol/L Range: 22-29

    Free T3 4.6 pmol/L Range: 2.8 -8.0
    Free T4 17.3 pmol/L Range: 10.3 -24.5
    TSH 2.1 mU/L Range: 0.4 - 4.0
    Insulin <2.00 µU/mL Range: 6.0 -27.0

    It's worth noting the parts marked in RED were flagged by the lap and atypical. The parts marked in BLUE were flagged by me and seeing a bit off. The lab did not flash my LH as being high, but they did. I marked it blue because it was at the high end of normal.

    Matrix, do the rest of my results offer any more insight to what the problem could be? Anything specifically you guys think I should do? I'm going to start taking Zinc and Fish/Flax Oil.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigBlackGuy View Post
    Could be thyroid or prolactin, among other things. You want estradiol lower than that. around 10 pg/ml is a good range for men.

    Outside of that, I wonder what others will have to say.

    Could also be cortisol issues.

    DAA probably won't help as much as you think. IMO, try Erase or Sustain alpha. Bring estrogens down a bit.
    My thyroid and prolactin results appear normal don't they BigBlackGuy?

    Does everyone agree that my E2 is too high? Any suggestions for what to do about that?

    Any other tests I should get done?

    Are my GH levels low enough to warrant HGH supplementation? Can I get my levels back up with diet and training?

    Since my LH levels are at the high end of normal and DAA seems to increase LH would taking DAA be a BAD idea for me?

    If I have the beginnings of what could become primary hypogonadism how will that effect my fertility the next 10 years? I do not have kids and would like to have them. Should I get my sperm count tested now and freeze some sperm to store at a clinic for use later just in case?

    I really appreciate the feedback and help!
    Last edited by ctrlaltdel; 01-15-2011 at 03:46 PM. Reason: More questions
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    FSH is usually a good indicator of sperm production, however I recommend that you get the fertility test. Everything looks decent (slightly elevated estrogen, imo), so maybe there is some kind of physical defect.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigBlackGuy View Post
    FSH is usually a good indicator of sperm production, however I recommend that you get the fertility test. Everything looks decent (slightly elevated estrogen, imo), so maybe there is some kind of physical defect.
    Flax seed and fish oils are over rated.
    Flax seed oil is goitergenic ,estrogenic and can cause an imbalance in 6:3 ratio resulting in suppressing your immune system, metabolsm, and increase oxidative stress which is not good. People really need to understand taking certain fats in the wrong ratio can cause a world of trouble. Been there done that and one of the reason my health and immune system was out of balance.
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    I added DAA to my TRT regimen and my test level went from 775-1100 average to over 1600. My doctor freaked and almost took me off TRT!!! Give DAA a try and then re-test and see where you stand.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Presa View Post
    I added DAA to my TRT regimen and my test level went from 775-1100 average to over 1600. My doctor freaked and almost took me off TRT!!! Give DAA a try and then re-test and see where you stand.
    That's awesome! When did you start feeling a difference? How long did it take to your levels that high? Are you taking 3 grams or more?
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    I just started taking the recommended dose, 3Grams prior to workout. Now, my estradiol was slightly elevated bur my doc says that was expected with test so high. However, I have had zero side effects or any gyno type issues. In fact, now I would have to recommend adding DAA before upping test dosage. Either way, you're still safe.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Presa View Post
    I added DAA to my TRT regimen and my test level went from 775-1100 average to over 1600. My doctor freaked and almost took me off TRT!!! Give DAA a try and then re-test and see where you stand.
    WOW! that is amazing. Are you sure it was 100% the DAA you didn't try anything different ... get your blood drawn straight after a shot or something? ... Which brand did you use?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Presa View Post
    I just started taking the recommended dose, 3Grams prior to workout. Now, my estradiol was slightly elevated bur my doc says that was expected with test so high. However, I have had zero side effects or any gyno type issues. In fact, now I would have to recommend adding DAA before upping test dosage. Either way, you're still safe.
    It would make sense if your LH was low and DAA raised it. But otherwise... I dunno. Maybe it's awesome.
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    I'm on DAA now. Taken it 6 days straight. Today was the first day I really noticed something. Maybe it's all in my head, but I feel like I've de-aged a decade. Libido up, energy up, focus up... I will get new blood work done after 30 days on it and I'll update this thread. Then we'll see what DAA is up to...
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctrlaltdel View Post
    I'm on DAA now. Taken it 6 days straight. Today was the first day I really noticed something. Maybe it's all in my head, but I feel like I've de-aged a decade. Libido up, energy up, focus up... I will get new blood work done after 30 days on it and I'll update this thread. Then we'll see what DAA is up to...
    Good call. I am thinking the same I might spreed my shots out to be exact the same time apart and get blood drawn at the same time after each shot DAA first no DAA the second time! If I can get my Dr on board. I am a bit of a skeptic like most 35+ people that have been in the game and call most supps out as BS, Hype and placebo so only bloods will convince me! DAA is getting me interested and for only a few $$$ I can find out for sure.
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    Just tested my hormone levels again today. Interesting results...

    E2: 48 pg/mL - Range <56 - Prev. Result: 38.2 (01.14.11)
    LH: 6.5 U/L - Range 1.4 - 7.7 - Prev. Result: 6.6 (01.14.11)
    FSH: 19.7 U/L - Range: 1.5 - 14 - Prev. Result: 16.9 (01.14.11)

    Prolactin: 105 mU/L - Range 53 - 360 - Prev. Result: 118 (01.14.11)
    Testosterone: 3.00 ng/mL - Range: 2.70 - 15.00 - Prev. Result: 4.40 (01.14.11)
    SHBG: 51 nmol/L - Range: 13 - 71 - Prev. Result: 40 (01.14.11)

    Free Androgen Index: 20.41 tabula - Range: 14.8 - 95.0

    Blue I marked. Red the lab marked.

    I've been taking DAA @3 grams a day for 16 days and ZMA for 11 days.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctrlaltdel View Post
    I'm on DAA now. Taken it 6 days straight. Today was the first day I really noticed something. Maybe it's all in my head, but I feel like I've de-aged a decade. Libido up, energy up, focus up... I will get new blood work done after 30 days on it and I'll update this thread. Then we'll see what DAA is up to...
    In a clincal setting DAA at 3 grams a day has increased T levels with people that are secondary from 200 to up to upper 600 TT.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    In a clincal setting DAA at 3 grams a day has increased T levels with people that are secondary from 200 to up to upper 600 TT.
    I found out today I'm infertile. Sperm count = 5. Not 5 million. FIVE. It also looks like I probably have a testicular varicocele and likely prostatitus (sperm WBC 8 times what it should be).

    Great day...
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    so it looks like after 2 weeks of the DAA and zinc you dropped test levels by 1/3 and increased e2 by a noticeable amount. I actually saw a similar drop in total testosterone on DAA though I did feel a little better and had morning wood a few times which has not happened in 15 years.
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    Quote Originally Posted by v4lu3s View Post
    so it looks like after 2 weeks of the DAA and zinc you dropped test levels by 1/3 and increased e2 by a noticeable amount. I actually saw a similar drop in total testosterone on DAA though I did feel a little better and had morning wood a few times which has not happened in 15 years.
    Optimal estrogen levels are required for proper sexual functioning. With lowered T levels, people often will have lower E levels just because there is less to aromatise.

    To the OP... you could always try some toco-8. It sensitizes the testes to LH, which you seem to have a sufficient amount of. It takes time, though, for the testes to respond to LH so you may want to wait a week or two before making another purchase/verdict.
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    I forgot to ask, and missed this either way last time I looked at the OP.

    My last cycle of anything was a short cycle of pro-hormones back in 2004.
    What was the cycle exactly, the PCT, length, etc. And did you start feeling low-test after running this ph?
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigBlackGuy View Post
    I forgot to ask, and missed this either way last time I looked at the OP.

    What was the cycle exactly, the PCT, length, etc. And did you start feeling low-test after running this ph?
    A week and a half or 2 weeks. Superdrol. I stopped because my blood pressure went way up and was scared of gyno. I did PCT. Nolva and a couple things to get natural test working again. I forget what they were. I felt fine afterwards.

    It seems I probably have a quite bad varicocele on both sides. I went to a urologist yesterday and he said my testicles are half the normal size. They have always been roughly this size my whole life. It looks like my testicles have never functioned properly. Getting a ultrasound in a week.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctrlaltdel View Post
    A week and a half or 2 weeks. Superdrol. I stopped because my blood pressure went way up and was scared of gyno. I did PCT. Nolva and a couple things to get natural test working again. I forget what they were. I felt fine afterwards.

    It seems I probably have a quite bad varicocele on both sides. I went to a urologist yesterday and he said my testicles are half the normal size. They have always been roughly this size my whole life. It looks like my testicles have never functioned properly. Getting a ultrasound in a week.
    Good luck man hang in there!
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    DAA kicked my test and free test up from 1100 to over 1600. My doctor threatened to take me off TRT. He had to read about DAA before deciding to keep me on Testim AND DAA!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctrlaltdel View Post
    LH: 6.6 U/L - Range: 1.5 - 7.7
    FSH: 16.9 U/L - Range: 1.5 - 14
    Testosterone: 4.40 ng/mL - Range: 2.70 - 15.00
    SHBG: - 40 nmol/L Range: 13 - 71

    Prolactin: 118 mU/L Range: 53-360
    Estradiol: 38.2 pg/mL Range: <56

    Growth Hormone: - 0.14 ng/mL Range: 0.06 - 5.0

    Only my FSH levels were out of range, but my growth hormone looks quite low and based on the range the lab uses, my testosterone seems kind of low, no? The highish LH and lowish Test concerns me since my dad has had testicular failure and is on TRT.

    For what it's worth my Uric Acid was high, Chloride low, HDL slightly low, HC03 a bit high and Insulin levels low (but glucose levels are perfect).

    I'm 32 and in pretty good shape (not overweight at all).

    My last cycle of anything was a short cycle of pro-hormones back in 2004.

    I'm seriously thinking about starting Monday @3grams of DAA per day for a month and getting everything tested again at that point. Any advice or thoughts on my results that you guys could offer are greatly appreciated.
    Where do you go to get all of these readings? I am new to this and not only curious, but I think it is necessary in order to target my weaknesses to achieve optimum health and strength. Thanks for your reply.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ocoeeman1 View Post
    Where do you go to get all of these readings? I am new to this and not only curious, but I think it is necessary in order to target my weaknesses to achieve optimum health and strength. Thanks for your reply.
    An overseas lab where they are cheap to get done Are you in the US?
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    I just got the results of my Zinc test back. I am deficient in zinc also.

    Zinc 60µg/dL (70-120)
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    Hmmm. Maybe get DHEA/cortisol checked for adrenal fatigue... but that's a far out chance if you don't have the side effects of adrenal fatigue.
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    His Estradiol is not all that bad for his SHBG and Estradiol of 10 is way to low for any man. The higher the SHBG the higher ones Estradiol can be. The best range of Estraidol is 20 pg/ml best way to tell if our Estraidol is in the sweet spot is by checking "These involuntary nocturnal erections that appear during REM (Rapid Eye Movement) sleep" if you don't have them and you can't get it up for sex your Estradiol is to high or if your on an AI to low.

    The lower your SHBG the lower you can keep your Estradiol my SHBG is 20 I keep my Estradiol at 15 to 20 but going down to 10 is to low.

    With this high FSH levels you need to be checked out by an Uro. Both your Prostate and your Testis some thing is not working right.

    If you are told to go on TRT first figure out why your low TRT is for life. In most men if you find out what is wrong and fix it your levels can come back up.

    If you need to go on TRT have your sperm tested if it's good and you want kids later have some frozen for a back up.
    Quote Originally Posted by BigBlackGuy View Post
    Could be thyroid or prolactin, among other things. You want estradiol lower than that. around 10 pg/ml is a good range for men.

    Outside of that, I wonder what others will have to say.

    Could also be cortisol issues.

    DAA probably won't help as much as you think. IMO, try Erase or Sustain alpha. Bring estrogens down a bit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmgamer18 View Post
    With this high FSH levels you need to be checked out by an Uro. Both your Prostate and your Testis some thing is not working right.

    If you are told to go on TRT first figure out why your low TRT is for life. In most men if you find out what is wrong and fix it your levels can come back up.

    If you need to go on TRT have your sperm tested if it's good and you want kids later have some frozen for a back up.
    I have had a SA done (2 actually) and I'm infertile. Just a handful of sperm were found and only after using a centrifuge. The WBC of my sperm were also way way too high to the tune of ~6 to 8 times above the maximum for normal.

    I do not have prostatitis and I do not appear to have any inflammation in either epididymis.

    A urinalysis turned up nothing atypical.

    A semen culture turned up staph so I'm on antibiotics now.

    I found out I'm deficient in zinc so I'm taking ~40mg a day (ZMA x 4 pills per day).

    It is now confirmed, by ultrasound, that I have at least a level 1 varicocele on the left side. Getting another scan done next week to check both sides.

    I've switched to wearing briefs at least every other day or more. Used to wear only boxers. This seems to help with varicocele pain.

    I've never had a problem with ED or libido, but I can definitely say that the last few days libido is way up and "morning wood" (and "nocturnal" wood) is also way... up. Feels a bit like being a teenager again. It also seems to me that my testicles are increasing in size. My significant other commented on this as well without me even mentioning it to her. I also seem to need to shave more frequently. Now in 3 days I'm getting more facial hair growth than I would normally get in a week or so. I'm also noticing back hair in places I never saw back hair before.

    So, what is causing the improvement? Adequate zinc? Briefs not aggravating my varicocele? A few days of antibiotics? Is it psychosomatic? All of the above? I have no idea... I'm going to check hormone levels again soon and in several weeks I'll do another SA. We'll see what turns up...
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    I would say antibiotics if you had an infection it can mess up the body big time. I pray this keeps getting better for you.

    I have been on TRT over 30 yrs it's not fun.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmgamer18 View Post
    I would say antibiotics if you had an infection it can mess up the body big time. I pray this keeps getting better for you.

    I have been on TRT over 30 yrs it's not fun.
    Thank you. I really hope so as well. I really hope to avoid TRT.
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