Is HCG a good addition to TRT? (Labs included)

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    Is HCG a good addition to TRT? (Labs included)


    My doctor started me on Androgel 2 weeks ago. I asked about HCG because my brother suffers from low-t also and he takes HCG with his test and feels wonderful. My doctor said he would have to read up on it. Is HCG a good thing?


    Quest Diagnostics

    Dihydrotestosterone........<6. ....L......25-75 ng/dL
    Testosterone, Total.........66.....L....250-1100 ng/dL
    Testosterone, Free..........21.4...L......46-224 ng/dl
    Testosterone, Bio............42.1...L.....11 0-575 ng/dL
    SHBG was..........6......Low....... 9-45 nmol/L
    Albumin, Serum.......................4. 3...............3.6-5.1 g/dL

    FSH........................... .....3.5...........1.6-8 mIU/mL
    LH............................ ......4.1...........1.5-9.3 mIU/mL
    Prolactin..................... ....11.0..........2.0-18.0 ng/mL
    IGF-I............................1 22............86-220 ng/mL
    IGFBP 3............................4 .6...........3.3-6.7 mg/L

    There's more......I'm not sure what else is needed. Thanks!!!!

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    Get your estradiol (E2) tested also. If high, it may be suppressing production of testosterone. Wow, your total T is super low. Get E2 under control, then retest testosterone. If still low, get your doc to give you HCG. If that doesn't help, then you'll need T supplementation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by THOR65 View Post
    My doctor started me on Androgel 2 weeks ago. I asked about HCG because my brother suffers from low-t also and he takes HCG with his test and feels wonderful. My doctor said he would have to read up on it. Is HCG a good thing?


    Quest Diagnostics

    Dihydrotestosterone........<6. ....L......25-75 ng/dL
    Testosterone, Total.........66.....L....250-1100 ng/dL
    Testosterone, Free..........21.4...L......46-224 ng/dl
    Testosterone, Bio............42.1...L.....11 0-575 ng/dL
    SHBG was..........6......Low....... 9-45 nmol/L
    Albumin, Serum.......................4. 3...............3.6-5.1 g/dL


    FSH........................... .....3.5...........1.6-8 mIU/mL
    LH............................ ......4.1...........1.5-9.3 mIU/mL
    Prolactin..................... ....11.0..........2.0-18.0 ng/mL
    IGF-I............................1 22............86-220 ng/mL
    IGFBP 3............................4 .6...........3.3-6.7 mg/L

    There's more......I'm not sure what else is needed. Thanks!!!!
    Post everything.
    Very often there is much more than just low T.

    I have to tell two items, three, four.

    1-your pituitary is not getting excited by your low TT.
    Get pituitary MRI

    2- Your SHBG is very low, usually metabolic problems,
    check glucose/insulin, HbA1c
    If any of those is high, stop eating high GI and mid GI foods

    3-I would prefer if you started with
    HCG-shot=125iu
    T-shot=15units=30mg=105mg/week
    do both of those shots every day
    after 2-3 months do blood test


    4-buy HCG over internet, buy it right now, buy HUCOG-2000iu from..
    You do not want anything more than 2000iu package due to shelf lfe after reconstituting.
    You can buy HCG right away.
    Eventually your doc will catch up and give you script for HCG.
    You do not want HCG from local pharmacy.
    They have only 10000iu packages.
    But, you want your doctor to know that you are using HCG.
    He needs to know everything that you are doing

    5- you really do not want to fool around or baby your self.
    You have to man up.
    Do both of those shots every day

    6-use only these needles for all your shots needs and for mixing HCG
    BD Ultrafine II U-100 Insulin Syringe 31 Gauge 3/10cc 5/16inch Short Needle


    ...
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    Great advice! Went through this a while back. My doctor was not very good and medical wouldn't cover hcg. I was on Androgel for a long time and low testasterone symptoms didn't completely go away until I started treating myself. I had an MRI and tons of blood work. My doctor was against Test injections and after getting nipple sensitivity from the gel, nothing was prescribed to prevent gyno or high levels of estrogen. Now I feel great!
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    Quote Originally Posted by omni View Post
    Great advice! Went through this a while back. My doctor was not very good and medical wouldn't cover hcg. I was on Androgel for a long time and low testasterone symptoms didn't completely go away until I started treating myself. I had an MRI and tons of blood work. My doctor was against Test injections and after getting nipple sensitivity from the gel, nothing was prescribed to prevent gyno or high levels of estrogen. Now I feel great!
    you need to tell insurance that hcg is needed for fertility, which it is, If you tell them that they should pay for it. HCG for low T they will never pay for. This is important, its getting expensive,
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    Thanks, JanSz

    I screwed up on entering my labs. My SHBG was..........6......Low....... 9-45 nmol/L
    The other number was Albumin, Serum.......................4. 3...............3.6-5.1 g/dL

    Sorry about that!!! Do you still recommended the shots over transdermal. I thought I read somewhere that the transdermal acts more like a younger man's test where inj. test acts more like an older man???? I'm a novice at all this, as I'm sure you can tell. I truly appreciate all your help!!!
    Also, My Estradiol, Ultrasensitive is still pending.
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    Thanks Spinn, I'll try that!
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    Quote Originally Posted by THOR65 View Post
    Thanks, JanSz

    I screwed up on entering my labs. My SHBG was..........6......Low....... 9-45 nmol/L
    The other number was Albumin, Serum.......................4. 3...............3.6-5.1 g/dL

    Sorry about that!!! Do you still recommended the shots over transdermal. I thought I read somewhere that the transdermal acts more like a younger man's test where inj. test acts more like an older man???? I'm a novice at all this, as I'm sure you can tell. I truly appreciate all your help!!!
    Also, My Estradiol, Ultrasensitive is still pending.
    I have edited my above post.

    You have said that you have more tests, where are they.

    Post everything you have done in last 5 years.

    Describe you problems.
    Describe your lifestyle.

    ..
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    Quote Originally Posted by JanSz View Post
    I have edited my above post.

    You have said that you have more tests, where are they.

    Post everything you have done in last 5 years.

    Describe you problems.
    Describe your lifestyle.

    ..
    Thanks JanSz!

    I'm 44yr. old former boxer, linebacker and weightlifter who has been in and out of shape for the past 20years. I was in a horrific car accident 11years ago and I've struggled with exercise ever since. I've had all the classic symptoms: erectile dysfunction and decreased libido, feeling lousy, fogginess, difficulty concentrating, anxiety, depression, and increased weight (fat) gain. About 10years ago, at age 34, my female internal medicine doctor told me my total test was around 260 which in her mind was not low enough to treat, so she put me on a diet, gave me anti-depressants, and a prescription for viagra. I switched doctors. The next doctor started giving my test shots every two months (how much and what kind, I don't remember). I felt good for about a week and then crash! Then he put me on methlytest which I found out was not good for low test. He then prescribed HGH because my IGF-1 was low. I decided not to get it filled (actually my wallet decided) and I went to an endocrinologist (another female, big mistake). A special test to check IGF-1 came back normal and she put me on androgel for low t. I ran out of androgel about a month ago and had to get labs again before she would refill it. I decided to get the labs done and go to another doctor. This doctor(male) seems receptive, however, he said he has to check into HCG before he will prescribe it. I'm 5'10", 300lbs. and wanting desperately to get back into shape, for my wife, my children (especially my very active 8yr. old son) and myself!!!

    Two Pituitary MRI's in the last seven years, last one several years ago, were both fine. Other blood work as follows:

    Comprehensive Metabolic Panel w/ EGFR Glucose........84.......65-99 mg/dL

    Thyroid Panel T3 uptake...............35....... .......22-35%
    ...................T4 (Thyroxine)Total..7.8......... ...4.5-12.5 mcg/dL
    Free T4 Index (T7)......................2.7. ...........1.4-3.8

    Cortisol, A.M........................... ....20.1 mcg/dL

    PSA, Total......................... .......0.1.................... < or = 4.0 ng/mL
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    Quote Originally Posted by spinn View Post
    you need to tell insurance that hcg is needed for fertility, which it is, If you tell them that they should pay for it. HCG for low T they will never pay for. This is important, its getting expensive,
    Fertility wasn't covered. Had blue shield and told the doctor I wanted off the gel to get my girl pregnant.
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    Quote Originally Posted by THOR65 View Post
    ...told me my total test was around 260

    It sounds like you're not on the right dose. If your free test was 260 without any TRT and now it's even lower then you are being suppressed but not getting enough externally to make up for it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by THOR65 View Post
    Thanks JanSz!

    I'm 44yr. old former boxer, linebacker and weightlifter who has been in and out of shape for the past 20years. I was in a horrific car accident 11years ago and I've struggled with exercise ever since. I've had all the classic symptoms: erectile dysfunction and decreased libido, feeling lousy, fogginess, difficulty concentrating, anxiety, depression, and increased weight (fat) gain. About 10years ago, at age 34, my female internal medicine doctor told me my total test was around 260 which in her mind was not low enough to treat, so she put me on a diet, gave me anti-depressants, and a prescription for viagra. I switched doctors. The next doctor started giving my test shots every two months (how much and what kind, I don't remember). I felt good for about a week and then crash! Then he put me on methlytest which I found out was not good for low test. He then prescribed HGH because my IGF-1 was low. I decided not to get it filled (actually my wallet decided) and I went to an endocrinologist (another female, big mistake). A special test to check IGF-1 came back normal and she put me on androgel for low t. I ran out of androgel about a month ago and had to get labs again before she would refill it. I decided to get the labs done and go to another doctor. This doctor(male) seems receptive, however, he said he has to check into HCG before he will prescribe it. I'm 5'10", 300lbs. and wanting desperately to get back into shape, for my wife, my children (especially my very active 8yr. old son) and myself!!!

    Two Pituitary MRI's in the last seven years, last one several years ago, were both fine. Other blood work as follows:

    Comprehensive Metabolic Panel w/ EGFR Glucose........84.......65-99 mg/dL

    Thyroid Panel T3 uptake...............35....... .......22-35%
    ...................T4 (Thyroxine)Total..7.8......... ...4.5-12.5 mcg/dL
    Free T4 Index (T7)......................2.7. ...........1.4-3.8

    Cortisol, A.M........................... ....20.1 mcg/dL

    PSA, Total......................... .......0.1.................... < or = 4.0 ng/mL
    Plan for your TRT is laid out in post #3
    -------------------------
    adrenals/thyroid
    insulin/glucose/metabolism

    --------------------
    Lets compare to top shape Arnold 6', 260#, waist 33"
    You at 5'11" and same shape are allowed 250#
    not 300#

    First step, you have to loose (most likely) 100#

    To get there you have to eat:
    1-2pounds a day of
    fat, fatty meats, fatty fish, chicken, turkey, eggs (use only steam to heat)
    and as much as you like green vegetables
    drink only tap water and juice from (above) green vegetables
    add large variety of spices to this green juice

    Omega-8005 masticating juicer

    you have to practically eliminate all carbohydrates that have high or medium GI

    Just because some guys are going all the way, I have to say this,
    make sure that you do not loose weight too quick.

    4-5# a week or about 2% of body weight per week, should not stress the liver (or make it into fatty liver).
    If loosing too fast, eat a little of potatoes or pasta.

    ---------------------
    All above assumes that you stop all supplements that you currently use.
    You put in your mouth only what is written above, plus good (plain) beer, barley and hopes, nor other additives.
    If you could get home made vine (no additives)
    --------------------

    To figure out what supplementation you need do these tests:

    Spectracell-5000(all available micronutrients and lipids)

    Essential & Metabolic Fatty Acids Analysis (EMFA) (Genova Diagnostics)

    Then you will eat recomended supplements.

    Note: Spectracel measures what is going on in lymphocytes.
    Life span of lymphocytes is about 4-6 months.

    It does not make sense to repeat this test more than 2x/year
    Results from first test may not indicate your best long term strategy because of lots of changes to
    body composition
    diet
    supplements variation

    http://spectracell.com/product-specs/
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Your health should improve on all above and you may want to give it a time to work its way thru your system.


    But you still may have number of problems.

    To get a picture of balance of your health more analysis is need.

    Hair Analysis
    and
    Adrenocortex Stress Profile
    at Genova

    Blood test per list below.
    List is made for Quest Diagnostics, if you cant use Quest, I will give you other list.
    List cost $3500
    If you do not have insurance and have to pay cash, I will give you still another list that does not require insurance or script from doctor,
    But you have to pay cash.
    But you do not need doctor.
    Your choice.

    ============================== ==========
    1 --------- Comprehensive Metabolic Panel w/EGFR
    2 --------- CBC w/ diff/PLT
    3 --------- VAP TM Cholesterol Test (10270X)
    4 --------- Selenium, Whole Blood (4875W)
    5 --------- Copper, serum
    6 --------- Zinc
    7 --------- Magnesium, Serum (622X)
    8 --------- C-Reactive Protein (CRP), Highly Sensitive, CSF - (17401X)
    9 --------- Fibrinogen
    10 --------- Homocysteine, cardio
    11 --------- Lipoprotein (A) Lp(A)
    12 --------- Iron and Iron Binding Capacity (7573X) - (356N)
    13 --------- Iron, Total (571X) - (24984P)
    14 --------- Ferritin (457X) - (22764P)
    15 --------- Transferrin (891X) - (30346P)
    16 --------- Folate, RBC & Hematocrit - (1768N)
    17 --------- Hemoglobin A1c (496X) - (45484P)
    18 --------- Hemoglobin, Plasma (514X) - (7211P)
    19 --------- VITAMIN A, E, B3, B12
    20 --------- Vitamin D, 25-Hydroxy, LC/MS/MS - (17306X)
    21 --------- T3, Total (859X)
    22 --------- T4, Total (Thyroxine)
    23 --------- T3, Free
    24 --------- T4,Free
    25 --------- T3, Reverse (967X)
    26 --------- Ultrasensitive TSH
    27 --------- Thyroid Peroxidase and Thyroglobulin Antibodies (7260X)
    28 --------- Insulin, serum
    29 --------- IGF Binding protein-3
    30 --------- IGF-1
    31 --------- DHEA Sulfate 402X
    32 --------- Aldosterone
    33 --------- Renin Activity, Plasma
    34 --------- ACTH, Plasma
    35 --------- Cortisol Binding Globulin (Transcortin) (37371X)
    36 --------- 8AM/4PM/10PM---Cortisol, Free and Total, LC/MS/MS (37077X)
    37 --------- Prolactin - (746X)
    38 --------- Progesterone, LC/MS/MS 17183X
    39 --------- Pregnenolone, LC/MS/MS (31493X) 28373P
    40 --------- Androstenedione, LC/MS/MS - (17182X)
    41 --------- Estradiol [4021X](13- 54 pg/mL)
    42 --------- Estrogens, Fractionated, LC/MS/MS (36742X)
    43 --------- Testosterone, Free, Bio/Total (LC/MS/MS) Code: 14966X
    44 --------- Dihydrotestosterone
    45 --------- 3a-Androstanediol Glucuronide
    46 --------- Ceruloplasmin (326X)
    47 --------- Coenzyme Q10 (198268)
    48 ---------
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    244.9 ----- 257.2 ----- 780.79
    250.00 ----- 272.4 ----- 788.41
    250.01 ----- 601.9 ----- 253.3
    255.4 ----- 780.4 ----- 255.8
    783.9 -----
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    To talk to Quest 1-800-631-1390 ,, press zero few times to get to physical person
    //////////




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