HCG and Trt the benefeits??....

[redbishop123]

So basically I'm just asking if you take Hcg from the beginning does it negate the side effects of the Trt??...So bascically you could stop at anytime with no real shutdown or is just so the testes don't shrink up??

 

[rick055]

So basically I'm just asking if you take Hcg from the beginning does it negate the side effects of the Trt??...So bascically you could stop at anytime with no real shutdown or is just so the testes don't shrink up??

Any time you introduce exogenous T (or even HCG), you would still expect to induce HPT suppression.

Supplementing TRT with HCG (or, in a sense LHRT - leutinizing hormone replacement therapy) will mean that your testes will still receive a mimic of the LH signal that would otherwise be disrupted with TRT.

This simply means that if you were to stop TRT, your would expect your boys to still be functioning at their baseline level.

 

[JanSz]

Any time you introduce exogenous T (or even HCG), you would still expect to induce HPT suppression.

Supplementing TRT with HCG (or, in a sense LHRT - leutinizing hormone replacement therapy) will mean that your testes will still receive a mimic of the LH signal that would otherwise be disrupted with TRT.

This simply means that if you were to stop TRT, your would expect your boys to still be functioning at their baseline level.

That assumes that LH & FSH would come back to pre-TRT levels.

Eric (PrimordialPerformance)
have on his web site some discussion on how to raise the TRT one level up.
========================================================
U-opiod antagonists to prevent HPTA suppression, and pituitary atrophy
========================================================


http://muscle chatroom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2603

 

[NewAtThis10]

Could a HRT recipient take HCG in cycles, say one month on one month off? That would get his testes 'back in the game' from time to time, but would save you a lot of injections (and money, if insurance isn't covering it).

 

[JanSz]

Could a HRT recipient take HCG in cycles, say one month on one month off? That would get his testes 'back in the game' from time to time, but would save you a lot of injections (and money, if insurance isn't covering it).

Contact
Eric (PrimordialPerformance)
he is familiar with normal TRT and steroids
I am not.
I am interested in TRT only, that is what I have to do for my own health.
.
.

 

[Gutterpump]

He didn't mean taking cycles of steroids, he meant cycling the hcg itself to save money.

NewAtThis10 - you could do this but you will not feel good in your off months. Your LH will be supressed and your test will be low. I wouldn't advise it. It normally takes one or two months to feel the overall benefits from HCG, and you would be on a constant rollercoaster, never really receiving the full benefit. HCG is also pretty cheap on it's own.

If you were only taking HCG in addition to test, this could work, but honestly it's so cheap to have hcg prescribed. Also, it normally takes a good two months to fire up the testes properly again once they've been shutdown such as with test without hcg.

 

[Gutterpump]

Btw, if you are on TRT, or full blown HRT (thyroid, test, GH therapy) then why would you worry about pituitary atrophy?

 

[colkurtz_spf]

He didn't mean taking cycles of steroids, he meant cycling the hcg itself to save money.

NewAtThis10 - you could do this but you will not feel good in your off months. Your LH will be supressed and your test will be low. I wouldn't advise it. It normally takes one or two months to feel the overall benefits from HCG, and you would be on a constant rollercoaster, never really receiving the full benefit. HCG is also pretty cheap on it's own.

If you were only taking HCG in addition to test, this could work, but honestly it's so cheap to have hcg prescribed. Also, it normally takes a good two months to fire up the testes properly again once they've been shutdown such as with test without hcg.

I don't think it should take more than two weeks to feel the effects of HCG, and in my opinion there's no need to take a break. If he plans to anyway he should gradually reduce the dose to avoid crash. That's how I handled it when I stopped for 8 months. I wouldn't do that again. I wanted to see where my baseline numbers would be, and found they returned to my levels prior to any kind of HRT. I was also curious to see if my sensitivity would be there when I resumed. I did very high doses for close to a year and was somewhat worried by the posts on this thread claiming I would experience Leydig burn out. The fact is that I successfully resumed therapy on much smaller doses.

 

[Gutterpump]

If you are shut down, you will feel effects of T from hcg sure, but you will not regain full function so quickly. I think it could take some time for the 'boys' to regain their size again.

How long after stopping HCG would you say that your levels start to crash? Within 3-4 days? Something I've been curious about.

 

[colkurtz_spf]

If you are shut down, you will feel effects of T from hcg sure, but you will not regain full function so quickly. I think it could take some time for the 'boys' to regain their size again.

How long after stopping HCG would you say that your levels start to crash? Within 3-4 days? Something I've been curious about.

Four years ago I spent a year on T therapy alone and was severely shut down. At my new doctor's request I dosed 5000 IUs of HCG twice per week for a total of six weeks, and then took three weeks off. I crashed badly the end of the third week when I had my exam. My TT dropped to 97. I was tired and incoherent. My doctor gave me a T booster to help me out and put me back on high dose HCG.

A year later I took a long break. At that time I didn't crash because I gradually reduced the dose and frequency. If you're shut down from T it could take some time to regain size and function. If you have been using both T and HCG it should not take long at all. If you have been on no previous therapy then HCG should kick in almost immediately. Of course this has been my experience and everyone is different.

 

[Gutterpump]

That assumes that LH & FSH would come back to pre-TRT levels.

Eric (PrimordialPerformance)
have on his web site some discussion on how to raise the TRT one level up.
========================================================
U-opiod antagonists to prevent HPTA suppression, and pituitary atrophy
========================================================


http://muscle chatroom.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2603

For HRT patients, if concerned with pituitary atrophy (although I don't know what the concern is fully, HRT is for life), wouldn't the use of GnRH and GHRP-6 keep the pituitary very active, forcing it to secrete LH/FSH/GH. I think this combo could even be more superior than hCG + sermorelin alone as a means of HRT. Increasing LH + FSH would be more favorable than LH alone.

 

[MetalMX]

What about those of us with extremely poor estrogen detoxification issues?

And who are unable to use arimidex (due to it weakening the immune system and not being helpful to the bones in my case) to control their E levels?

My options are slim to nil at present.

 

[Gutterpump]

Pretty interested in learning more about GnRH

http://www.webmd.com/infertility-and-reproduction/gonadotropin-releasing-hormone-gnrh-for-infertility

I really like the idea of 1 drug that stimulates the pituitary release of LH + FSH instead of shutting it down

 

[Gutterpump]

What about those of us with extremely poor estrogen detoxification issues?

And who are unable to use arimidex (due to it weakening the immune system and not being helpful to the bones in my case) to control their E levels?

My options are slim to nil at present.

The Matrix recommended one to me before... it was some type of herb I think, acts as an adaptogen with estrogen. I think he was trying some people out on it with good results.

If you have a serious problem with estrogen, you could do small daily shots of hcg, or use gels for TRT.