25 Year Old Male - Low T - Need Help

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    Exclamation 25 Year Old Male - Low T - Need Help


    So, I recently had my T levels tested because my older brother (who is 30) had his levels tested and he was around 190 ng/dL (ref range 250 - 1100). We have a lot of the same issues (extremely low libido, lack of energey, anxiety, depression, etc) - so I decided to get mine checked.

    My original results were as follows:

    DHT - 9 ng/dL (ref range: 25-75) <--had this checked bc I was on propecia for a couple years, JUST got off it
    Test Total - 211 ng/dL (ref range: 250 - 1100)
    % Free - 2.06 (Ref range: 1.5 - 2.2)
    Test Free - 43.4 (Ref Range: 35 - 155)
    DHEA - 356 (Ref Range: 110-510)
    FSH - 1.3 (Ref Range: 1.6-8.0)
    LH - 4.1 (Ref Range: 1.5-9.3)
    Estradiol - 24 (Reg Range: 13-54)
    ---Lab was Quest Diagnostics

    I talked with my GP, who was trying to be really helpful, and she put me on 5mg daily test patch. I wore the patch for a month, then was tested again.


    Same lab (Quest) with the same Ref Ranges as above.
    New Levels

    DHT - 19 (this was after being off propecia for several months at this point)
    Test Total - 235 ng/dL
    % Free T - 2.55
    Test, Free - 59.9
    DHEA - 321
    FSH - 0.8
    LH - 2.0
    Estradiol - 26

    Overall, it BARELY bumped my T, % Free, and Test Free up. Had no discernable affect on DHEA, and lowered my FSH and LH (as expected).

    SO - at this point she recommended I go see an Endo. I went to an Endo, gave him my lab results. He said that he didn't believe the results and needed to do the tests again using HIS lab (even though he admitted Quest is great lab), AND told me that my lack of libido was really just a strong conscience. At that point, I decided I would not be seeing him again.

    Also, I do want to add that my brother has been seeing an anti-aging specialicist, since his visit with HIS endo went about as well as mine. The AA-specialist has him on a DHT-based test cream, plus doing some herbel stuff. In a month's time, my brother's total T went from 190 to 635. Cream seems to be working for him. I likely will end up following the same route.

    ----------------------------

    OK, so from all of this, I do have some thoughts and questions.

    1. I want to get this issue resolved, but I also want to understand why my levels are so low. I realize there are likely 1000s of possibilities, but does anyone have any thoughts?

    2. I'm worried about going on compounded cream with DHT b/c I'm already losing my hair (that's why I was on propecia), and I know the cream will shoot my DHT levels up. I have been reading about HCG, and seligiline as possible alternatives for raising T levels, especially if you are young. Thoughts?

    3. I live in LA and I'm trying to find a doctor out here that can help me, and it would be even better if I could find someone who actually takes insurance (all these anti-aging folks seem to be cash only!). Anyone out here in LA have any recs? You can send me a private message if that's a more appropriate place to suggest that info.

    Overall, I'm looking for a little more understanding of WHY this is occuring, some thoughts on possible treatment option, some recs for possible doctors in LA, and maybe even some empathy - cuz this sucks.

    Thanks Guys.

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    One other thing..


    Oh yeah, I also had some basic bloodwork done. I've seen some mentions on here about connection with Cholesterol and T levels, etc. etc. I work out about three days a week, eat well, yet my levels were pretty high...

    Cholesterol: 209 mg/dL
    Triglycerides: 317 mg/dL (range 40-150)
    VLDL (Calc.): 63 mg/dL (range 0 -40)

    Yikes!
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippybing View Post
    So, I recently had my T levels tested because my older brother (who is 30) had his levels tested and he was around 190 ng/dL (ref range 250 - 1100). We have a lot of the same issues (extremely low libido, lack of energey, anxiety, depression, etc) - so I decided to get mine checked.

    My original results were as follows:

    DHT - 9 ng/dL (ref range: 25-75) <--had this checked bc I was on propecia for a couple years, JUST got off it
    Test Total - 211 ng/dL (ref range: 250 - 1100)
    % Free - 2.06 (Ref range: 1.5 - 2.2)
    Test Free - 43.4 (Ref Range: 35 - 155)
    DHEA - 356 (Ref Range: 110-510)
    FSH - 1.3 (Ref Range: 1.6-8.0)
    LH - 4.1 (Ref Range: 1.5-9.3)
    Estradiol - 24 (Reg Range: 13-54)
    ---Lab was Quest Diagnostics

    I talked with my GP, who was trying to be really helpful, and she put me on 5mg daily test patch. I wore the patch for a month, then was tested again.


    Same lab (Quest) with the same Ref Ranges as above.
    New Levels

    DHT - 19 (this was after being off propecia for several months at this point)
    Test Total - 235 ng/dL
    % Free T - 2.55
    Test, Free - 59.9
    DHEA - 321
    FSH - 0.8
    LH - 2.0
    Estradiol - 26

    Overall, it BARELY bumped my T, % Free, and Test Free up. Had no discernable affect on DHEA, and lowered my FSH and LH (as expected).

    SO - at this point she recommended I go see an Endo. I went to an Endo, gave him my lab results. He said that he didn't believe the results and needed to do the tests again using HIS lab (even though he admitted Quest is great lab), AND told me that my lack of libido was really just a strong conscience. At that point, I decided I would not be seeing him again.

    Also, I do want to add that my brother has been seeing an anti-aging specialicist, since his visit with HIS endo went about as well as mine. The AA-specialist has him on a DHT-based test cream, plus doing some herbel stuff. In a month's time, my brother's total T went from 190 to 635. Cream seems to be working for him. I likely will end up following the same route.

    ----------------------------

    OK, so from all of this, I do have some thoughts and questions.

    1. I want to get this issue resolved, but I also want to understand why my levels are so low. I realize there are likely 1000s of possibilities, but does anyone have any thoughts?

    2. I'm worried about going on compounded cream with DHT b/c I'm already losing my hair (that's why I was on propecia), and I know the cream will shoot my DHT levels up. I have been reading about HCG, and seligiline as possible alternatives for raising T levels, especially if you are young. Thoughts?

    3. I live in LA and I'm trying to find a doctor out here that can help me, and it would be even better if I could find someone who actually takes insurance (all these anti-aging folks seem to be cash only!). Anyone out here in LA have any recs? You can send me a private message if that's a more appropriate place to suggest that info.

    Overall, I'm looking for a little more understanding of WHY this is occuring, some thoughts on possible treatment option, some recs for possible doctors in LA, and maybe even some empathy - cuz this sucks.

    Thanks Guys.
    First of all, good idea to not go back to the endo. Sounds like a ****. If i were you i would go back to your GP and tell him your experience at the endo. Tell him you cannot afford nor want to go through much more bloodwork, and was wondering if he, your GP, could put you on TRT.

    I would mention your brother. I wouldnt mention him seeing an AA, but i would mention that he is on TRT. I also wouldnt go the same route as your brother. A DHT based cream sounds terrible.

    You need to find a doctor who is willing to get you on TRT injections, 100-200mg/week. If you were on propecia im guessing you have hair loss problems. A DHT cream would have you bald in no time.

    As far as why your levels are low, it could be MANY things. Could be genetics. Do you drink alcohol? What time of the day did you get your bloodwork done? Are you on any medication? Do you take any supplements, even herbal one?

    Do not go on any DHT cream. HCG may be an option for you, but TRT via testosterone injections work 100% and are the best bet. You may want to take propecia again.

    As far as finding a good doctor...you can do it yourself. DO NOT see an endo. You need to find a DO. A DO is a type of GP who is going to handle everything in their office, and not send you to an endo. How do you find a DO? Simple...took up all the family docotors, GP's in your area. Most will say "Dr. Firstname Lastname, M.D.". These guys will be sending you to an endo. You need to find one that says "Dr. Firstname Lastname, D.O.". Bring him all your bloodwork. Tell him about your brother. Tell him about your endo. He will see that youve already spend a lot of money and left a lot of doctors to see him. Try to find one who is young. Most old-timers are against TRT.

    Hope this helps, as I started TRT in my 20's as well from a genetic background of low T.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zippybing View Post
    Oh yeah, I also had some basic bloodwork done. I've seen some mentions on here about connection with Cholesterol and T levels, etc. etc. I work out about three days a week, eat well, yet my levels were pretty high...Cholesterol: 209 mg/dL Triglycerides: 317 mg/dL (range 40-150)VLDL (Calc.): 63 mg/dL (range 0 -40) Yikes!
    you may have fatty liver and probably if you ran a VAP you see the whole lipid picture. This is known as metabolic syndrome which can be remedy by proper lifestyles and nutritinal interevention which dr'sare total clueless about. I have several people I work with get this in check by few simple changes. If this does not get controlled then you are disposing your self to prediabetic state. Analysising the adrenals, thyroid is imperitive since lipids are highly linked. A good Dr would be Dr mariano he in san fran..
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    My suggestion is not to gor TRT yet. First you need to find why you have low Total T. All other levels are in range for you. So you donít need to worry much, Also since you are single you should not go for just T-shots or cream. Once you go for TRT you cannot stop it. Its for life long. You may be suffering from depression or some other factors are contributing for Total T, which doctors cannot find. Try alternative medicine like pranic Healing or Reiki or Accupuncture to increase Libido.
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkblue1 View Post
    My suggestion is not to gor TRT yet. First you need to find why you have low Total T. All other levels are in range for you. So you donít need to worry much, Also since you are single you should not go for just T-shots or cream. Once you go for TRT you cannot stop it. Its for life long. You may be suffering from depression or some other factors are contributing for Total T, which doctors cannot find. Try alternative medicine like pranic Healing or Reiki or Accupuncture to increase Libido.
    So you recommend him to live a life with low testosterone? Great advice. Because he is single he she be making certain medical decisions towards improving his health? More great advice. Once you start TRT you can stop it...but you are going to have the same testosterone levels as he does now. He is 25 with levels around 200, they can only get lower. People with low testosterone suffer from depression like symptoms. Alternative medicine would be stupid as well. All of your advice is terrible.
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkblue1 View Post
    My suggestion is not to gor TRT yet. First you need to find why you have low Total T. All other levels are in range for you. So you donít need to worry much, Also since you are single you should not go for just T-shots or cream. Once you go for TRT you cannot stop it. Its for life long. You may be suffering from depression or some other factors are contributing for Total T, which doctors cannot find. Try alternative medicine like pranic Healing or Reiki or Accupuncture to increase Libido.
    IF i examined your lifestyle we could probably pin point it back to an event with in 6 months of feeling this way. PTSD is very common cause of HPTA dysfucntion. Lifestyle, nutriitional intereventions would be my first place to look. From looking at just little information you presented it appears that insulin is running rampant which can cause your to lower your testotererone production indirectly. It appears that you have encountered a point in your life where you are in a stressed state and cortisol and insulin is running rampant. I personally would dump the T patch since it is the weakest form of TRT and look to the root cause. IMO its lifestyle, nutrittional inteventions, insulin, adrenal, probably thyroid as prime cause.
    I am not a medical Dr, please keep in mind that this answer is for information purposes only, and is not intended to diagnose, treat or replace sound medical advice from your physician or health care provider.
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    If you want to go on TRT then find a DO or dr. mariano and bring all of your labwork. Explain your situation.

    If you are having a lot of depression issues and **** like that they are going to tell you TRT is no for you, even though getting your test in range can help this...messing with hormones is about the last thing they do. If you have lack of energy libido and motivation, though, TRT will be the first with your low T levels. As soon as you say the word depression the tables turn.
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    Listen to Matrix, Before going to TRT, find the root cause
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    Quote Originally Posted by darkblue1 View Post
    Listen to Matrix, Before going to TRT, find the root cause
    I also agree with that. Matrix knows his stuff. He is helping me out. I recommend to have a talk with him first before going on TRT which is for life. Dont give up. Try to find the cause.

    good luck
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Matrix View Post
    IMO its lifestyle, nutrittional inteventions, insulin, adrenal, probably thyroid as prime cause.
    stress can lower test
    belly fat can lower test - whats your body fat %
    do you do the following 4 exercises in the gym - deadlifts, squats, bench, clean and press
    do you get enough eggs in your diet (3 per day minimum)

    you're just under the low minimum, which might be fixable just by altering your lifestyle a bit, which is not only healthier, but the cheaper option. on a sidenote, i have a 20 year old friend on TRT, so not everything is this easy to do.

    EDIT: if your triglycerides are that high, and you are frequently urinating, getting tested for pre-diabetes and insulin resistance is something to consider - again, fixable with diet and exercise.

    please post your diet, body fat %, and your workout routine.
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