GHRP6 again.

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    GHRP6 again.


    Yea, got some on the way.
    Ideally how much BW woudl i add to keep the dosing simple and not land on "off" numbers at the .5?
    5mg vials.
    Ill be dosing at 200mcgs then going to 300mcgs if all goes well.
    Thanks. I ask cause this is the first time ill have to mix anything like this.

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    i would use 2.5ml of water that way is simplest, so if you draw out 10iu's it will be 200mcgs, 25iu's would be 500mcgs and so on
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanlambo View Post
    i would use 2.5ml of water that way is simplest, so if you draw out 10iu's it will be 200mcgs, 25iu's would be 500mcgs and so on
    Thats exactly what I do, and usually do 2 shots a day...sometimes 3. I do believe the best time to use it though is when you wake up in the middle of the night to piss. I keep a pin loaded in the bathroom everynight to hit up before i go back to sleep. If I was to only do 1 dose that would be the one, as blood sugar levels are low and will be more effective. Post workout is also another good time to pin it (with some igf-1 )
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    nice. Dont know that ill do the mid night deal, but ill try the PostWO for awhile since im bulking and then try before bed sometime. I would do both but I WO at night around 9 and then get home around 10:15-10:30, so I guess ill get best of both worlds.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TripDog View Post
    Thats exactly what I do, and usually do 2 shots a day...sometimes 3. I do believe the best time to use it though is when you wake up in the middle of the night to piss. I keep a pin loaded in the bathroom everynight to hit up before i go back to sleep. If I was to only do 1 dose that would be the one, as blood sugar levels are low and will be more effective. Post workout is also another good time to pin it (with some igf-1 )
    Damn trip I could never imagine pinning my self in the middle of the night when I am half asleep taking a whizz. I can barely hit the toilet let alone sticking myself with something lol, You are a talented man my friend.
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmiller383 View Post
    Damn trip I could never imagine pinning my self in the middle of the night when I am half asleep taking a whizz. I can barely hit the toilet let alone sticking myself with something lol, You are a talented man my friend.
    Well i dont pin WHILE im pissing, i do it after.
    The LORD is my rock, my fortress, and my savior; my God is my rock, in whom I find protection. He is my shield, the power that saves me, and my place of safety.-Psalm 18:2
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    lame pin question. Most dont alcohol swab on SubQ right?

    Also, as a side note, you can buy ready shoot 29g slin pins/syringes but you cant buy the pins....? so a 10pack of ready to goes is $2.50...what kind of crap is that? haha oh well.
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    always swab with etoh dude. please. lowers the risk of infection big time
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    Quote Originally Posted by ludacris007 View Post
    always swab with etoh dude. please. lowers the risk of infection big time
    yea, thats what i figured. Thanks.
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    yup
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    trip, it will be my first time with ghrp6 would 200mcg 2x a day be good? THis is pinned ed with low blood sugar levels?
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    Quote Originally Posted by pistonpump View Post
    trip, it will be my first time with ghrp6 would 200mcg 2x a day be good? THis is pinned ed with low blood sugar levels?
    Well I'm not Trip but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night. ...seriously now I have spent the last couple of weeks reading 100+ studies in full plus 100+ abstracts and assorted books on GHRH and analogs & Growth Hormone Secreatogues.

    The studies on GHRP-6 refer to a saturation dose as being 100mcg w/ 20mcg being the minimum to illicit a response.

    GHRP-6 is also an enhancer of slow wave sleep unlike Hexarelin...and it is during the first stage of slow wave sleep that the largest GH pulse of the day occurs in men.

    So it would be good to take a dose of GHRP-6 just prior to bedtime.

    Another good time to dose would be post-workout.

    I've been using GHRP-6 all by itself twice a day (bedtime & PWO) at 100mcg each time. This is enough to illicit a hunger response w/o it being too intense. I did try 200mcg doses and liked that as well...but my experiment calls for examining a minimal dose.

    I don't think you need to keep your blood sugar levels low.

    Your protocol looks fine PP.
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    Quote Originally Posted by datBtrue View Post
    Well I'm not Trip but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night. ...seriously now I have spent the last couple of weeks reading 100+ studies in full plus 100+ abstracts and assorted books on GHRH and analogs & Growth Hormone Secreatogues.

    The studies on GHRP-6 refer to a saturation dose as being 100mcg w/ 20mcg being the minimum to illicit a response.

    GHRP-6 is also an enhancer of slow wave sleep unlike Hexarelin...and it is during the first stage of slow wave sleep that the largest GH pulse of the day occurs in men.

    So it would be good to take a dose of GHRP-6 just prior to bedtime.

    Another good time to dose would be post-workout.

    I've been using GHRP-6 all by itself twice a day (bedtime & PWO) at 100mcg each time. This is enough to illicit a hunger response w/o it being too intense. I did try 200mcg doses and liked that as well...but my experiment calls for examining a minimal dose.

    I don't think you need to keep your blood sugar levels low.

    Your protocol looks fine PP.
    Good stuff DBT.

    BTW, if you have not come across this one (which I doubt since you are lean mean studyin' machine), this is a great 504 page e-book called:

    "Growth Hormone Secretagogues in Clinical Practice"

    http://books.google.com/books?id=DcO...ClNXQ80w&hl=en

    Page 369+ has great info on GHRH, GHRP, and SWS in the normal adult male, as related to your posting.

    Take Care
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    Quote Originally Posted by datBtrue View Post
    Well I'm not Trip but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night. ...seriously now I have spent the last couple of weeks reading 100+ studies in full plus 100+ abstracts and assorted books on GHRH and analogs & Growth Hormone Secreatogues.

    The studies on GHRP-6 refer to a saturation dose as being 100mcg w/ 20mcg being the minimum to illicit a response.

    GHRP-6 is also an enhancer of slow wave sleep unlike Hexarelin...and it is during the first stage of slow wave sleep that the largest GH pulse of the day occurs in men.

    So it would be good to take a dose of GHRP-6 just prior to bedtime.

    Another good time to dose would be post-workout.

    I've been using GHRP-6 all by itself twice a day (bedtime & PWO) at 100mcg each time. This is enough to illicit a hunger response w/o it being too intense. I did try 200mcg doses and liked that as well...but my experiment calls for examining a minimal dose.

    I don't think you need to keep your blood sugar levels low.

    Your protocol looks fine PP.
    awesome, apprieciate the help. I think ill start out the same protocol as you, shooting 100mcg postWO and another 100mcg prebedtime.

    This would be done everyday subQ correct? When would be a good time to shoot if there is no workout that day?
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    Oh dam nice, looks like I got some good reading material to look over.

    Piston: that protocol is good and very similar to what I do. I do 2 shots of 250mg lately, on workout days post workout, and a shot either before bed, or during the night.

    I have to say i noticed extreme hunger the first few weeks, but that seems to be going away......this must mean I'm developing immunity or something.
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    Is everyone doing every day? I thought most did 5on 2off or 4on 3off....
    I was thining 2 on 2 off, off days i use Melatonin and GABA.

    Is it worth mixing GHRP-6, GABA and Melatonin for bedtime?
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    Quote Originally Posted by MentalTwitch View Post

    Is it worth mixing GHRP-6, GABA and Melatonin for bedtime?
    Oh yes definitely... Some L-dopa and 4-5 grams AAKG and you'd be sitting pretty.
    The LORD is my rock, my fortress, and my savior; my God is my rock, in whom I find protection. He is my shield, the power that saves me, and my place of safety.-Psalm 18:2
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    Quote Originally Posted by TripDog View Post
    Oh yes definitely... Some L-dopa and 4-5 grams AAKG and you'd be sitting pretty.
    sweet.
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    so when would you dose the ghrp6 on non workout days considering the other dose would be before bed, when is the optimal time to take the other dose?
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    Quote Originally Posted by pistonpump View Post
    awesome, apprieciate the help. I think ill start out the same protocol as you, shooting 100mcg postWO and another 100mcg prebedtime.

    This would be done everyday subQ correct? When would be a good time to shoot if there is no workout that day?
    I don't think it matters as long as you keep the dosing at least 3 hours apart. The night-time dosing is important to support the slow wave sleep GH pulse. Growth Hormone Secreatogues (GHS) of which GHRP-6 is one have been shown to increase the amplitude of the GH pulse.

    SubQ is likely to result in a little slower release which is what you want.
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    Quote Originally Posted by datBtrue View Post
    My method of learning involves writing papers to myself based on my research. I was trying to understand why PGH (Gaba & Gabob) work...

    Here is the section I wrote on that topic...it is far from complete but the research is just either old or sparse. It is important to note that Gaba can be either a promoter or inhibitor of GH release depending on the state of CNS stimulation.

    Slow Wave Sleep (SWS) enhancers

    SWS & GH release

    There are two types of sleep, rapid eye movement (REM) and non-rapid eye movement (NREM). Sleep proceeds in cycles composed of four types of stages of NREM and a stage of REM usually ordered as: 1 > 2 > 3 > 4 > 3 > 2 > REM

    The cycle lasts on average 90 to 110 minutes, with a greater quantity of stages 3 and 4 experienced early in the night and more REM later in the night.

    NREM accounts for 75–80% of total sleep time. Non-REM is comprised of four stages; stages 1 and 2 are considered 'light sleep', and 3 and 4 'deep sleep' or slow-wave sleep (SWS).

    It has been shown that sleep, more specifically slow-wave sleep (SWS), does affect growth hormone levels in adult men. During eight hours sleep, it has been demonstrated in several studies that the men with a high percentage of SWS (average 24%) also had high growth hormone secretion, while subjects with a low percentage of SWS (average 9%) had low growth hormone secretion.

    In one very complete study referenced by several others, it was demonstrated that “GH secretory rates and peripheral GH concentrations were maximally correlated with sleep stage, with lags of 4.5 and 16 min, respectively, suggesting that maximal GH release occurs within minutes of the onset of stage 3 or 4 sleep”.

    Furthermore “sleep-related augmentation of GH secretion… usually occurs around midnight and the GH levels at that time are, as a rule, at their highest during the 24-hour period. Partially, this phenomenon is time-entrained and partially related to sleep itself. It is associated with a slow wave sleep, and the maximal GH levels occur within minutes of the onset of slow wave sleep” -Holl RW, Hartman ML, Veldhuis JD, et al. Thirty-second sampling of plasma growth hormone in man: correlation with sleep stages. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1991;72:854–61.


    The origin of nocturnal GH release in humans is still unknown. Most likely hypothalamic GHRH release is a major contributing component, but an additional role of another factor, presumably augmenting GHRH responsiveness of the somatotrophs, is likely. However the precise explanatory mechanisms are still not fully identified.

    It is worth reiterating though that nocturnal release of GH makes up only a fraction of the total daily GH release in women, but the bulk of GH output in men.

    Gaba & its derivatives

    Gamma-amino butyric acid (GABA) is an amino acid and the chief inhibitory neurotransmitter in the central nervous system and the retinas of humans, which regulates muscle tone and other functions. It is also chiefly an excitatory neurotransmitter in most species.

    GABA taken orally has been purported to increase the amount of the Human Growth Hormone. One such study demonstrated that gram amounts “induced clear-cut GH increments in plasma with a peak after 60–90 minutes”. The results of those studies have been seldom replicated, and have recently been in question since it is unknown whether GABA can pass the blood-brain barrier. However GABA when taken in injected form has been shown to both pass the blood-brain barrier and have a pronounced GH secretory effect.

    At various times & in various studies GABA has been found to both inhibit GH release and exacerbate it. This contradiction is explained as… “inhibition of the GH release stimulated by GABA and its ability to raise baseline GH share the same basic mechanism, i.e., an action through dopaminergic (DA) neurons. Continuous stimulation of central nervous system (CNS-DA) receptors by GABA mimetics through DA release would ultimately lead to a state of partial refractoriness to DA-mediated events…”

    The key then appears to be the avoidance of continuous stimulation of the central nervous system.

    Two derivatives of GABA, gamma-amino-beta-hydroxy butyric acid (GABOB) and gamma- hydroxy butyric acid (GHB) have been shown to increase GH secretion as well.

    PGH (akaTyric-6)

    PGH (Tyric-6) is a gaba-derivative injectable growth hormone stimulate that simply contains:

    GABA - a neurotransmitter with a stabilizing role in the brain that has a calming effect. GABA also under certain circumstances increases levels of human growth hormone; and

    GABOB - This has been used in the treatment of epilepsy, but it is a legal molecule that is very similar to GHB (a now illegal molecule) without GHBs negative effects; and

    Magnesium amino-bromohydrate - An essential mineral which enhances the effect of GABA & GABOB.

    The key to understanding why pGH (Tyric-6) is an effective GH releaser is recognizing that GHB (and presumably GABOB as well as GABA in certain circumstances) enhances both slow wave sleep and GH release. - Van Cauter E, Plat L, Scharf MB, et al. Simultaneous stimulation of slow-wave sleep and growth hormone secretion by gamma-hydroxybutyrate in normal young men. J Clin Invest 1997;100:745–53.

    While GHB is illegal and not a component of PGH, its similarly structured brother GABOB has been shown to enhance slow wave sleep as well as increase GH. “Significant increases of prolactin and GH plasma levels were observed after injection with 100 mg GABOB”. - Gamma-amino-beta-hydroxy butyric acid stimulates prolactin and growth hormone release in normal women, P Fioretti,… Journal of Clinical Endocrinology & Metabolism, Vol 47, 1336-1340

    In another study an intrathecal injection of 300 mg of L-GABOB to cerebrovascular patients caused significant increases in plasma GH, prolactin and cortisol levels at 60 min after injection. These results indicate that GABOB may elicit the secretion of GH, prolactin and ACTH via the central nervous system. - Stimulatory Effects of Gamma-Aminohydroxybutyric Acid (GABOB) on Growth Hormone, Prolactin and Cortisol Release in Man, J. Takahara…


    Although the data is sparse and GABA studies as they relate to GH release no longer occur it appears that injectable forms of GABA & its derivatives enhance SWS (slow wave sleep) which is the time period GH is secreted. Since the majority of GH release is secreted in the first early round of SWS it seems that administration of PGH (GABA & GABOB) by injection just prior to sleep will enhance restful sleep and increase the GH secretory pulse.

    Over the last few years anectdotal feedback from users including myself report both of these occurances. A protocol involving taken periodic breaks from use appears to be sufficient to promote continued effectiveness.

    PGH is a simple, safe and effective compound whose ingredients may be purchased easily over the counter. GABA is sold in most supplement stores, while GABOB is harder to source but is available with international sourcing likely being less expensive.

    Of course pGH is available from a research chemical facility and if purchased already assembled need only be reconstituted in Bacteriastatic Water prior to use.
    great post!!!!!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by pistonpump View Post
    ...THis is pinned ed with low blood sugar levels?
    PP I need to clarify my previous response to your question on low blood sugar levels.

    No you don't need the levels to be abnormally low for GHRP-6 to work...normal is fine.

    HOWEVER you don't want them to be high as this will reduce the effect of GHRP-6.

    From a paper by Naila Goldenberg, MD:

    The GH response to (growth hormone releasing hormone) GHRH and (growth hormone secreatogues) GHS infusion after glucose load is attenuated in healthy volunteers [87,88], suggesting the rapid inhibitory effect of glucose on GH release may be caused by a discharge of (somatotropin release–inhibiting factor) SRIF from the hypothalamus.

    When SRIF release declines, endogenous GHRH secretion is activated reciprocally, and available pituitary stores of GH are released, leading to the rebound increase in serum GH levels [89].

    References:

    87 - Masuda A, Shibasaki T, Nakahara M, et al. The effect of glucose on growth hormone
    (GH)-releasing hormone-mediated GH secretion in man. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1985;
    60:523–6.

    88 - Broglio F, Benso A, Gottero C, et al. Effects of glucose, free fatty acids or arginine load
    on the GH-releasing activity of ghrelin in humans. Clin Endocrinol (Oxf) 2002;57:
    265–71.

    89 - Valcavi R, Zini M, Davoli S, et al. The late growth hormone rise induced by oral glucose is
    enhanced by cholinergic stimulation with pyridostigmine in normal subjects. Clin Endocrinol
    (Oxf) 1992;37:360–4.
  

  
 

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