IGF-1 worth it?
- 09-17-2007, 01:49 PM
- 09-18-2007, 09:47 PM
- 09-19-2007, 12:06 AM
the difference in doses makes a huge difference for me in media grade. Gavin Kane SWEARS receptor grade is 3x stronger and while he may not be a pure scientist like PA, he is a smart guy...
For receptor I notice MUCH more at 80mcg post workout 3 times a week. Because I only workout 3 times a week I am sure some of the "over flow" hits the other muscle groups I worked that day as well.
09-19-2007, 04:56 AM
10-16-2007, 05:22 AM
My approach is different. I like small doses of 20mcg (split 10mcg bi-laterally) for long runs. It is a slow drip approach which works well for me and enhances my physique in noticable 3 month chunks (as opposed to seeing results right away).
10-16-2007, 06:31 AM
10-16-2007, 05:34 PM
In PCT I'll dose 20mcg everyday even when there is no workout. Nonworkout days my only constant is to take it before a meal with a solid amount of carbs.
An example of a low dose everyday potocol is Dave Palumbo's:
11 micrograms per day for 30 days (cycle 1) 333 micrograms
2 weeks OFF
11 micrograms per day for 30 days (cycle 2) 333 micrograms
2 weeks OFF
11 micrograms per day for 30 days (cycle 3) 333 micrograms
8 weeks OFF
10-17-2007, 03:07 AM
10-17-2007, 04:01 AM
So why is that protocol working? A. L. Rea has written that insulin shuttles only some amino acids into muscle and that GH shuttles the rest of the amino acid profile. This is suppose to account for the growth that guys are witnessing. But my very limited research indicates that insulin is capable of shuttling all the aminos except Tryptophan...so who knows.
The GH is reducing insulins ability to shuttle into fat cells and the insulin is reducing the side-effects from the GH.
My question is does administering IGF-1 LR3 and insulin together PWO during a steroid cycle create any synergy? I don't know but I am experimenting in part because I have no GH to experiment with at the moment.
I do know that it takes a lot of nutrients to "grow" out those sat cells and insulin really pushes those nutrients so there may be a benefit. It is to early to tell...however recovery & strength are up as a result of the combo...
So what is the best use of IGF-1 by itself?
I believe that it is indespensible for PCT. The reason appears to be that it increases Follicle-Stimulating Hormone (FSH) and Gonadotropin-Releasing Hormone which further stimulates FSH.
I do believe that you will get some site specific enhancement that will show up down the road. I once did a low dose cycle of IGF-1 and injected mainly in the forearms...I witnessed increased veins that are present still almost a year later & within 5 months I noticed some strength and size gains.
10-21-2007, 03:24 PM
with all that said i think you HAVE to use this drug immediately after working out 15-30 min or else you miss out.
11-16-2007, 03:44 PM
He got 50 mcgs bilaterally for 6 weeks during pct. Other than lethargy and a noticeable metabolic advantage :burg: , his frame looked the same. Although, results with IGF use may not manifest during the cycle.
I will give him another round of treatment with some epi, next year .
11-21-2007, 06:23 AM
11-21-2007, 07:07 AM
wassup marc anthony? how is j-lo doing these days? you are a lucky man!
11-21-2007, 07:25 AM
01-11-2008, 10:11 PM
They say a high dose of EPA is as good as IGF ; itís anti-catabolic effects are shown to be even more potent than IGF-1 from what I understand. Id go with GHRP6 and MGF.
01-12-2008, 03:18 PM
It has been worth it from my one cycle with it. The cycle was not run very well, I did the IGF every day and in retrospect I realize this was a waste and unnecessarily shut down natural production.
This time I'm running it 4 days a week (immediately PWO) and going to keep going for 5-6 weeks at 30-40mcg split bilat.
I'll also be dove tailing (ie the last 1-2 weeks will be concurrent) with GHRP-6 and Hexaralin each at 100-150mcg a night (together sub Q). I'll run that for 2-4 weeks or whatever my finances allow.
I would love to find a cheap source for Hexaralin (hint hint!).
I'll be sure to report on my experience, peace ya'll!
01-16-2008, 09:12 AM
Effects are seemingly much less when using this generic Chinese crap as opposed to the GroPep.
01-18-2008, 03:52 PM
01-19-2008, 12:12 AM
01-22-2008, 02:51 PM
Not worht the risk. I have heard of brain tumors caused by igf.
01-22-2008, 04:11 PM
01-22-2008, 08:06 PM
I have seen and used quite a bit of igf over the past couple of years. I miss the pre-ORD days fo sho!
I have used GroPep and generic chinese. I do think the GroPep was better but I have seen (not ran) 97-98% chinese igf that I would say would be very close to GroPep.
Igf is a great peptide but I do get tired of the lethargy.
01-23-2008, 08:39 AM
LOL the Chinese is good. I just had a bad first experience. Maybe I should give it another go.
01-23-2008, 08:48 AM
01-23-2008, 10:30 AM
01-23-2008, 10:52 AM
01-23-2008, 07:31 PM
Nothing has pointed to IGF CAUSING such a thing. That's like people accusing steroids for hair loss. If your predisposed for it the process just speeds up.
01-23-2008, 10:11 PM
01-24-2008, 08:14 AM
I prefer the hitting my anal sphincter with alternating igf/mgf cycles.....
01-28-2008, 08:43 AM
I voted yes.....but at low doses.
01-28-2008, 10:28 AM
02-02-2008, 11:54 PM
02-12-2008, 06:55 AM
as long as you have good igf and use enough it is well worth it. i have used it many of times and loved the results. i know alot of people that are cheap and try to get away with shooting 40mcgs a day so they dont have to buy 2 or 3 bottles and then wonder why they are not having good results. 50mcgs shot twice a day works great for me
03-24-2008, 02:50 AM
i voted yes. im now opening my mind to the notion, that many others have, that good old IGF-1 injected several times a day is better than LR3 because it stays site specific and does not go systemic. After this next course im doing(mgf+lr3 igf-1) im going to do an mgf+igf-1(non lr3) to compare the difference and see if there is any site specific growth.
for the same reasons I also feel that regular mgf injections may be more effective than less frequent peg-MGF ones.
I dont mind being a pin cushion, a few years back I did a long pgf2a course, nothing will ever compare to how bad that **** makes you feel. lol on my first day I really believed I was going to be found dead on the ****ter.
03-24-2008, 07:50 AM
I have been reading on another forum that IGF DOES NOT cause hyperplasia and its main intent is for muscle hypertrophy. I reading the debate as it goes on but any more info showing IGF does or does not cause hyperplasia would be a great benefit, because if it does not cause hyperplasia then I would feel it is useless for that is the only reason I would take it for.
03-24-2008, 08:05 AM
the original study with IGF-1 (not LR3 version) in mice proved hyperplasia, after they dissected the infused muscles and counted the number of fibres so im still with the belief it does but as I said im of the thinking that LR3 becomes systemic and hence we are not seeing these effects.
03-24-2008, 08:42 AM
pumbertot- You dont belive igf/hgh/mgf can cause hyperplasmia in humans? Only certain animals?..
03-24-2008, 09:42 AM
with mgf im just not sure yet but ive heard more positive results from the non-peg version. maybe pegylation has altered the peptide too greatly? i know 2 people very well that have made incredible site specific growth to their biceps, tris and delts with regular mgf. I mean freaky size differences in the space of a few months so my money is on that form.
hgh im unsure of with hyperplasia but certainly hypertrophy and fat loss make it very worthwhile imo.
03-29-2008, 09:39 AM
03-29-2008, 09:49 AM
i believe they made it to extend the half life.
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