Please help my buddy!
- 05-31-2006, 11:12 PM
- 06-01-2006, 12:31 AM
Originally Posted by CHAPSPharmD
- 06-01-2006, 12:42 AM
vinegar is ~15% acetic acid so no it should not have damaged the IGF, sorry Lakemount....
06-01-2006, 12:53 AM
Posted by RedBaron on Steroid.comOriginally Posted by Matthew D
I have noticed several posts lately wondering about a good method for reconstituting IGF-1 and a few posts about using vinegar/water to do so. I originally wrote this post at ****************, but since there seems to be a reasonable interest here as well, I will post it for those that might be interested.
I began using this method many months ago ... mainly out of impatience. I was out of Benzyl Alcohol, and while I had access to HCl, it wasn't accessible when I wanted to begin my Long R3 IGF-1 cycle. I dWhite Vinegar.ecided to use plain ol' grocery store Distilled I used the following, which has worked out really well for me....and the feedback I have had from others that I have shared it with has been positive so far. So here it is for anyone that is interested:
Distilled white vinegar is supposed to be standardized to ~5% acetic acid, which would make it 850mM. To get it to the recommended 100mM, you'd want 11.76% white vinegar (100mM/850mM = 11.76%). Since it would be almost impossible to draw out 11.76IU's, I round this to 12, which is certainly going to be close to our desired 100mM.
The filtering process:
I use off the shelf grocery store distilled white vinegar. In order to ensure safety, I filter it using .20u whatman filters. Here is the step by step for those that may not be familiar with filtering using whatmans. What you will want to have on hand before starting out is some sterile vials, some .20u whatman filters, some syringes and needles (I use a 10cc syringe, and .23 gauge 1" needles), and some alcohol swabs.
(1) First draw up about 10cc of the distilled white vinegar
(2) screw on the .20u whatman to the 10cc syringe (or whatever size you use)
(3) screw on a .23 gauge needle (or whatever size you decide to use)
(4) take your sterile vial, swab the top with alcohol, insert a needle for venting.
(5) Insert your syringe/whatman/needle apparatus and slowly push the 10cc's into the sterile vial.
Now you have safe vinegar to use for your reconstituting.
ALTERNATE METHOD - Alternately, you could simply mix your water and distilled white vinegar before filtering using about 7.5 parts of water per 1 part of distilled white vinegar. After mixing these together in this ratio, run the mixture through your .20u whatman as above. You will end up with a vial of dilutent this way that has the proper PH for use with your IGF-1.
How much water/vinegar you reconstitute with is going to somewhat depend on which LR3 IGF-1 you are using. Igtropin is shipped in 100mcg vials, which I usually reconstitute at 1ml(cc) per 100mcg vial (which will make the 10 mark on your insulin syringe = 10 mcgs). The gropep based IGF-1's are primarily shipped in 1mg vials, and I usually use 5ml for these (which will make the 10 mark on your insulin syringe = 20mcgs).
At any rate, what I do is:
(1) take an alcohol swab and swab the tops of my water, vinegar solution, and IGF-1 vials
(2) take a syringe with a 23 gauge, 1" needle and draw out .12 cc's of vinegar for the 100mcg vials or .60 cc's for the 1mg vials.
(3) next I take this syringe and draw out the water - .88cc's for 100mcg, 4.4cc's for the 1mg.
FOR ALTERNATE METHOD in lieu of steps (2) and (3) - Just draw out the desired amount of dilutent from your pre-mixed vial of
vinegar / water.
(4) next i poke the needle into the LR3 IGF-1 vial and dribble this solution down the side of the vial, avoid any direct spray on the lyophilized powder until all of the dilutent is in the vial
(5) using a gentle swirling motion, I reconstitute the powder.
(6) I stick the vial in the fridge and it is now ready for use.
Well, I think that about sums it up. Hope this helps anyone who may have been wondering about using vinegar to reconstitute. I would advise that if you end up using Igtropin, you seriously consider using this vinegar method. Igtropin and other dilutents such as BA do not get along well together at all.
06-01-2006, 01:00 AM
I know there are many variations of Vinegar in the market place, so I guess have him read off the bottle exactly the strength, and was it Cider Vinegar or White Vinegar?
The trivial name acetic acid is the most commonly used and officially preferred name by the IUPAC. This name derives from acetum, the Latin word for vinegar. The synonym ethanoic acid is a systematic name that is sometimes used in introductions to chemical nomenclature.
Glacial acetic acid is a trivial name for water-free acetic acid. Similar to the German name Eisessig (literally, ice-vinegar), the name comes from the ice-like crystals that form slightly below room temperature at 16.7 °C (about 62 °F).
The most common and official abbreviation for acetic acid is AcOH or HOAc where Ac stands for the acetyl group CH3−C(=O)−. In the context of acid-base reactions the abbreviation HAc is often used where Ac instead stands for the acetate anion (CH3COO−), although this use is regarded by many as misleading. In either case, the Ac is not to be confused with the abbreviation for the chemical element actinium.
Acetic acid has the empirical formula C2H4O2. This is often written as CH3-COOH, CH3COOH, or CH3CO2H to better reflect its structure. The ion resulting from loss of H+ from acetic acid is the acetate anion. The name acetate can also refer to a salt containing this anion or an ester of acetic acid.
Vinegar is as old as civilization itself, perhaps older. Acetic acid-producing bacteria are present throughout the world, and any culture practicing the brewing of beer or wine inevitably discovered vinegar as the natural result of these alcoholic beverages being exposed to air.
The use of acetic acid in chemistry extends into antiquity. In the 3rd century BC, the Greek philosopher Theophrastos described how vinegar acted on metals to produce pigments useful in art, including white lead (lead carbonate) and verdigris, a green mixture of copper salts including copper(II) acetate. Ancient Romans boiled soured wine in lead pots to produce a highly sweet syrup called sapa. Sapa was rich in lead acetate, a sweet substance also called sugar of lead or sugar of Saturn, which contributed to lead poisoning among the Roman aristocracy. The 8th century Persian alchemist Jabir Ibn Hayyan (Geber) concentrated acetic acid from vinegar through distillation.
In the Renaissance, glacial acetic acid was prepared through the dry distillation of metal acetates. The 16th century German alchemist Andreas Libavius described such a procedure, and he compared the glacial acetic acid produced by this means to vinegar. The presence of water in vinegar has such a profound effect on acetic acid's properties that for centuries many chemists believed that glacial acetic acid and the acid found in vinegar were two different substances. The French chemist Pierre Adet proved them to be identical.
In 1847 the German chemist Hermann Kolbe synthesised acetic acid from inorganic materials for the first time. This reaction sequence consisted of chlorination of carbon disulfide to carbon tetrachloride, followed by pyrolysis to tetrachloroethylene and aqueous chlorination to trichloroacetic acid, and concluded with electrolytic reduction to acetic acid.
there is more mumbo jumbo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetic_acid
06-01-2006, 01:02 AM
Also good post LakemountD, I bet if he were to use it right now it would BURN like a MOFO!
06-01-2006, 01:03 AM
HAHA oh my goodness would it burn. Considering it would be 8.5 times stronger (if it was pure white wine vinegar) than the acetic acid he should be using!!!Originally Posted by FitnFirm
06-01-2006, 01:58 AM
Yep it was straight white vinegar I believe he said it burnt like hell.
06-01-2006, 02:14 AM
See Mathew D I'm not a complete retard lol.Originally Posted by CHAPS
06-01-2006, 11:25 AM
Ummmmmm...................Originally Posted by LakeMountD
06-01-2006, 11:59 AM
Ohhhhhhh idunk idunk. And I reiterrate my previous statement! Your boy messed up his IGF-1 lol, or well it will degrade pretty quickly anyways.Originally Posted by idunk42
06-01-2006, 10:23 PM
Lake I didn't think you were a retard at all until you made that last statement...
06-02-2006, 01:25 AM
I was only kiddinOriginally Posted by Matthew D
Here I let you have a free shot back!
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