Systematic MGF possibility:

[xtraflossy]

I was discussing the possible dangers with MGF (which it was concluded it was realitivly safe) and a systematic MGF came up after discussing viral administration.

The comment Im about to repeat comes from someone who has worked in genetics for for for around 20 years as a researcher, and now specializes in metabolic deseises heading up a huge research facility in the study in the US.

The comment was: Ya know,.. what we usually do for something like that is incoorporate (and Im going to spell this wrong and probably a little more then that Vascular / endotheilier GF (this would be to along with the MGF and use the other GF as a carrier of sorts, also allowing the MGF to be taken into the muscle for a systematic approach)

I don't have any supporting research on this to show, This would be word of mouth as of the time of the post.
The statement was given kinda matter-of-factly, .. like this is a common pratice to make something systematic that normally is not.
I asked if it was because the Endo/vascular GF was used because it increased bloodflow and carried it into the muscle....He said yes,.. I then asked if vascular dialators (like Arginine maybe) could produce a simular effect. In theory, It SHOULD help- even at the local level as is the case when administering Mechano Growth Factor.

Any increased risk factors aside, (as I mentioned that MGF was probably not something you'd want floating around in the bloodstreem (and the inplication here was bloodstream infusion. What that really means I am unsure of; because any injection tends to lead somewhat into the bloodstream at some level).
So, maybe the addition Arginine before (or the other growth factor) would help "spred" and carry MGF to a wider area durring local adminastration increasing the toital area of the muscle injected.
This is just a thought, I feel almost obligated to share this information because of the possibility. The main risk factor "might" be that MGF (If I remember from my research) is expressed durring eymbreotic (SP: -fetus) development in the heart, and also has some neurological effects as well (wether this is due more to the IGF-1 in which it came is unknown).

Anyways,.. Here is the information I have learned. I plan to look into it some,.. but I also wanted to (hopefully) peek others interest to do so as well,...

 

[Pax]

I understand what you're saying... but I'm not sure if what we're getting is the "viral" MGF.

But I've always been suspicious of IGF-1's role in causing cardiomegaly (enlargement of the heart). MGF in any form or capacity, has GOT to have some sort of effect on the heart, as I, like you, believe that any site injection will inevitably have some uptake into the blood stream, however minute it may be.
I think I'm going to have my "friend" hold off on the MGF for a while until more is known about this stuff. I think there may be some real dangers here that we have yet to discover... primarily what the half-life of this MGF is that people have been receiving, and if it has extended effects that are not yet known...

Keep up the research XF!

 

[xtraflossy]

First off, we are not getting the viral MGF. Were getting just the growth factor, not a virus with the gene in it.


Well, As I know it, is MGF is only expressed within the muscle tissue, alone, it should not last very long in the bloodstream before it is broken down. The purpose would be (to make systemic) to circulate the MGF for a short period of time for it to be absorbed into the muscles.
Now, Isnt MGF a splice of IGF-1????,... technically then, at some point it was in circulation,..
I definately DO NOT think that when used with the vasco/endo GF Total circulation is acheived, or if it is, then not any extended period of time and Definately NOT like IGF-1 (R3).

 

[xtraflossy]

it was already stated that MGF is alot safer than IGF that being said, what your friend told you does not make any since what so ever our MGF is the peptide only not in a viral carrier

As I do not know the implication "friend" (as it was definately not just a "guy I know") but as I stated in the previous post repeated below:
"First off, we are not getting the viral MGF. Were getting just the growth factor, not a virus with the gene in it."

I also agree with it being a lot safer then IGF (As I stated in my first post about it being relitivly safe.
So, Im a little confused why you posted what you did??? What your saying makes no sence. Viral carriers are completely different then what I am refering to. I wanted to make that distinction early on, as the delivery methoeds and results, and what is used is TOTALLY different.

I wasnt talking about gene theropy via virus, I was refering to increasing the coverage area or a local injection site, and other carriers I herd were used to transport/aid in some degree of circulation of the peptide / MGF.

I guess Im just a little confused; as I am assuming your post was in response to mine. :blink:

-Not to bite the hand,..............

 

[Bionic]

Hey XF, I wonder if something like Glucophase XR would be of benefit since it takes nutrients in the blood and transports it to muscle?

 

[xtraflossy]

As this idea is in no way "mine", I couldnt provide a straight, 100% answer on that.
However, I can speculate on increasing the chances if it is:

I would think that anything that promotes bloodflow or muscle intake would help ANY product that is looking for a home in muscle tissue. Some better then others.

You couldnt do both at the same time though, obviously, the XR would need to be already doing its thing.

I wouldnt count on seeing an increase in response with that approcah though. Something administered alongside of MGF would probably work best. And that methoed would probably work best for generalizing (expanding the area of
) a local administration (such as if you were to do a single central inj into your quads).

The first thing we would need to find out, and we'll have some idea soon, is if tissue damage is a prerequisute for the MGF induced hypertrophy, or to what extint.
Perhaps injecting closer to a main artery or something, carring blood away from the heart (just in case ya know,.. ) and also traveling accross muscle groups. Some may find its way into that artiery's flow, and with the endo vascular GF be absorbed into muscle tissue the same way a bomb explodes, from one central location (birds eye view) going out and being absorbed in all directions.

Of course this is only speculation at this time

I just wanted to say that when I say systemic MGF, in this case I mean it more like a repeatable "deposit" of MGF into (multipule/?) muscle tissue not limitied to immedieate injection site, and not as a continuous circulating peptide.

 

[same_old]

XF - no offense, but you're a little hard to follow.

remind me - what is wrong with site-specific hyperplasia/hypertrophy??? it's the holy grail of bodybuilding.

i suspect you are worried about MGF not hitting your entire quad - am i right? if it's anything like IGF, and it appears that is, then there wont be any trouble with that - IGF does MORE at the injection site, but you feel the effects all over.

if i'm off base, please help me understand so we can fruitlessly conjecture some more

 

[UnicronSpawn]

Hey XF, I wonder if something like Glucophase XR would be of benefit since it takes nutrients in the blood and transports it to muscle?

Or maybe even insulin.....provided we could/ or should get MGF into the blood for long enough for humalog to distribute it.
If not, then if nothing else insulin could help insure we have sufficient amino acids shipped to the muscle's for "building materials", and to keep the sattelite cell count topped off.

 

[xtraflossy]

XF - no offense, but you're a little hard to follow.
remind me - what is wrong with site-specific hyperplasia/hypertrophy??? it's the holy grail of bodybuilding.

Nothing is wrong with it!! I actually have used that same expression in regaurds to to growth factors!!
I like the fact that this could prove usufull for lagging parts and such. Im not so much debating the effectiveness of MGF (as I do not yet know), as much as I am sharring a peice of information I herd, and thought it is worth sharring and exploring (and to me no doubt interesting)

i suspect you are worried about MGF not hitting your entire quad - am i right? if it's anything like IGF, and it appears that is, then there wont be any trouble with that - IGF does MORE at the injection site, but you feel the effects all over.

Good to hear! It's not so much that Im worried, but a consideration I couldnt help but think about.


Fruitlessly conjecture some more?? I would say that exploring possibilities is never fruitless. If for no other reason then you learn the reason why something wont work (which can lead to way to make things work).
I dont think your off base,.. Its just seems like a few people are getting the wrong idea. It would appear that somehow (and I know I can be hard to follow at times,... if you only knew what the inside of my head was like!!) I am not making my points clear. As I have been missunderstood on a few things in this post already. My goal is not to say one thing or annother, only speculation at this point.

IGF-1 (long form) is great for sucking things into muscle (like insulin mentioned before). Since the vitro studies show that satalitte cells seem to grow in number in response to MGF (in the absence of IGF) and form myotubes in the presence of.
An IGF-1 run looks imminent in the near future, once I have built up a flooding of cells just looking to do something constructive :rofl:

 

[ryano]

sub:yawn:

 

[UnicronSpawn]

IGF-1 (long form) is great for sucking things into muscle (like insulin mentioned before). Since the vitro studies show that satalitte cells seem to grow in number in response to MGF (in the absence of IGF) and form myotubes in the presence of.
An IGF-1 run looks imminent in the near future, once I have built up a flooding of cells just looking to do something constructive :rofl:

I remember reading that MGF initiates formation of myotubes in the presence of IGF, and I remember the part about MGF "activating" sattelite cells w/out the need for IGF, but I took "activating" to mean the process of existing sattelite cells merging with contractile muscle...... Are you saying that the MGF is supposed increase the actuall NUMBER of sattelite cells as well? :think:

 

[xtraflossy]

I JUST freakn deleated my MGF link in my favorits,.. their not in my trashcan!! Let me search around for it again, I'll just cut and past the part when I find it.

I wonder what happends to activated satalitte cells with nothing to repair??......

Still looking,.. but I must admit, its all starting to get a little trivial now; as its not looking like anyone is getting anything from it (doses below 100mcg) -I dont know about higher then 100mcg doses...

 

[UnicronSpawn]

In another thread I said something like..."wouldnt that suck if people needed to pin like an MG per day billaterally to see significant results?" That would be like $1,400/wk.

 

[xtraflossy]

I doubt that will be the case,.. couldnt imagin. I wouldnt have the 45min to take the inj

 

[UnicronSpawn]

If I dont see anything good by the end of next week, Im going to wait for the PEGylated version before I get anymore.

 

[LakeMountD]

Just so you know I recently read in a Goldspink article that MGF does not enter the bloodstream in ANY quantity.

"MGF, however, appears to be designed for local action and does not enter the blood stream in any quantity. It has a 52 base insert in the E domain which alters the reading frame of the 3' end, which results in it binding to a different binding protein which exists in the interstitial tissue spaces of muscle and neuronal tissue. This would be expected to localise its action as it would be unstable in the unbound form; this is important as its production would not unduly perturb blood sugar levels."