[ryanbodybuilder]

I will be staring Humalog, after 1.5 years of researching..I will only be using
Post Workout starting at 5iu and working my way up to about 15iu max....I have my
Slin Shake somewhat organized......what do you think?

50g Whey in water
10g dextrose
25g malto
30g half of a wheat bagel

hour later
6 cooked egg whites, or chicken breast ect.

[ryanbodybuilder]

anybody, anybody? also should I use this subq or IM...humalog is the fastest acting so maybe I should use it subq?

[ryanbodybuilder]

I am thinking more along the lines of a slin shake like:

50g whey in water
10g dextrose
50g malto

whatdya think?

[glenihan]

don't know much about slin as i have no desire to use it .. but from what i know your pwo shake sounds fine .. although you might want to do more research about the 1 hour meal .. i think you'll need some carbs in there .. i'm not sure though

[Poobah]

Malto is classified as a Complex carb.. but in reality it absorbs real quick. I still say you need some slow absorbing carbs with your meal.. whether its oatmeal or whole grain bagel. With the slower absorbing carbs, I don't think you need carbs with your 1 hour meal.. I never needed it from a hypo point of view, myself anyway...

Your first meal looks much better to me.

[CROWLER]

YIKES


Yes buddy I have some advice LESS slin to start PLEASE>


Try just a cc or 2 and see how it goes from there.

Each person reacts differently. I have used slow acting and even after using it for weeks and eating alot of carbs after the injection (sub q) one day I was VERY suprised.

I found myself sweating, light headed and dizzy in the middle of a Borders Book store buying carbs and slamming them down. The clerk probably thought I was crazy.


BTW all slin did for me was make me fat.

It seems the thinking for SOME people is

slin by itself does nothing.

Slin with AS does almost nothing.

Slin with GH and AS is GREAT.



CROWLER

[jonny21]

Originally Posted by CROWLER

YIKES


Yes buddy I have some advice LESS slin to start PLEASE>


Try just a cc or 2 and see how it goes from there.

Each person reacts differently.

Take heed. I posted in another insulin thread regarding this same issue. Humalog(Lispro) is rapid/short-acting(<15 min) insulin with a peak of ~30-90 min. and a relatively short duration(~3-5 hrs). Go slow since you have endogenous insulin also being secreted. Since it is your first time and there is going to be an endogenous response I would play it safe and only do 1 unit per 20-30 grams of CHO. An insulin dependant diabetic would typically use 1 unit for ~10-15 grams of CHO, and often that is with background or basal insulin. I hour meal should also have CHO. Keep glucose tabs close if available.

Originally Posted by ryanbodybuilder

anybody, anybody? also should I use this subq or IM...humalog is the fastest acting so maybe I should use it subq?

subq

[123 go]

60 g pwo?
isnt it your bw x .5 for high gi carbs pwo?

[ryanbodybuilder]

a cc or 2? are you crazy isnt that like 200iu or something? I am only starting out with 5iu and working my way up to 10iu....I mispoke in the first message...I am also adding in 10g glutamine and 10g creatine to each slin shake and only doing them postworkout which is 4 times a week

Originally Posted by CROWLER

YIKES


Yes buddy I have some advice LESS slin to start PLEASE>


Try just a cc or 2 and see how it goes from there.

Each person reacts differently. I have used slow acting and even after using it for weeks and eating alot of carbs after the injection (sub q) one day I was VERY suprised.

I found myself sweating, light headed and dizzy in the middle of a Borders Book store buying carbs and slamming them down. The clerk probably thought I was crazy.


BTW all slin did for me was make me fat.

It seems the thinking for SOME people is

slin by itself does nothing.

Slin with AS does almost nothing.

Slin with GH and AS is GREAT.



CROWLER

[jonny21]

Originally Posted by ryanbodybuilder

a cc or 2? are you crazy isnt that like 200iu or something? I am only starting out with 5iu and working my way up to 10iu....I mispoke in the first message...I am also adding in 10g glutamine and 10g creatine to each slin shake and only doing them postworkout which is 4 times a week

I think he meant 1 or 2iu's, at least that's how I interpreted it. Yes it is typically 100iu per ml. The amount of insulin must be based on carbohydrate intake not on how much you want to work up to. With 5 units you would probably need ~100-150g of carbohydrates to play it safe. Do you have a glucometer? If so, do a postprandial 2-3 hours after and see where your BS's are. Try that a few times until you get a good idea of the insulin:carb ratio that works well for you. That'd be the safest and probably most efficient way.

[glenihan]

Originally Posted by 123 go

60 g pwo?
isnt it your bw x .5 for high gi carbs pwo?

do a search my friend .. if you are talking about PWO when NOT using insulin high gi carbs are inferior to low gi carbs (which has been covered ad nauseum on this board) .. and when talking slin it should be 10g carbs (mix of hi and low) for every 1iu of slin or until you know how you body reacts

[Poobah]

I went back and checked my notes... my second slin meal contained a combination of egg whites (Raw), scoop whey, and a quarter cup of oats.. (tasted like ass).. but the topic is to important to screw up. Sorry about that.

You don't need alot of carbs though.. but yea definate have some complex one with your second meal.

[BOHICA]

Screw all this insulin crap, not worth it with all the extra crap you have to watch out for.








At least until the inhaler version comes out!!

[glenihan]

i completely agree with Bo ... most find they only get fat from it unless combined with BOTH aas and gh

just not worth trouble IMO

but ryan's a big boy and a smart guy i have faith he won't **** it up .. just not worth it IMO especially since i can get plenty fat on my own if i want

[Poobah]

I'll be happy to publicly admit I was a fool for using while cutting.. (I was able to mind you), but I'm sure I would of did better from a fat loss perspective without.. (perhaps with a pinch less muscles at the end). Regardless I think it was a mistake, especially while cutting.. (but Damn do you feel **** happening in combo with igf and aas).

however, when I'm done cutting.. (and I will be some day damn you.. ), I'll definately consider it again in combonation with igf/hgh/aas. (With a top notch diet of course.) Might be years off yet though.

[ryanbodybuilder]

yea i will only be using it during bulking cycles with aas.....and I dont get fat easy at all.....thanks for all the comments guys..I dont plan on using it for well over 10 weeks now....but I have it on cool in my fridge!

[123 go]

ifbb pros suggest 10g of simple carbs per iu

Originally Posted by ifbb pro

IFBBPRO: WELL I SUGGEST THAT FOR OPTIMAL RESULTS, YOU USE HUMALOG AT 10-15IU'S IMMEDIATELY AFTER TRAINING BECAUSE THAT IS WHEN YOU BODY IS MOST DEPLETED OF GLYCOGEN STORES AND IS PRIMED TO OVERCOMPENSATE FOR THE INFLUX OF NUTRIENTS. NOW HUMALOG HITS IN 5-15MINUTES SO YOU MUST IMMEDIATELY INGEST 10 GRAMS OF SIMPLE CARBS PER EVERY I.U. OF INSULIN YOU USE (IN THIS CASE BETWEEN 100-150 GRAMS) I WOULD ALSO TAKE IN ADDITIONAL NUTRIENTS THAT HELP CONTRIBUTE TO MUSCLE GROWTH SUCH AS AMINO ACIDS OR 50 GRAMS OF WHEY ISOLATE. I WOULD ALSO HAVE 5 GRAMS OF CREATINE AT THIS TIME TO AID IN CELL VOLUMIZING

[123 go]

that was taken from an interview with an ifbb pro, from another board
here it is.

Originally Posted by Interview with IFBB pro

INTERVIEWS ARE A DIME A DOZEN AND CAN GO ONE OF 2 WAYS. THEY ARE EITHER COMPLETELY ****ING BORING WHICH IS THE KIND YOU READ IN THE MAGAZINES.....OR THEY ARE COMPLETELY FABRICATED, LIKE THE KIND YOU SEE ON OTHER BODYBUILDING WEBSITES. THIS INTERVIEW REPRESENTS NEITHER. THE NAME OF THE INDIVIDUAL HAS BEEN KEPT ANONYMOUS DUE TO CONTRACTUAL OBLIGATIONS. WITH THAT BEING SAID, WHAT IS TO FOLLOW IS A MOST INFORMATIVE AND EDUCATIONAL INTERVIEW ON ONE PARTICULAR TOPIC:

TREVOR; WHAT WAS THE CAUSE OF THE 20-30LB BODYWEIGHT JUMPS FROM 1994-PRESENT. I MEAN LETS FACE IT, NASSER EL SONBATY WAS AN AVERAGE PRO UNTIL 1995 AND RONNIE COLEMAN WAS A 2ND OR 3RD TIER ATHLETE UP UNTIL 1997, JEAN PIERRE FUX GAINED 40 LBS OF TISSUE IN A YEAR AND A HALF, CHRIS CORMIER HAS GONE FROM AVERAGE TO TOP 3, HELL EVEN DORIAN WENT FROM 230LBS TO 260LBS SEEMINGLY OVERNIGHT. ALL OF THESE MEN HAVE HAD LOTS OF EXPERIENCE WITH STEROIDS AND G.H. SO THERE HAD TO BE ANOTHER FACTOR. AT FIRST IT WAS THOUGHT IGF-1 WAS RESPONSIBLE, BUT THIS PROVED TO BE A RATHER INEFFECTIVE COMPOUND.

SO WHAT WAS IT?

THIS QUESTION HAS BEEN ON EVERYONE'S MIND SINCE THE EMERGENCE OF 280-290LB BODYBUILDERS FROM SEEMINGLY OUT OF NO-WHERE. I ALWAYS THOUGHT IT MUST HAVE BEEN THE EMERGENCE OF IGF-1, BUT THEN AFTER RESEARCHING SOME THINGS, I FOUND OUT THAT IGF-1 IS A **** DRUG AND DOESN'T DO MUCH. (hey this is Trevors opinion not mine-DC) WHAT GIVES?

IFBBPRO: I N S U L I N! THAT'S WHAT GIVES! I'VE KNOWN A LOT OF THESE GUYS FOR A WHILE NOW AND I CAN UNEQUIVOCALLY TELL YOU THAT IT IS THE RESULT OF INSULIN THAT THESE HUGE LEAPS HAVE BEEN MADE.

TREVOR; INSULIN? IF THAT IS THE CASE, THEN HOW COME SO MANY PEOPLE CLAIM IT WILL MAKE YOU FAT

IFBBPRO: BECAUSE IT CAN MAKE YOU FAT IF YOU DO NOT KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING AND DO NOT USE THE RIGHT TYPE.

TREVOR; CAN YOU EXPLAIN HOW TO USE IT SO ONE WOULD NOT GET FAT.

IFBBPRO: ACTUALLY IT'S QUITE SIMPLY. YOU SEE THERE ARE DIFFERENT TYPES OF INSULIN L, N, R , AND HUMALOG. THE DIFFERENCE IS IN THE ACTING TIMES. L LASTS IN THE SYSTEM FOR AROUND 24HOURS PEAKING SEVERAL TIMES THROUGHOUT THE DAY AND TAKES 2 HOURS TO BEGIN TO WORK, N IS MEDIUM IN ITS ACTING TIME LASTING AROUND 12 HOURS AND R IS THE QUICKEST OF THESE THREE, LASTING FOR ABOUT 6 HOURS AND HITTING THE SYSTEM IN ABOUT 30-45 MINUTES. HUMALOG IS NEWER AND ACTUALLY BEGINS WORKING IN 5-15 MINUTES AND LASTS FOR 4 HOURS

ONCE YOU UNDERSTAND THIS, YOU CAN USE INSULIN TO YOUR ADVANTAGE. WITH ALL INSULIN YOU NEED TO HAVE GLUCOSE PRESENT IN THE BLOOD STREAM SO IT CAN HAVE SOMETHING TO ACT ON AND TRANSPORT IT INTO THE CELLS. THE POPULAR RULE OF THUMB OF 10-15 GRAMS OF GLUCOSE/CARBS PER I.U. OF INSULIN WAS SOMETHING THAT I ACTUALLY CAME UP WITH. PLEASE DON'T THINK I AM BEING ARROGANT, IT'S JUST THAT I WAS DOING A LOT OF RESEARCH ON INSULIN IN THE EARLY 90'S AND IT IS DIRECTLY AND INDIRECTLY DUE TO THAT RESEARCH THAT INSULIN HAS BECOME A POPULAR TOOL IN THE BODYBUILDERS ****NAL. MANY PEOPLE HAVE CONTACTED ME ON HOW TO USE INSULIN. NOW WITH INSULIN YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER THAT IT IS AN INDISCRIMINANT CARRIER WHICH IS BOTH GOOD AND BAD. GOOD BECAUSE ALONG WITH THE TRANSPORTING OF GLUCOSE, IT WILL ALSO TRANSPORT AMINO ACIDS INTO THE MUSCLE CELLS. BAD BECAUSE IF THERE IS A LOT OF