[BodyWizard]

Originally Posted by BigVrunga

I can't wait to try this stuff! Anyone have an idea how UK's PGH-T would compare to IBE's Hexatropin?

I don't.

[BodyWizard]

ryano, that's some sister you got there -
makes me feel like going ho-ho-ho!

[ryano]

Thats it im calling Chuck.

You guys are in some serious **** noW

[ryano]

Body wiz can you give me a basic rundown of ecto, hex and for what reasons you are running them.

I have been on IBE's site more than a few times. But Im curious as to why you are running them and what benefits you hope to gain.

[BodyWizard]

Ectotropin is GHRP-6 in a d-lysate form that is supposed to antagonise ghrelin receptors in the stomach; the intended effect of this is a reduction in appetite. Hexarelin OTOH is a dose of straight-up GHRP-6 identical to Ectotropin's dose (100mcg) AND an equal amount of hexarelin, which is a so-called super-analog of GHRP-6.

I keep saying hexarelin is interesting stuff - here's why:
- it increases the amount of GH released;
- it increases the frequency of GH release;
- it may affect GH release long-term (ie, well after hexarelin is stopped).

Hexarelin is supposed to be a much stronger stimulant of GH than GHRP-6 itself (seen in several papers). The potency of the d-lys-3 in Ectotropin relative to GHRP-6 is unknown to me.

I bought a box of Ectotropin in early November, because my research into hormones led me to learn about GH & IGF-1. I was intrigued by the new GHS; the d-lys-3 seemed like an interesting twist. As I continued researching, I ran across more and more that pointed to hexarelin as being much more interesting (to me) (see above).

Beyond that, I get real specific in the first few posts in the thread.

[ryano]

Ok I think I am grasping a little of this.

What do you mean by d-lysate form?

And no flamming guys I let you talk smack on my sis.

[BodyWizard]

not enough of a chemist to give a precide & rigorous answer, but the d-lysate-3 form is a structural modification of the GHRP-6; the 'd-' indicates a right-handed chemical structure; 'lysate' is the contents of a cell that has been broken down, and the '3' is probably a position in the peptide. Basically, is a description of the modification.

This is the delivered active in Ectotropin, arguably less the target of research than either of the actives in Hexatropin. That's why there's not tons of info around on it.

Is this helping?
(can't help noticing you haven't changed your avatar since you got hacked...)

HAPPY NEW YEAR!

[BodyWizard]

Here at the end of one month on Ectotropin, it’s almost hard to remember exactly how I felt at the beginning. Everything was a struggle, I felt sluggish and stupid, and things had felt pretty bleak for awhile.

Today, I’m losing some fat, while I’m not pain-free by any means, I’m substantially more comfortable than I’ve been in a long time, and my energy level (& activity) is much higher. Normal activities are much less effort, my stress level is way down (even with the holidays & the home situation), my attitude is much more positive. Most importantly (in some ways) my body feels more like a unified whole than a collection of parts.

I know I’ve said things like this over the last month: they remain true, and have intensified, improved, deepened and other vague adjectives. Nothing euphoric, or even particularly physical. I guess the closest I can get is to say I feel rested.

Almost silly, isn’t it - I’m not giddy, grumpy, picked-on, pissed-off or glorious - I’m just ready to go; not amped, not pumped, not cranked - just engaged. I’m probably much easier to be around now than I was a month ago. I’ve been noticeably hornier, too.

I feel like I’m on the right track: if the Hexatropin adds nothing to the equation beyond what I’ve been getting from the Ectotropin, I think it’s still worthwhile for me. Anything beyond this would be very nice.


Weight: 197 waist: 40 BF: 18.2

7# in weight
39.372 - 35.854 = 3.5 lbs

if I were guessing, I’d guess the other 3.5# was water.

The impact of ET on my appetite was generally stimulating, though it slacked off considerably after the first 2 weeks. Overall, the effect on appetite was probably a wash, in that I was hungrier, but more indifferent about satisfying it. I had no real trouble keeping my calories well below maintenance, even with the holiday festivities (I won’t pretend I ate clean these last 2 weeks, but I was far from pigging out...kinda nice,actually).

I feel like I’m just getting started: glad I planned for the long run. Ultimately, I ran the ET to prime the pumps, to get GH response going so the HT could hit the ground running, so to speak. I definitely got my money’s worth. YMMV.

Any questions?

[BodyWizard]

The effect of ET on my GH levels can’t be reasonably estimated, but I did name some markers I’d be tracking:

hair color and thickness
Hair is definitely growing faster, plainly getting thicker in the bald spot on top;
hair & beard seem to be getting darker; no comment from others so far, but it’s really only noticeable if you look at the top of my head fairly often - wish I’d been able to arrange photos, as it really is undeniable. Nothing grand, but actually happening.

skin tone and texture
no observable changes in skin or complexion, but there’ve been a couple of odd things:

burned fingers
one morning last week, while making coffee, I accidentally poured boiling water over the thumb & fingers of my left hand, straight out of the kettle, fresh off the boil. I felt it, and it was hot, of course, but it didn’t really hurt. It also didn’t burn me. Didn’t even turn red. A couple of hours later, after breakfast & all, it occurred to me that I probably ought to put something on it, so I rubbed in some aloe, but I really don’t think it was necessary. By that night, I’d forgotten it completely.

scalp bumps
like a lot of old guys, I get **** growing on my head, kind of mini-melanomas, only benign (mostly). Every now and then I go to the dermatologist, & she burns some off & leaves others. Annoying, really...still, it’s been 6 months or so, and I had been noticing the bumps under my fingers & thinking it was time to go back for another round when I started ET. This morning, I was rubbing my head, kind of absently checking for bumps, when I realised I didn’t have any. There’s nothing up there (bump-wise). Except more hair.

floaters & general visual reactivity & acuity
hard to judge, but the floaters haven’t been much of an annoyance lately; I’ll have to start tracking their occurrence, rather than their absence, now. I notice nothing on the other.

changes in perceived tinnitus
since beginning ET, I have occasionally noted the ABSENCE of the tone; I’ve also noticed that I no longer *always* hear the exact same tone.

changes in quality & degree of joint pain
joint pain as a product of movement is reduced to a very low point
joint pain as a product of injury or deterioration is reduced
pain around the joints as a product of applied pressure is much increased.

speed of growth (nails, hair)
before ET, I trimmed hair, beard & nails every 2 weeks or so;
after 1 month of ET, I trim every 6-8 days

miles walked - only 10 or so, formally, but close to 25 overall: I plead holidays

miles run - none so far

times for distances - none so far

[SJA]

Hey BW....do you ever get vertigo?

[ryano]

Sounds like everything is moving along well and thanks for your insight on the tropins.

When do you plan on using the Oratropin?

Also not nitpicking / just being lazy but.. Maybe putting what day or week you are into your experiment would be good?

I thought ringing sensation(tinnitus) you were talking about was interesting.

I was an audio engineer(studio only) for about 8 years and still have some ringing in my ears around the 2,000khz range. It has been about a year and a half since I have been in front of some monitors for any extended period of time and the ringing is not as loud. But from what I have always been told any hearing loss or damage is permanent. I wonder if the ringing is effect of the hairs breaking in the inner ear and or some other mechanism.

Anyhoo, sounds like this stuff is def raising those GH levels. I wonder if the hair coming in is a long term gain.

I like your description of your body feeling like a whole instead of a collection of parts. Im only 32 right now but I relate to your statement.

Sounds like your walking alot. What is the diet like? Are you keeping things around or below maintence. Eating clean and frequently etc...

Ok I will shut up now

[BodyWizard]

Originally Posted by SJA

Hey BW....do you ever get vertigo?

not in a strict sense: never had the whirling, which-way-is-up sensation that causes folks to keel over. That said, I have had instances where I've lost my balance (and have even fallen once or twice) in the last 15 years; since I started taking the 'Tropins, I've not had any balance issues.

Truth is, I've had blood-pressure-related dizziness on standing for 40 years off+on, but none in the last several years. however, vertigo is different. either way, I've had no episodes of any kind in recent months (although my daughter & my wife's cat managed to trip me up in the hall last month - not my fault, damn' kids gangin' up on me like that!)

Just for the record, for as long as I can remember, my sense of balance has been excellent, and i've been surefooted on virtually any terrain in virtually any weather.

Originally Posted by ryano

When do you plan on using the Oratropin?

Haven't decided: lame, I know - I've had the stuff long enough!
The main thrust of this experiment, beyond seeing how much of my health and fitness I can re-create, is to see if the GHRP-6 family can retore my GH levels long-term; I'm just not sure where in that the OT would best serve.

Originally Posted by ryano

Also not nitpicking / just being lazy but.. Maybe putting what day or week you are into your experiment would be good?

I've been doing that, I thought: in addition to regular posts & responses, I've been posting a weekly log of dosing schedule & effects - each one is labeled with the week.

For current purposes, I'm at the end of Week 5, and the end of my first week of Hexatropin. Posting the log for this past week sometime in the next 24.

If I'm NOT flagging where I am in the process well enough, maybe others will chime & straighten me out....

Originally Posted by ryano

I thought ringing sensation(tinnitus) you were talking about was interesting.

It has been about a year and a half since I have been in front of some monitors for any extended period of time and the ringing is not as loud. But from what I have always been told any hearing loss or damage is permanent. I wonder if the ringing is effect of the hairs breaking in the inner ear and or some other mechanism.

I've always been told tinnitus is irreversible; that plus the fact that I've been noticing mine more & more over the last few months made it something I could track for changes fairly easily.

The fact that I've noticed ANY variation strikes me as (at least vaguely) positive. But, we'll see how it all turns out.

Originally Posted by ryano

I wonder if the hair coming in is a long term gain.

I sure as hell hope it is!! Of all the things that have conspired to make me feel old, having my hair go thin-to-nonexistent has been a biggie.

Originally Posted by ryano

Sounds like your walking alot. What is the diet like? Are you keeping things around or below maintence. Eating clean and frequently etc...

not walking as much as I want, but like everything else, walking takes time. Diet is unexceptional: not terribly clean, but little-to-no fast or frozen food; I mostly buy & cook real food: chicken & fish are my main protein, followed by whey, beef and lamb (in that order - virtually no pork at all, BTW); veggies are what I can get fresh at Whole Foods or the local road-side stands (in-season, that is); no cream sauces & like that, mostly use mint, peppers & citrus for seasoning.

Indulgences are few & far between (NO BINGING!)

Calories can fluctuate between 2300 - 2700, with maintenance @ 3500

Originally Posted by ryano

Ok I will shut up now

Dude, I appreciate your questions & comments, okay?

[SJA]

I was asking about vertigo due to the tinnitus. It's pretty common to have bouts of vertigo when you have tinnitus.....I know it all to well.....Get up at night to piss and all of a sudden something hits you in the head and gives you a large lump on your head...half asleep you're thinking "I'm going to get ass raped by the night stalker" but then you notice it was the wall and that you have the bed spins but can't remember drinking a fifth of tequila......then it hits you....oh yeah......vertigo

[Beelzebub]

sounds like a personal problem, lol.

[BodyWizard]

Originally Posted by ryano

I like your description of your body feeling like a whole instead of a collection of parts. Im only 32 right now but I relate to your statement.

I actually associate this pretty directly with the hidden infection that eventually had me bed-ridden for so long, rather than with age. I think any prolonged convalescence would have a comparable effect on anyone. Given the long-term deterioration I experienced, my eventual loss of conditioning was catastrophic; just so, it's possible for any athlete to be bed-ridden long enough to experience similar de-conditioning.

So I see it as a by-product, a secondary effect of infirmity, which I firmly believe need not accompany aging. Whether age, in and of itself, has been